Date   

In The Pipeline: A New HO Scale Santa Fe Prototype Model

Bob Chaparro
 

In The Pipeline: A New HO Scale Santa Fe Prototype Model

Sometime next month a major manufacture will announce a new, plastic R-T-R HO scale model of a Santa Fe freight car from the early and second-generation diesel eras.

This will be an accurate, highly detailed model developed from official engineering drawings and photographs. With small effort this car can be kit-bashed into other Santa Fe prototypes.

For me personally it represents a five-year quest to bring this car into the market. Along the way I was joined by a small group of very knowledgeable modelers and researchers who contributed greatly to this project.

Expect an announcement from the manufacturer around March 15.

Bob Chaparro

Moderator

Railroad Citrus Industry Modeling Group

https://groups.io/g/RailroadCitrusIndustryModelingGroup


Re: Photo: NKP Livestock Car 41001

Douglas Harding
 

Nice photo of a Mather 50’ stockcar. Built by “marrying” two 40’ cars.

 

Doug Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Bob Chaparro via groups.io
Sent: Sunday, February 21, 2021 11:43 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Photo: NKP Livestock Car 41001

 

Photo: NKP Livestock Car 41001

Courtesy of Adam C. Matthews on Facebook. He comments:

"Where's the beef? It's riding the Nickel Plate! Shipping up to six trains of livestock per day, and faster than any other carrier, earned the Nickel Plate Road the nickname “The Meat Express Line.” These shipments were also more profitable than any other commodity the road carried. From the day track laying was completed and operations began, the Nickel Plate Road received an allotment from the Chicago Stock Yard Company of 10% of all livestock traveling east, and this is why the Nickel Plate Road rostered large numbers of stock cars from the start of service.

Pictured is NKP 50-foot single-decked wooden stock car 41001 at Bellevue, OH on August 28, 1966. In two years all livestock business would be a thing of the past."

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


Photo: NKP Livestock Car 41001

Bob Chaparro
 

Photo: NKP Livestock Car 41001

Courtesy of Adam C. Matthews on Facebook. He comments:

"Where's the beef? It's riding the Nickel Plate! Shipping up to six trains of livestock per day, and faster than any other carrier, earned the Nickel Plate Road the nickname “The Meat Express Line.” These shipments were also more profitable than any other commodity the road carried. From the day track laying was completed and operations began, the Nickel Plate Road received an allotment from the Chicago Stock Yard Company of 10% of all livestock traveling east, and this is why the Nickel Plate Road rostered large numbers of stock cars from the start of service.

Pictured is NKP 50-foot single-decked wooden stock car 41001 at Bellevue, OH on August 28, 1966. In two years all livestock business would be a thing of the past."

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


Dry Ice Cars (was Re: [RealSTMFC] [SouthernRailway] Inman Yard in 1946 or 47)

Benjamin Hom
 

To follow on to Dan Mitchell's summary, here's a quick history of the Mathieson cars from Rich Yoder:


Ben Hom


Re: [SouthernRailway] Inman Yard in 1946 or 47

Daniel A. Mitchell
 

Yes, it is a typical dry-ice car. There were many minor variations. Common owner names were “Mathieson”, "Pure Carbonic", and “Liquid Carbonic” companies.

Some just looked much like normal refrigerator cars, and a number of HO models of conventional reefers have been painted in “dry Ice” livery. Ambroid-Northeastern and Westerfield offered PRR R7 wooden reefers in the silver “Mathieson" paint scheme. Red Ball had a classic wood and cardboard straight-side Sant Fe dry-ice car, and  Varney (1947) had wood and cardboard straight-sided kit.

However many seem to have had the sloped (angled) upper side panels as seen in the photo being discussed. In HO there was a nice stamped aluminum-foil kit from Laconia-Binkley (1950’s) with the tapered sides as shown in the photo. Precision Scale. and Rail-Head also offered brass HO models.

Dan Mitchell
==========

On Feb 21, 2021, at 9:51 AM, BRIAN PAUL EHNI <bpehni@...> wrote:

I don’t have the photo handy, but if memory serves, it’s a dry ice car. 

Thanks!
Brian Ehni 
(Sent from my iPhone)

On Feb 21, 2021, at 8:42 AM, Clark Propst <cepropst@q.com> wrote:


Sorry if I missed it, but what is that light colored car left center?
 
Thanks,
Clark
 
Sent from Mail for Windows 10
 


Re: heavy duty trucks on B&LE hoppers

Bud Rindfleisch
 

Chris Rooney,
    As a fellow S scaler, I am doing a rework of the Am Flyer triple hopper into B&LE which is why I was pushing for these trucks to be made in S. Interesting to note the 36" wheels!
    Bill Morris sells the decals for these cars now.
        Bud Rindfleisch


Re: heavy duty trucks on B&LE hoppers

Bud Rindfleisch
 

Ed Hawkins,
    Wow, thanks ever so much for all this info. Was interesting to see the heavy duty trucks also under the two bay hoppers!
    Bud Rindfleisch


Re: [SouthernRailway] Inman Yard in 1946 or 47

 

I don’t have the photo handy, but if memory serves, it’s a dry ice car. 

Thanks!
Brian Ehni 
(Sent from my iPhone)

On Feb 21, 2021, at 8:42 AM, Clark Propst <cepropst@q.com> wrote:



Sorry if I missed it, but what is that light colored car left center?

 

Thanks,

Clark

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 


Re: [SouthernRailway] Inman Yard in 1946 or 47

Clark Propst
 

Sorry if I missed it, but what is that light colored car left center?

 

Thanks,

Clark

 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

 


Re: HD Truck Tweak?

spsalso
 

Delano.  That guy was GOOD!

Ed

Edward Sutorik


Re: HD Truck Tweak?

Jeff Ford
 

Corey,

That second truck looks more like it.  from the looks of it, an Andrews truck wouldn't be hard to replicate.  I, for one, find the detail adequate.

Here's a photo from March, 1943 showing the Andrews version in good detail.  For anyone interested, this is from the Library of Congress FSA/OWI collection.  It was taken by Jack Delano on a cross country trip where he rode Santa Fe freight trains and made photos of railroad subjects as he went.

-Jeff Ford
Sanger, TX


Re: heavy duty trucks on B&LE hoppers

bigfourroad
 

Nice work on the Vulcan trucks!  If they were available in S scale I would swap them out for the modified American Models trucks under the bashed Louis Marx bodies used to make the B&LE hoppers. These cars were 90 tons capacity as the new data by Ed Hawkins points out. The wheels used were 36" diameter. As I recall the decals were mainly CDS dry transfers with a borrowed insignia -- but that was a while ago in S and the alternative was hand lettering.
Chris Rooney


Heavy duty trucks on B&LE hoppers-Why?

David Payne
 



Maybe it was on the Bessemer Southern ...
 
DPayne
 


Re: heavy duty trucks on B&LE hoppers

Ed Hawkins
 

STMFC members,
Following is a summary of B&LE twin or triple hopper cars equipped with the type of heavy-duty truck that has been discussed. I’m providing as much information as I have available from a variety of sources to include B&LE diagrams with the latest cars built in 1941 (class HT22).

Group 1: The earliest series I’ve been able to document are the class HT4 triples (1,050 cars), 90-tons, 2664 cu. ft., 40’-5” inside length, 31’-6” truck centers, Ajax hand brake, Blaw-Knox brake step, Ajax corrugated hopper doors, Wine door locks, Vulcan pedestal-type truck with Simplex clasp brakes & Barber lateral motion device, originally with KD-1012 brakes, multiple-wear 33” steel wheels.

60001-60300 (300), Standard Steel Car Co. (SSC) lot G-7240
60301-60600 (300), Pressed Steel Car Co. (PSC)
60601-60950 (350), ACF lot 1215
60951-61050 (100), Greenville Steel Car Co. (GSC) Office Order (O.O.) 177

SSC builder photo 60300 6-31 available from Keith Retterer.
ACF builder photo 60625 p. 285, 1937 Car Builders' Cyclopedia (CBC).
Links to GSC builder photos of 60951 & 61012.
https://pullman-lib.smugmug.com/Railroad-B/i-wh4jCBK/A
https://pullman-lib.smugmug.com/Railroad-B/i-545vkNb/A

The above 1931-built cars were painted entirely black with white stencils.

While it’s noted in the B&LE diagram that these HT4 cars were equipped with Blaw-Knox brake steps, it’s my belief that they were probably not original equipment but rather were installed when these cars received major repairs as of 1941.

Group 2: Classes HT16 & HT18 triples (1,500 cars): Cor-Ten Steel, 70-tons, 2775 cu. ft., 40’-8” inside length, 31’-8” truck centers, Blaw-Knox brake step, Dreadnaught hopper doors, Wine door locks, Vulcan pedestal-type truck with Simplex clasp brakes & Barber lateral motion device, AB brakes, single-wear 33” steel wheels.

75001-75750 (750), HT16, ACF lot 1488, built 1936, Ajax h/b
75751-76000 (250), HT16, GATC, built 1936, Miner h/b
76001-76500 (500), HT18, ACF lot 1633, built 1937, Ajax h/b

ACF builder photo 76064 p. 251/269, 1940 CBC (also in 1943, 1946, and other later CBC's).

Cars built in 1936 & later received brown paint. ACF paint specs for lots 1488 & 1633 - Scully Brown Products entire body & truck side frames; white stencils.

Group 3: Classes HT17, HT19, HT21, HT22 triples (3,650 cars): Cor-Ten Steel, 90-tons, 2775 cu. ft., 40’-8” inside length, 31’-8” truck centers, Blaw-Knox brake step, Wine door locks except for 200 H17 Pressed Steel cars with Fort Pitt door locks, Dreadnaught hopper doors, Vulcan pedestal-type truck with Simplex clasp brakes & Barber lateral motion device, AB brakes, two-wear 33” steel wheels.

65001-65800 (800), HT17, Pullman-Standard (P-S) lot 5521, built 1936, Miner h/b
65801-66000 (200), HT17, PSC, built 1936
66001-67000 (1,000), HT19, P-S lot 5555, built 1937, Miner h/b
67001-68000 (1,000), HT21, P-S lot 5622, built 1940, Superior h/b
68001-68650 (650), HT22, P-S lot 5660, built 1941, Ajax h/b (plus repairs to five H16 & H19 cars)

General arrangement drawing of B&LE 40’-8” IL, 90-ton triple (also applicable to 70-ton version), p. 284-285, 1937 CBC. Also p. 268-169, 1940 CBC; p. 270-271, 1943 CBC (HT17); ditto p. 276-277, 1946 CBC and published in every CBC through 1960.

P-S builder photos 65001 & 66601 p. 269 & p. 352, respectively, 1940 CBC.
P-S builder photos 67001 & 68101 available at the Illinois Digital Archives web site.

Group 4: Classes HT23, HT24 triples (1,225 cars): High Tensile Steel, 90-tons, 2775 cu. ft., 40’-8” inside length, 31’-8” truck centers, Wine door locks, Dreadnaught hopper doors, Vulcan pedestal-type truck with Simplex clasp brakes & Barber lateral motion device, AB brakes, two-wear 33” steel wheels.

68651-69075 (425), HT23, P-S lot 5712, built 1942, Superior h/b
69101-69900 (800), HT24, P-S lot 5725, built 1943, Ajax h/b

P-S builder photos 69050 & 69101 available at the Illinois Digital Archives web site.

Group 5: Additional cars built in the postwar period having the same type of trucks include 33’ IL 70-ton HM25 twins (750 cars), 2190 cu. ft.; 40’-5” IL HT26 90-ton triples (500 cars), 2664 cu. ft.

50001-50500 (500), HM25, P-S lot 5842, built 1946, Ajax h/b, Blaw-Knox brake step, Wine doors & locks
50501-50750 (250), HM25, PSC, built 1946, Wine door locks
62001-62500 (500), HT26, P-S lot 8022, built 1952, Ajax h/b, Wine door locks

P-S builder photo 50001 p. 223, 1949 CBC (also in 1953, 1957)
PSC builder photo 50679 available from Archives Canada.
P-S builder photo 62049 available at the Illinois Digital Archives web site & 62004 p. 209, 1953 CBC.

In addition to the above, B&LE sent various quantities of cars for periodic reconditioning/repairs. In some cases, original 70-ton cars were upped to 90-tons. Three orders had photos taken of reconditioned cars as indicated. One other photo relates to a photo published in the 1953 CBC.

O.O. 536, 325 cars, HT4 sample photo 60476 5-49 (link below)
O.O. 545, 300 cars, HT19 sample photo 66624 7-50 (link below)
O.O. 550, 200 cars, triples, ca. 1951
O.O. 553, 300 cars, triples, ca. 1951
O.O. 570, 1,000 cars, triples, ca. 1951
O.O. 604, 500 cars, triples, ca. 1953 (see sample photo 75325 below)
O.O. 664, 500 cars, HM25 sample photo 50645 9-55 (link below)
O.O. 671, 244 cars, twins, ca. 1956
O.O. 674, 250 cars, triples, ca. 1956

Photo of repaired 75325 1-53 p. 227, 1953 CBC (also in 1957, 1961).
Links to GSC photos of 60476 5-49, 66624 7-50, 50645 9-55.
https://pullman-lib.smugmug.com/Railroad-B/i-LgMSBfp/A
https://pullman-lib.smugmug.com/Railroad-B/i-RKmpP4m/A
https://pullman-lib.smugmug.com/Railroad-B/i-DMZ24NC/A

In some cases additional views of GSC B&LE freight car photos can be located at James Kinkaid’s collection.
https://pullman-lib.smugmug.com/Railroad-B/

That’s a lot of stuff, and my hopes are that I didn’t mess up too much!
Regards,
Ed Hawkins


SEEKING HELP ON A BRAKE ARRANGEMENT

WILLIAM PARDIE
 

Above is a shot of an Exacta rail UP B-50-15 flat car.  I purchased the model at Naperville sub sequent to a presentation by Exacta rail.  The model was very well done and needed onl a few upgrades.  These included tiedowns between the stake p;ockets and brackets for the air hoses.  I have questions on the arrangement
of the brake components.  I have tried here and on otgher venues without success.  I even contacted Exactarail for their research on this era and was told that they could not release it.

I will start by saying that the train line on these cast underframes ran up the canter of the center sill entering just behind the trucks.  My main copncern is the placement of the Royal brake regulator.  I have added this feature to many models (mostly Santa Fe) and the ;placement has always been on tyhe side opposite the brake 
lever.  It might be placed on the opposite side of the center sill due to the location of the brake reservoir.  I weould like to get some sort of confirmation prior to compleating the car.  The lever and rod to the trucks is not represented on this model.  That should come through the center sill just oppossite the brake regulator.
I hope someone might be able to share some light on this.  I hate to guess on something like this as my betting average on guesswes is very low.

Thanks for any help:

Bill Pardie


Re: [SouthernRailway] Inman Yard in 1946 or 47

gary laakso
 

That is a good looking dry ice car in the photo and a rare picture.

Gary Laakso
Northwest of Mike Brock


On Feb 20, 2021, at 11:34 AM, George Eichelberger <geichelberger@...> wrote:

Here is a “STMFC” era re-post from SouthernRailway.groups.io from the Southern Railway Historical Assoc. archives.

Ike


Subject: [SouthernRailway] Inman Yard in 1946 or 47
Date: February 20, 2021 at 2:20:51 PM EST

The SRHA archives includes many more photos than we can probably ever use in TIES or SRHA books. Here is an undated example that includes a variety of topics.

Although the photo is undated, we know that the Southern box car in the foreground of the photo is one of 1,000 post-war all steel design box cars built by Pullman-Standard and delivered in 1946 or 47 and the (most likely) NW-2 helps date the photo to 1947. No caption came with the image but it may be an Atlanta newspaper photo taken as part of the coverage of the fire in the distance.

The Chicago, St. Paul, Minneapolis and Omaha stock car coupled to the (very unusual!) dry ice car is a long way from home. The WFE car at Inman suggests the photo may have been taken during the Florida citrus, vegetable or peach shipping seasons when WFE equipment was moved east. The process reversed when apples were in season and FGE cars went west (there are mentions in the archives of solid trains of empty "reefers" moving back and forth as the seasons changed). The Inman icing platform is still in service and working, another "sign" it is peach or citrus season. With multiple Southern routes and railroads out of Atlanta, Inman was a diversion and re-icing point for northbound perishables.

The brakeman standing on the running board of the second car from the switch engine would be "interesting" during switch moves!

A great photo!

Ike


Re: [SouthernRailway] Inman Yard in 1946 or 47

Steve SANDIFER
 

Note also the unrestrained pole loads.

 

 

J. Stephen Sandifer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of George Eichelberger
Sent: Saturday, February 20, 2021 1:34 PM
To: RealSTMFC@groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] [SouthernRailway] Inman Yard in 1946 or 47

 

Here is a “STMFC” era re-post from SouthernRailway.groups.io from the Southern Railway Historical Assoc. archives.

 

Ike

 

 

Subject: [SouthernRailway] Inman Yard in 1946 or 47

Date: February 20, 2021 at 2:20:51 PM EST

 

The SRHA archives includes many more photos than we can probably ever use in TIES or SRHA books. Here is an undated example that includes a variety of topics.

Although the photo is undated, we know that the Southern box car in the foreground of the photo is one of 1,000 post-war all steel design box cars built by Pullman-Standard and delivered in 1946 or 47 and the (most likely) NW-2 helps date the photo to 1947. No caption came with the image but it may be an Atlanta newspaper photo taken as part of the coverage of the fire in the distance.

The Chicago, St. Paul, Minneapolis and Omaha stock car coupled to the (very unusual!) dry ice car is a long way from home. The WFE car at Inman suggests the photo may have been taken during the Florida citrus, vegetable or peach shipping seasons when WFE equipment was moved east. The process reversed when apples were in season and FGE cars went west (there are mentions in the archives of solid trains of empty "reefers" moving back and forth as the seasons changed). The Inman icing platform is still in service and working, another "sign" it is peach or citrus season. With multiple Southern routes and railroads out of Atlanta, Inman was a diversion and re-icing point for northbound perishables.

The brakeman standing on the running board of the second car from the switch engine would be "interesting" during switch moves!

A great photo!

Ike


Re: Rio Grande PS1

Dennis Storzek
 

On Sat, Feb 20, 2021 at 11:36 AM, Benjamin Hom wrote:
The AHM/Roco PS-1 scales out to 10 ft IH, but this appears to be by accident, not by design, as the model retains the six small rectangles on the top of the ends, which were not present on the prototype 10 ft IH cars.  I can't find it in the files or photos sections, but years ago, I posted a side-by-side photo of a IMWX 1937 AAR boxcar and AHM PS-1 which confirms this.
 
Best to not get too picky with the dimensional accuracy of AHM products. Long ago I realized that product development at AHM consisted of finding a bunch of photos, not necessarily all of the same prototype, a similar model, and sending it all over to Europe with the instruction to, "Make this, but make it look like the pictures."

I am convinced the AHM PS-1 is modeled on the Athearn "blue box" boxcar. The give-away is the shape of the roof. The various SRECo. roofs had the ends of the panels (at the sides of the car) truly vertical, since they riveted to the upward facing flange of the Z bar that formed the eave. Athearn's toolmaker wanted the mold to part at the top of the sides, but also wanted to represent the rivets along the edge of the roof panels, so he changed the angle of the edge of the roof by about 20 degrees so he could tool shallow rivets along the ends of the panels and have them pull. It wasn't very successful as most blue box boxcars have the rivets smeared off one side of the roof. The AHM PS-1 doesn't have rivets on the edges of its roof, but still have the odd angle. Why? Likely because that was all the info Roco was given.

If you think back to the time when people actually cared what the prototype of Athearn's car might have been, I think you'll find that someone identified the closest prototype as a series of SP, IIRC, boxcars that had an odd 10'-3" IH. At any rate the Athearn model stood lower than the MDC model of the AAR car, although that model had the wrong end for its height. So, it stands to reason that the Roco PS-1, and likely the Lilliput copy, ended up being lower than a 10'-6" IH car, although likely not correct for a 10'-0" car either.

Dennis Storzek


Re: [SouthernRailway] Inman Yard in 1946 or 47

Allen Cain
 

Ike,

Thanks for sharing the GREAT picture of Inman Yard.

Is there a way to get a higher resolution copy so that I can make out some of the car numbers and details?

Thanks again,

Allen Cain

--
Allen Cain
Modeling the Southern in 1955 in HO Scale


Re: Rio Grande PS1

Dennis Storzek
 

On Sat, Feb 20, 2021 at 08:55 AM, Tim O'Connor wrote:
I've never heard that before but can someone confirm this about the AHM PS-1... ??

Where did the Walthers PS-1 come from? (I think Accurail acquired that tooling.)
No. The Accurail PS-1 is the old McKean Models car, tooled by Front Range for Bill McKean to make use of the same floor as used on McKean's 40' double door boxcar.

As to the AHM PS-1, which one" There were two. As it was explained to me by Bill Wischer, Bernie Paul of AHM originally had the car done by Roco of Austria. The deal with Roco and several other European manufacturers was they would build a tool to your specs, but retain ownership, so you had to return for additional production. At some point Bernie became dissatisfied with the price Roco was quoting, so sent one of the models over to Lilliput and had them copy it. The Roco tooling eventually went to Walthers, and I believe the Lilliput tooling ended up at ConCor, but not before several other manufacturers had production runs made.

Dennis Storzek

3121 - 3140 of 185044