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Re: Beer Reefers for Everyone

Bruce Smith
 

Mike,

I've been thinking about a clinic on the brewing industry, but for Cocoa Beach, not Chi-town. The problem is that while I know a lot about brewing, I am not as familiar with railroad service to breweries.

Regards
Bruce Smith
Auburn, AL
________________________________________
From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com <STMFC@yahoogroups.com> on behalf of Mike Skibbe mskibbe@gmail.com [STMFC] <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, June 4, 2016 2:03 PM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Beer Reefers for Everyone

The topic of freight car fleets used to move beer would be a great clinic topic for RPM Chicagoland if anyone has some extra time and the inclination to pull it all together! Sounds like there is some knowledge of the St. Louis and Milwaukee fleets here. I can help with photos of the DSDX cars...

Any takers?? <grin>

Mike Skibbe
www.rpmconference.com



On Jun 3, 2016, at 2:50 PM, Jeffrey White jrwhite@midwest.net [STMFC] <STMFC@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Prohibition lives and not just in the South.

Illinois permitted every political subdivision (county, township, city,
ward and precinct) to decide if they were going to be wet or dry after
the repeal of prohibition. The law permitted that decision to be made
either by a vote of the elected representatives (i.e. county board, city
council) or by referendum. The law also states that once that decision
was made, it can only be changed by the same method it was made. In
other words, if the city council or county board voted to go wet, then
the city council or county board could return toe political subdivision
to dry. And if the wet/dry decision was made by referendum, then it can
only be changed by referendum.

This created a patchwork of wet/dry areas in Illinois that still exists.
During the time period we cover, much of rural Illinois was dry.

Of course alcoholic beverages still passed through the dry areas and
often there was a county that was dry but one or more municipalities in
the county were wet.

Anheuser Busch products were brewed only in St Louis until 1951 when
they opened a brewery in Newark, NJ. This later expanded to 9 breweries
in various parts of the country but much of that expansion happened
after the cutoff date of this list.

Busch began pasteurizing their beer in the early 1870s and shipped it
nationwide.

The Anheuser Busch website says this about the company owned cars:

http://www.anheuser-busch.com/index.php/our-heritage/history/history-of-innovation/

"Refrigerated Railcars- Adolphus expanded the use of refrigerated
railcars, which were first introduced at the 1876 Centennial Exhibition
in Philadelphia. By 1877, Adolphus was using 40 cars built by the
Tiffany Refrigerator Car Company of Chicago. In 1878, Adolphus and three
other businessmen established the St. Louis Refrigerator Car Co., which
later provided Anheuser-Busch with a fleet of 850 refrigerator cars to
transport beer throughout the nation.

Rail-side Ice Houses- Ice was another variable that Adolphus had to
manage in the shipment of his beer to distant markets. Ice melts, so in
order to keep the refrigerated railcars cold, fresh supplies needed to
be stored so that the cars could be repacked. To make sure the company
had an ample supply of fresh ice, Anheuser-Busch built a series of ice
houses and storage depots. When the railcars pulled in after traveling a
distance, they could stop and reload with fresh ice."

I wasn't aware that the company built it's own ice houses. I wonder
where they were located and how long they lasted?

Jeff White

Alma, IL




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Posted by: Mike Skibbe <mskibbe@gmail.com>
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Yahoo Groups Links
Re: nice roof weathering

Bill Welch
 

Indeed Curt, thank you for the alert!

Bill Welch
Re: R-40-10 reefers

Fred Jansz
 

OK will keep that in mind, thanks for the hint also on the apex boards.
Fred
Re: Beer Reefers for Everyone

skibbs4
 

The topic of freight car fleets used to move beer would be a great clinic topic for RPM Chicagoland if anyone has some extra time and the inclination to pull it all together! Sounds like there is some knowledge of the St. Louis and Milwaukee fleets here. I can help with photos of the DSDX cars...

Any takers?? <grin>

Mike Skibbe
www.rpmconference.com

On Jun 3, 2016, at 2:50 PM, Jeffrey White jrwhite@midwest.net [STMFC] <STMFC@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

Prohibition lives and not just in the South.

Illinois permitted every political subdivision (county, township, city,
ward and precinct) to decide if they were going to be wet or dry after
the repeal of prohibition. The law permitted that decision to be made
either by a vote of the elected representatives (i.e. county board, city
council) or by referendum. The law also states that once that decision
was made, it can only be changed by the same method it was made. In
other words, if the city council or county board voted to go wet, then
the city council or county board could return toe political subdivision
to dry. And if the wet/dry decision was made by referendum, then it can
only be changed by referendum.

This created a patchwork of wet/dry areas in Illinois that still exists.
During the time period we cover, much of rural Illinois was dry.

Of course alcoholic beverages still passed through the dry areas and
often there was a county that was dry but one or more municipalities in
the county were wet.

Anheuser Busch products were brewed only in St Louis until 1951 when
they opened a brewery in Newark, NJ. This later expanded to 9 breweries
in various parts of the country but much of that expansion happened
after the cutoff date of this list.

Busch began pasteurizing their beer in the early 1870s and shipped it
nationwide.

The Anheuser Busch website says this about the company owned cars:

http://www.anheuser-busch.com/index.php/our-heritage/history/history-of-innovation/

"Refrigerated Railcars- Adolphus expanded the use of refrigerated
railcars, which were first introduced at the 1876 Centennial Exhibition
in Philadelphia. By 1877, Adolphus was using 40 cars built by the
Tiffany Refrigerator Car Company of Chicago. In 1878, Adolphus and three
other businessmen established the St. Louis Refrigerator Car Co., which
later provided Anheuser-Busch with a fleet of 850 refrigerator cars to
transport beer throughout the nation.

Rail-side Ice Houses- Ice was another variable that Adolphus had to
manage in the shipment of his beer to distant markets. Ice melts, so in
order to keep the refrigerated railcars cold, fresh supplies needed to
be stored so that the cars could be repacked. To make sure the company
had an ample supply of fresh ice, Anheuser-Busch built a series of ice
houses and storage depots. When the railcars pulled in after traveling a
distance, they could stop and reload with fresh ice."

I wasn't aware that the company built it's own ice houses. I wonder
where they were located and how long they lasted?

Jeff White

Alma, IL




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Yahoo Groups Links
Re: e bay auctions

sprinthag@...
 

A lot of the sellers are not at all knowledgeable about trains. real of model.  They get some at a estate sale and think everything is worth a fortune.
These are also the ones that call a Mantua 4-6-0 a 4-4-2 just because of the odd driver spacing. Or they photograph a steam loco with the tender backwards. What I don't get is seeing two of the same item for, say, priced at $3500 and $40.00 and the a bit further down the same thing asking $200.00.
Sometimes when I see an obvious error, especially if something is listed incorrectly to the point where buyers that may want it won't even click on the item, I send a message to the sellers. Some are very grateful and send me thank yous and others, if they reply, basically tell me where to shove it.
Oh well. All we can do is watch for deals. One thging I can say is if you see a seller that appears to have really good asking prices, by all means check his/her other items.
John Hagen
Re: Friction Bearings

Brad Smith
 

Not true. I was a real railroader and we used the term friction bearing. A common term in describing car trucks and repair of such. 

Brad Smith 

Sent from Brad's iPod

On Jun 4, 2016, at 2:52 AM, riverman_vt@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:

 

Amen and thank you Tony. The term seems to have taken hold of model railroaders far 

more than it ever did with real railroaders and many of us, myself included, occasionally
slip up and use it.

Cordially, Don Valentine
Re: Red caboose -12 PFE models

Tony Thompson
 

Ed Miines wrote:

 
Which model is the proper height, R-30-12 or R-30-12-9? The prototypes were about 6" different, about .070" in HO. .The 2 models are the same height.


      Red Caboose did a correct R-30-12. They then brought out the R-30-9 lettering on the same body, and unfortunately some of those kits are out there (with incorrect height, as Ed says). But, God love 'em, they retooled the -9 kit to the correct height, and there were lots of those produced too. So for the question of which model is correct, the answer is "both," but beware of the exception. BTW, the -9 cars were lettered R-30-12-9 for five years or so, then it was simplified to R-30-9.
       Confession: Red Caboose had consulted with me about the possibility of doing the -9 models, and I evidently did not make sufficiently clear that the heights were different, and I know I emphasized that the body APPEARANCE was essentially the same, with the same side hardware, etc. Later we got it cleared up, and I reminded them that if they had sent me a drawing or test shot to review, I would have caught the problem. But as I said, they did do the stand-up thing and corrected the model.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history
Re: Beer Reefers for Everyone

William Hirt
 

Dave,

Flip the states and you would be correct. The golf course is on the Kansas side. Kansas still has somewhat restrictive liquor laws. Passenger trains were subject to these restrictions when traveling through Kansas. Schlitz used to have a brewery on the Missouri side just south of downtown - one of several breweries on the Missouri side of the line. And of course M K Goetz Brewing (later Pearl Brewing) was up the river in St Joseph. I've only seen URTX cars in Goetz Brewery photographs. The brewery was served by the CGW. My dad used to visit the brewery because he worked for Continental Can which supplied cans for the brewery's product (the most famous of which was Country Club Malt Liquor).

Bill Hirt


On 6/3/2016 10:23 PM, 'David North' david.north@... [STMFC] wrote:

At one golf club in Kansas City golfers would play a round of golf, then cross the road to go to the club house for a beer.

That road happened to be the state line.

The golf course was in Missouri which was dry � the club house was in Kansas which was wet.

(I think I have that the right way around).

I was told this during the 1998 Kansas City NMRA Convention.

Cheers

Dave


Re: Friction Bearings

Tony Thompson
 

Jim Pickett wrote:

 
If you look objectively at what the term actually implies, The old bronze bearings, even with wadding and lubrication incurred a lot more friction than did roller bearings. Therefore the name, "friction bearing" is actually appropriate.

        Actually, be careful with this statement. The measured frictional resistance is vanishingly small between solid and roller bearings at all speeds above about 5 miles per hour. And even starting friction, certainly distinctly higher for solid bearings, is not a huge difference for days above about 50 degrees F (if memory serves on the temperature number). Of course on really cold days the difference could get huge.
         The enormous advantage of roller bearings is not only the virtual absence of hot boxes, but the elimination of all the inspection and maintenance of solid bearings. In economic terms, this is the ball game.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history
nice roof weathering

Curt Fortenberry
 


Looks very realistic ;-)


Curt Fortenberry


Original Slide - Rock Island RI N&W ATSF Box Car Derailment Scene on N&W 1958
Re: Red caboose -12 PFE models

gary laakso
 

Can you share a picture of the car with us, Ed?
 
gary laakso
south of Mike Brock
 

Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2016 12:25 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Red caboose -12 PFE models
 
 

Which model is the proper height, R-30-12 or R-30-12-9? The prototypes were about 6" different, about .070" in HO. .The 2 models are the same height.


I recently built a -12 using 30 AWG soft black wire for the grab irons & Yarmouth stirrup steps. A lot of work but the car looks great.


Ed Mines
Re: e bay auctions

O Fenton Wells
 

My experience as well.  Oh Well

On Sat, Jun 4, 2016 at 12:14 PM, ed_mines@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:
 

My experience is similar and I've gotten some snotty rejections but I've bought some real nice AMB laserkit cabooses by bid for much less than the original price.


Ed Mines





--
Fenton Wells
5 Newberry Lane
Pinehurst NC 28374
910-420-1144
srrfan1401@...
Red caboose -12 PFE models

ed_mines
 

Which model is the proper height, R-30-12 or R-30-12-9? The prototypes were about 6" different, about .070" in HO. .The 2 models are the same height.


I recently built a -12 using 30 AWG soft black wire for the grab irons & Yarmouth stirrup steps. A lot of work but the car looks great.


Ed Mines
Re: e bay auctions

ed_mines
 

My experience is similar and I've gotten some snotty rejections but I've bought some real nice AMB laserkit cabooses by bid for much less than the original price.


Ed Mines
Re: e bay auctions

O Fenton Wells
 

Ed, I have purchased cars on eBay as a 'Best Offer' situation.  I have been successful on a few but most sellers have an unusual way of valuing these kits.  I bid on a Westerfield boxcar and offered $19.95 on an item that was listed at $69.00 or best offer.  As far as I know the gentlemen still owns the kit. Of course you can buy it new from Westerfield for about $35.00
Fenton

On Sat, Jun 4, 2016 at 12:01 PM, ed_mines@... [STMFC] <STMFC@...> wrote:
 

Does anyone have any experience buying freight car kits on e bay sold as "best offer"?


Some classic "junk" kits like the Ambroid ACF covered hopper kits are being offered, sometimes at premium prices. Screen roofwalks, ugh! Sealing the wood is no picnic these days either.


Every so often pretty nice kit built cars are offered. There's a nice, built up Gloor NYC caboose being offered now.


Ed Mines 




--
Fenton Wells
5 Newberry Lane
Pinehurst NC 28374
910-420-1144
srrfan1401@...
e bay auctions

ed_mines
 

Does anyone have any experience buying freight car kits on e bay sold as "best offer"?


Some classic "junk" kits like the Ambroid ACF covered hopper kits are being offered, sometimes at premium prices. Screen roofwalks, ugh! Sealing the wood is no picnic these days either.


Every so often pretty nice kit built cars are offered. There's a nice, built up Gloor NYC caboose being offered now.


Ed Mines 
Tichy Decals

Bill Welch
 

A few months ago I was told by someone I trust that Tichy had acquired the technology necessary to print decals. Tichy through the years has offered a few decals but the quality was uneven IMO. I think but cannot say for certain that they were done for them by F&C.


I am on their email list and receive periodic product updates and today received the second one about PFE and now WP reefer decals. Here is the link for HO: Tichy Train Group > What's New

Someone may want to let Don diplomatically know that he is confused about the paint schemes I think.


My source was interested because Tichy will also do custom runs from artwork furnished to them.


Bill Welch
Re: R-40-10 reefers

Tony Thompson
 

Thanks Todd I have 'em. Only Q is Apex or Morton on a R-40-10?


        As it was shop work, there is no record, but photos I have seen are all Apex, so that's a safe bet. Others just can't be ruled out.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history
Re: R-40-10 reefers

Tony Thompson
 

Fred Jansz wrote:

 

Thanks for your expertise Tony. Saw your name on the Red Caboose leaflet. The kit included fans and tackboards however, a wooden running board. Should've been a metal one in there too. I think I'll model this one with wooden board and no fans and tackboards as one of the 'forgotten' to be upgraded. Heavy weathering included. 


    Not required to be super dirty. PFE did wash a lot of cars in that era, so you can't proportion weathering to age of paint scheme.

Tony Thompson             Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705         www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; e-mail, tony@...
Publishers of books on railroad history
Re: R-40-10 reefers

Fred Jansz
 

Thanks Todd I have 'em. Only Q is Apex or Morton on a R-40-10?
Fred
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