Date   

Re: SANTA FE FE-22 REBUILT BOX CARS

Paul Lyons
 

Bill,

I did not find one when I asked the list earlier in the year. If one surfaces, please share it with me.

Thanks,
Paul Lyons

-----Original Message-----
From: WILLIAM PARDIE <PARDIEW001@...>
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Sun, Dec 12, 2010 12:59 pm
Subject: [STMFC] SANTA FE FE-22 REBUILT BOX CARS





Al of the photos that I have found of the Santa Fe FE-22 boxcars feature
the end with the end doors. Does anyone know of a photo showing the
"B" end?

Thanks in advance.

Bill Pardie

.
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Shake/Take Cocoa Beach DT&I Gondola work-in-progress project.

dennyanspach <danspach@...>
 

For those of you on the list participating in the this cooperative 2009 project from The Bash at the Beach and are unaware of it, note that there is active and productive dialogue going on on the Yahoo! Shake_N_Take list. As usual at this time of year, the goal is for participants to work on their projects preparatory to bringing their projects to Cocoa in a few weeks.

DEnny
Denny S. Anspach MD
Sacramento


Re: SANTA FE FE-22 REBUILT BOX CARS

Richard Hendrickson
 

This is actually the B end of an Fe-21 single door car, but the B
ends on Fe-21, Fe-22, and Fe23 classes were all the same, as all
three were rebuilt from Fe-S class wood sheathed cars.

Richard Hendrickson



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Re: SANTA FE FE-22 REBUILT BOX CARS

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Dec 12, 2010, at 12:59 PM, WILLIAM PARDIE wrote:

Al of the photos that I have found of the Santa Fe FE-22 boxcars
feature
the end with the end doors. Does anyone know of a photo showing the
"B" end?
Bill, I'm sending you a scan off-list.

Richard Hendrickson


SANTA FE FE-22 REBUILT BOX CARS

WILLIAM PARDIE
 

Al of the photos that I have found of the Santa Fe FE-22 boxcars feature
the end with the end doors. Does anyone know of a photo showing the
"B" end?

Thanks in advance.

Bill Pardie

.


Re: Stamping hopper ribs, was: Reading class HTf and HTh hoppers/rivet heracy

eddie_walters <eddie_walters@...>
 

Ed -

I have the "disadvantage" of being one of the young guys. Missing rivets are definitely visible! Archer rivet decals make rivet lines a breeze.

Ed (the other one).

--- In STMFC@..., "EdwardM" <ed_mines@...> wrote:

How big are HO scale rivets? .005"? .007"? And how tall? .002"? These are teeny tiny to an old geezer like me and from a few feet away I wonder how noticeable their absence would be. Better to concentrate on scale thickness ladders and stirrup steps.
Ed


Re: Wanted: Blue box offset side hopper

ed_mines
 

Whatever happened to all the blue box kits? Are they under the table at
train shows? What did the hobby shops do with their stock?
They are all meeting in my attic and waiting to be picked up by a spaceship.


Re: Stamping hopper ribs, was: Reading class HTf and HTh hoppers/rivet heracy

ed_mines
 

How big are HO scale rivets? .005"? .007"? And how tall? .002"? These are teeny tiny to an old geezer like me and from a few feet away I wonder how noticeable their absence would be. Better to concentrate on scale thickness ladders and stirrup steps.
Ed

--- In STMFC@..., "eddie_walters" <eddie_walters@...> wrote:

Would have helped, I suppose, if I'd included the link. Ho hum!
http://www.yardoffice.com/RR/Modeling/howto/ribstamp.html
--- In STMFC@..., "eddie_walters" <eddie_walters@> wrote:

Thanks all for the info!

Being the 1940 modeler Bruce mentioned that was discussing this with, I've been thinking about scratchbuilding some hoppers to cover the more distinctive types. The problem I've always been a little wary of with hoppers is how to make the side ribs. I found this fantastic article by Jeff Eggert on stamping ribs out of brass using a styrene form, using all sorts of clever tricks to make them repeatable and quick.

With Archer rivets, some careful styrene work and this technique, I think some presentable and relatively accurate hoppers are quite possible. Reading cars seem to be quite distinctive, with a relatively shallow slope of the slope sheets.

Ed Walters

--- In STMFC@..., "George Losse" <glosse1@> wrote:

Bruce,

The Reading rebuilt their open hopper cars in large batches in their company shops. I have a copy of a Reading book that documented the rebuilding of the HTf class during the thirties. The photos do not show every end panel being replaced. The repair appears to be done on an "as-needed" basis.

This was also done to the HTj (USRA twin) class when they were rebuilt in the thirties. This is why some of the LOa covered hoppers had the same panel on the ends of the cars but not all. The panels that were applied to the hopper cars were recycled from boxcars as some have boxcar lettering on them when applied during the rebuilds. None went out of the shops with that paint, but it does show that the panels were being used a second time also.

Not sure what would be a good start for the HTh in HO, I model in O scale. The car does appear to have a shallow slope to the slope sheet than other cars on the Reading roster. I plan to use an Atlas War Emergency hopper as the starting point in o scale, with new scratch-built sides. It is within a few inches on the inside length, the height will need to come down a little.

George Losse



--- In STMFC@..., Bruce Smith <smithbf@> wrote:

Folks,

A friend and I were having a discussion on modeling the READING
hopper fleet, especially circa 1940-44 (he models 1940, and I 1944).
I had a couple of questions regarding various READING hoppers.

1) I see that F&C sells kits (1019, 1020) for class HTf twin hoppers
with plain and pressed steel ends respectively. The F&C web site
implies that the pressed steel ends replaced the plain ends around
the time the cars were converted from arch-bar trucks. Is this correct?

2) I'm curious to know if there are any models in HO of the READING
HTh class twin "pre-USRA" cars, series 74500-78999 or suggestions on
how to kitbash these cars. With 4500 built in 1917-18 this car
should be represented in both our fleets.

Regards
Bruce

Bruce F. Smith
Auburn, AL
http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/index.pl/bruce_f._smith2

"Some days you are the bug, some days you are the windshield."
__
/ &#92;
__<+--+>________________&#92;__/___ ________________________________
|- ______/ O O &#92;_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ |
| / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 &#92; | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||
|/_____________________________&#92;|_|________________________________|
| O--O &#92;0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0




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Re: Salt Service

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Barry Bennett wrote:
T&NO was close to and served the salt mines at New Iberia, La. so gave PFE 'direct' access to a supplier, for instance. I'm reasonably sure that others reefer operators did too.
T&NO was not a major part of PFE's operation, compared to the far west, so whether locally-needed salt may have been obtained from Avery Island and similar sources, I don't know, but certainly not for system-wide operations. PFE did buy major amounts of salt from the Bay Area producers (naturally evaporated salt ponds) for California use. Whether salt needs on UP territory may have been filled from the numerous Kansas salt mines, I don't know.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Larry Jackman 1931-2009

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Dec 12, 2010, at 9:22 AM, dennyanspach wrote:

I did not know Larry Jackman, although I did meet him briefly one
time. He could be abrasive at times in his posts, but his
experiences as a real life on-the-ground railroad operations
employee always came through with a healthy dose of credibility.

Over a period of several years prior to his move from Florida to
the northwest, he sent me box after box after box of his railroad-
subject photos (color prints) most of them photos of railroad car
details- details of all kinds from cars of all kinds.

Although I counseled him repeatedly that if he contributed them
directly to the California State Railroad Museum, he could be
eligible for tax credits, he insisted that they be given to me, to
then give to the CSRM. That is what I did (no, I did not take the
tax credits).
Larry sent me a large number of freight car blueprints on the same
basis that I was to use them in any manner I saw fit and eventually
contribute them to CSRM. Like Denny, I never quite understood why he
chose to give away his collection in this fashion, but I was happy to
honor his request. As Denny says, he was sometimes abrasive on-line
I sometimes wondered if the problems with his health rendered him a
bit irritable but pleasant in person, on the two occasions when I
met him at prototype modelers' gatherings. And he was certainly
generous in insuring that his collection of prototype photos and data
wouldn't end up in a dumpster somewhere. I'd like to think that he
is now violating car service rules right and left in the great
freight yard in the sky.

Richard Hendrickson



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Re: Salt Service

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Dec 12, 2010, at 4:45 AM, barryb2again wrote:

I have just bought a built-up Westerfield ATSF Bx-3 Salt Sevice box
car on eBay UK for $8.70!!!

When this item first appeared I had a rummage through the PFE bible
and found only informatiomn on the use of salt, but nothing in
regard to it's purchase, storage or distribution.

It is a fact that several companies had salt service cars, it is
obvious that they were used to distribute salt to icing stations
but what is not so obvious, to me at least, is how the salt was
moved to the distribution centres.

T&NO was close to and served the salt mines at New Iberia, La. so
gave PFE 'direct' access to a supplier, for instance. I'm
reasonably sure that others reefer operators did too.

My thoughts revolve around who and how the salt would be shipped
from the supplier, by the usual jumble of available free runners or
would PFE, ATSF etc use their own salt service cars to fetch the
salt or only transload it for distribution. Would distance from
source have been a consideration.
I won't speak for PFE (perhaps Tony Thompson will) but Tom Madden is
correct, citing John Dobyne's Santa Fe box car book, that salt for
Santa Fe ice docks came from Hutchison and Lyons, KS and was
transported system-wide in old box cars equipped with refrigerator
car hinged doors to insure that the door openings were weather-
proof. Some obsolete Bx-24 class truss rod 40' box cars inherited
from the Kansas City, Mexico & Orient were used in this service - I
have a nice photo of one converted at La Junta CO in 1947 with a
permanent placard reading "RETURN TO LYONS KANS. FOR SALT LOADING" -
and, as they deteriorated rapidly, they were replaced in the early
1950s by former Bx-3 and Bx-6 class sectional-sheathed cars, also
with reefer doors. As with cars in hide service, those in salt
service were at the end of their useful lives, could not be used for
anything else, and suffered heavily from corrosion. As the Santa
Fe's salt cars were in dedicated service, they never went off-line in
interchange.

Richard Hendrickson


Re: Larry Jackman 1931-2009

dennyanspach <danspach@...>
 

I did not know Larry Jackman, although I did meet him briefly one time. He could be abrasive at times in his posts, but his experiences as a real life on-the-ground railroad operations employee always came through with a healthy dose of credibility.

Over a period of several years prior to his move from Florida to the northwest, he sent me box after box after box of his railroad-subject photos (color prints) most of them photos of railroad car details- details of all kinds from cars of all kinds.

Although I counseled him repeatedly that if he contributed them directly to the California State Railroad Museum, he could be eligible for tax credits, he insisted that they be given to me, to then give to the CSRM. That is what I did (no, I did not take the tax credits).

His brief very last and candid posts from Florida were remarkable in that he made clear in his own words that he was moving to the Northwest to die. I do not believe that we heard from him again.

Denny

Denny S. Anspach MD
Sacramento


Re: Larry Jackman 1931-2009

dh30973
 

The subject of Larry came up on Andy Harman's Diesel List the end of November, which prompted several posts. I had the opportunity to get to know Larry pretty well, a little better than the semi casual we do with people we meet through this hobby and keep in touch with with letters, phone calls, e-mail or seeing at various meets. Here is a reposting of what I wrote to Andy's List:

This discussion about Larry Jackman got me digging through my files. I first met Larry through Ed Ryan back in the late 1980's. Ed was working in the Seattle area and somehow had been introduced to Larry (I think it was through Bob Hundman of Mainline Modeler). I went up to see Ed and he took me to visit Larry. Talk about the mad professor/shade tree mechanic, his garage was full of "stuff" for making the parts he was selling under the Smokey Valley line. He had some attachment for his drill press that heated plastic pellets that were then squeezed into a mold that he just clamped in a mill vise. Very basic for small parts. He had several molds that were made from the 3M Tartan process that used a sintered metal powder to capture the detail off of a male master. Thru Ed we became friends.

In 1989 Rail Power Products introduced their SD60 shell, and Larry had the late Joel Berling tool him a three window cab to convert the SD60 into a SD60M. Ed had moved back to Southern California and moved in with me. Larry asked Ed and I to build him a display model for the Houston NMRA Convention for his display. Later I wrote and article on the model that ran in the January 1990 issue of Mainline Modeler. Later that year I had scratch built a Dynamic Brake Section to make a Phase II GP50 out of an Athearn GP50. At Larry's request I made drawings for the dynamic section that I sent to Larry in June 1990. He had Joel make the tooling for the dynamic and then also the Blomberg Type M truck side frame.

Over the years we kept in touch and saw each other at shows, and he was always after me for other ideas that he could make. After he sold Smokey Valley to Bob Wright (Wright Track, who subsiquently sold the Smokey Valley part of it to Larry Burt) there was a period that he could not compete. I think this is when he and is wife moved to Florida, and he got involved in S Scale stuff, and later back into HO with the switcher side frames. His connection with Joel was fruitful for Larry and the hobby. Joel was one of those master "behind the scenes" toolmakers who did projects for lots of small companies from Detail Associates, Smokey Valley, Des Plaines Hobbies, PBL, Hi Tech Details, Wright Track, and many others. He could work from sketches and photographs and produce quality molds. Joel passed away in 2006 not long after Gordon Cannon. Without Joel, Larry lost his toolmaker.

I last saw him at one of the Cocoa Beach meets a few years ago, but he didn't spend much time as his wife was not doing well and he wanted to get back home. Many of you only know him from his stories and/or rants on the various lists but anyone who met him will remember him as someone with a lot of knowledge and a will to share it.

Larry we (at least me) miss you.

Regards

David Hussey
PS Tom, Thanks

--- In STMFC@..., "pullmanboss" <tcmadden@...> wrote:

On the Passenger Car List yesterday, Bill McCoy mentioned "the late Larry Jackman". Further digging uncovered a Social Security death notice for Lawrence Albert Jackman, born 12/11/1931, died 6/9/2009 in Pierce, WA. The notice says previous records can be found at Boca Raton, FL.

This seems to be "our" Larry, and it appears that his passing was not unknown in the RR hobby community. But it was never noted on the STMFC List, which is the reason for this post.

Tom Madden

"I started with nothing, and still have most of it left." Larry Jackman


Re: Unsual routings?

lstt100
 

From my AAR files on Car Service Rules:

"Special Car Order 45 issued in 1942 and reissued in 1948, suspends application of Car Service Rules 2 and 3 as to refrigerator cars owned by the A.T.& S.F. Railway in order to permit handling of SFRD refrigerators on a basis similar to that applying to privately owned railroad-controlled refrigerator cars." (Dated Dec 1954)

The railroad using the SFRD cars was in compliance with the Car Service Rules at the time they were loaded.

Dan Holbrook


Re: Warped Resin Kit

Rich Chrysler <richchrysler@...>
 

I've had great luck by laying the warped castings on a truly flat surface
(detail side up) and carefully warming with a hair dryer to the point of
being hot, but not too hot to touch. A small bag of lead shot pellets laid
over the casting applies gentle and even pressure until it cools..result..an
evenly flat casting with no warpage or twisting, etc.



Rich Chrysler


Re: Salt Service

pullmanboss <tcmadden@...>
 

According to Dobyne's Santa Fe Boxcar book, the loading points for the Santa Fe's Bx3/6 salt cars were Hutchinson, Kansas and Lyons, Kansas.

Tom Madden

--- In STMFC@..., "barryb2again" <Barrybennetttoo@...> wrote:

I have just bought a built-up Westerfield ATSF Bx-3 Salt Sevice box car on eBay UK for $8.70!!!

When this item first appeared I had a rummage through the PFE bible and found only informatiomn on the use of salt, but nothing in regard to it's purchase, storage or distribution.

It is a fact that several companies had salt service cars, it is obvious that they were used to distribute salt to icing stations but what is not so obvious, to me at least, is how the salt was moved to the distribution centres.

T&NO was close to and served the salt mines at New Iberia, La. so gave PFE 'direct' access to a supplier, for instance. I'm reasonably sure that others reefer operators did too.

My thoughts revolve around who and how the salt would be shipped from the supplier, by the usual jumble of available free runners or would PFE, ATSF etc use their own salt service cars to fetch the salt or only transload it for distribution. Would distance from source have been a consideration.

Your thoughts and knowledge on the matter?

Barry Bennett
Coventry, England.


Re: new EJ&E set

Clark Propst
 

These cars would make for a great "Iron Modeler" project.

As I was reading the various approaches to building those J 'things' I thought of an "Iron Modeler" Yahoo group. That would allow attachments, so guys could show their progress.
But, after seeing how few finished "Shake'N'Take" cars are brought back to the CCB meet the next year, a thought is all it is...
Clark Propst


new EJ&E set

jerryglow2
 

At a customer request and thanks to the help here, I've added a new set for a postwar EJ&E boxcar: http://home.comcast.net/~jerryglow/samples/EJ&E_postwar.jpg

As usual, keep inquiries OFF LIST

Jerry Glow
http://home.comcast.net/~jerryglow/decals/


Salt Service

barryb2again <Barrybennetttoo@...>
 

I have just bought a built-up Westerfield ATSF Bx-3 Salt Sevice box car on eBay UK for $8.70!!!

When this item first appeared I had a rummage through the PFE bible and found only informatiomn on the use of salt, but nothing in regard to it's purchase, storage or distribution.

It is a fact that several companies had salt service cars, it is obvious that they were used to distribute salt to icing stations but what is not so obvious, to me at least, is how the salt was moved to the distribution centres.

T&NO was close to and served the salt mines at New Iberia, La. so gave PFE 'direct' access to a supplier, for instance. I'm reasonably sure that others reefer operators did too.

My thoughts revolve around who and how the salt would be shipped from the supplier, by the usual jumble of available free runners or would PFE, ATSF etc use their own salt service cars to fetch the salt or only transload it for distribution. Would distance from source have been a consideration.

Your thoughts and knowledge on the matter?

Barry Bennett
Coventry, England.


Re: Marker brackets on oil-tank cars

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Evan Leisey wrote:
Several roads used tank cars coupled behind the tender for additional water to eliminate the expense and delays of water stops. Also, helpers and pushers working long grades also employed auxilary water tanks, sometimes excess tenders from retired locomotives converted to water tenders. The D&RGW, D&SL and the Reading Co. are a few roads that regularly used auxilary water cars. The Reading and the D&SL cars had provisions to display marker lanterns and flags for pusher service.
Entirely true, but the thread began with info about Santa Fe tank cars, and ATSF authority Richard Hendrickson stated that Santa Fe rarely if ever used tank cars this way.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history

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