Date   
Re: OMI 1930-built GATC 10,000 Gal double dome tank car

Fred Jansz
 

Thank you very much for this information Craig!
The puzzle is nearing completion.
If only I could find out what was stecilled on those domes!
Resumé: these 1930-built, 10,000 Gallon insulated double dome cars were in service as NIPX #6, 7 & 8 for the North Indiana Public Service plant in Michigan City, Indiana.
They were already out of the ORER in 1936.
#8 was possibly the only only surviver (the other 2 possibly went back into the GATX pool) at the NIPCO plant as 'captive car' and was photographed there by Arnt Gerritsen.
Who also made drawings of which Overland made a model in ca. 1991.
Pity they didn't issue a painted & letterd version, otherwise it would have been on the BT files as sample for mine.
Now the real challenge is to find the original Arnt Gerritsen picture of NIPX 8, so I can make some decals for it.
In my closets this car is a sample of a lost car, far away from home in 1950 in the Feather River Canyon.
To return home after decades, just in time for Arnt to take pictures of it around 1988.
I understand from Jeff Lemke the OMI model is from 1991.
cheers,
Fred Jansz

Re: OMI 1930-built double dome tank car

Jon Miller
 

On 11/5/2019 9:59 AM, Tim O'Connor wrote:
I love them because they are among the finest examples of styrene freight car kit
design.

Yes!

-- 
Jon Miller
For me time stopped in 1941
Digitrax  Chief/Zephyr systems, JMRI User
SPROG User
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS

Re: OMI 1930-built double dome tank car

Tim O'Connor
 


And Overland was working in a time period when we were ALL learning about the
incredible diversity of freight cars, led by modelers like Hendrickson and Nehrich
and many others who sparked the whole RPM movement. So naturally Overland (and the
other importers) made a lot of "mistakes" (I can think of some real howlers from
Precision Scale) and often didn't reveal very much about the prototypes for their
models (if indeed there was one). It was an 'era' of the model industry, and that
time has passed at least for hand made brass models.

I take it with a grain of salt. An interesting looking, well made brass tank car
that is realistically (if not "accurately") painted and lettered is always welcome
in a train of mine... Many people hate Tichy tank cars because they're not right.
I love them because they are among the finest examples of styrene freight car kit
design.

Tim O'Connor





On 11/4/2019 6:47 PM, WILLIAM PARDIE wrote:
Overland produced many fine pieces of rolling stock many of which I am proud to have in my collection.  Some of their tank cars gave me reason to question them.  They produced a three dome model which years ago I finished as a ULTX car.
I was pleased with the model until several years ago when I purchased a Tangent three dome car.  The Tangent car looked like an N scale model next to the Overland car.  I found some drawings in Mailine Modeler which were smaller than the Overland car.

I also had a problem with their 10,000 gallon car which had a rather large platform on each end of the car.  Searched and searched but none found a prototype photo of this car.  Again Mainline modeler had a drawing that exactly matched the
 Overland car.  Possibly Overland used this drawing in producing the car.

My only other disappointment was a Texas & Pacific caboose which was 6' too short.  This car was replaced with a Hallmark model that was correct.

These disappointments are avery small percentage of the many fine models that they produced.  I recently rounded out my collection with the purchase of an Overland E-1 diesel originally done for the City Of San Francisco.  Overland also produced the version that SP converted to the Daylight scheme with the big number boards. Very pleased with this model.

Bill Pardie



Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone

-------- Original message --------
From: Tony Thompson <tony@...>
Date: 11/4/19 1:20 PM (GMT-10:00)
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] OMI 1930-built double dome tank car

Bruce Smith wrote:

I was quoting the man… I can find no subsequent change of that sentiment, and it is clear from Richard’s comments that he was not involved in the design of this car.

     You are right that Richard had nothing to do with model design and was less than happy about what eventually came from OMI.
      At one point he pulled out his prints of all the photos he had sent to OMI. I had a few of those cars, and he had others, which we then looked at. I don't have any doubts of his connection as at least a source of info for OMI.

Tony Thompson




--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts

Re: PM Box loading with ground corn cobs.

al.kresse
 

Yep!  Any luck making contact with Mac Beard lately?  Al

On November 4, 2019 at 11:10 PM Joseph <Mstl852@...> wrote:

Think of the fun we will have!!

On Mon, Nov 4, 2019 at 10:08 PM sherman4863 via Groups.Io <sherman4863= yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
The flour mill in Franklin, MN was used in the 50's, after it quit making flour, to grind cobs and shipped in boxcars to Shakopee where it was bagged and sold for floor dry.  Sam Sherman 

 

 


 

Re: PM Box loading with ground corn cobs.

Jon Miller
 

On 11/5/2019 7:13 AM, james murrie via Groups.Io wrote:
Somewhere I have a 1943 or 1944

    I also remember that in the late 40s my relatives in SD used corn cobs for fuel in the kitchen stove.  Don't know if they were delivered or collected from the farm.

-- 
Jon Miller
For me time stopped in 1941
Digitrax  Chief/Zephyr systems, JMRI User
SPROG User
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS

Re: PM Box loading with ground corn cobs.

james murrie
 

Somewhere I have a 1943 or 1944 Illinois license plate that my father told me was made from corn cobs to save steel.  It's definitely some kind of "wood" that was then painted and lettered.
Jim Murrie

Re: PM Box loading with ground corn cobs.

O Fenton Wells
 

Corn cobs were also used for grinding and polishing things like poker chips.
Fenton

On Mon, Nov 4, 2019 at 11:02 PM Matt Smith <flyn96@...> wrote:
Doug,

If you zoom in the resolution is sufficient to show that the truck is full of cobs. Corn shellers are larger and more mechanically complicated than the grinder/blower on the back of this truck. 

Matt Smith
Bloomington, IL



--
Fenton Wells
250 Frye Rd
Pinehurst NC 28374
910-420-8106
srrfan1401@...

Re: Boxcar With Roof Hatches

Marty McGuirk
 

Add Central Vermont to the list.


On Nov 2, 2019, at 11:22 PM, Jim Gates via Groups.Io <jim.gates@...> wrote:



3M had several that were at home on the Santa Fe's Corona branch.

Jim Gates

On Wednesday, October 30, 2019, 4:51:29 PM CDT, Bob Chaparro via Groups.Io <chiefbobbb@...> wrote:


Boxcar With Roof Hatches

I've seen a few photos of boxcars with roof hatches for loading such commodities as aluminum dross, cement, various clays, lime and spent grain.

All of the photos I've seen are associated with shippers in the Southeast and Midwest.

Would such boxcars have served shippers in the Southwest to any degree?

Thanks.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA

Re: OMI 1930-built GATC 10,000 Gal double dome tank car

Craig Wilson
 

Tom Marsh lived in downstate Indiana.  However his draftsman, Arnt Gerritsen, lived near Valparaiso in northwest Indiana.  He drew many, many projects that got produced as Overland Models and some that didn't.  Arnt had a fondness for the out-of-the-ordinary and would venture out to measure and photograph when he found one.  This particular car resided at the NIPCO plant in Michigan City Indiana.  It was a "captive car" there and no one that Arnt talked to could tell him how long it had been there or what its previously life had been.  Arnt considered it a one-of-kind-prototype, which it may indeed be.

Arnt drew projects that interested him on his own time and filed the drawings away.  Because OMI was his employer, Tom Marsh had first right of refusal on these and this tank car may have caught Tom's eye and he decided to built it.  Another one of these "private efforts" resulted in the Speedwitch AA Single Sheath boxcar kit.  The prototype cars were all retired in 1962-63 and dismantled, save for couple door-and-a-half cars what went into MofW service.  Then a fully intact single door car was discovered sitting in the DPW yard in Cadillac Michigan and being used as a storage shed.  Arnt and I got permission to go measure and photograph it.  Arnt created a beautiful set of scale drawings which went in the drawer until Ted Culotta saw them and borrowed the drawings for the Speedwitch model.

Craig Wilson

Re: PM Box loading with ground corn cobs.

Joseph
 

Sorry, meant to be off list.  Time for me to get some shut eye
Joe Binish

On Mon, Nov 4, 2019 at 10:10 PM Joseph via Groups.Io <Mstl852=gmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
Think of the fun we will have!!

On Mon, Nov 4, 2019 at 10:08 PM sherman4863 via Groups.Io <sherman4863=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
The flour mill in Franklin, MN was used in the 50's, after it quit making flour, to grind cobs and shipped in boxcars to Shakopee where it was bagged and sold for floor dry.  Sam Sherman 

Re: PM Box loading with ground corn cobs.

Joseph
 

Think of the fun we will have!!

On Mon, Nov 4, 2019 at 10:08 PM sherman4863 via Groups.Io <sherman4863=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:
The flour mill in Franklin, MN was used in the 50's, after it quit making flour, to grind cobs and shipped in boxcars to Shakopee where it was bagged and sold for floor dry.  Sam Sherman 

Re: PM Box loading with ground corn cobs.

sherman4863
 

The flour mill in Franklin, MN was used in the 50's, after it quit making flour, to grind cobs and shipped in boxcars to Shakopee where it was bagged and sold for floor dry.  Sam Sherman 

Re: PM Box loading with ground corn cobs.

Matt Smith
 

Doug,

If you zoom in the resolution is sufficient to show that the truck is full of cobs. Corn shellers are larger and more mechanically complicated than the grinder/blower on the back of this truck. 

Matt Smith
Bloomington, IL

Re: OMI 1930-built GATC 10,000 Gal double dome tank car

spsalso
 

There's no NIPX reporting marks in January 1939 ORER.




Ed

Edward Sutorik

Re: PM Box loading with ground corn cobs.

Lloyd Keyser
 

The Quaker Oats plant in Cedar Rapids, IA in the 40's into the 60's consumed six to eight car loads of cobs a day and processed them obtaining a chemical named Furfural. The cob residue, a very fine powder, was blown into IC covered hoppers for delivery for use in plastics. The covered hoppers were converted in company shops in 1950 and 51, numbers 81750-81752, by modifying three bay coal hoppers. The sides were increased in height and a roof added containing a small vent at the diagonal corners of the roof. In the center of the increased height was a two piece door which opened and a large plate secured with dogs. A flexible pipe was attached to blow the fine power into each end of the car. The hopper doors were modified for unloading the powder. As farming technology improved the corn pickers shelled the corn as it was picked dropping the cobs on the ground along with the stocks and plowed under for next years planting. As the availability of cobs declined the processed was modified to using oat hulls which was the byproduct of making cereal.
I am modeling the loading platform and kit bashing two hoppers for loading. I have the IC diagram sheet which gives enough detail to accomplish this. What I lack is a good side view  for creating the decals. I have been unsuccessful in obtaining this picture. They are not in the IC archives. Can anyone help? 

Lloyd Keyser 

Re: OMI 1930-built GATC 10,000 Gal double dome tank car

al_brown03
 

The 1955 tariff 300-H lists *no* 10,000-gallon twin-compartment cars with equal-sized compartments and 4.5% domes.

AL B.

Re: PM Box loading with ground corn cobs.

Douglas Harding
 

The photo shows a portable corn sheller mounted on the back of a truck. The farmer is shoveling corn into the sheller, which is blowing the shelled corn into the boxcar and dumping the cobs on the ground.

 

Corn cobs were a valuable commodity well after WWII. The CNW built a cob unloading device in Colo IA in 1956, (drawing attached) And I have people who remember the cob pile in town. I also know Belle Plaine IA had a large cob pile and shipped out cobs on the CNW well into the 60s & 70s. I understood they went to a cosmetics company.

 

Cobs were also used as a biodegradable sand blasting material, animal bedding, and today for ethanol production.

 

Doug  Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Matt Smith
Sent: Monday, November 4, 2019 12:00 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] PM Box loading with ground corn cobs.

 

Nice pic of car loading with ground corn cobs. I read that corn cobs used during the war effort I believe it had something to do with plastics manufacturing??? Several articles indicated local elevators shipping corn cobs for the war effort.

http://www.idaillinois.org/digital/collection/p16614coll35/id/34348/rec/62

No location but somewhere in the central Illinois area.
5/4/44 IDA Pantagraph Collection
--
Matt Smith
Bloomington, IL

Re: OMI 1930-built GATC 10,000 Gal double dome tank car

Bill Kelly
 


NIPX 8 is listed in the 1936 Freight Tariff No. 300-A, capacities of tank cars. The owner is Northern Indiana Public Service Co. It is listed as an insulated two compartment car equipped with heater coils having a total capacity of 9901 gallons. The A compartment is 4952 gal with a 226 gal dome, the B compartment is 4949 gal with a 226 gal dome. There is also a no.6 and a no.7, both with very similar descriptions. Sure sounds like this car. Anybody have info on it after 1936 ?
Later,
Bill Kelly
 
On Mon, 4 Nov 2019 22:55:12 +0000 "Bruce Smith" <smithbf@...> writes:
 
Fred,

Just to be 100% clear, NIPX 8 did not exist in the 1950s. That’s a “post-modern” reporting mark for this list ;)

Regards

Bruce


Bruce F. Smith            

Auburn, AL

"Some days you are the bug, some days you are the windshield."




On Nov 4, 2019, at 4:08 PM, Fred Jansz <fred@...> wrote:

Thanks Bruce and Tim.
Checked the historic files of this group and decided I will paint & letter for NIPX 8.
We can't ask Arnt anymore, but Jeff Lemke has a huge OMI database, maybe he comes up with more details?
regards, Fred Jansz


Re: OMI 1930-built GATC 10,000 Gal double dome tank car

al_brown03
 

The 5/1936 tank car tariff lists Northern Indiana Public Service as having three 10,000-gallon two-compartment tank cars, NIPX 6-8. They *don't* appear in the 1/1943 ORER.

Al Brown, Melbourne, Fla.

Re: OMI 1930-built double dome tank car

WILLIAM PARDIE
 

Overland produced many fine pieces of rolling stock many of which I am proud to have in my collection.  Some of their tank cars gave me reason to question them.  They produced a three dome model which years ago I finished as a ULTX car.
I was pleased with the model until several years ago when I purchased a Tangent three dome car.  The Tangent car looked like an N scale model next to the Overland car.  I found some drawings in Mailine Modeler which were smaller than the Overland car.

I also had a problem with their 10,000 gallon car which had a rather large platform on each end of the car.  Searched and searched but none found a prototype photo of this car.  Again Mainline modeler had a drawing that exactly matched the
 Overland car.  Possibly Overland used this drawing in producing the car.

My only other disappointment was a Texas & Pacific caboose which was 6' too short.  This car was replaced with a Hallmark model that was correct.

These disappointments are avery small percentage of the many fine models that they produced.  I recently rounded out my collection with the purchase of an Overland E-1 diesel originally done for the City Of San Francisco.  Overland also produced the version that SP converted to the Daylight scheme with the big number boards. Very pleased with this model.

Bill Pardie



Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone

-------- Original message --------
From: Tony Thompson <tony@...>
Date: 11/4/19 1:20 PM (GMT-10:00)
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] OMI 1930-built double dome tank car

Bruce Smith wrote:

I was quoting the man… I can find no subsequent change of that sentiment, and it is clear from Richard’s comments that he was not involved in the design of this car.

     You are right that Richard had nothing to do with model design and was less than happy about what eventually came from OMI.
      At one point he pulled out his prints of all the photos he had sent to OMI. I had a few of those cars, and he had others, which we then looked at. I don't have any doubts of his connection as at least a source of info for OMI.

Tony Thompson