Date   
Re: Admin: RE: GN 92202 - Ice Bunker Reefer With Moore Refrigeration System

Jack Mullen
 

Ok, boss, but why would one search for "regrigeration"?

Seriously, I got 8 hits on "Moore refrigeration". Unfortunately, one was your Admin post, 6 were the current thread, and only one was from an earlier thread. That did, indeed link to the other posts in the thread. Again unfortunately, most of those posts talked about Moore heaters, not overhead bunkers. Not really germane to the OP.

Jack Mullen

SOLD: R-30-16 kits

Andy Carlson
 

Gone,
Thanks,
-Andy

Admin: RE: GN 92202 - Ice Bunker Reefer With Moore Refrigeration System

Mikebrock
 

Bob Chaparro writes:

I searched the archives for message with the words "Moore" and "refrigeration". There was only one message.”

 

I found 11 entries with “refrigeration”

In the message during the last year….7 with “Moore Regrigeration”.

 

Mike Brock

STMFC Bossman

Wegmann HO wooden rebuilt PFE R-30-16reefer kits

Andy Carlson
 



Hello-

I have found 2 Pacific Fruit Express R-30-16 wood side reefer kits in my search for other missing items. These were a very limited run by the late Terry Wegmann, toolmaker and founder of N&G Signal Co. SP author Tony Thompson covered the construction of one of these kits on his "modeling the SP blog". You can view that story by clicking on this link:   Microscale decals has an excellent recently released set useful for this car.

The R-30-16 was a large class (3664) of PFE reefers which were upgraded from earlier PFE reefers by the PFE company after the war. The rebuilding had the replacement of the wood roof and hatch covers with steel Murphy roofs and Equipco hatch covers. The rebuilt cars were the last PFE rebuild class to retain wood ends.

Terry put together his R-30-16 kit as a hybrid; the core Red Caboose all wood side and end PFE reefer kit with Terry's steel roof from the tooling of his R-30-18 kit (which Intermountain has sold several runs many times). Terry machined both ends to accurately fit to the steel roof, and the roof was machined to fit the RC carbody. The Red Caboose kit has a Bettendorf underframe, and the cross tie parts weren't very good, so Terry made a tool for better Bettendorf styrene cross ties, which are included in this kit. The Wegmann steel hatch covers are included.

All parts necessary to complete the all styrene kit, including trucks, come with the kit. Couplers paint and decals are to be provided by the kit builder. Microscale has excellent PFE wood side decals suited for these cars. Includes the Red Caboose wood reefer kit. I am also including 4 axles of IMRC semi-scale metal wheel sets.

Seems with a class of reefers this large in the post-war era, many operators could use some examples.

It is highly unlikely these will ever be produced again due to problems of lost tooling and the machining time involved.
I am offering these last 2 hybrid kits for $52/each, including shipping to the US.

I accept checks and money orders. For a small fee I also accept PayPal. Contact me Off-List at for answers and ordering information.
Thanks,
-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA







Re: GN 92202 - Ice Bunker Reefer With Moore Refrigeration System

Tony Thompson
 

Bruce Smith wrote:

 

1) Cool air sinks - logically you would get more even cooling this way,


      Cold air sinks in ice bunkers too. The overhead advantage is that it sinks the whole length of the car.

2) Canadian roads did widely adopt this approach - it works

      Yes, U.S. roads found that too, but fans were as good or better in achieving uniform temperature. Canadians didn't like fans in winter conditions.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history





Re: GN 92202 - Ice Bunker Reefer With Moore Refrigeration System

Bruce Smith
 

Bob,

Too restrictive - try “overhead ice” ;)

Regards

Bruce


Bruce F. Smith            

Auburn, AL

https://www5.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/

"Some days you are the bug, some days you are the windshield."



On Jul 7, 2017, at 12:40 PM, thecitrusbelt@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:



I searched the archives for message with the words "Moore" and "refrigeration". There was only one message.


Keep in mind the search function on this list is not very good so saying this topic, or any topic, has been covered before doesn't mean it can be easily found.


Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA

Re: GN 92202 - Ice Bunker Reefer With Moore Refrigeration System

Bruce Smith
 

Bob,

1) Cool air sinks - logically you would get more even cooling this way,
2) Canadian roads did widely adopt this approach - it works
3) It is inefficient - more hatches to work with, and with the ice distributed, faster melting

Regards

Bruce


Bruce F. Smith            

Auburn, AL

https://www5.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/

"Some days you are the bug, some days you are the windshield."



On Jul 7, 2017, at 11:33 AM, thecitrusbelt@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:





Another photo from the Barriger Library:

 



 


This was an early design with overhead, rather than end, ice bunkers.

 


Advertisement from Railway Age Gazette of December 29, 1916: 


 


Advertisement from Railway Age Gazette of June 22, 1917:


 


Mouse over ad to zoom in. 

 


I assume this refrigeration system was never widely adopted as it probably proved to be less efficient in use, more costly to maintain or did not reduce perishable claims as compared to conventional refrigerator car designs. But I can only speculate.

 


Does anyone know why these cars fell out of favor and how many were produced?

 


Thanks.  

 


Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA




Re: GN 92202 - Ice Bunker Reefer With Moore Refrigeration System

thecitrusbelt@...
 

I searched the archives for message with the words "Moore" and "refrigeration". There was only one message.


Keep in mind the search function on this list is not very good so saying this topic, or any topic, has been covered before doesn't mean it can be easily found.


Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA

Re: GN 92202 - Ice Bunker Reefer With Moore Refrigeration System

Tony Thompson
 

Bob Chaparro wrote:

 
This was an early design with overhead, rather than end, ice bunkers.
I assume this refrigeration system was never widely adopted as it probably proved to be less efficient in use, more costly to maintain or did not reduce perishable claims as compared to conventional refrigerator car designs. But I can only speculate.
Does anyone know why these cars fell out of favor and how many were produced?

     Bob, we have covered this topic on this list a couple of times, and it is fairly completely described in the PFE book. I am not sure I have the energy to summarize it again.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history





GN 92202 - Ice Bunker Reefer With Moore Refrigeration System

thecitrusbelt@...
 

Another photo from the Barriger Library:

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/barrigerlibrary/28745254694/in/dateposted/

 

This was an early design with overhead, rather than end, ice bunkers.

 

Advertisement from Railway Age Gazette of December 29, 1916:

http://tinyurl.com/y8oohsj7

 

Advertisement from Railway Age Gazette of June 22, 1917:

http://tinyurl.com/y76fu33v

 

Mouse over ad to zoom in.

 

I assume this refrigeration system was never widely adopted as it probably proved to be less efficient in use, more costly to maintain or did not reduce perishable claims as compared to conventional refrigerator car designs. But I can only speculate.

 

Does anyone know why these cars fell out of favor and how many were produced?

 

Thanks.  

 

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA

Re: B&O 380365

rwitt_2000
 

Brian,

I don't have that book so I can't review the photo you reference. Obviously it is a B&O wagon-top. All I can suggest that it still has its original Tatum XLT door.  This door was a flat panel type door. I have several photos of B&O wagon-tops with white "stuff" on them.

Please reply to me off list so I can send some photos that may answer your questions.

Bob Witt

Re: Steam Loco Serial Numbers

Schleigh Mike
 

Thank you for those who helped me with my questions noted below.  I have discovered another  mystery.....

Baldwin Construction Number 14349----What was this locomotive?

It appears in Pietrak's book on the Buffalo & Susquehanna as the first of three 2-8-0 locomotives delivered in June of 1895 as their 107, 109, and 110, Baldwin 14349, 14350, and 14351, respectively.  The quandary is that none of the other B&S roster references I have seen mention 14349, so, what else is known of this Baldwin?

These locomotives pulled a lot of freight cars of logs, lumber, coal and coke in central Pennsylvania mountains.

By the way, the reference below to DSS&A 600 should have been to MStP&SStM 600.  (Whew, what a mouthful!!!)

With gratitude from mosquito infested Grove City in western Penna. ---- Mike Schleigh



From: Schleigh Mike
To: STMFC YahooGroup
Sent: Tuesday, July 4, 2017 1:56 PM
Subject: Steam Loco Serial Numbers

Hello Group!  Happy Forth of July!!!

I am need of builder serial numbers of the following steam locomotives which I am sure pulled and pushed freight cars in our era.

Baldwin built 2-10-0-- Soo Line 950, earlier DSS&A 600--On display in Ashland, Wisconsin, built in 1900.

Brooks built 2-8-0--Illinois Terminal No. 27, earlier St. Louis, Troy & Eastern No. 6, built in 1910.

Thanking in advance from Grove City in humid western Penna.

Mike Schleigh


Re: B&O 380365

Tony Thompson
 

Brian Termunde wrote:

 

 . . . Ed Austin and Tom Dill's excellent "The Southern Pacific in Oregon Pictorial (it IS a mandatory book to own isn't it? Being published by Signature Press and all ). 


    Nope, not one of our books. We'd be proud if it were ours, but . . . no.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history





Re: General Electric Tank Car

thecitrusbelt@...
 

By the way, all of us have used Mazda lamps. I won't go into it here but if you Google "mazda lamp" you'll be in the know...great cocktail party conversational item.


Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA

B&O 380365

Brian Termunde
 

As a result of Bob's post (thanks Bob!) about an ice dock (on the Espee Group, IIRC), and subsequent replies identifying it as Klamath Falls, Oregon, I was looking at the K Falls section of Ed Austin and Tom Dill's excellent "The Southern Pacific in Oregon Pictorial (it IS a mandatory book to own isn't it? Being published by Signature Press and all ). And I eventually ended up in Eugene (makes sense, right?), and on p. 43, there is an interesting Bert Ward photo of a B&W wagon-top box car, number 380365, on the Can. 

It seems to have a lot of some white material on the roof (not snow, I'm positive), and while that's interesting, but I am really interested in what appears to be an ordinary door (not quite a house door, but close) in the cars sliding door.

I tried to do a search on this car, but came up MT, does anyone perchance know if this was something unique, or was it in assigned service or ???? Obviously I cannot include the photo here, but I hope someone can identify the car, and what service it might have be in.

TIA!

Take Care,
 
Brian R. Termunde
Midvale, Utah

Re: General Electric Tank Car

Steve and Barb Hile
 

Note that the capacity of the tank, stenciled on the end is not in liquid units (gallons), but in solid units - 1113 cubic feet.  This is an early example of trying to adapt tank car technology to hauling dry substances that could flow somewhat like a liquid, in this case silica sand, most likely, for the production of light bulbs.  Hence the multiple hatches and unloading nozzles (and no safety valves on the dome.)
 
Steve Hile



From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Thursday, July 06, 2017 3:35 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] General Electric Tank Car

 

This car has a somewhat unusual arrangement of hatches(?) along the top of the tank. What are these if not hatches and what commodities would have been carried in such cars?

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/barrigerlibrary/24794887695/in/dateposted/

 

Thanks.

 

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA

Re: Water Plugs

william darnaby
 

That is a heavy weight to force closed the water valve.  If you watch enough steam era freight car videos you will observe the fireman pulling down on the long handle at the end of the spout which raises this bell shaped weight to open the valve.  This particular brand is called a Pogue and was probably hauled in steam era freight cars.

Bill Darnaby



From: "thecitrusbelt@... [STMFC]"
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Thursday, July 6, 2017 3:31 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Water Plugs



In several photos featuring water plugs I've noticed small structures on top of the plugs that resemble bells:
 
 
 
Are these bells or merely items that resemble bells?
 
Thanks.
 
Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA




Re: General Electric Tank Car

brianleppert@att.net
 

That's a AC&F Type 25 underframe.  And zoom in at the tank end.  Instead of  giving gallon capacity, its stenciled "1113 Cubic Feet".

Brian Leppert
Carson City, NV

Re: Lehigh wrong way door boxcar paint color.

John Riddell
 

Hi Scott,


There is a good clear color photo of a LV wrong-way door boxcar on page 105 of book 'Rutland in Color' by Philip Jordon, published by Morning Sun Books. The photo taken in 1952 clearly shows the color of the car.


John Riddell

Re: General Electric Tank Car

Tony Thompson
 

Bill Welch wrote:

 

I see Five outlets. Although built by AC&F, it is not one of their under frames.


     The AC&F tank car books are full of examples of AC&F building a new tank on an old underframe.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history