I'd like to do at least one Soo Line 40' steel boxcar with 6' door for
my railroad, but don't have a huge amount of research material handy
to pull this off without at least a little input from the list. I'd
like to model a car as it appeared in the *late* steam era with the
billboard lettering.

Hope this question isn't too broad.

Any suggestions for what available plastic kit from Branchline,
Intermountain or Red Caboose would be most appropriate? Looking at an
ORER there are a ton of number series to choose from, but I'm unclear
as to combination of car end, door, roof, etc. I suppose I'd like to
model a *common* series of cars--perhaps the 10'6" 1951 cars built by
North Fond du Lac shops?

Thanks in advance for advice/help.

--blair kooistra
fort worth, TX

Attaching corner grabs to Plano laterals:

Hoo boy, what a pain that is. The open-grid pattern and the expanded
pattern, and maybe the Morton, have the three attachment holes etched.
But, they're too small. Now I should know better, but early on I just
drilled those out. Took me a half-hour per hole, and a drill bit
barely lasted through one pair of laterals. Worse, the hole at the
left edge of the lateral is on top of the brass frame provided. So, I
do an inaccurate thing and force the grab through one of the slots
adjacent to the proper hole. I use a Detail Associates 2206 eyebolt
for the corner attachment.
But, and this is a large but, I trim the grab legs and the eyebolt so
they just barely go through toe lateral. That way there's no chance of
them anchoring to the roof and forming that incredibly rigid attachment
that causes the bowing of the roofwalk proper due to thermal
contraction.
There's more to this, but that's the heart of the matter.

Ron Merrick


--- In STMFC@..., "Schuyler Larrabee"
<schuyler.larrabee@...> wrote:

<snip>

But nobody's hit on the second question: How do you all handle

attaching the corner grabs to Plano

lateral roofwalks?

I've developed a repeatable "method" but I'm willing to bet that it's

not the best way . . .so, how

do you perform this feat?

SGL

But nobody's hit on the second question: How do you all
handle attaching the corner grabs to Plano lateral roofwalks?

I've developed a repeatable "method" but I'm willing to
bet that it's not the best way . . .so, how do you perform
this feat?

Schuyler -
My technique involves popping them out of a pair of tweezers and never
finding them again. (I did hear them hit once, but I'm not quite sure
where.) As you might guess, the results are less than optimal and I'm still
searching the recesses of my modeling desk. As one who adheres to the "two
square foot" theory, this becomes quite a challenge.<G>

Perhaps you'll share your method and I can have greater success. Is Keith
Hapes over on Modern Freightcars? Perhaps asking there might get a reply
from the master.<BG>

Dan Stinson
Helena, Montana

Even some of the most chaotic and poorly maintained museums can be used as an adjunct to successful modeling of freight cars. Here are some of the things to look for at Billy-Bob's Rail Museum and Souvenir Stand.

1. If the rolling stock is out in the open, you can get some shots of extreme weathering.
2. Snoop around the lower depths, you may find some of the original hardware kicking about even on that pink freight car.
3. With digital cameras you can take tons of shots to take back and analyze later to see if it passes the hogwash test.
4. Look how the light and shadows play across the cars, I often do shelve layouts and I've been strongly tempted to paint in the shadows so that cars can't be turned around but will look great!
5. If worse comes to worse, you will absolutely see how NOT to do things.

Just don't use it as your final authority unless you have no other options.

Jim Eckman

Hi. In regard to Tom Olsen's message of Monday, May 22
quoted below:

I sent an email to Aaron Gjermundson at the email listed on
his website inquiring about the availability of the "30 sets
of castings" that Tom Madden said he was doing for Aaron.
He
responded within a few days that they were there and
available. I sent a check for three on May 8 and received
them in the mail Monday, May 22. The castings are terrific
and the new
wood deck by Bruce Barney and Ken Van Wormer adds a great
touch, too.

Exemplary communication and service, I think.

Cheers,
David Turner
Keeping S. P. & S. Rwy. alive in Santa Rosa, California


From: "Thomas M. Olsen" tmolsen@...
Date: Mon May 22, 2006 9:53pm(PDT)
Subject: Re: Northern Specific Models NP Flat Car

List,

Recently there was a discussion regarding Aaron
Gjermundson's new NP
flat car and some people having sent money for the kit,
but not hearing
or receiving theirs. I would like to say that I sent
for three of the
kits on March 29th and received them this past
Saturday, May 19th. The
only delay was how long it took for Tom Madden to
complete the castings,
get them to Aaron and for Aaron to reach my name in the
queue!

I must say that I am impressed with the quality of the
castings. It
appears that Aaron has learned from his earlier
mistakes and has his
operation up to speed. I wonder what he has in mind
for an encore after
this model?

Tom Olsen

(NOTE: This my second attempt to send this message, if I was
misinformed and the first one did get through, please accept
my apology for the extra bandwidth.)

OK, so I now have more information about the clearances and proper dimensions for grabirons than I
ever thought of knowing . . .

Thanks, one and all . . .

But nobody's hit on the second question: How do you all handle attaching the corner grabs to Plano
lateral roofwalks?

I've developed a repeatable "method" but I'm willing to bet that it's not the best way . . .so, how
do you perform this feat?

SGL

Hi. In regard to Tom Olsen's message of Monday, May 22
quoted below:

I sent an email to Aaron Gjermundson at the email listed on
his website inquiring about the availability of the "30 sets
of castings" that Tom Madden said he was doing for Aaron.
He responded within a few days that they were there and
available. I sent a check for three on May 8 and received
them in the mail Monday, May 22. The castings are terrific
and the new wood deck by Bruce Barney and Ken Van Wormer
adds a great touch, too.

Exemplary communication and service, I think.

Cheers,
David Turner
Keeping S. P. & S. Rwy. alive in Santa Rosa, California


From: "Thomas M. Olsen" tmolsen@...
Date: Mon May 22, 2006 9:53pm(PDT)
Subject: Re: Northern Specific Models NP Flat Car

List,

Recently there was a discussion regarding Aaron
Gjermundson's new NP
flat car and some people having sent money for the
kit, but not hearing
or receiving theirs. I would like to say that I
sent for three of the
kits on March 29th and received them this past
Saturday, May 19th. The
only delay was how long it took for Tom Madden to
complete the castings,
get them to Aaron and for Aaron to reach my name
in the queue!

I must say that I am impressed with the quality of
the castings. It
appears that Aaron has learned from his earlier
mistakes and has his
operation up to speed. I wonder what he has in
mind for an encore after
this model?

Tom Olsen

Tentative Schedule for 2006 New England/Northeast Prototype Modelers Meet

Folks:
The 2006 New England/Northeast Prototype Modelers Meet is less than a
month away. We've been working to line up a great array of clinics,
vendors and manufacturers.

The meet is Friday and Saturday, June 2-3 at the Canton Community
Center, 40 Dyer Ave., Collinsville, Connecticut

For information, contact neprotomeet@... or Dave Owens at 860-233-0303.

To register, send a check payable to NE Proto Meet to Fran Richard, 34
Ellsworth Road, West Hartford, CT 06107. The meet costs $20 in advance
and $25 at the door.

Here is the tentative schedule. Please note that it is subject to change.

Thursday evening, June 1:

Open house and tours at Branchline Trains, East Hartford, Connecticut
Contact Dave Owens and neprotomeet@... for directions and to
register.

Friday, June 2:

8 a.m.
Meet registration and model setup.

9 a.m.
John Orofino
Making Plastic Structure Kits Look Great – John, an architect, will
show what he does to make inexpensive plastic structure kits look like
craftsman kits.

Tom Murray
Modeling Amtrak – Tom is one our meet organizers and a rabid Amtrak
modeler. Ever wonder which paint phase fits your era? What locos fit
your era? Why Bachmann Amfleet cars are actually better than Walthers?
Tom will tell ya'.

10:30 a.m.
John Sacerdote
Hand-laying track. John will share the experience he gained installing
hand-laid track on his home layout.

Neil Gage
Modeling Military Freight Car Loads – Anyone who's been to the West
Springfield show has been treated to Neil's magnificent models of
1970s and World War II era trains hauling tanks, trucks and other
equipment.

Noon – Lunch

1 p.m.
Mike Rose
Tree Making – Mike will lead a hands-on clinic on making the kinds of
trees he's been using to fill his layout. The clinic has an additional
charge of $5 to cover materials and participants can expect to take
home a few trees. Pre-registration is urged as space and materials are
limited.

2:30 p.m.
George Barrett
Bodies, Trailers and Loads – George, owner of Sheepscot Models, has
given a clinic each year on vehicle modeling. This year's is the next
progression in that series.

Bill Schaumburg
Using Photos and Documents from Archives to Model a Prototype Scene –
Bill, editor of Railroad Model Craftsman, will talk about research for
his home layout.


4 p.m.
Dave Messer
Designing the Pennsylvania Railroad Northeast Division -- Although it
is set outside of NE, it connects with the New Haven through Maybrook
Yard. It is a combination of overhead foils documenting the historic
rationale of the takeover of the L&NE by PRR and the development of
the track plan, plus slides showing its current state (sorry no
digital projection yet).

Ramon Rhodes
Modeling the urban landscape -- Ramon will present slides and talk
about realistically modeling the urban environment. He'll highlight
items commonly seen but often overlooked that make cities and suburbs
great places to model. Ramon will also compare and contrast the modern
diesel era with the steam era, and give examples of the transition
between the two.

5:30 p.m. – Dinner break/swap meet/

7 p.m.
Art Biehler
Transcontinental Passenger Service on the New York Central in the Post
War Era – Art's clinic traces the evolution, trains, operation, and
equipment found in the service the New York Central offered from 1946
to 1958 to California and to Texas and Oklahoma in conjunction with
several western railroads. Comparisons to similar services offered by
the PRR and B&O will be demonstrated. References to modeling these NYC
trains would be raised.

Marty McGuirk
Something Central Vermont.

8:30 p.m.
Pete McLachlan – Pete hired out with the New Haven and worked until
Conrail. And he took his camera to work damned near every day.

Open time until 11 p.m. for slides, etc.

Saturday, June 3:

8 a.m.
Registration and model setup

9 a.m.
Jeff Hanke
Something Chessie

John Orofino
Part 2 of Making Plastic Structure Kits Look Great.

10:30 a.m.
Steve Funaro
Building Resin Kits – Steve will lead a hands-on clinic on building
resin kits. Each participant will receive a Funaro & Camerlengo kit.
This clinic has a fee of about $12 and pre-registration is requested
as space is limited.

Rick Abramson
What are Those Details on a Diesel Engine and What do They Do? – Ever
open a package of Details West MU hose and wonder how many you're
supposed to put on the locomotive your modeling. Rick, a well-known
New Haven modeler and a dispatcher for the Housatonic Railroad, will
answer that and other questions about diesels.

Noon – Lunch

1 p.m.
Preston Cook
What's In Those Steam Locomotives – A detailed examination of a steam
engine's components. This two-part session will help you understand
what all those parts do. This is a two-part presentation and continues
into the 2:30 p.m. session.

Mike Simonds
Wiring a Locomotive for DCC and Sound – Mike will show what it takes
to install sound and DCC in a locomotive and will be on hand Saturday
to offer advice on an individual basis.

2:30 p.m.
Scott Mason
Building Craftsman Kits – Scott, well-known craftsman kit builder,
will share the skills and techniques he's developed.

Preston Cook
Continuation of What's in Those Steam Locomotives

4 p.m.
Ralph Barger
The Harriman Common Standard Passenger Cars – Ralph will discuss total
Harriman car production (3041 cars), including dates, car type, plan
and lot numbers for the Pullman built cars and also the cars built by
AC&F, Bethlehem Shipbuilding, J. G. Brill, Pressed Steel Car, St.
Louis Car Co., Standard Steel Car and the prototypes built by SP & UP.

John Greene
Reading Covered Hoppers – John, owner of Bethlehem Car Works, will
talk about Reading's fleet of covered hoppers.

5:30 p.m. – Dinner/Swap meet

7 p.m.
Ted Culotta
Designing the Naugy and Highland in HO – If you read Railroad Model
Craftsman, you've seen Ted's ongoing series "Essential Freight Cars."
Ted is a master at research and he'll talk about how he's applying
those skills to his home layout, which is based on the New Haven's
Naugatuck and Highland lines. While this will be of interest to NH
modelers and historians, it will also be pertinent to those thinking
about or currently designing layouts as it will discuss many of the
tools being used to develop the track plan, including photos, maps,
timetables, and other relevant data sources.

Jim Homoki
Freight Car Stenciling Details in the Diesel Era – Jim will show how
to identify the paint and stencil details that make a car era-
specific. It will be a look at how the information provided on freight
cars has changed since the 1950s and how you can identify and model
cars to fit a specific era.

8:30 p.m.
Rob Pisani
The Final Years of Conrail – shot in New Jersey, New York,
Pennsylvania and Ohio; with some immediate post-CSX/NS coverage.

After Rob:
Tom Nanos
A View from the Cab – Tom, a Connecticut-based railfan photographer,
will present his work.

Vendors and manufacturers:
Branchline Trains, Atlas Model Railroad Co., Bethlehem Car Works,
Speedwitch Media and Models, Reboxx, Sheepscot Scale Models, Funaro &
Camerlengo, Bob's Photo, Arlington Station, Mohawk Valley Car Shops,
Short Line Products, Penn Central Historical Society, Chessie System
Historical Society, Pennsylvania Railroad Technical and Historical
Society New England Chapter.

All clinics, vendors, manufacturers and other meet participants are
subject to change.

Some of the Southern’s Seley hoppers did last into the 1960s which could
cause confusion: in this case “post-war” should be taken to mean after the
Great War not WW2. In my particular time frame this was
post-the-only-world-war at the time.



Aidrian

Stuck in the thirties

Another reference compared New Brunswick to New Century Schoolbook . . .

I can only speak about details for SP lettering, but this is an excellent example of how a nominally "close" font does NOT duplicate a particular railroad's lettering. The SP characters, including numerals, were reprinted in my Vol. 1 on SP freight cars, and several are quite at odds with any of the Century siblings, Schoolbook or otherwise. Numerals in particular are visibly quite condensed for SP relative to the font.
As Al Westerfield mentioned, this requires use of other fonts to get closer to the actual railroad's lettering practice, followed by juggling both size and weight to be as "close" as possible.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history

Randy and friends,

I have read the historical report on the OA&E flatcar your group restored for the CSRM. This document was a gold mine of information. Your suggestion is an excellent one, always assuming the museum does such research and is willing to make their documentation available.

Kind regards,


Garth G. Groff

Randy Hees wrote:

If you have questions about the historical accuracy of a car at a museum, request an opportunity to review the car's (loco, etc) restoration report or file. This should include any compromises and a discussion of all choices made during the restoration. You may need to make an appointment in advance depending on the site.

They frequently include a signficicant amount of information on the history of the artifact, including all known changes through the years..

They do differ, in content and format from site to site. Sometimes they include a pre-restoration report, sometimes its primarily a file of notes, sometimes it includes lettering templates and stencils... Most responsible museums have some record of what was done.

Randy Hees
Society of the Preservation of Carter Railroad Resources.

Corel Draw offered a font called "New Brunswick" that was a very close match
for Century Schoolbook. Someone with an older version of CorelDraw might
have this. I'm afraid I don't know which version, but I'd check around
version 3 or 4.

Another reference compared New Brunswick to New Century Schoolbook See:
http://desktoppub.about.com/cs/findafont/a/fontaliases_n.htm

My preferred font dealer is www.myfonts.com . YMMV.

Dan Stinson
Helena, Montana

New Brunswick is an alias for Century Schoolbook

Rich Orr

--- In STMFC@..., "Eric Hansmann" <ehansmann@...> wrote:

Al,

Can you share with us the font dealer for New Brunswick? I spent time
searching this morning, but all that seems to come up are references to
a town in New Jersey.

Eric Hansmann
Morgantown, W. Va.

I'm not Al, and you may have some compelling reason to find this
specific font, but if all you are looking for is a source of computer
fonts that are generally close to what the certain railroads used,
check out Benn Coifman's fonts at:

http://www.railfonts.com/

Not free, but not expensive, and there are several different serif
(Roman) styles to chose from.

Ben Hom wrote:

Existing Class XL boxcars shopped after July 1, 1911 received a
revised arrangement of safety appliances to conform to the Safety
Appliance Act. The tunnel brake was removed during this shopping.

=======================================


Thanks for the details Ben. I never realized what that brake wheel on
the a-end was for on older cars, until this thread. A friend is also
scratchbuilding some XA cars and I thought I'd pass along the info as he
also did not know.

Eric Hansmann
Morgantown, W. Va.

Al Westerfield wrote:

For my rail Roman I use a font called New Brunswick which scales out
approximately in 3-3-4 increments from 7 point on as 2", 3", 4", etc.
but when I
mix it with other fonts to get more correct styles (Gs are particulary
difficult
to match) the sizes don't match and I have to fit to size by eyeball on
the
computer.

======================================



Al,

Can you share with us the font dealer for New Brunswick? I spent time
searching this morning, but all that seems to come up are references to
a town in New Jersey.

Eric Hansmann
Morgantown, W. Va.

Roger Ackert, 521 S. 7yh st., De Kalb, IL 60115

Thank you for the information - Looks like I have to
change the doors.

Excellent model, Jim. Hard to see the details but the weathering is very fine.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history

Mr. Fitzgerald's post yesterday prompted a brief exploration on my
part of Post-modernist topics and the critiques thereof which was
both interesting and frankly, somewhat disturbing. Anybody
interested has only to plug a couple of the names from that post
into any of the search engines to open a world you may not have
suspected existed! I have to agree with Tony Thompson and others
that this thread is a "red herring". Examining the "cultural context
and bias" in historical materials is certainly an important concept,
although one I thought that was covered under the general heading
of "critical thinking" and directed at working closer to finding
the "truth" in the materials, not as an end in itself.

While these concepts could be applied to a general history of
railroads or car builders; I doubt that Messrs Foucault and Hayden-
White would have bothered to apply their concepts to a technical
history of freight cars any more than one would apply the "cyclical
history" (frameless tank cars reviving the Van Dyke design)
or "Great Man" theory (The influence of George Fowler on freight car
design) or Marxist-Leninist dialectic (Freight cars are tools of the
capitalist oppressors!) or even Freudian analysis (I won't go
there). To insist that Post-modernism is directly applicable points
toward the cliché that "if your only tool is a hammer, then to you
everything looks like a nail".

I should suppose all of us are now aware (if we were not before)
that the appearance of a freight car in a museum is in no way
conclusive evidence of how it looked in service. I'm not sure there
is much else freight car related to be gained from this line of
discussion.

Pieter Roos