--- In STMFC@..., richtownsend@... wrote:

When you look on eBay, check under Revell, too, since Revell was the

original manufacturer of this kit.






There is a pair up for auction as we speak...eBay item #140234183080


John Hile
Blacksburg, VA

The fact that there were customs and "red tape" problems IMO was the
fault of the NMRA not recognizing it but it's in the past hopefully
not to reoccur. On the smaller "grass roots" level, I can attest to
Intermountain (and others) attending ProtoRails in Cocoa Beach and IM
even attending a Regional meet in Florida last weekend. I think the
opportunity to talk it up with the real hands on modelers is time
well spent.

Jerry Glow

--- In STMFC@..., "Charlie Vlk" <cvlk@...> wrote:

I was working for Kato at the time and there were other issues

involved beyond rash decisions based on rumor....

The customs situation (not exclusively on the Canadian side of the

border either) made bringing commercial displays extremely expensive,
cumbersome and subject to a lot of extra work to inventory and
document everything.

Companies had to worry about Potential liability for their

employees. Added to the hassle of the customs it was a rational
business decision/excuse for many of the exhibitors to take a pass on
the NMRA Train Show and reallocate the money to other venues.

Even without the border and SARS issues some NMRA Shows may be

judged as marginal.....not all the cities that have to be included
for fairness reasons are winners for Train Shows. Some manufactuers
are foregoing the big shows (NMRA, iHobby, etc.) for more regional
shows where a broader audience than the usual cast of characters
attend. Milwaukee's TrainFest and the Springfield Show are examples
of lower-cost opportunities to get a broader exposure to existing and
potential consumers....for some manufactuers the Prototype Modelers
give excellent "bang for the buck" and provide an opportunity for
quality face time with their independent researchers and high-end
customers.

Charlie Vlk


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Garth,

Thanks for the response. I need to clarify what I meant. My comment
was meant to indicate my disagreement over the time period of this
photo with some of the other members of the historical society. I know
it was a shipment of Fords - I strongly suspect this was not during
the war but instead shows an overseas shipment of autos in the years
after the war. In any event, would make a neat string of cars to
model.

I do find it odd war production materiel -- Willys or Ford Jeeps or
otherwise -- would be shipped in a crate marked "Ford" whereas the
vast majority of war materiel I've seen being loaded onto ships was
devoid of the manufacturer's name or logo. I have a similiar photo
showing a shipment of aircraft engines being loaded into a boxcar at
the P&W factory and the crates have some stencilling on them, but not
a "company" logo or even name.


Marty McGuirk

Also, do these boxcars have cast-on grabs & ladders like most (all?)
Accurail cars?

Rob Simpson


--- In STMFC@..., "Garth G. Groff" <ggg9y@...> wrote:

Bob,

They have to be considered stand-ins. Yes, the PE had similar

boxcars (SP design, except for the special brake rigging for tight
curves), but you would do better to track down the Sunshine resin
kits.

Kind regards,


Garth G. Groff

Bob Chaparro wrote:

Alpine Scale Models has partnered with Accurail to offer two

outside braced boxcars as can be view on the following links.

http://www.alpinemodels.com/catalog/item/5258330/5385147.htm

http://www.alpinemodels.com/catalog/item/5258330/5385134.htm

Can anyone tell me if there were actual Pacific Electric

prototypes for

these models?

Thank you.

Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA

Bob Chaparro asked:
"Alpine Scale Models has partnered with Accurail to offer two outside
braced boxcars as can be view on the following links.

http://www.alpinemodels.com/catalog/item/5258330/5385147.htm

http://www.alpinemodels.com/catalog/item/5258330/5385134.htm

Can anyone tell me if there were actual Pacific Electric prototypes for
these models?"

PE 10000-10399, Class B-50-14. The Accurail models are stand-ins;
these prototypes had radial roofs.


Ben Hom

I was working for Kato at the time and there were other issues involved beyond rash decisions based on rumor....

The customs situation (not exclusively on the Canadian side of the border either) made bringing commercial displays extremely expensive, cumbersome and subject to a lot of extra work to inventory and document everything.

Companies had to worry about Potential liability for their employees. Added to the hassle of the customs it was a rational business decision/excuse for many of the exhibitors to take a pass on the NMRA Train Show and reallocate the money to other venues.

Even without the border and SARS issues some NMRA Shows may be judged as marginal.....not all the cities that have to be included for fairness reasons are winners for Train Shows. Some manufactuers are foregoing the big shows (NMRA, iHobby, etc.) for more regional shows where a broader audience than the usual cast of characters attend. Milwaukee's TrainFest and the Springfield Show are examples of lower-cost opportunities to get a broader exposure to existing and potential consumers....for some manufactuers the Prototype Modelers give excellent "bang for the buck" and provide an opportunity for quality face time with their independent researchers and high-end customers.

Charlie Vlk

Bob,

They have to be considered stand-ins. Yes, the PE had similar boxcars (SP design, except for the special brake rigging for tight curves), but you would do better to track down the Sunshine resin kits.

Kind regards,


Garth G. Groff

Bob Chaparro wrote:

Bob,

You need a copy of Tony Thompson's book on SP Boxcars and all your questions will be answered.

Jim Scott
Lompoc, CA.

Alpine Scale Models has partnered with Accurail to offer two outside
braced boxcars as can be view on the following links.

http://www.alpinemodels.com/catalog/item/5258330/5385147.htm

http://www.alpinemodels.com/catalog/item/5258330/5385134.htm

Can anyone tell me if there were actual Pacific Electric prototypes for
these models?

Thank you.

Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA

CVSNE,

They were probably marked "Ford" because Ford built the greatest number of Jeeps during WWII, not Willys. American Bantam, which more or less invented the Jeep, built only a few prototypes. AB was given the contract for trailers to tow behind the vehicle they had developed.

Kind regards,


Garth

cvsne wrote:

Al, this is later than the Model T era - I don't have a date on the
photo but believe it was taken around WWII. Some of the guys in the
CV Historical Society mentioned they thought these were Jeeps being
loaded for shipment from New London. (War materiel was shipped from
New London - and German POWs from Rommel's Afrika Korps arrived in
New London and went north on the CV to camps in Canada.) But if
these were Jeeps why would they be marked "Ford"?? That doesn't make
any sense.





--- In STMFC@..., water.kresse@... wrote:

They boxed up Fords and other autos for overseas shipments. What

year was it? There are images of Model Ts being disassembled for
crating for overseas shipment on the Model T Forum Website. I've
pix of creates of Buicks in Pere Marquette gons for shipment
overseas after WW2.

Al Kresse
-------------- Original message --------------
From: STMFC@...

Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the STMFC
group.

File : /yard - NH to right137.jpg
Uploaded by : cvsne <mjmcguirk@...>
Description : New London CT - note Ford crates on gondolas. What

would these be carrying? These are on approach tracks to the CV pier
in New London.

You can access this file at the URL:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/STMFC/files/yard%20-%20NH%20%20to%

20right137.jpg

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:

http://help.yahoo.com/l/us/yahoo/groups/original/members/web/index.ht
mlfiles

Regards,

cvsne <mjmcguirk@...>





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

I have posted to the photos section scans of photos from a scrapbook of CB&Q furniture cars being repainted for two different
owners by the Grace Tank Car Lines. They were a family-owned lessor of tank cars and used equipment broker.
From a stencil on the end view of one of the cars it appears this took place at Aurora in August of 1927. I have no idea of
who the lessees were or what the original CB&Q numbers were. It appears that at least four different cars were involved,
perhaps more.
Charlie Vlk

They boxed up Fords and other autos for overseas shipments. What year was it? There are images of Model Ts being disassembled for crating for overseas shipment on the Model T Forum Website. I've pix of creates of Buicks in Pere Marquette gons for shipment overseas after WW2.

Al Kresse

On May 21, 2008, at 10:11 AM, benjaminfrank_hom wrote:

Al Kresse asked:
"Were not the GTW and NYC flats longer than 56-ft >> maybe 65-70-ft
long or so?"

I can't speak for any possible experimental GTW racks, but the NYC
flats were 53 ft 6 in flats:
NYC 500085, Lot 793-F
http://www.canadasouthern.com/caso/NYC-EARLY-AUTORACK-STORY.jpg
http://www.canadasouthern.com/caso/images/lot-793.jpg
http://www.canadasouthern.com/caso/NYC-MODELS-FREIGHT.htm

At least one additional car received a slightly different rack design
which the Athearn rack appears to be based upon. I don't have the
citation handy, but a photo of this car ran as the last page of Scale
Rails/NMRA Bulletin a few years ago.

The RPI pay site has photos of bilevel auto-racks on NYC and UP flat cars. If you're a member, you can see these at:
http://railroad.union.rpi.edu/displayimage.php?i=33485
http://railroad.union.rpi.edu/displayimage.php?i=33484

However, the original question asked about TOFC auto carriers (ie autos on truck trailers in turn on flat cars), and frankly, I'm not sure that ever occurred, or if it did, it was both extremely rare and after the time-frame of this list.

Regards
Bruce

Bruce F. Smith
Auburn, AL
http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/index.pl/bruce_f._smith2

"Some days you are the bug, some days you are the windshield."
__
/ &#92;
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|- ______/ O O &#92;_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ |
| / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 &#92; | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||
|/_____________________________&#92;|_|________________________________|
| O--O &#92;0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0

Hello,

This email message is a notification to let you know that
a file has been uploaded to the Files area of the STMFC
group.

File : /yard - NH to right137.jpg
Uploaded by : cvsne <mjmcguirk@...>
Description : New London CT - note Ford crates on gondolas. What would these be carrying? These are on approach tracks to the CV pier in New London.

You can access this file at the URL:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/STMFC/files/yard%20-%20NH%20%20to%20right137.jpg

To learn more about file sharing for your group, please visit:
http://help.yahoo.com/l/us/yahoo/groups/original/members/web/index.htmlfiles

Regards,

cvsne <mjmcguirk@...>

Brian Ehni wrote:

"P.S. I seem to be unable to post messages here and on PCL via email; I have to come to the web site; anyone else having problems?"

I had problems last night with pretty much all Yahoo forums (and with Yahoo e-mail to boot), but it seems like it's working now.

CJM

--- In STMFC@..., "leakinmywaders" <leakinmywaders@...>
wrote:

Erie 40 ft, 10ft4in IH steel boxcars 96700-96899, built by Magor in
1936 had an unusual end referred to as a "Reverse Buckeye

end....... original

ends and Viking roofs, and in some cases their early Youngstown
(Camel?) 5/6/5 doors. Two modeling-related questions:

1) Before I plunge into an anticipated scratchbuild of these ends,
anyone know if some Erie niche modeler has already built HO scale
masters and had them cast in resin?

Chris- These cars had "Buckeye steel ends" when built, not reverse
Buckeye. You can check the diagrams on the fallen flags site (these
were originally double door box cars). As to the ends being available
in HO you are in luck. Sunshine had them (or a similiar, shortened
version) in their models of 78,000-78,499 box cars. Red Ball had them
in both metal and plastic (maybe for a 10'4" car). Roller Bearing had
them in resin (not sure what height the car was). F&C may have
shorter Buckeye ends on their Erie/B&M milk cars (couldn't see the
ends in the photo on their web site but the original Yankee Clipper
box car kits had correct Buckeye ends).

There are plans for similar Erie double door box cars in the 1940 Car
Builders Cyclopedia.

Ed

When you look on eBay, check under Revell, too, since Revell was the original manufacturer of this kit.


Richard Townsend
Lincoln City, Oregon

Al Kresse asked:
"Were not the GTW and NYC flats longer than 56-ft >> maybe 65-70-ft
long or so?"

I can't speak for any possible experimental GTW racks, but the NYC
flats were 53 ft 6 in flats:
NYC 500085, Lot 793-F
http://www.canadasouthern.com/caso/NYC-EARLY-AUTORACK-STORY.jpg
http://www.canadasouthern.com/caso/images/lot-793.jpg
http://www.canadasouthern.com/caso/NYC-MODELS-FREIGHT.htm

At least one additional car received a slightly different rack design
which the Athearn rack appears to be based upon. I don't have the
citation handy, but a photo of this car ran as the last page of Scale
Rails/NMRA Bulletin a few years ago.


Ben Hom

Al:



The title is "NEW CAR CARRIERS" "1910 - 1998 Photo Album" by Donald F. Wood
ISBN 1-882256-98-0. This is an excellent book as Tim stated and it has a
picture of a Southern Pacific (PMT) tractor and auto carrier trailer on the
cover.



Paul C. Koehler



_____

From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of
water.kresse@...
Sent: Wednesday, May 21, 2008 7:18 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] 1950's Auto Transport Trailers



Tim,

I pondered over that statement. Rail (auto-rack box cars) was ramping down
and truck haulage was ramping up. They had some beautiful trailers with
enclosing sheet metal for hauling autos in those early-1950s days. The C&O
was still adding or converting 50-ft Auto-Rack box cars in 1948.

If you look up that Iconografix book title (or get a brain flash) I would
appreciate it.

Al Kresse