Date   

Re: Standard Steel Freight Cars - Experiment (corrected)

al.kresse <water.kresse@...>
 

Now it works! Thanks!


On June 7, 2019 at 7:45 PM Bob Webber <rgz17@...> wrote:

Many of you know me - I am Bob Webber, current Curator of the Pullman Library in Beautiful Downtown Union, IL.  Data on our Library can be found on the IRM web site:
https://www.irm.org/pullmanlibrary/

MANY years ago, I created a "shadow" web site because we could not get ANYTHING changed, posted or deleted on the official one - hence the link at the bottom.

For years people have been asking if we can provide a list of all the drawings we had.  We could not - there simply is no index. 

On the other hand, we have a few drawings scanned.  In one particular stretch - basically in 1928-1930 - we've been busily scanning drawings.  So now there is about 1% scanned, or about 2800 drawings. But they give a fairly good cross section of types of drawings in these years.  (Note, these years are encompassed by drawings from about SS-53000 to SS-55000) .

The list that will be linked in this e-mail is an experiment and a call for comments.  Note that this list is just that - drawing number & caption.  No sample drawings, no other information. 

We know there are errors, typos, and such - bound to be after some 50,000 drawings of all types have been scanned & metadata added.  Too, the roughly 15 years that is represented on our part was a learnign curve as we had to learn what was important, how to use the software, etc.

I'll leave off the "FAQ" I did on another list - if there are comments, questions, hate mail, etc. remember one thing.  DO NOT CALL.  The Library's phone system is about as stable as a rat in a meth lab.  Sometimes we get it, and it works beautifully (usually for spam phone calls) customer phone calls, not so much.   Use the IO, Comcast or the Pullman Library's gmail account irmpulllib&gm***.c** (asterisks to be replaced by real stuff by you, the reader).  Note.  DO NOT USE the IRM E-mail that has been set up because...you guessed  it - that too is hosed.  At times well over the limit set, at other times I simply do not get the mail, and at other times, it forwards only half of it.  So...there is that (or not).

Anyway...here is a slightly upgraded version of the freight car list (heh) for your perusal - I can answer questions as will others - you likely should keep the more personal, attacking and/or specific questions to the above accounts and not litter the list.

http://www.pullmanlibrary.org/


(The list can be found almost at the bottom of this index - which otw has not been updated since ..well...a long time)

Bob Webber


 


 


Want to share a room at Collinsville?

Jared Harper
 

I am interested in sharing a room at the Collinsville RPM meet.

Jared Harper
Athens, GA


Standard Steel Freight Cars - Experiment (corrected)

Bob Webber
 

Many of you know me - I am Bob Webber, current Curator of the Pullman Library in Beautiful Downtown Union, IL.  Data on our Library can be found on the IRM web site:
https://www.irm.org/pullmanlibrary/

MANY years ago, I created a "shadow" web site because we could not get ANYTHING changed, posted or deleted on the official one - hence the link at the bottom.

For years people have been asking if we can provide a list of all the drawings we had.  We could not - there simply is no index. 

On the other hand, we have a few drawings scanned.  In one particular stretch - basically in 1928-1930 - we've been busily scanning drawings.  So now there is about 1% scanned, or about 2800 drawings. But they give a fairly good cross section of types of drawings in these years.  (Note, these years are encompassed by drawings from about SS-53000 to SS-55000) .

The list that will be linked in this e-mail is an experiment and a call for comments.  Note that this list is just that - drawing number & caption.  No sample drawings, no other information. 

We know there are errors, typos, and such - bound to be after some 50,000 drawings of all types have been scanned & metadata added.  Too, the roughly 15 years that is represented on our part was a learnign curve as we had to learn what was important, how to use the software, etc.

I'll leave off the "FAQ" I did on another list - if there are comments, questions, hate mail, etc. remember one thing.  DO NOT CALL.  The Library's phone system is about as stable as a rat in a meth lab.  Sometimes we get it, and it works beautifully (usually for spam phone calls) customer phone calls, not so much.   Use the IO, Comcast or the Pullman Library's gmail account irmpulllib&gm***.c** (asterisks to be replaced by real stuff by you, the reader).  Note.  DO NOT USE the IRM E-mail that has been set up because...you guessed  it - that too is hosed.  At times well over the limit set, at other times I simply do not get the mail, and at other times, it forwards only half of it.  So...there is that (or not).

Anyway...here is a slightly upgraded version of the freight car list (heh) for your perusal - I can answer questions as will others - you likely should keep the more personal, attacking and/or specific questions to the above accounts and not litter the list.

http://www.pullmanlibrary.org/


(The list can be found almost at the bottom of this index - which otw has not been updated since ..well...a long time)

Bob Webber


Re: Standard Steel Freight Cars - Experiment

al.kresse <water.kresse@...>
 

Bob,

I could NOT find a link on your Index page.

Al Kresse

On June 7, 2019 at 7:04 PM Bob Webber <rgz17@comcast.net> wrote:


Many of you know me - I am Bob Webber, current Curator of the Pullman
Library in Beautiful Downtown Union, IL. Data on our Library can be
found on the IRM web site:
https://www.irm.org/pullmanlibrary/

MANY years ago, I created a "shadow" web site because we could not
get ANYTHING changed, posted or deleted on the official one - hence
the link at the bottom.

For years people have been asking if we can provide a list of all the
drawings we had. We could not - there simply is no index.

On the other hand, we have a few drawings scanned. In one particular
stretch - basically in 1928-1930 - we've been busily scanning
drawings. So now there is about 1% scanned, or about 2800 drawings.
But they give a fairly good cross section of types of drawings in
these years. (Note, these years are encompassed by drawings from
about SS-53000 to SS-55000) .

The list that will be linked in this e-mail is an experiment and a
call for comments. Note that this list is just that - drawing number
& caption. No sample drawings, no other information.

We know there are errors, typos, and such - bound to be after some
50,000 drawings of all types have been scanned & metadata
added. Too, the roughly 15 years that is represented on our part was
a learnign curve as we had to learn what was important, how to use
the software, etc.

I'll leave off the "FAQ" I did on another list - if there are
comments, questions, hate mail, etc. remember one thing. DO NOT
CALL. The Library's phone system is about as stable as a rat in a
meth lab. Sometimes we get it, and it works beautifully (usually for
spam phone calls) customer phone calls, not so much. Use the IO,
Comcast or the Pullman Library's gmail account irmpulllib&gm***.c**
(asterisks to be replaced by real stuff by you, the
reader). Note. DO NOT USE the IRM E-mail that has been set up
because...you guessed it - that too is hosed. At times well over
the limit set, at other times I simply do not get the mail, and at
other times, it forwards only half of it. So...there is that (or not).

Anyway...here is a slightly upgraded version of the freight car list
(heh) for your perusal - I can answer questions as will others - you
likely should keep the more personal, attacking and/or specific
questions to the above accounts and not litter the list.

https://www.irm.org/pullmanlibrary/

(The list can be found almost at the bottom of this index - which otw
has not been updated since ..well...a long time)


Bob Webber




Standard Steel Freight Cars - Experiment

Bob Webber
 

Many of you know me - I am Bob Webber, current Curator of the Pullman Library in Beautiful Downtown Union, IL. Data on our Library can be found on the IRM web site:
https://www.irm.org/pullmanlibrary/

MANY years ago, I created a "shadow" web site because we could not get ANYTHING changed, posted or deleted on the official one - hence the link at the bottom.

For years people have been asking if we can provide a list of all the drawings we had. We could not - there simply is no index.

On the other hand, we have a few drawings scanned. In one particular stretch - basically in 1928-1930 - we've been busily scanning drawings. So now there is about 1% scanned, or about 2800 drawings. But they give a fairly good cross section of types of drawings in these years. (Note, these years are encompassed by drawings from about SS-53000 to SS-55000) .

The list that will be linked in this e-mail is an experiment and a call for comments. Note that this list is just that - drawing number & caption. No sample drawings, no other information.

We know there are errors, typos, and such - bound to be after some 50,000 drawings of all types have been scanned & metadata added. Too, the roughly 15 years that is represented on our part was a learnign curve as we had to learn what was important, how to use the software, etc.

I'll leave off the "FAQ" I did on another list - if there are comments, questions, hate mail, etc. remember one thing. DO NOT CALL. The Library's phone system is about as stable as a rat in a meth lab. Sometimes we get it, and it works beautifully (usually for spam phone calls) customer phone calls, not so much. Use the IO, Comcast or the Pullman Library's gmail account irmpulllib&gm***.c** (asterisks to be replaced by real stuff by you, the reader). Note. DO NOT USE the IRM E-mail that has been set up because...you guessed it - that too is hosed. At times well over the limit set, at other times I simply do not get the mail, and at other times, it forwards only half of it. So...there is that (or not).

Anyway...here is a slightly upgraded version of the freight car list (heh) for your perusal - I can answer questions as will others - you likely should keep the more personal, attacking and/or specific questions to the above accounts and not litter the list.

https://www.irm.org/pullmanlibrary/

(The list can be found almost at the bottom of this index - which otw has not been updated since ..well...a long time)


Bob Webber


Re: "Machinist Tools For Modeling, Part 1 - Hand Tools" Clinic ar rent NERPM

Daniel A. Mitchell
 

For most purposes, if you don’t have a temperature-stabilized lab or shop, working to “tenths” is a fiction. The main exception is comparisons between two items in the same place at the same time, and at the same temperature. Just picking up an item can alter its dimensions.

Visit a metrology lab to see how it’s actually done.

Dan Mitchell
==========

On Jun 7, 2019, at 6:11 PM, Dennis Storzek <destorzek@...> wrote:

On Fri, Jun 7, 2019 at 02:31 PM, Todd Horton wrote:
Calipers are questionable to 4 places but it’s nice to have that feature.
Actually, with regard to the Mitutoyo digitals, the fourth place is limited to 0 or 5. This gives the same functionality as "eyeballing" halfway between the marks on a vernier caliper. It also lets them claim repeatability to .0005", which sounds nice. Just for grins, I looked up their tolerance specs. The 4" and 6" calipers are +/- .001 along their whole range, the 8" +/- .0015, and the 12" +/-.002. One of the things you pay the big bucks for is the assurance that when the jaws are closed, the inside jaws, step, and depth rod are also zeroed within this tolerance, which is not a foregone conclusion with some of the cheap imports. But the real advantage is the battery life; nothing like grabbing the tool and finding out it's dead. With the Mits, the low battery symbol comes on months before it actually dies. That and they last forever. We have a couple that are now thirty years old here at work that get used daily.

Dennis Storzek


Re: Rapido USRA 40-ton Boxcar

Todd Sullivan
 

Thank you, Bill, for straightening out the record. 

Todd Sullivan
(now in Richardson, TX)


Re: "Machinist Tools For Modeling, Part 1 - Hand Tools" Clinic ar rent NERPM

Dennis Storzek
 

On Fri, Jun 7, 2019 at 02:31 PM, Todd Horton wrote:
Calipers are questionable to 4 places but it’s nice to have that feature.
Actually, with regard to the Mitutoyo digitals, the fourth place is limited to 0 or 5. This gives the same functionality as "eyeballing" halfway between the marks on a vernier caliper. It also lets them claim repeatability to .0005", which sounds nice. Just for grins, I looked up their tolerance specs. The 4" and 6" calipers are +/- .001 along their whole range, the 8" +/- .0015, and the 12" +/-.002. One of the things you pay the big bucks for is the assurance that when the jaws are closed, the inside jaws, step, and depth rod are also zeroed within this tolerance, which is not a foregone conclusion with some of the cheap imports. But the real advantage is the battery life; nothing like grabbing the tool and finding out it's dead. With the Mits, the low battery symbol comes on months before it actually dies. That and they last forever. We have a couple that are now thirty years old here at work that get used daily.

Dennis Storzek


Re: "Machinist Tools For Modeling, Part 1 - Hand Tools." clinic at recent NERPM

Daniel A. Mitchell
 

Indeed! A well respected little drilling machine … and now $1200!

Dan Mitchell
==========

On Jun 7, 2019, at 10:57 AM, Jack Burgess <jack@...> wrote:

I bought my Cameron Micro Drill drill press fifty years ago and use it with #85 drills. It was about $175 when I purchased it and about $1200 now. You might find one on eBay. Made in the USA…still.
 
Jack Burgess
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Daniel A. Mitchell
Sent: Friday, June 7, 2019 7:36 AM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] "Machinist Tools For Modeling, Part 1 - Hand Tools." clinic at recent NERPM
 
Excellent advice. Any drill-bit can’t operate with spindle “runout” (wobble) more than a few percent of it’s diameter. Thus a cheap drill-press with, say, 0.010” runout will work just fine with a 1/4” drill, but be totally unacceptable with a #50 or smaller drill.
 
Really small drills like a #75 (0.021”) require a spindle runout of less than a couple thousandths of an inch. Cheap power tools can’t meet this requirement. Precise power tools for this kind of work are available, but not in hobby shops or home-centers, and they are EXPENSIVE.
 
“Little Machine Shop”, "Micro-Mark", and a couple other suppliers offer better-grade small machines suitable for almost all hobby work. There are still better ones, but then you’re talking real money ($20K for a Levin 4” lathe)… investigate Horological, Instrument, and Jeweler’s machines if interested.
 
Oddly, such small drills can be used, with care and practice, by hand in pin-vise or such. If not used “ham-handed” one can feel any misalignment and correct while drilling. The little drills are somewhat flexible, but can’t accept sustained flexure from a misaligned spindle.
 
In addition to spindle “runout” (lack of concentricity) there’s also the issue of the entire spindle assembly (usually called a “quill”) wiggling around loosly in its housing. Instead of a wobble, this produces a sustained side-thrust on the tiny drill that may also cause problems. All these factors lead to drill breakage, misplaced holes, out-of-round holes, and oversized holes.
 
Dan Mitchell
==========
 


On Jun 6, 2019, at 11:36 PM, John <jbopp007@...> wrote:
 
A good source for many of the tools mentioned in this clinic is Little Machine Shop.  I’ve used their sensitive drill feed for many years.  It’s well made and I’m quite pleased with it.  The keyless chuck is convenient, too.
A word of caution, though.  A sensitive drill feed like this has to be used in a machine with a smooth, true running spindle.  Runout (wobble) of just a few thousands may not seem like much with, say, a quarter inch drill bit, but with a #80 it can be serious, leading to oversized holes and/or broken drills.
John Bopp
Farmington Hills, MI
 
 



Re: "Machinist Tools For Modeling, Part 1 - Hand Tools" Clinic ar rent NERPM

Todd Horton
 

Calipers are questionable to 4 places but it’s nice to have that feature. Any time I get into the 4 place I rely on more technologically advanced measuring tools

On Jun 7, 2019, at 1:01 PM, Denny Anspach <danspachmd@gmail.com> wrote:

Jack Burgess hit it on the head when he points out that you get what you pay for: the Harbor Freight and similar are commodity grade or less calipers and if one is into disposable instruments, these can certainly be useful.

I have six calipers, Mititoyo, Helios (German), Brown & …..? (Swiss), none of them new, all extremely accurate, and none…none at all depending on batteries. I use dial calipers routinely, but use only vernier calipers to check on critical measurements. I learned my lesson on the latter some years ago when I found to my chagrin that I could find no one, nada, zip, that would even consider, much less touch a repair on any of the digital calipers (“throw them out”). I also learned that to a man, the fine instrument repair shops use only vernier calipers to check accuracy in their work.

My core instruments are almost all the very best I can find, and in that regard, they have paid, and continue to pay for themselves in accuracy, wear, longevity, and usefulness over the years- the ultimate economy.

Denny

Denny S. Anspach MD
Okoboji, IA




Sunshine NYC/P&E Steel Hopper Mini-Kit

Andy Carlson
 

Hello-
Among the many items which I will most likely never get to is a Sunshine Models mini-kit for a NYC/PE Steel hopper kit. Mint kit in never been removed from mint/new packaging.  Offered for $15, plus buyer to pay $4.50 1st class shipping to the US. I accept checks and money orders. With a small fee I also accept PayPal. Contact me off-list (Please) at <midcentury@...> for particulars.
Thanks,
-Andy Carlson Ojai CA


Re: Rapido USRA 40-ton Boxcar

Bill Schneider
 

Absolutely true in the GN cars Garth. We’re doing one version in this run, others in later runs. Lots of fodder there!

 

Bill Schneider

Rapido Trains

 

 


Re: Rapido USRA 40-ton Boxcar

Garth Groff <sarahsan@...>
 

Bill,

Many GN cars also received AB brakes as well, and operated up into the 1960s. In fact these were the last surviving large block of USRA boxcars in near-original condition.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff

On 6/7/19 2:04 PM, Bill Schneider wrote:

Now that I’m back from a few days off, let me clarify a couple of things on the USRA boxcar project that have been discussed here                   …

 

1 – The cars are being sold TO DISTRIBUTORS as a four-pack, but they are four induvial that can be offered for sale by the stores individually.

 

2 – The majority of the cars will come with KC brakes installed. Only a few will have AB (primarily TH&B and SP&S). This information will be on the web site shortly. However, realizing that brake changeover dates (if any) varied, I’ve asked the factory to include the other set of brake parts in the box so that they can be swapped out if desired.

 

3 – Most of the lettering styles (in this run) are from the 1930-50s era as that is our most popular (sorry Eric….). If we get enough requests we will certainly look at adding earlier schemes into the next run.

 

4 – Prices are in US dollars.

 

Bill

 

Bill Schneider

Rapido Trains

 



Re: Rapido USRA 40-ton Boxcar

Bill Schneider
 

Now that I’m back from a few days off, let me clarify a couple of things on the USRA boxcar project that have been discussed here                   …

 

1 – The cars are being sold TO DISTRIBUTORS as a four-pack, but they are four induvial that can be offered for sale by the stores individually.

 

2 – The majority of the cars will come with KC brakes installed. Only a few will have AB (primarily TH&B and SP&S). This information will be on the web site shortly. However, realizing that brake changeover dates (if any) varied, I’ve asked the factory to include the other set of brake parts in the box so that they can be swapped out if desired.

 

3 – Most of the lettering styles (in this run) are from the 1930-50s era as that is our most popular (sorry Eric….). If we get enough requests we will certainly look at adding earlier schemes into the next run.

 

4 – Prices are in US dollars.

 

Bill

 

Bill Schneider

Rapido Trains

 


Re: "Machinist Tools For Modeling, Part 1 - Hand Tools" Clinic ar rent NERPM

Dennis Storzek
 

On Fri, Jun 7, 2019 at 10:34 AM, Charles Peck wrote:
Every measuring tool we used had to be traceable back to the
Bureau of Standards.  Our calibration people had no way to connect software to any official standard.
Vernier calipers were OK.
I thought I was hearing the ghost of Larry Jackman. Nobody in this hobby needs accuracy beyond what is achievable with a decent quality digital caliper, which, by the way, are certifiable by a calibration shop. The main reason for choosing a dial or digital caliper is reduction of errors; it is considerably easier to misread a vernier scale, or screw up the mental math than it is to misread a dial, especially as our eyes get older, and dial calipers still require reading the marks on the slide and adding that to what is shown on the dial. Digitals present the actual number in a format that is hard to misinterpret. If greater accuracy is needed, the micrometer is the tool of choice, of course, those are available in digital version these days too.

Dennis Storzek


Re: Photo: Unloading DeSotos

Tim O'Connor
 

That web site collection is a nice find Bob! Many interesting photos there

for example https://www.wisconsinhistory.org/Records/Image/IM7191

Tim O'


On 6/7/2019 1:38 PM, Bob Chaparro via Groups.Io wrote:

Small photo from the Wisconsin History website:

https://www.wisconsinhistory.org/Records/Image/IM12630

Caption: "Four men posing with the first shipment of new 1946 DeSoto automobiles as they come off a train onto a loading dock for Stadium Garage, 1501 Monroe Street, Plymouth and DeSoto Sales and Service."

Taken in 1946.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA



--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: "Machinist Tools For Modeling . . .

Tony Thompson
 

I have to agree with Jack Burgess and Denny Anspach. Every time I have yielded to the impulse to save a little money and buy a cheaper tool, I have regretted it. I now try very hard to resist such impulses . . .

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Photo: Unloading DeSotos

Bob Chaparro
 

Small photo from the Wisconsin History website:

https://www.wisconsinhistory.org/Records/Image/IM12630

Caption: "Four men posing with the first shipment of new 1946 DeSoto automobiles as they come off a train onto a loading dock for Stadium Garage, 1501 Monroe Street, Plymouth and DeSoto Sales and Service."

Taken in 1946.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


Re: "Machinist Tools For Modeling, Part 1 - Hand Tools" Clinic ar rent NERPM

Charles Peck
 

Absolutely with you, Denny.  When I was working for the US Navy as a machinist, we were not allowed
to have digital calipers in our tool boxes.  Every measuring tool we used had to be traceable back to the
Bureau of Standards.  Our calibration people had no way to connect software to any official standard.
Vernier calipers were OK.  Mechanical dial calipers were allowed to check the size of a drill bit, not a 
finished piece.  Nothing digital at all.
That said, now I'm retired, I have a pair of digitals for such things as checking rail size or styrene strip.
Chuck Peck

On Fri, Jun 7, 2019 at 1:01 PM Denny Anspach <danspachmd@...> wrote:
Jack Burgess hit it on the head when he points out that you get what you pay for:  the Harbor Freight and similar are commodity grade or less calipers and if one is into disposable instruments, these can certainly  be useful.

I have six calipers, Mititoyo, Helios (German), Brown & …..? (Swiss), none of them new, all extremely accurate, and none…none at all depending on batteries. I use dial calipers routinely, but use only vernier calipers to check on  critical measurements.  I learned my lesson on the latter some years ago when I found to my chagrin that I could find no one, nada, zip, that would even consider, much less touch a repair on any of the digital calipers (“throw them out”).  I also learned that to a man, the fine instrument repair shops use only vernier calipers to check accuracy in their work.

My core instruments are almost all the very best I can find, and in that regard, they have paid, and continue to pay for themselves in accuracy, wear, longevity, and usefulness over the years-  the ultimate economy.

Denny

Denny S. Anspach MD
Okoboji, IA





Re: "Machinist Tools For Modeling, Part 1 - Hand Tools" Clinic ar rent NERPM

Denny Anspach <danspachmd@...>
 

Jack Burgess hit it on the head when he points out that you get what you pay for: the Harbor Freight and similar are commodity grade or less calipers and if one is into disposable instruments, these can certainly be useful.

I have six calipers, Mititoyo, Helios (German), Brown & …..? (Swiss), none of them new, all extremely accurate, and none…none at all depending on batteries. I use dial calipers routinely, but use only vernier calipers to check on critical measurements. I learned my lesson on the latter some years ago when I found to my chagrin that I could find no one, nada, zip, that would even consider, much less touch a repair on any of the digital calipers (“throw them out”). I also learned that to a man, the fine instrument repair shops use only vernier calipers to check accuracy in their work.

My core instruments are almost all the very best I can find, and in that regard, they have paid, and continue to pay for themselves in accuracy, wear, longevity, and usefulness over the years- the ultimate economy.

Denny

Denny S. Anspach MD
Okoboji, IA

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