So the NG lines (which could still use K brakes) must have been able
to pick up good used brake parts cheap in the early 50s.

regards,

Andy Miller

On Jul 31, 2007, at 9:09 AM, Bruce Smith wrote:

On Jul 31, 2007, at 10:36 AM, Norm wrote:

> The ultimate usage for the info is to determine which type of brake
> gear to put on a kitbashed -- but plausible -- narrow gauge
> short line caboose for a similarly mythical but plausible line
> running from the interior to the coast of Maine in 1940.
>
> What I'd like to find is some sort of chart or descriptive info
> showing the differences between the various types of gear: K vs.
> KC vs. AB and the years of usage.

Norm,

Um... as to the latter -
K - from around 1900 to now (banned in interchange 1953)
AB - from around 1931 to now (required on all newly built cars in
1933)

Close. K brakes were banned in interchange in August, 1953. AB brakes
were installed experimentally as early as 1931 but not required on new
construction until 1934. After that, AB equipment was supposed to be
applied on older cars whenever they received major repairs or
rebuilding, but many car owners ignored that requirement through the
1930s and early 1940s owing to depression-era economics and then to
World War II shortages of materials. There was a big scramble in the
early 1950s to replace K brakes with ABs on older cars before the 8/53
deadline. Also, narrow gauge lines weren't covered by the 8/53
interchange rule and so never converted to AB equipment. The
hypothetical caboose in question would almost certainly have had K
brakes in 1940 (possibly KDs if mounting space under the car were
limited).

Richard Hendrickson

Thanks Tim, that's one of the few Cyc's I have.

Richard Wilkens

--- In STMFC@..., Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:

There is a builder's photograph and diagram of UP 68100 in
the 1961 Car Builder's Cyclopedia, page 304.

Tim O'

--------------------------------------------------------------------

Trying to locate some historical info on three freight cars at

the

Yakima Valley Trolleys Museum in Washington State.

UP 68130 - Union Pacific Tankcar built May 1958, Class O-50-7,

ICC

103AW. This was brought to the YVT after the eruption of Mount

St.

Helens to clear ash. Again any info on builder, register page
drawing, and what service was this car used in.

Thanks,

Richard Wilkens

Hi Richard

An equipment drawing for this car series is in Jim
Ehernberger's "Union Pacific Freight Car Diagrams Circa 1979,

Volume

#2": Built by GATC 1958, 50 cars in series 68100-68149; Acid

Service

(Spec. 103A-W); Diagram F-13-14, Drawn 10-14-59.

I don't know what you mean by "register page drawing", but if you
contact me off list I can send you a scan of this diagram.

Best wishes,
Larry Ostresh
Laramie, WY

On Jul 31, 2007, at 10:36 AM, Norm wrote:

The ultimate usage for the info is to determine which type of brake gear to put on a kitbashed -- but plausible -- narrow gauge
short line caboose for a similarly mythical but plausible line running from the interior to the coast of Maine in 1940.

What I'd like to find is some sort of chart or descriptive info showing the differences between the various types of gear: K vs.
KC vs. AB and the years of usage.

Norm,

Um... as to the latter -
K - from around 1900 to now (banned in interchange 1953)
AB - from around 1931 to now (required on all newly built cars in 1933)

Just because K brakes were banned from INTERCHANGE, it does not mean that they disappeared. In fact, there are museum cars with functioning K brakes in service, and certainly for years after the interchange deadline, RRs had MOW and company service cars with K brakes.

As to your first question, the KC and KD were simply variations of the K brake. The KC was the combined type where the reservoir and cylinder were together and the KD was the "split" type where the reservoir and cylinder were separate. Application of the split K systems was usually due to space issues, although the PRR seems to have been very fond of the KD for almost all situations.

Regards
Bruce

Bruce F. Smith
Auburn, AL
http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/index.pl/bruce_f._smith2

"Some days you are the bug, some days you are the windshield."
__
/ &#92;
__<+--+>________________&#92;__/___ ________________________________
|- ______/ O O &#92;_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ |
| / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 &#92; | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||
|/_____________________________&#92;|_|________________________________|
| O--O &#92;0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0

Four of the last five messages are in violation of STMFC rules. Members ARE required to sign messages with their full name...first and last.

As an alternative, members may elect to have an Email address in which their full name is positioned to the left of the "@" sign. Failure to follow this simple rule...as I've said many times, even I know my first AND last name...will as of now result in being placed in Moderate Jail. This is not a good thing because not only the food is bad [ I prepare it ], but your messages may not be approved for days. So, for those that either don't know your last name, can't remember it or simply can't spell it, do your homework and find it. Thanks.

Sigh.

Mike Brock...becoming more and more appreciative of my second grade teacher
STMFC Owner

The ultimate usage for the info is to determine which type of brake gear to put on a kitbashed -- but plausible -- narrow gauge short line caboose for a similarly mythical but plausible line running from the interior to the coast of Maine in 1940.

What I'd like to find is some sort of chart or descriptive info showing the differences between the various types of gear: K vs. KC vs. AB and the years of usage.

TIA
Norm

Well I have one more car I'm trying to find the history of. Boxcar MKT
100248 is at the Yakima Electric Railway Museum and is used for
storage. The car shows being built in 2-1960 and was last in a reddish
orange paint scheme. The car was last used in MOW service and the in
service reporting marks were painted over.

Any chance someone could help with the builder, in service number, and
diagram page?

Thanks.

Richard

"Mike Brock" <brockm@...> wrote:

Rome,
Very interesting message and entirely within scope.
About how long did it take to change out a "brass"?
Mike Brock
STMFC Owner

Mike and Gang,

at Steamtown one day the 1246 got a hotbox on the engineers side of
the tender, I think it was on the rear truck. The bearing had failed,
but the axle was OK. We ran up to the shop area and the mechanical
forces changed out the bearing between the scheduled trips, all told,
about half an hour or so. And of course it was a rainy day...

I had forgotten that in addition to the bottle jack, there is another
piece of metal used shaped like a lazy Z, about 6" wide, and about
1/2" thick rolled steel. One end rests on the tie (or work surface in
a shop area), you then place the bottle jack on it, and the other end
has a large set screw and rests on the rim of the wheel. This keeps
the wheel and axle from lifting off the rail as you are jacking up the
box.

Glad you enjoyed this!

Rome

--- In STMFC@..., "Rome" <r111369@...> wrote:

Fellow Freight Car Historians,

My personal experiences and observations of inspecting journals

were a

bit different than discussed here, but I am sure that it varied from
region to region. Over the early years of my career a Rutland car
inspector and hostler, a CB&Q hostler, and a museum CMO who was

taught

by a DL&W hostler (later senior engineer on the Phoebe Snow) taught

me.

We used two "hooks" for inspecting and servicing the journals, the
first was an actual hook about three feet long for reaching into the
back corners of the boxes and pulling wedges. The second was also
about three feet long and is a bit hard to explain in that it had a
slight bend in the middle, keeping the ends parallel. This bend

made

it easier to fluff the waste or pads, and made it easier to stuff

new

packing or pads into the box. A small piece of metal with a curled
end was welded onto the back of the hook for opening the journal

box lids.

http://americanhistory.si.edu/ONTHEMOVE/collection/object_130.html

I was instructed to never contact the axle with the hooks or any

other

metal tool...

And my job in those days as a carman was to take those wheelsets or
loose axles and mount them in a journal lathe to restore the worn
journals and torn up dust guards to good working condition. It was
pretty easy to tell what sort of damage had occured in service, a
yellowish or brownish tinge would indicate that the journal had
overheated or in a car fire, and an "RJ" cold stamped on the end of
the axle would confirm overheated for certain. Pitting and/or water
etching in the journal surface was a sure sign of the results of a
damaged dust guard seal allowing moisture in and the car sitting on a
siding that way. And long scratches lengthwise in the journal surface
was an obvious sign of an overzealous or careless car knocker or
whoever. Sometimes the surface of the journal looked like the metal
had "smeared" somehow, and there were fillets that just looked like
the brass was eating its way towards the center of the axle for some
reason. A bent axle was always a possibility, you checked that with a
metal device shaped like a divining rod, placing the top of the "Y"
on the center of the axle and rubbing the leg against the machine bed
as the axle turned. That would scrape a shiny section on to the leg
of the metal rod and you could measure it...over 3/8" and the axle
was history. Derailment wheels sets were always interesting, amazing
the damage that can be done to solid metal during a derailment.
Anyway, cut out the defects from the journal and the dust guard, and
then coat it with journal oil mixed with lard oil or solvent and then
clamp the rollers in place and roll the machined surface of the
journals, which made it smooth as glass. Check the measurements and
remove it from the lathe and send it on to the magnaflux machines to
check for cracks. If they had any cracks in them, you'd take it back
to turn it down again, until either the cracks came out of it or it
went scrap due to small diameter or too long of journal length. Then
clean it, coat the journals and dust guards with cosmoline or asphalt
cutback, stencil the UT information on the axle and grind out any
gouges from the axle body, and send it back out for service...

There is a builder's photograph and diagram of UP 68100 in
the 1961 Car Builder's Cyclopedia, page 304.

Tim O'

--------------------------------------------------------------------

I have not bought any Sunshine kits for a couple of years but the last
ones I bought (Bethlehem gons) were a little light on intructions.

Some of the members of this group are personally acquainted with the
owner of Sunshine.

Could you gents suggest that they might sell a few more kits if the
instructions were more detailed?

It must be pretty discouraging for a beginner (or first time resin
builder) to buy a Sunshine kit from an ad in a magazine and then have
questions about how to assemble the kit.

F&C kits suffer from the same short comings. Surprising to me the
original Yankee Clipper instructions were much more detailed.

Ed

What's your point Bill? How do you think we all get Star
paints from California? Pony Express?

Hello Brian,

I haven't built the Sunshine kit you ask about, but I often use thin strips
of styrene to shim parts that are too narrow or too short for a good fit.
Make sure the edge is square, stick the styrene strip in place with super
glue, and trim the styrene to length. It's actually best if the styrene
makes the part a little too wide or too long, because then you can sand it
to the perfect size.

Sometimes a part has a slight curve, and adding styrene strips can provide
enough extra material to let you sand it to a straight edge while
maintaining the desired width.

I'll be talking about techniques like these in a workshop at Naperville this
fall.

Good luck,

Andy

Andy Sperandeo
Executive Editor
Model Railroader magazine
asperandeo@...
262-796-8776, ext. 461
FAX 262-796-1142

--- In STMFC@..., "railsnw1" <railsnw@...> wrote:

Hello,

Trying to locate some historical info on three freight cars at the
Yakima Valley Trolleys Museum in Washington State.

UP 68130 - Union Pacific Tankcar built May 1958, Class O-50-7, ICC
103AW. This was brought to the YVT after the eruption of Mount St.
Helens to clear ash. Again any info on builder, register page
drawing, and what service was this car used in.

Thanks,

Richard Wilkens

Hi Richard

An equipment drawing for this car series is in Jim
Ehernberger's "Union Pacific Freight Car Diagrams Circa 1979, Volume
#2": Built by GATC 1958, 50 cars in series 68100-68149; Acid Service
(Spec. 103A-W); Diagram F-13-14, Drawn 10-14-59.

I don't know what you mean by "register page drawing", but if you
contact me off list I can send you a scan of this diagram.

Best wishes,
Larry Ostresh
Laramie, WY

timboconnor@... wrote:

I just noticed that PWRS stocks and sells Accupaint mail-order... and they appear
to have most of the colors in stock.
http://www.pacific-western-rail.com/product_search.php?f_ProductTypes=null&f_Keywords=accu-paints
Tim O'Connor

Only one item shows as "In Stock" the rest show 'Available'.
Makes me think that "Available' means Available to order. An email would be in order before getting your hopes up. They don't have a magic line to Accupaint.

As they are solvent based paints they cannot be mailed! They must be shipped surface. Of course you could ignore the rules but if the Post Office catches you, you won't be mailing anything again.

Bill Dixon

Don't be put off by the opening page, click on the Planes/Trains/Ships link on the left.

Cool graphics from railroads, most in the steam era . . .


N.B. These are NOT inexpensive, but they ARE originals. I've seen them firsthand. And they are beautiful.



http://www.nancysteinbockposters.com/

SGL
La vita e breve, mangiate prima il dolce!

I looked at the kit some more tonight, The inside of the sides has a rivet
strip near the bottom. I think the steel floor should be immediately below
this row of rivets. However in order to put the underframe in the correct
location, it looks like I need to remove 1/2 to 3/4 of the "subfloor"
thickness (solid "floor" cast with the underframe. The instructions do not
indicate this and neither the prototype nor model photo's provide much
guidance. Complicating the fact if my underframe is about a 1/16 short in
length so I can't get a tight fit with the sides. If I put the underframe
bolsters level with the bottom of the sides the floor cast with the
underframe is directly in line with the aforementioned rivet detail
resulting in a poor fit between the underframe and sides. I'm sure others
have built these gons did anyone else have this problem I have?

Brian J Carlson P.E.
Cheektowaga NY

I just noticed that PWRS stocks and sells Accupaint mail-order... and they appear
to have most of the colors in stock.

http://www.pacific-western-rail.com/product_search.php?f_ProductTypes=null&f_Keywords=accu-paints

Tim O'Connor

I'll soon begin building the sunshine kit for the WLE/NKP 41' fixed end gon,
kit 67.12. I have cleaned up the major castings, there are only 3. My
question involves fitting the floor casting to the side and end one piece
casting. I want to be sure on a point of reference for the floor casting
since it is thin and flexible. The bolster caster should be even with the
bottom of the side, correct? It appears that way in the one photo of the
P&WV gon in the instructions. I figure if I get the bolsters in the right
location the rest of the underframe will be easier. Thanks.
Brian J Carlson P.E.
Cheektowaga NY

Bill:

Please add e the list for or for sale freight car kits.

Thanks,

Max S. Robin, P.E.
M_robin@...