Date   

ADMIN messages

Mike Brock <brockm@...>
 

It has been requested to me that members not use the term "ADMIN" in the subject line even when replying to an ADMIN message. I think thats a good idea because ADMIN messages should be read by the members and I don't think we should subject the members to more ADMIN messages than necessary. Feel free, however, to ask about a subject in the ADMIN subject line. Hopefully ADMIN messages will be few in number and should really only be used to keep the group functioning in as efficient manner as possible. The less we see of the judge the better...IMO.

Mike Brock
STMFC Owner


Re: Color Matching for Freight Cars

Mike Brock <brockm@...>
 

Charlie Vlk writes:

"I envision doing the database prior to dealing with the actual drift cards, means of reproducing them, etc... and as an ongoing
work.
This database will, incidently, provide some framework of drawings and other documents in existence as a byproduct. While it
will, because of the thrust of the project, be limited to General Arrangement and Lettering & Painting drawings and specifications
that normally contain color information, it would be something."

OK...I'm curious. Are you saying that you suggest that the data base you are going to build will contain only "Arrangement and Lettering & Painting drawings and specifications that normally contain color information"? Exactly what does that mean? I'm puzzled. I mean, we have that already for many RRs...certainly UP.

Mike Brock


Re: Texaco Tank Car Fleet in 1950

Cyril Durrenberger
 

The following are from what I remember from builders photos, but is being written from our summer house and I do not have my Texaco file here.

In about 1929 The Texas Company began using the name "Texaco" on their tank cars instead of "The Texas Company". It appears that up until that time almost all of their tank cars were painted black, but there may have been some that were painted white (I recal a photo of a white tank car).. They also had some box cars that were painted white. In 1929 they began using the scheme with silver on the upper part of the tank with large black letters spelling out "Texaco". These were used for gasoline, or that is what their magazine indicated when they discussed their new paint and lettering scheme. Black cars were still used for other products. It is not clear how soon they repainted their cars in the new paint and lettering scheme.

Cyril Durrenberger

"Garth G. Groff" <ggg9y@...> wrote:
George,

Sorry. I hit the wrong key. I have nothing solid to offer you, except
that the silver Texaco cars date from the 1930s and were all black well
before the 1950s.

Kind regards,

Garth G. Groff

George Hollwedel wrote:

Garth, that wasn't much help...

Prototype N Scale Models (TM)
by George Hollwedel
310 Loma Verde St
Buda, TX 78610-9785
512-796-6883
www.micro-trains.com/hollwedel.php


--- On Fri, 6/6/08, Garth G. Groff <ggg9y@...> wrote:


From: Garth G. Groff <ggg9y@...>
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Texaco Tank Car Fleet in 1950
To: STMFC@...
Date: Friday, June 6, 2008, 11:38 AM
matthewjstrickland wrote:

Hi guys,

Can anyone tell me what period Texaco used the black
tank cars with

White Thick Block lettering of "TEXACO"?
From when to when?

Were these tanks cars 8000 or 10,000 gallon?

Also if you were putting together a fleet of tank cars
for Texaco in

1950 which tank cars were most likely to be seen?

Plain GATX? Silver TEXACO? Still some labelled THE
TEXAS COMPANY or

just simply labelled TCX? And what size?

Thanks for your help in advance

MATT


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Northern Pacific Boxcar Red dba Corvette Red dba Chocolate Syrup Brown

gary laakso
 

Per a research piece by Bill McKown of W&R fame, Northern Pacific box car red is the same red used on Corvettes and in the DuPont catalogue in 1993 when he wrote an article for the NPRHS, its was Lucite C8120L. It is an interesting color that faded or "morphed" to a chocolate syrup brown in some paint batches and that was the color Challenger Imports used on the NP single sheathed war emergency boxcar. There are pictures of NP trains with boxcars some of which are the corvette red and others in the syrup brown and the boxcars are from the same era. I just weather to suit, knowing the colors did not stay nearly consistent on NP.
Great Northern colors did not "morph" to chocolate! Well, at least not in the pictures that i have seen.
I like Richard Henderickson's weathering ideas more all the time!


gary laakso
south of Mike Brock
vasa0vasa@...


Re: Color Matching for Freight Cars

Charlie Vlk
 

Ed-
Thank you for your thoughtful and informative reply.
Your comments indicate, to me, the importance of including the application data and allowing for reported and observed
variances in the color over time. A field for this with a suffix to the "official" paint number (if any) should be a part of the
database to allow for this.
Not all fields for every entry will be able to be populated.... your horror example (for us) of a lot of cars to be painted to match
a drift card sample without any brand, number, name of the paint is an example.

I envision doing the database prior to dealing with the actual drift cards, means of reproducing them, etc... and as an ongoing
work.
This database will, incidently, provide some framework of drawings and other documents in existence as a byproduct. While it
will, because of the thrust of the project, be limited to General Arrangement and Lettering & Painting drawings and specifications
that normally contain color information, it would be something.

Charlie Vlk




Charlie,
For the period 1931-1952, the AC&F bills of materials have numerous
paint samples that were affixed to the back covers of these documents.
As many people know, Pat Wider, Ray Long and I researched these BOMs
and received permission to cut a small sliver of the paint sample to
keep. I have a collection of these paint samples. Anyone can see the
samples by visiting the St. Louis Mercantile Library (Barriger National
Railroad Library) and go through the BOMs.

From the standpoint of freight car colors used in this period, in many
cases the BOMs specify a generic name of a paint color without the
mention of a brand of paint. Others specify the brand of paint plus a
name of the paint color (i.e., DuPont Tuffcoat Brown). In very few
cases are there paint numbers that were specified. Not all orders BOMs
had paint samples (absolutely none on tank cars), so there are many
examples where there are no samples available for various road names or
private owners. In other cases there are perhaps up to a dozen paint
samples used on various cars for a given railroad.

In addition to the AC&F material, I have a collection of Pullman BOMs
that apply, for the most part, to cars built at Bessemer, Alabama from
1929 to 1947. Included in this collection are a relatively small number
of BOMs of cars built at Pullman's Butler, Pa. plant. These documents
have no color samples, but they tend to specify the paint brand/paint
name in the same way that the AC&F BOMs specify them. Some have paint
numbers, but most do not.

The AC&F paint samples clearly show that paint colors changed over time
even though the name of the paint may have remained the same. For
example, Santa Fe Mineral Brown changed significantly from the samples
of the late 1930s/early 1940s to those from the late 1940s.

Many of the paint brands and color names have already been published in
RP CYC articles and/or my articles in Railmodel Journal. A main point
that I want to emphasize is that each AC&F paint sample represents the
color applied to one order of cars. The same color may have been used
on other lot numbers that were produced, but in many cases the colors
changed from one order to another even for the same railroad. Sometimes
multiple brands of paint were used for the cars built in one lot
number. In some cases there are multiple paint samples in the BOM and
sometimes there's only one sample. It can get pretty complicated. but I
am willing to be a participant in a study to help define the colors to
the extent that they can be defined. The challenge is to come up with
some way to match these paint samples to some type of standard that's
available for anyone to use.

Of course, these paint samples document selected cars when they were
brand new. Samples for repainted cars typically done at the railroad
shops will have to some from other sources.
Regards,
Ed Hawkins


Re: Texaco Tank Car Fleet in 1950

George Hollwedel
 

That helps me, I hope it helps MATT as well.

Prototype N Scale Models (TM)
by George Hollwedel
310 Loma Verde St
Buda, TX 78610-9785
512-796-6883
www.micro-trains.com/hollwedel.php

--- On Fri, 6/6/08, Garth G. Groff <ggg9y@...> wrote:

From: Garth G. Groff <ggg9y@...>
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Texaco Tank Car Fleet in 1950
To: STMFC@...
Date: Friday, June 6, 2008, 1:14 PM
George,

Sorry. I hit the wrong key. I have nothing solid to offer
you, except
that the silver Texaco cars date from the 1930s and were
all black well
before the 1950s.

Kind regards,


Garth G. Groff

George Hollwedel wrote:
Garth, that wasn't much help...

Prototype N Scale Models (TM)
by George Hollwedel
310 Loma Verde St
Buda, TX 78610-9785
512-796-6883
www.micro-trains.com/hollwedel.php


--- On Fri, 6/6/08, Garth G. Groff
<ggg9y@...> wrote:


From: Garth G. Groff <ggg9y@...>
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Texaco Tank Car Fleet in 1950
To: STMFC@...
Date: Friday, June 6, 2008, 11:38 AM
matthewjstrickland wrote:

Hi guys,

Can anyone tell me what period Texaco used the
black
tank cars with

White Thick Block lettering of
"TEXACO"?
From when to when?

Were these tanks cars 8000 or 10,000 gallon?

Also if you were putting together a fleet of
tank cars
for Texaco in

1950 which tank cars were most likely to be
seen?

Plain GATX? Silver TEXACO? Still some labelled
THE
TEXAS COMPANY or

just simply labelled TCX? And what size?

Thanks for your help in advance

MATT


------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links




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------------------------------------

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Re: Color Matching for Freight Cars

Charlie Vlk
 

A verrrry red-faced Charlie Vlk admits that he did mean Mr. Tom Madden, Dean of All Things Pullman.....
The process of objectivity you describe hits the nail on the head...... we can wax poetic about how
the human eye processes different wavelengths of light, etc... but if we don't know what the size and
nature of the subject we're dealing with it is just a waste of electrons.....
I'd like to work on a Color Project, but sure would like a few people that have more knowledge of setting
up databases and are more internet savvy than I.... also that have some time to devote to data entry, etc..
Since the source documents (unlike the Pullman records which are in a few locations) are scattered
in files across the world, I think the real population of the database (i.e., CB&Q E7 EMD Styling Drawing
Dated 4/48, Issue C with such and such colors referenced) would be a Wikopedia type effort.
Charlie Vlk


Charlie Vlk wrote:

> ... what we really [need] to get started is a
> database of the caliber of Mr. Maddox's Pullman Project.

I'm going to go out on a limb here and assume you meant me, Charlie.
But if Tom Maddox (QB: UCLA, Denver, Pittsburgh) has been working up
a Pullman database, please point me to it. :-)

There is almost no subjectivity in the Pullman database - it contains
facts directly transcribed from original Pullman records. I had to do
some interpretation (is that written number a "3" or a "5"?) and make
occasional inferences (the original truck data is missing for this
car, but every other car in that lot was delivered with 2410A trucks,
ergo...), but there wasn't a lot of opportunity to make subjective
judgements. Color interpretation is going to be chock full of
subjective judgements, for reasons that have been discussed at
excruciating length here on the STMFC.

Having said that, databases and other foundation documents seldom
originate in committees. They happen because someone (and it's almost
always one) decides to do it. And they keep at it until others
recognize the value of the undertaking and decide to contribute to
it. But it's that one person creating the framework that makes it all
happen. You start with curiosity, move up to "interest",
then "passion", and next thing you know you've committed all your
hobby time, energy and resources to it. You do need to stop
before "obsession", because that tends to scare people off!

Tom Madden


Re: Texaco Tank Car Fleet in 1950

Garth G. Groff <ggg9y@...>
 

George,

Sorry. I hit the wrong key. I have nothing solid to offer you, except that the silver Texaco cars date from the 1930s and were all black well before the 1950s.

Kind regards,


Garth G. Groff

George Hollwedel wrote:

Garth, that wasn't much help...

Prototype N Scale Models (TM)
by George Hollwedel
310 Loma Verde St
Buda, TX 78610-9785
512-796-6883
www.micro-trains.com/hollwedel.php


--- On Fri, 6/6/08, Garth G. Groff <ggg9y@...> wrote:


From: Garth G. Groff <ggg9y@...>
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Texaco Tank Car Fleet in 1950
To: STMFC@...
Date: Friday, June 6, 2008, 11:38 AM
matthewjstrickland wrote:

Hi guys,

Can anyone tell me what period Texaco used the black
tank cars with
White Thick Block lettering of "TEXACO"?
From when to when?

Were these tanks cars 8000 or 10,000 gallon?

Also if you were putting together a fleet of tank cars
for Texaco in
1950 which tank cars were most likely to be seen?

Plain GATX? Silver TEXACO? Still some labelled THE
TEXAS COMPANY or
just simply labelled TCX? And what size?

Thanks for your help in advance

MATT


------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links



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Yahoo! Groups Links




------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links




Re: Texaco Tank Car Fleet in 1950

George Hollwedel
 

Garth, that wasn't much help...

Prototype N Scale Models (TM)
by George Hollwedel
310 Loma Verde St
Buda, TX 78610-9785
512-796-6883
www.micro-trains.com/hollwedel.php

--- On Fri, 6/6/08, Garth G. Groff <ggg9y@...> wrote:

From: Garth G. Groff <ggg9y@...>
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Texaco Tank Car Fleet in 1950
To: STMFC@...
Date: Friday, June 6, 2008, 11:38 AM
matthewjstrickland wrote:
Hi guys,

Can anyone tell me what period Texaco used the black
tank cars with
White Thick Block lettering of "TEXACO"?
From when to when?

Were these tanks cars 8000 or 10,000 gallon?

Also if you were putting together a fleet of tank cars
for Texaco in
1950 which tank cars were most likely to be seen?

Plain GATX? Silver TEXACO? Still some labelled THE
TEXAS COMPANY or
just simply labelled TCX? And what size?

Thanks for your help in advance

MATT


------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links




------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links



Re: Texaco Tank Car Fleet in 1950

Garth G. Groff <ggg9y@...>
 

matthewjstrickland wrote:

Hi guys,

Can anyone tell me what period Texaco used the black tank cars with White Thick Block lettering of "TEXACO"? From when to when?

Were these tanks cars 8000 or 10,000 gallon?

Also if you were putting together a fleet of tank cars for Texaco in 1950 which tank cars were most likely to be seen?

Plain GATX? Silver TEXACO? Still some labelled THE TEXAS COMPANY or just simply labelled TCX? And what size?

Thanks for your help in advance

MATT


------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links




Texaco Tank Car Fleet in 1950

matt
 

Hi guys,

Can anyone tell me what period Texaco used the black tank cars with
White Thick Block lettering of "TEXACO"? From when to when?

Were these tanks cars 8000 or 10,000 gallon?

Also if you were putting together a fleet of tank cars for Texaco in
1950 which tank cars were most likely to be seen?

Plain GATX? Silver TEXACO? Still some labelled THE TEXAS COMPANY or
just simply labelled TCX? And what size?

Thanks for your help in advance

MATT


Re: J & L Steel and Koppers Coal Car Tank Cars

Claus Schlund &#92;(HGM&#92;)
 

Hi Larry and list members,

Looking at the P&LE HS web site at

http://www.plerrhs.org/store/BookShelf.pdf

It appears to me that maybe there might be a charge for S&H, but you didn't mention such in your post.

I'd like to order one of these. Larry - can you clarify if we need to include a separate S&H charge?

Thanks - Claus Schlund

-----Original Message-----
From: Larry Kline [mailto:lndkline@...]
Sent: Friday, June 6, 2008 07:32 AM
To: 'STMFC list'
Subject: [STMFC] Re: J & L Steel and Koppers Coal Car Tank Cars

Jamie Toman wrote:
Does anyone know were I could find out about J & L Steel and Koppers
Coal Car Tank Cars? I have one good pic of a J & L one, need some
more photos or info on them. I know 3RD Rail makes them in brass in O-
Scale. Did they have an "A" or "B" end markings or which end was it?
I know they had handbrakes on both ends.

The latest issue of the P&LE RR Historical Society magazine *The
Little Giant* includes an article with three 1958 photos of J&L coal
tar tankcar 1022 which was part of a derailment in 1958, color photo
of an indentified J&L coal tar tankcar, and the builder's photo that
was in the cyclopedias. These cars were painted black in the 1950s.

There are drawings for these cars in the April 1956 Model Railroader.

The magazine, Vol. 3 No. 3 is available from the Society store. Send
request for TLG V3 N3 and a check for $6.95 to:
P&LERRHS
PO Box 15512
Pittsburgh, PA 15244

Larry Kline
Pittsburgh, PA









------------------------------------

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Re: ADMIN: Re: Re: Color Matching for Freight Cars

Mike Brock <brockm@...>
 

Hi, Al,

You ask:

"As a side question - is there still a group that deals specifically with early-1800s thru mid-1900s steam era freight cars, i.e. the prototypes only and not models? . . . . documenting early paint colors, builder's records, etc."

To be honest...I don't know. I run the STMFC and help with the PCL as a moderator. I also run a group dealing with trade marks...LICEN...but that's all.

Mike

Al Kresse

-------------- Original message --------------
From: "Mike Brock" <brockm@...>
Dave Nelson writes:

"I highlighted a word above -- model -- to point out what I regard as an
unfortunate bias here, one that usually pops out in spades whenever the
subject is color: that this list is only about **models** of steam era
freight cars. IIRC, the scope is about Steam Era Freight Cars (note the
absence of any other qualifiers)."

Not so, Dave. From the group's rules:

"The objectives include the sharing of information about North American,
standard gauge railroad freight cars
including their operation, distribution and the various techniques of
building models of them. Discussions about the cargos of freight cars are
permitted but only as they are directly associated with a freight car.
Emphasis is to be placed on the study of the prototype with
a goal of producing models of them with as great a degree of accuracy as
possible."

Dave asks: "Fair enough -- for modeling. Can I get a clarification from our
hosts on
whether scale models are or are not a qualifier to what is or is not proper
here, with specific reference to the topic of color?"

Obviously, if one is going to build a model of a real frt car, one needs to
know a great deal about the real frt car...the more the better...including
its [ gasp ] color impression [ don't overlook the term "impression". ].
Certainly discussions about frt cars not including references to models are
within scope but note the sentence..."Emphasis is to be placed on the study
of the prototype with a goal of producing models of them with as great a
degree of accuracy as possible." IOW, while discussions about the paint
consist of a real frt car would not be out of scope, it would not be a
primary goal of the STMFC...except as an avenue to developing a model of the
real car. Again, such discussions regarding the paints applied to real frt
cars ARE within the scope of the STMFC...just as would other discussions
about the physical features of a real frt car.

As an aside, the STMFC is historically associated with the rise of Railroad
Prototype Modeler [ RPM ] activities including the development of RPM
meets...Naperville, Cocoa Beach, North East Prototype Modeling Meet, John
Golden's St. Louis meet to name a few. In general, presentations might
include information about a prototype or about the modeling of it or both.
At least at Cocoa Beach the goal is to provide information about a prototype
and how to model it...very similar to the STMFC [ surprise! ]. However,
never is it required to provide both in the same presentation at Cocoa Beach
or message in the STMFC.

Mike Brock
STMFC Owner

Fair enough -- for modeling. Can I get a clarification from our hosts on
whether scale models are or are not a qualifier to what is or is not proper
here, with specific reference to the topic of color?

Dave Nelson


Re: ADMIN: Re: Re: Color Matching for Freight Cars

water.kresse@...
 

Mike,

As a side question - is there still a group that deals specifically with early-1800s thru mid-1900s steam era freight cars, i.e. the prototypes only and not models? . . . . documenting early paint colors, builder's records, etc.

Al Kresse

-------------- Original message --------------
From: "Mike Brock" <brockm@...>
Dave Nelson writes:

"I highlighted a word above -- model -- to point out what I regard as an
unfortunate bias here, one that usually pops out in spades whenever the
subject is color: that this list is only about **models** of steam era
freight cars. IIRC, the scope is about Steam Era Freight Cars (note the
absence of any other qualifiers)."

Not so, Dave. From the group's rules:

"The objectives include the sharing of information about North American,
standard gauge railroad freight cars
including their operation, distribution and the various techniques of
building models of them. Discussions about the cargos of freight cars are
permitted but only as they are directly associated with a freight car.
Emphasis is to be placed on the study of the prototype with
a goal of producing models of them with as great a degree of accuracy as
possible."

Dave asks: "Fair enough -- for modeling. Can I get a clarification from our
hosts on
whether scale models are or are not a qualifier to what is or is not proper
here, with specific reference to the topic of color?"

Obviously, if one is going to build a model of a real frt car, one needs to
know a great deal about the real frt car...the more the better...including
its [ gasp ] color impression [ don't overlook the term "impression". ].
Certainly discussions about frt cars not including references to models are
within scope but note the sentence..."Emphasis is to be placed on the study
of the prototype with a goal of producing models of them with as great a
degree of accuracy as possible." IOW, while discussions about the paint
consist of a real frt car would not be out of scope, it would not be a
primary goal of the STMFC...except as an avenue to developing a model of the
real car. Again, such discussions regarding the paints applied to real frt
cars ARE within the scope of the STMFC...just as would other discussions
about the physical features of a real frt car.

As an aside, the STMFC is historically associated with the rise of Railroad
Prototype Modeler [ RPM ] activities including the development of RPM
meets...Naperville, Cocoa Beach, North East Prototype Modeling Meet, John
Golden's St. Louis meet to name a few. In general, presentations might
include information about a prototype or about the modeling of it or both.
At least at Cocoa Beach the goal is to provide information about a prototype
and how to model it...very similar to the STMFC [ surprise! ]. However,
never is it required to provide both in the same presentation at Cocoa Beach
or message in the STMFC.

Mike Brock
STMFC Owner

Fair enough -- for modeling. Can I get a clarification from our hosts on
whether scale models are or are not a qualifier to what is or is not proper
here, with specific reference to the topic of color?

Dave Nelson


Re: NE prototype modelers meet

Gatwood, Elden J SAD <Elden.J.Gatwood@...>
 

Folks;



I have spent a lot of time trying to figure this out because of the need to
take pics for TKM and other, under a variety of light sources.



Fluorescents (the light of choice in those venues) vary tremendously, and
cast a light that can vary from ghoulish purple green to cool grey to vaguely
warm orange, depending on what Kelvin they generate. The ones I have run
across run anywhere from 4000 to over 6000 Kelvin. This runs from marginally
warm (even then, your camera may not interpret as such) to extremely cold.



By contrast, most Tungsten lighting is about 3200 Kelvin, which is pretty
warm. That is what most pros use for studio lighting.



Since your eye automatically adjusts to various lighting to create the same
general appearance under any condition, most people do not notice how cool or
warm the lighting is, with the exception of Fluorsecent-lit venues/subjects.
Most people notice these as cool. Your camera may turn subjects lit by them
to a sickly green, when you see them as just fine. For folks that have
layouts under high Kelvin fluorescents, models painted under sunlight may
appear cool. The solution some have suggested is to switch to "warm"
fluorescents, so your models look more "real". This seems to be a matter of
personal subjectivity, as some seem to regard their lighting as fine, and
others hate the same lighting.



The use of fluorescents and pro lighting causes many digital cameras,
including my own, to go wacky. The Program mode on some cameras seems more
able to combat this than others, so your camera may do just fine (like
appears to be Jerry's case). Other cameras have an option to have the camera
judge the light source and adjust to a middle value (like maybe 3500K)
automatically.



There are also folks that put media over their fluorescents to adjust the
color temperature. This usually involves colored mylar sheets.



I find that I have to just take the pictures under whatever lighting is
available in a Model Room (hideous fluorescent green), supplemented by the
more even, and less contrasting Tungsten pro lights, and adjust it
accordingly (usually warming it up and making it a bit for dramatic), on my
computer, for posting in TKM. PhotoShop is a favorite of many pros.



BTW, these new fluorescents that take the place of your old incandescents
have very cool color. I had to heavily warm some digitals that I took under
that light recently. My Brunswick Green F-7 actually looked "morning after"
green.



Elden Gatwood





I ran out of time to take pics at Cocoa Beach this year but from the
looks of others' pics I've seeen, lighting does not appear to be an
issue. Of course digital cameras are not as critical of the light
source as film.

Jerry Glow

--- In STMFC@... <mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com> ,
"wmcclark1980" <walterclark@...> wrote:

With all the discussion(s) about color I'm going to ask a very
subjective question. When you take a model to Naperville or Cocoa
Beach or ? has anyone had a problem with the lighting "shifting" the
color? As in, what looked "right" at home wound up being anything
but
right under the lighting in the display room? I'm asking because I
might be able to get to both Naperville and Cocoa Beach this winter
and before I pack up my pride and joy to show off I'd like to know
if
my "Metallic" (SP "Boxcar Red") B-50-? would look purple (for
instance) under the lighting in the display room.

Time stopped in November 1941
Walter M. Clark
Pullman, Washington, USA

--- In STMFC@... <mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com> ,
"feddersenmark" <feddersenmark@>
wrote:

Dave, I was responsible for raising the the table heights at
Naperville last year. As a member of the group that selects the
models for recognition of participation in the display, I was
tired
of leaning over and squinting in dim light to view the models. 10
foot lengths of 1.5 inch PVC pipe were cut into 19 3/4" pieces (6
per
10'lenght) to create the leg extensions. Contrary to your earlier
concerns, it was my impression that participants of the meet "hug
around" the disply room much longer and more often than in past
years, possibly due to an increased comfort level when viewing
the
models. I observed many groups standing around tables discussing
the
intracacies of the offerings. An additional benefit of raising
the
table height is that it gets the models slightly closer to the
usually poor light source present in most display rooms. I hope
to
have all of the tables raised this year. Mark Feddersen




--- In STMFC@... <mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com> , "David
Owens" <daowens@> wrote:

We will look into it.
Dave Owens

On 6/2/08, tgregmrtn@ <tgregmrtn@> wrote:
Mike,

As I recall raising the tables for the meet was a big hit. I
am
not sure if the manufaturers would appreciate the difference or
not
but the modelers sure did.

Greg Martin


-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Brock <brockm@>
To: STMFC@... <mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sun, 1 Jun 2008 7:56 pm
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: NE prototype modelers meet






Dave Owens writes:

"Our model room is a gathering place -- people come in, sit
down,
shoot
the breeze, etc. Raising the tables would hamper that.

Otherwise, it's a fine idea. They do it that way at the
Philadelphia proto
meet."

This last Jan was the first time we raised the tables which
we
did for model
displays. We did not for manufacturers or dealers. It worked
out
quite well.
No complaints that I'm aware of.

Mike Brock









------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links




--
2009 New England/Northeast Prototype Modelers Meet
May 29-30, 2009, Collinsville, CT
www.neprototypemeet.com


Correction to SR flat car web link

Jim King
 

Bob Harpe noted correctly that my page link was missing the "l" in the
suffix. To link directly to the page to view the S scale Southern Ry. 41'6"
flat car pilot model, related history and pricing, go here:



http://www.smokymountainmodelworks.com/sscalesou42'flat.html



Let's try this again!



Jim King

Smoky Mountain Model Works, Inc.

www.smokymountainmodelworks.com


Re: J & L Steel and Koppers Coal Car Tank Cars

Larry Kline
 

Jamie Toman wrote:
Does anyone know were I could find out about J & L Steel and Koppers
Coal Car Tank Cars? I have one good pic of a J & L one, need some
more photos or info on them. I know 3RD Rail makes them in brass in O-
Scale. Did they have an "A" or "B" end markings or which end was it?
I know they had handbrakes on both ends.

The latest issue of the P&LE RR Historical Society magazine *The
Little Giant* includes an article with three 1958 photos of J&L coal
tar tankcar 1022 which was part of a derailment in 1958, color photo
of an indentified J&L coal tar tankcar, and the builder's photo that
was in the cyclopedias. These cars were painted black in the 1950s.

There are drawings for these cars in the April 1956 Model Railroader.

The magazine, Vol. 3 No. 3 is available from the Society store. Send
request for TLG V3 N3 and a check for $6.95 to:
P&LERRHS
PO Box 15512
Pittsburgh, PA 15244

Larry Kline
Pittsburgh, PA


Re: ADMIN: Re: Re: Color Matching for Freight Cars

Mike Brock <brockm@...>
 

Dave Nelson writes:

"May I suggest you keep the above handy for whenever the topic of color comes
up again."

I know the rules by heart. I will say, however, that even within scope threads can be terminated if they produce "diminishing returns".

Mike Brock
STMFC Owner


Re: NE prototype modelers meet

Mike Brock <brockm@...>
 

Walter Clark writes:

"With all the discussion(s) about color I'm going to ask a very
subjective question. When you take a model to Naperville or Cocoa
Beach or ? has anyone had a problem with the lighting "shifting" the
color? As in, what looked "right" at home wound up being anything but
right under the lighting in the display room? I'm asking because I
might be able to get to both Naperville and Cocoa Beach this winter
and before I pack up my pride and joy to show off I'd like to know if
my "Metallic" (SP "Boxcar Red") B-50-? would look purple (for
instance) under the lighting in the display room."

I don't know. I'm color blind.

Mike Brock <G>


Re: Etched Brass instead of Scribed Siding

Bruce Smith
 

On Jun 6, 2008, at 6:56 AM, jerryglow2 wrote:

And it's even more trouble to paint to look like wood than plastic. I
did a couple Overland bulkhead flats for a customer when painting
commercially and it was no fun. The most fun of the project was
removing the decking from the bulkheads and replacing it with
individual slats of stryene some missing and or broken.

Jerry Glow
Jerry, folks,

Here is what I did for my brass F22 flats (Crown Custom, nee Railworks). The decks were already painted PRR FCC, so I painted individual boards with Poly Scale mud, roof brown and RR tie brown (the later two looked identical to me). I painted 1 or 2 boards in each color, randomly shifting the pattern. I did NOT worry too much about neatness. The results were really stark, so I painted the entire deck with several washes of RR Tie Brown to blend the colors, and a final wash of grimy black to pop the details... It looks pretty good, for a brass deck, but I'll have to say.......................... (since I'm bored of the paint discussion and we haven't had the wood deck discussion in, well, it seems like years)

Nothing looks more like a wood deck than wood! (There, that should stir the pot <VBG>)

Regards
Bruce

Bruce F. Smith
Auburn, AL
http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/index.pl/bruce_f._smith2

"Some days you are the bug, some days you are the windshield."
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