Date   

Re: PRR R6- Express Refrigerator Car - T rucks

pennsylvania1954
 

Hi Ken--You have asked this while many of the PRR folks are away at our annual meeting. Sadly, I am not. You may expect some more traffic on your question later today and tomorrow as they catch up with their mail.

First, I suggest you ask this question over on
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/PRR-Modeling/
to reach the most knowledgeable.

Trucks: I have very little info about the R60. Based on your assertion that the original trucks were 2D3P1, here is a diagram of this truck:
http://prr.railfan.net/diagrams/PRRdiagrams.html?diag=2D3P1-24826.gif&sel=ptk&sz=sm&fr=
Note that these are different than the 2D-P3 shown at the link in your original message. The 2D-P3 was used also on many B60b baggage cars. It is a modified version of the truck found on the vast majority of tenders used with the K4 Pacific.

Although this is speculation, if any of the cars were re-trucked, the most likely new truck would be the 2D-P5, modeled by Walthers for the R50b and B60b and currently available separately.

Of course, all these cars would have been found carrying freight in freight trains within the time frame of this list.

Steve Hoxie
Pensacola FL


Re: PRR R6- Express Refrigerator Car - T rucks

Kenneth Montero
 

Dear colleague,

Walthers made the PRR R50b express refrigerator car, which is quite a different car. Walthers also made the PRR B60b baggage car, which also is quite a different car.

The similarity in car type numbers makes it "interesting" when searching for information about the R60 express refrigerator car, of which PRR only had 36 of them. PRR had hundreds of the other two cars. Initially, I made the same assumption that you did.

I suspect that my best hope is to find that at least one of the R60 cars got re-trucked with a more common PRR truck. The 2D3P1 truck may be unique to the R60 car.

Ken Montero


Re: PRR R6- Express Refrigerator Car - Trucks

"markstation01@yahoo.com <markstation01@...>
 


Re: BLI 6,000 gal. tank car

Tony Thompson
 


Don Valentine wrote:

Most cars are listed as AAR Mech. Design Type TPI but I have yet to figure out what the suffix "I" denotes when attached to the more normal Type TP applying to normal ICC-105A300 cars.

    Don, the"I" meant "insulated" and virtually all ICC 105A cars would have been insulated.

Tony Thompson 
Car #1119 was designated as Type TMU with the notation that it was an "addition". It was also a 100,000 lb. capacity car, as were #1133-#1135 also Type TMU. The TMU cars are surprising in that I have never seen photos of such cars in New England.

This all begs the question about #1128 - #1130, all built in the two years between 11-1928 and 10-1930. Were these cars really all alike or were changes made as time progressed? Needless to state, if they were all alike
I will be after BLI's Bob Grubba to offer #1128 and #1129 to go along with the available #1130. The reason I wonder about possible differences is due to the variation in water capacity by lbs. for each of the three cars.
Again no two were alike as for #1128 it was 48606, #1129 was 48084 and #1130 was 48215. Not a huge variance but a variance none-the-less. But the July 1959 ORER at least shows #1129 and #1130 as having a capacity of 5,798 gals., information that is not provided in the earlier ORER's. #1128 was off the roster by that date. The only older cars still on the roster in July 1959 were the #1104 and #1105, which you note were new cars utilizing old car numbers and rebuilt trucks. Their capacity was only 3,086 gals. All of these cars mentioned were only 60,000 lbs. capacity with the exception of the odd ball #1119 and #1127, another odd 
ball with only a 5,000 gal. capacity but with trucks rated for 80,000 lbs. Hopefully that nominal 6,000 gal. capacity (actual 5,798) indicates that #1128 - #1130 were all alike so two more cars are a possibility.

Again my thanks for your assistance. Hopefully what I have added will be of some value to others interested
in these cars. 

Cordially, Don Valentine


Re: Automobile Engine Unloading

riverman_vt@...
 




---In STMFC@..., <thecitrusbelt@...> wrote :

These 1958 photos just make it into the group's era. Captions state the engines are being unloaded at a Lincoln-Mercury plant. The source of the photos was Merge Studios in Los Angeles so the location probably is Southern California.

 

Ford operated a plant in Pico Rivera (1957-1980), a suburb southeast of Los Angeles, served by the Santa Fe. I am unaware of another Ford plant in the area other than Ford's Long Beach plant, which closed in 1959.

 

http://catalog.library.ca.gov/exlibris/aleph/a21_1/apache_media/T8DTUN8QLI1G6QA3P7QX182MBV1MEN.jpg

 

http://catalog.library.ca.gov/exlibris/aleph/a21_1/apache_media/PRLBRXSE4YTD94GAMBGA7F4JXI2EUK.jpg

 

http://catalog.library.ca.gov/exlibris/aleph/a21_1/apache_media/YGB2KC52ILVK3EVGQJSREA12E91V8H.jpg

 

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA



    Interesting photos, Bob. Thanks for posting them. The DT&I 50 ft. auto-boxes must have been nearly new in 1958 as well. Richard Hendrickson provided information on what must have been the previous type of cars used to transport competed motors at least for Ford.

These were basically a car very similar in construction to a USRA single sheathed cars

from the Grand Truck Western's car fleet but having 1 1/2 doors. It was Richard's article

years ago that prompted New England Rail Service to introduce the #1000 1/2 door molded add-on kit through its Standard Car Co. div. for freight car parts. The kits make it very easy

to modify Accurail's #4000 series HO models of the USRA style cars into models of the prototype GTW cars. These cars were the subject of my hands-on clinic at last years New England Prototype Modelers Meet, which is coming up again in two weeks on 2-4 June.


Cordially, Don Valentine


Re: BLI 6,000 gal. tank car

riverman_vt@...
 




---In STMFC@..., <hawk0621@...> wrote :


On May 20, 2017, at 11:00 AM, Don Valentine riverman_vt@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:

The Brown Co. car, however, I am certain of 
and know that the company had additional cars as well though none seem to be exact duplicates.
Again more research is necessary. But to me the Brown Co. car is a little jewel. I really like the
frame and feel it makes the overall model a bit better than the older design Atlas car. Again YMMV.
when one puts the BLI model next to an Atlas model the difference in size really stands out! It does
so in a way that to me at least heightens the impression of both models. Thus I am hopeful that 
other New England based users of these really nice prototypes can be found and documented as
I'd really like to add more of them to the fleet.

Don,
The Brown Co. received the following three 6,000-gal., ICC-105A300, Type 27 tank cars from ACF. 

Lot 738, BCX 1128, built 11-28
Lot 981, BCX 1129, built 8-29
Lot 1188, BCX 1130, built 10-30

BCX also purchased from ACF nine 3,000-gallon chlorine tank cars.

Lot 9635, BCX 1104-1105, built 11-23 (ARA V)
Lot 568, BCX 1122-1126, built 2-28 (ICC-105A300)
Lot 2476, BCX 1104-1105, built 1-43 (ICC-105A300)

Note the lot 2476 cars used the same numbers as cars built in 11-23. The lot 2476 cars were built new but with old customer-furnished trucks that ACF reconditioned.
Regards,
Ed Hawkins



Thanks for that additional information Ed. My problem with the Brown Co., as anyone who ever viewed the variety of rolling stock sitting in their former yard north of the plant in Berlin knows, is that there never seemed to be two cars that were alike until they acquired a batch of incentive per diem cars in the late 
1970's, IIRC, for their Berlin Mills Rwy. The Brown Co. itself updated its listing in the ORER's in July 1947 and that update held at least through April 1948 as I have the ORER's for both months. Most cars are listed as AAR Mech. Design Type TPI but I have yet to figure out what the suffix "I" denotes when attached to the more normal Type TP applying to normal ICC-105A300 cars. Car #1119 was designated as Type TMU with the notation that it was an "addition". It was also a 100,000 lb. capacity car, as were #1133-#1135 also Type TMU. The TMU cars are surprising in that I have never seen photos of such cars in New England.

This all begs the question about #1128 - #1130, all built in the two years between 11-1928 and 10-1930. Were these cars really all alike or were changes made as time progressed? Needless to state, if they were all alike
I will be after BLI's Bob Grubba to offer #1128 and #1129 to go along with the available #1130. The reason I wonder about possible differences is due to the variation in water capacity by lbs. for each of the three cars.
Again no two were alike as for #1128 it was 48606, #1129 was 48084 and #1130 was 48215. Not a huge variance but a variance none-the-less. But the July 1959 ORER at least shows #1129 and #1130 as having a capacity of 5,798 gals., information that is not provided in the earlier ORER's. #1128 was off the roster by that date. The only older cars still on the roster in July 1959 were the #1104 and #1105, which you note were new cars utilizing old car numbers and rebuilt trucks. Their capacity was only 3,086 gals. All of these cars mentioned were only 60,000 lbs. capacity with the exception of the odd ball #1119 and #1127, another odd 
ball with only a 5,000 gal. capacity but with trucks rated for 80,000 lbs. Hopefully that nominal 6,000 gal. capacity (actual 5,798) indicates that #1128 - #1130 were all alike so two more cars are a possibility.

Again my thanks for your assistance. Hopefully what I have added will be of some value to others interested
in these cars. 

Cordially, Don Valentine


Re: Automobile Engine Unloading (L.A. Area Plants)

Paul Doggett <paul.doggett2472@...>
 


Thanks Bob that's my excuse for all my Automobile boxcars.

On Sun, 21 May 2017 at 1:26, thecitrusbelt@... [STMFC]
wrote:
 

Below is a list I compiled from various sources that I believe to be accurate. There may be a plant or two I have missed, however.


Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA

++++


Southern California Automobile Assembly Plants


 Chrysler

Commerce, 1929-1971


Ford

Pico Rivera, 1957-1980

Long Beach, 1930–1959


General Motors

South Gate, 1936-1982

Van Nuys, 1947-1992


Kaiser Frazer

Long Beach, 1947-1955?


Nash Motors

El Segundo, 1948-1955


Studebaker

Vernon, 1936-1956

 

Toyota (Truck Beds)

Long Beach, 1972-2004


Willys-Overland

Maywood 1928-1954



Re: DO NOT HUMP: FGEX Double Deck Refrigerator

Garth Groff <sarahsan@...>
 

Friends,

The car is FDEX 9163, part of series 9050-9249, 58 cars in my October 1958 ORER. The series is covered by note "X", which refers to stage icing. There apparently were exceptions called out, but that page is missing from my copy of the ORER. There are no other notes on commodity assignment or other special equipment.

Maybe Bill Welch can comment on the term "Double Deck". Could this just refer to the stage icing feature? I can't envision how the interior could be set up with two floors or something like that in the cargo compartment.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff


On 5/20/17 8:57 PM, 'gary laakso' vasa0vasa@... [STMFC] wrote:
 

Here is a picture of a double deck FGEX reefer with very prominent DO NOT HUMP placards and its placed behind the UP F-3 diesels.

 

https://donstrack.smugmug.com/UtahRails/Emil-Albrecht-Photos/1948-Jan-Salt-Lake-City/i-WJhZ5dt/A 

 

Why would a refrigerator be so placarded?  Likely hauling eggs?  I have not seen many such placarded reefers.

 

Gary Laakso

south of Mike Brock

 

 



PRR R6- Express Refrigerator Car - Trucks

Kenneth Montero
 


Dear Colleagues,

I recently acquired a RailWorks PRR R60 Express Refrigerator car, from which the trucks had been removed. I am trying to find replacement trucks.

The only pictures that I could find were (1) a 3/4 angle shot of the prototype from the Hagley Library, and (2) a head-on side shot of the model from the San Diego Model Railroad Club. Going to D. Garrett Spear's website, Pennsylvania Passenger Car Information - Trucks: http://varnish.pennsyrr.com/PRRTrucks/DGS_PRR_PTrucks.htm  it appears that the original trucks were 2D3P1. 

Does anyone make such a truck in HO scale? The closest ones appear to be on Bethlehem Car Works site under Kitbits as no. 1265. Is there anything available that is closer.

My other alternative would be, if the original trucks ever were replaced with other trucks on a prototype car, what would be to apply such other trucks, but I would like to know what were the replacement trucks and to which car(s) such truck were used as replacement trucks.

I am sharing this request with the Passenger Car Yahoo group since these cars are treated as both freight and passenger cars.

Thank you.

Ken Montero



Re: film of interest

Ray Breyer
 

In case anyone wants to download and watch the film:


Interestingly, the train and most of the vehicle footage is WWII stock film of stateside training, and features M10 Wolverines rather than M4 Shermans or M24 Chaffees (which were usually used in 1950s monster movies). I'd love to know were the original footage went.

Ray Breyer
Elgin, IL



From: "Bob Miller cajonpass02@... [STMFC]"
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Saturday, May 20, 2017 7:47 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] film of interest



That's a blast from the past. I remember seeing that movie! I would have been 6 that year.


On May 20, 2017, at 8:34 PM, 'Al Westerfield' westerfieldalfred@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:

 
 
 
To all – The syfy film Invaders From Mars (1953) has an extended sequence of loading tanks, armored vehicles and jeeps on flat cars, the train in motion plus a troop train. – Al Westerfield
.






Re: DO NOT HUMP: FGEX Double Deck Refrigerator

rwitt_2000
 

Bill Welch when you can please take a look at this photo ... to my eye the underframe for this FDEX reefer is from a former PRR R7.

Were these rebuilds on the former PRR R7 underframes random or were there specific rebuilding programs?

Bob Witt


Re: Lehigh wrong way door boxcar paint color.

Scott
 

Thank you Chuck!

I ran to the hobby store and you are absolutely correct on the paint mix. I think that will be the winner. I have to admit when I mixed it for a test paint it was really pink but when it dried out it looks great. I have three more wrong way kits (long story) so it will give me a chance to try different weathering.

Thanks
Scott McDonald


Re: DO NOT HUMP: FGEX Double Deck Refrigerator

Todd Sullivan
 

Might be loaded with Campbell Soup in cans.  I know the Campbell's plant in Camden, NJ shipped lots of canned soup in FGEX reefers.  Another possibility is beer in bottles.  Or maybe eggs, as you suggested. 

Todd Sullivan


DO NOT HUMP: FGEX Double Deck Refrigerator

gary laakso
 

Here is a picture of a double deck FGEX reefer with very prominent DO NOT HUMP placards and its placed behind the UP F-3 diesels.

 

https://donstrack.smugmug.com/UtahRails/Emil-Albrecht-Photos/1948-Jan-Salt-Lake-City/i-WJhZ5dt/A 

 

Why would a refrigerator be so placarded?  Likely hauling eggs?  I have not seen many such placarded reefers.

 

Gary Laakso

south of Mike Brock

 

 


Re: film of interest

Robert J Miller CFA
 

That's a blast from the past. I remember seeing that movie! I would have been 6 that year.


On May 20, 2017, at 8:34 PM, 'Al Westerfield' westerfieldalfred@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:

 

 
 
To all – The syfy film Invaders From Mars (1953) has an extended sequence of loading tanks, armored vehicles and jeeps on flat cars, the train in motion plus a troop train. – Al Westerfield
.


film of interest

 

 
 
To all – The syfy film Invaders From Mars (1953) has an extended sequence of loading tanks, armored vehicles and jeeps on flat cars, the train in motion plus a troop train. – Al Westerfield
.


Re: Automobile Engine Unloading (L.A. Area Plants)

thecitrusbelt@...
 

Below is a list I compiled from various sources that I believe to be accurate. There may be a plant or two I have missed, however.


Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA

++++


Southern California Automobile Assembly Plants


 Chrysler

Commerce, 1929-1971


Ford

Pico Rivera, 1957-1980

Long Beach, 1930–1959


General Motors

South Gate, 1936-1982

Van Nuys, 1947-1992


Kaiser Frazer

Long Beach, 1947-1955?


Nash Motors

El Segundo, 1948-1955


Studebaker

Vernon, 1936-1956

 

Toyota (Truck Beds)

Long Beach, 1972-2004


Willys-Overland

Maywood 1928-1954



Re: Automobile Engine Unloading

Tim O'Connor
 


Didn't Willys (i.e. Jeep) have an assembly plant in the LA area? I vaguely recall hearing that with regard
to some Santa Fe freight cars ...

Tim O'Connor



These 1958 photos just make it into the group's era. Captions state the engines are being unloaded at a Lincoln-Mercury plant. The source of the photos was Merge Studios in Los Angeles so the location probably is Southern California. Ford operated a plant in Pico Rivera (1957-1980), a suburb southeast of Los Angeles, served by the Santa Fe. I am unaware of another Ford plant in the area other than Ford's Long Beach plant, which closed in 1959.

http://catalog.library.ca.gov/exlibris/aleph/a21_1/apache_media/T8DTUN8QLI1G6QA3P7QX182MBV1MEN.jpg
http://catalog.library.ca.gov/exlibris/aleph/a21_1/apache_media/PRLBRXSE4YTD94GAMBGA7F4JXI2EUK.jpg
http://catalog.library.ca.gov/exlibris/aleph/a21_1/apache_media/YGB2KC52ILVK3EVGQJSREA12E91V8H.jpg

Bob Chaparro


Re: BLI 6,000 gal. tank car

Ed Hawkins
 


On May 20, 2017, at 11:00 AM, Don Valentine riverman_vt@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:

The Brown Co. car, however, I am certain of 
and know that the company had additional cars as well though none seem to be exact duplicates.
Again more research is necessary. But to me the Brown Co. car is a little jewel. I really like the
frame and feel it makes the overall model a bit better than the older design Atlas car. Again YMMV.
when one puts the BLI model next to an Atlas model the difference in size really stands out! It does
so in a way that to me at least heightens the impression of both models. Thus I am hopeful that 
other New England based users of these really nice prototypes can be found and documented as
I'd really like to add more of them to the fleet.

Don,
The Brown Co. received the following three 6,000-gal., ICC-105A300, Type 27 tank cars from ACF. 

Lot 738, BCX 1128, built 11-28
Lot 981, BCX 1129, built 8-29
Lot 1188, BCX 1130, built 10-30

BCX also purchased from ACF nine 3,000-gallon chlorine tank cars.

Lot 9635, BCX 1104-1105, built 11-23 (ARA V)
Lot 568, BCX 1122-1126, built 2-28 (ICC-105A300)
Lot 2476, BCX 1104-1105, built 1-43 (ICC-105A300)

Note the lot 2476 cars used the same numbers as cars built in 11-23. The lot 2476 cars were built new but with old customer-furnished trucks that ACF reconditioned.
Regards,
Ed Hawkins




Auxiliary Water Tender

hubert mask
 

I have two C&O Black water tenders left. Price 72. 00 includes shipping and handling.
Maskislanddecals.com
Mask Island Decals Inc

Hubert Mask

31561 - 31580 of 181233