Date   
Reboxx wheelsets

Jared Harper
 

I have tried twice to contact Reboxx to purchase some wheelsets but I  have received no response.  What's going on there and can I get code 88 36" wheelsets to fit my CV 6-wheel pullman trucks from another source?

Jared Harper
Athens, GA

Re: Real Wood Roof Walks for HO Box Cars

ed_mines
 

the Taurus template in the reefer kit could help you and you could build a similar instrument.


I used .010 wire as a spacer. for my cabooses it doesn't matter the spacings of the cross pieces - they don't show.


getting roof walk saddles to all be in the same plane has been near impossible for me but is not necessary on plastic cars.


ed mines


Re: Real Wood Roof Walks for HO Box Cars

spsalso
 

Evergreen styrene???

Ed

Edward Sutorik

Real Wood Roof Walks for HO Box Cars

Jim Betz
 

Hi,

So I have some -excellent- real wood, scale, running board
material and I want to use them on some of my models. To
get the concept of what I want to achieve see:

https://donstrack.smugmug.com/UtahRails/Roger-Kingsford-Photos/i-k8WX95c

I am thinking I need to develop a method for doing these
that is more efficient than just gluing them to the existing
styrene supports "one board at a time". That's a lot of
fiddly work. (I want to do several dozen cars - probably at
least 4 dozen and perhaps twice that many.
The individual pieces of wood that I have are very thin -
so handling them during the process will be a challenge.

What I'd prefer is to develop some kind of jig that I can
pre-build the walks into 'assemblies' that can be attached
to the roof of the car in one action.
Similar in concept to using any of the available styrene
roof walks such as the ones from Kadee.
The jig has to accommodate different lengths (both for
40' cars and 50 footers ... but also just due to the
small variations in the various car models.

I'm thinking I can put in some small cross members that
are glued to the top of the assembly in the jig - and then
remove the completed roof walk and turn it over and
attach it to the car.
I'm also intending to pre-stain the boards in batches
of different shades and then selecting them more or
less at random using different shades (see pic above).

===> Sound good/doable to you?

How should I create the jig? Metal? Something else?

- Jim B.

Re: Presence of Canadian Cars

John Riddell
 

For many years CN boxcars carried large quantities of newsprint from the large pulp and paper mill in Kapuskasing, Northern  Ontario. This large mill was built in 1926 by Spruce Falls Power and Paper Company (the Canadian affiliate of Kimberly-Clark Corp.)  To obtain a reliable supply of newsprint the New York Times purchased 49 % and after 1957 the Washington Post purchased 10%  Prior to 1962 CN 40 ft boxcars were used and after 1964 new CN 50-ft purpose-built newsprint boxcars were used. between Kapuskasing and New York and Washington DC.

 

John Riddell

Delivery Status Notification (Delay)

Armand Premo
 

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---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Armand Premo <arm.p.prem@...>
To: STMFC@...
Cc:
Bcc:
Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2017 19:12:46 -0400
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: Presence of Canadian Cars
In December of 1950 the following number of box cars were on Rutland Train
# 9: NYC193 ,CN 125 PRR 9, AT SF,65,Milw and CNW 40 each CPR,39 lesser
numbers for the balance of the train,. The Rutland had 29 .If interested,
I'll have numbers for your favorite road(s) ..Armand Premo

Re: Speaking of "Do Not Hump" ...

Bruce Smith
 

Jim,


You're way off on the timing of hump yards.  Enola yard was built in 1905 with two humps.  I'd put that as close to the beginning of the era of common use.


Do not hump cars were anything that couldn't hand the coupling OR anything that might "hang up" on either the hump or the bowl, so typically extra-dimension loads were "Do Not Hump" as well. Explosives, glass, delicate machinery, etc... all got do not hump.  My 16" 50 cal Mark VII naval rifle barrels certainly get a "DO NOT HUMP" placard, just like the prototype loads.


Special handling cars were often placed at the front (or back) of the train so that they would be cut out of the string before it was sorted on the hump.  If a do not hump car got too the hump, somebody screwed up.  If the crew cared, it was likely either switched into a pocket or the locomotive would take it over the hump rather than let it run free.  On an extra dimensional load, they'd have to back it off the hump and put it where it belonged.


Valuable specialty cargos often had accompanying riders who would ensure that the cargo was handled properly in just this sort of a situation as well.  Typically, they rode in the cabin car (caboose) with the crew but sometimes, companies would lease a coach or could own their own "rider car" for their person to accompany loads. 


Regards,

Bruce Smith

Auburn, AL



From: STMFC@... on behalf of jimbetz@... [STMFC]
Sent: Sunday, June 25, 2017 10:21 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Speaking of "Do Not Hump" ...
 


Hi,


  Every once in a while we see cars that are labeled "Do Not Hump" - often with some

lettering on a white background attached to a tack board but also, every once in a

while, just marked in chalk on the sides or doors of the car.

  This prompts me to ask the following questions:


  1) When were hump yards "invented" ... and when were they in common use?

      I'm guessing post WW-II for the second part ... ???


  2) Why were cars marked "Do Not Hump" - what was the reason for it?  The kind

      of load it was carrying?  Something about the car itself?  I'm guessing that

      this was done to avoid damage ... but what kinds of loads/cars would be

      damaged by going thru the hump?


  3) What did the RR do if a car was coming up over the hump and the hump operator

      saw that marking/warning on it?  Did they send it down an empty track?  Stop

      the shove and take the cut back down the way it came up and 'side track' the

      car?


  4) If you were establishing a "no earlier than 19__" date for "Do Not Hump" to be

      on any of your cars (because your layout represented that date or earlier)

      what year would you use?

                                                                                          - Jim B.



Re: Praise from the Collinsville Il RPM

Douglas Harding
 

I second Clark’s comments. An outstanding meet. And the clinics were top notch. If any downside, it was the same weekend as the Galesburg Railroad days which drew away some vendors and perhaps some attendees.

 

Jared’s clinic was good, very good, as he took us through establishing a freight car roster for his layout. I did challenge some assumptions he was making about freight cars for his 1943 layout based upon the 1958 data he was using, a list of fright cars in and out of a town on his line. I realize he does not have 1943 freight car data for the branchline he is modeling, but suggested he look at existing data available for the time period from other railroads. This lead to a discussion about the changes that occurred in fright car usage and traffic patterns from 1943 to 1958. I have similar data for two small towns on the M&StL in Iowa, covering the years from the early 40’s to the early 60s. Thus the gauntlet was let laid down by Clark that I prepare a clinic on the changes in freight car traffic patterns during the years discussed. Clark I accept the challenge.

 

I also saw Mike Skibbe and learned he still has 6 open slots for clinics this fall at the Chicagoland RPM. Not committed yet, but something may develop.

 

Doug  Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 

From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...]
Sent: Sunday, June 25, 2017 10:43 AM
To: STMFC
Subject: [STMFC] Praise from the Collinsville Il RPM

 

 

The crew for putting on another outstanding meet!  I don’t know what their secret is, but it sure works! The highlight for me were the great clinics. Great to see John again, loved the little mustache under his nose  ;  ))

Also a vender had an abundance of old Sylvan freight car kits, made up for F&C cancelling.

Had a chance to use Scott Thornton’s new Porto throttle. Once the Iowa Engineered guys explained to me how the thing functioned, it was a real joy to run.

A note about freight car clinics I attended. Jared Harper’s got guys thinking and set Doug Harding up for a possible future clinic I’ll be looking forward to seeing. Michael Gross’s weathering clinic was outstanding as well as Ed Hawkins in-depth study of 40’ PS1s box cars. Thinking, hoping, the next RPM Cyc will cover them?

Clark Propst
Mason City Iowa

Re: Speaking of "Do Not Hump" ...

Dennis Storzek
 




---In STMFC@..., <jimbetz@...> wrote :


  1) When were hump yards "invented" ... and when were they in common use?

      I'm guessing post WW-II for the second part ... ???

=======================


Here is a link to a scan of the October, 1925 issue of Popular Science magazine with an article on hump yard retarders:


https://books.google.com/books?id=0CcDAAAAMBAJ&lpg=PA38&dq=railroad%20retarder&pg=PA38#v=onepage&q=railroad%20retarder&f=false


But hump yards are actually older; the originals were "rider yards" where a brakeman rode each car or cut of cars to stop them with the hand brakes.


  2) Why were cars marked "Do Not Hump" - what was the reason for it?  The kind

      of load it was carrying?  Something about the car itself?  I'm guessing that

      this was done to avoid damage ... but what kinds of loads/cars would be

      damaged by going thru the hump?

===========================


Anything that couldn't survive the expected 4 MPH coupling impact.


  3) What did the RR do if a car was coming up over the hump and the hump operator

      saw that marking/warning on it?  Did they send it down an empty track?  Stop

      the shove and take the cut back down the way it came up and 'side track' the

      car?

===========================


Hump yards were often designed with pocket tracks at the crest so the car could be set out before going over the hump, unless the crew didn't feel like doing it, then over it went.


Dennis Storzek

I'm looking to offload some items

Claus Schlund \(HGM\)
 

Hi List Members,

I'm looking to offload some items, here are two back issues of The Banner, published by the Wabash Historical Society, that might be of interest...

(1) American Refrigerator Transit Issue

(2) Head-End Equipment

They are free, I will simply mail them to you via postal mail. First person who wantes them gets them. Let me know which one of the two (or both) you want.

Since these both cover STEAM ERA FREIGHT CARS as content, they should be within scope of this list.

As a courtesy to everyone else, please reply OFF LIST to claus@...

Claus Schlund

Re: Speaking of "Do Not Hump" ...

Benjamin Hom
 

Jim Betz asked: 
"Every once in a while we see cars that are labeled "Do Not Hump" - often with some
lettering on a white background attached to a tack board but also, every once in a
while, just marked in chalk on the sides or doors of the car.
This prompts me to ask the following questions:

1) When were hump yards "invented" ... and when were they in common use?  I'm guessing post WW-II for the second part ... ???"

Your guess is wrong by at least four decades.  Hump yards were introduced as early as May 1903 at East Altoona on the Pennsy.  It's true that technology was introduced over time to reduce the amount of manpower used (ex: retarders to eliminate brakemen riding each car), but hump yards being a post WWII concept?  No.  


"2) Why were cars marked "Do Not Hump" - what was the reason for it?  The kind of load it was carrying? Something about the car itself?  I'm guessing that this was done to avoid damage ... but what kinds of loads/cars would be damaged by going thru the hump?"

Think about it - what loads do you not want slammed around by potential hard coupling after going over the hump? 


"3) What did the RR do if a car was coming up over the hump and the hump operator saw that marking/warning on it?  Did they send it down an empty track?  Stop the shove and take the cut back down the way it came up and 'side track' the car?"

Pretty much, which is why you switch the car out of the cut before you send it over the hump. 
One of the downsides of hump yards is fixing mistakes takes time - send a car to the wrong track and you have to send a trimmer into the yard to switch it to the correct track, which stops traffic coming over the hump until it clears out. 


"4) If you were establishing a "no earlier than 19__" date for "Do Not Hump" to be on any of your cars (because your layout represented that date or earlier) what year would you use?"

I'd consider this question N/A for transition era modelers as the date would fall well before WWII.  It's a legitimate one for those modeling the early part of the 20th century as we'd have to determine when hump yards became common enough to warrant this placarding.

See this NYCS video for more information on transition era hump yard operations.


Ben Hom 

Praise from the Collinsville Il RPM

Clark Propst
 

The crew for putting on another outstanding meet!  I don’t know what their secret is, but it sure works! The highlight for me were the great clinics. Great to see John again, loved the little mustache under his nose  ;  ))
Also a vender had an abundance of old Sylvan freight car kits, made up for F&C cancelling.
Had a chance to use Scott Thornton’s new Porto throttle. Once the Iowa Engineered guys explained to me how the thing functioned, it was a real joy to run.
A note about freight car clinics I attended. Jared Harper’s got guys thinking and set Doug Harding up for a possible future clinic I’ll be looking forward to seeing. Michael Gross’s weathering clinic was outstanding as well as Ed Hawkins in-depth study of 40’ PS1s box cars. Thinking, hoping, the next RPM Cyc will cover them?
Clark Propst
Mason City Iowa

Speaking of "Do Not Hump" ...

Jim Betz
 

Hi,


  Every once in a while we see cars that are labeled "Do Not Hump" - often with some

lettering on a white background attached to a tack board but also, every once in a

while, just marked in chalk on the sides or doors of the car.

  This prompts me to ask the following questions:


  1) When were hump yards "invented" ... and when were they in common use?

      I'm guessing post WW-II for the second part ... ???


  2) Why were cars marked "Do Not Hump" - what was the reason for it?  The kind

      of load it was carrying?  Something about the car itself?  I'm guessing that

      this was done to avoid damage ... but what kinds of loads/cars would be

      damaged by going thru the hump?


  3) What did the RR do if a car was coming up over the hump and the hump operator

      saw that marking/warning on it?  Did they send it down an empty track?  Stop

      the shove and take the cut back down the way it came up and 'side track' the

      car?


  4) If you were establishing a "no earlier than 19__" date for "Do Not Hump" to be

      on any of your cars (because your layout represented that date or earlier)

      what year would you use?

                                                                                          - Jim B.

Re: Presence of Canadian Cars (autos)

Greg Martin
 

Allen,
 
Yes pool were around and the yes Canadian cars were in auto parts service but from parts plants to assembly plants and that is what you are seeing in this service. New finished cars didn't come across the boarder as far as I have seen in our era. I believe that cars marketed in Canada at the time I believe has different model name if I recall correctly.
 
Greg Martin  
 
Eventually all things merge into one and a river runs through it.
Norman Maclean
 

In a message dated 6/24/2017 8:45:07 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, STMFC@... writes:

Hi,
  Were Canadian cars in auto parts/new auto's pools? (did pools even exist yet?)

Copeland reports show 18000 loads Wab > CP, 24000 loads CP > Wab in 1947.

Allen Rueter

Re: Presence of Canadian Cars (autos)

Allen Rueter
 

Hi,
  Were Canadian cars in auto parts/new auto's pools? (did pools even exist yet?)

Copeland reports show 18000 loads Wab > CP, 24000 loads CP > Wab in 1947.

Allen Rueter

Re: DO NOT HUMP: FGEX Double Deck Refrigerator

Greg Martin
 

Campbell Soup had two facilities that knew of one in Camden one outside Chicago. Ironically Glidden paint did as well in the same towns. Both Glidden paint and Campbell soup shipped in insulated cars and required pools of car to satisfy the need.
 
Greg Martin
 
Eventually all things merge into one and a river runs through it.
Norman Maclean
 

In a message dated 5/20/2017 6:13:07 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, STMFC@... writes:
Might be loaded with Campbell Soup in cans.  I know the Campbell's plant in Camden, NJ shipped lots of canned soup in FGEX reefers.  Another possibility is beer in bottles.  Or maybe eggs, as you suggested. 

Todd Sullivan

Re: Presence of Canadian Cars

Greg Martin
 

George,
 
Most likely a different species like Western Red Cedar or perhaps Douglas Fir or Douglas Fir-Larch as they were kiln dried. There may have been some western SPF  (Spruce-Pine-Fir)  also kiln dried.
 
I wasn't until the early sixties that the Southern Pine Lumber companies and the eastern SPF producers embrace kiln drying  seriously and only then fully capture their customers attention.
 
Greg Martin
 
Eventually all things merge into one and a river runs through it.
Norman Maclean
 

In a message dated 6/24/2017 3:09:25 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, STMFC@... writes:

 A question.  By the 1950's much Southern timber was softwood pine.  For furniture quality lumber, it might have been necessary to import from Canada or the West Coast.  There was a lot of furniture making in North Carolina and east Tennessee during that era.  Is it possible Canadian cars could have brought more rare species or higher grade of lumber to the furniture makers in the South?


George Courtney

Re: Presence of Canadian Cars

George Courtney
 

 A question.  By the 1950's much Southern timber was softwood pine.  For furniture quality lumber, it might have been necessary to import from Canada or the West Coast.  There was a lot of furniture making in North Carolina and east Tennessee during that era.  Is it possible Candian cars could have brought more rare species or higher grade of lumber to the furniture makers in the South?

George Courtney

Re: Presence of Canadian Cars

Chuck Soule
 

This spurred some interesting discussion on the NP Telltale list when I inquired there.  Basically, in Western Washington, the Northern Pacific ran a daily train from Auburn (main yard between Seattle and Tacoma) to Sumas, on the BC border, a ways inland from Vancouver BC.

Kent Sullivan says that surviving dispatcher sheets from 1955 indicate about 17 loaded cars (5 to CPR, 12 to BCER) and 19 empty (10 to CPR, 9 to  BCER) were delivered to the Canadian roads daily. About 38 loaded (23 from CPR, 15 from BCER) and 12 empty (4 from CPR, 8 from BCER) were received there daily.  The BCER cars were mostly interchanged by BCER in Canada with the CN, which did not serve Sumas directly.

I think this is a total car tally, so I would assume that the loads sent to Canada daily were mostly US cars unless a return load was found to fill a Canadian car in the US.  The empties delivered to Canada would be Canadian cars.  Similarly, the loads received from Canada daily would mostly be Canadian cars, and the empties would be US cars.

This does not account for traffic that the Great Northern handled between Seattle and Vancouver BC.  Without having inquired directly on the GN list, I would assume the level of traffic would be roughly comparable, maybe even higher because the GN served directly into Vancouver.  On the other hand, the Sumas border crossing was a more likely destination for cars originating or being sent to locations in Central BC or farther east.

At any rate, there was a substantial level of Canadian traffic through western Washington into Oregon and California.

Chuck Soule

Re: Presence of Canadian Cars

Dave Parker
 

I was intrigued by Tim O'Connor's proposal that most newsprint came from Canada, and would help justify the presence of Canadian cars in the border states and perhaps elsewhere during the steam era.  As is my habit, I went looking for data the would help support or refute that notion.

The annual ICC freight commodity statistics included a separate tabulation for newsprint (as well as several other paper/cardboard categories), and included data for the U.S., by region, and by railroad.  I looked first at the B&M as it had trackage in three border states as well as an obvious urban center needing large quantities of newsprint.  In 1935, the B&M transported 431,000 tons of newsprint (46 carloads per day), virtually all of which originated on a foreign road.  Of that, 40% was terminated on the B&M (i.e., Boston), while 60% was bridge traffic that went on to points south and west.

I then looked at the roads most relevant to Canadian traffic:  the CN in New England, the CP in VT and ME (separate listings), and the CV (an obvious bridge line with the CN).  In short, the numbers just didn't add up, plus the Canadian lines were dominated by bridge traffic (although I suppose that could reflect reporting conventions when cars crossed the border).

So, I took a peek at the Maine railroads.  To my surprise, the BAR (the potato railroad) transported 281,000 tons, all of which originated on the BAR and was handed off to another road.  The MeC moved 368,000 tons, about half of which originated (but not terminated) on the MeC, and half of which was bridge traffic.  The numbers do not add up in a fully satisfying way, suggesting that some quantity of the newsprint was handed off the CN and/or CP and transported north. They further suggest that much, maybe most, of the newsprint carried by the B&M in 1935 came from mills in Maine, not Canada. 

I don't think this analysis necessarily diminishes the importance of Canadian boxcars on a border railroad like the B&M, but it does seem to gibe with Dave Evans' assertion that we may need to look beyond forest products when thinking about imports from our northern neighbors.

I suppose the next exercise could be to look at the lumber statistics, but I really need to work on some models, including several CP/CN boxcars in the queue.

Dave Parker
Riverside, CA








On Friday, June 23, 2017 3:11 PM, "devans1@... [STMFC]" wrote:


 
All,

Looking at the 1946 data from Mr. Gilbert, I noticed that only 3 of the SB CN/CP cars carried paper. 2 cars carried tobacco (There is still Tobacco farming today on the north shore of the great lakes.) Perhaps that was a movement unique to the east coast since in those days I believe the Richmond, VA area was the cigarette capital of North America (so the move was more like a captive service). But car loads of soap, syrup, salt, cereal and apple sauce were also recorded, along with 4 SB carloads of "Merchandise", so we shouldn't fall into the trap of viewing Canada as an exporter of only refined wood products.

While Alexandria was the east coast gateway to the south for North-south traffic, with Canadian traffic making up 3% of the XM's, for that era and location, CP and CN should not be discounted. For an east-west line in the deep south - obviously it will be less. Near the northern border, much more (CN & CP were 13% of the North American boxcar fleet in 1943.)

Dave Evans