Date   

Re: LVTs was SHPX ORER help needed

Daniel A. Mitchell
 

WWII M4 “Sherman” tanks weighed from 28-41 tons (many versions & variations). The WWII T26 (later became the M26 “Pershing”) weighed about 45 tons.

For comparison the LVTA-4 weighed only about 18 tons. As noted that HAVE to be light enough to float. That means minimal armor and large volume. The unarmored troop transport versions would be in the 12 ton weight range.

Even the “armored” LVT versions provided only partial protection from small arms fire. They were extremely vulnerable to even the lightest anti-tank guns (unfortunately the Japanese had some very good anti-tank weapons).

The LVTA-4 used the same turret as the M8 Howitzer Motor Carriage, which was based on the M5 light tank chassis. Compared to a LVTA-4 it weighed about the same, but was both much smaller and more “dense” having much heavier armor (and would NOT float … it would sink like a rock).

Dan MItchell
==========

On May 22, 2020, at 8:50 PM, Hudson Leighton <hudsonl@...> wrote:

[Edited Message Follows]

They float, so they need the internal volume to displace the water.

Compare to the Duplex drive Sherman with the folding canvas screens.

The weight of US WWII combat vehicles was limited by the capacity of the ship cranes, about 20 tons.

This is one of the reasons the US did not field a heavy tank, they did not  have a way to transport them.

-Hudson


Re: Boxcars Labeled "Vehicle" Or "Carriage"

Claus Schlund \(HGM\)
 

Hi Bob,
 
Sometimes cars were labeled “Furniture and Vehicles” – see attached image of CNW 41098 at Appleton WI in 1892.
 
Claus Schlund
 
 
 

From: Bob Chaparro via groups.io
Sent: Friday, May 22, 2020 9:14 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Boxcars Labeled "Vehicle" Or "Carriage"
 

Boxcars Labeled "Vehicle" Or "Carriage"

The attached photo Pere Marquette Boxcar 42794 is the only one I've seen of a boxcar labeled "Vehicle".

I was told such a label was not all that uncommon around 1900 and that some boxcars were labeled "Carriage" as well because their usual loads were wagons and carriages. This was slightly before the popular introduction of horseless carriages.

Has anyone see more examples of these "Vehicle" boxcars or the even more elusive "Carriage" boxcars?

Thanks.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


Re: Rutland Stock Car in Neutral Yellow Primer

Bill Welch
 

Dave obviously the model is already built and I am not going to disassemble it and start over. It is a compromise I am willing to live with on this model. In the past I have scratch built board x board roofs—see my Speedwitch NYC stock car roof—and have started on a PFE 40-4 wood roof to fit Tichy kit that will be BxB.

Bill Welch


Re: Need Scalecoat paint

O Fenton Wells
 

Don’t forget eBay they have SC and SCII
Fenton 


On May 22, 2020, at 6:57 PM, Schuyler Larrabee via groups.io <schuyler.larrabee@...> wrote:



My first email to him was four weeks ago . . .

 

No Response.

 

S

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Pierre Oliver
Sent: Friday, May 22, 2020 4:24 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Need Scalecoat paint

 

Use the email address on the website 

Shaun is usually pretty good at returning emails 



On May 22, 2020, at 3:53 PM, Schuyler Larrabee via groups.io <schuyler.larrabee@...> wrote:



Sorry for this not perfectly on topic post, but . . .

 

I need one bottle of Scalecoat 1 Silver paint.  

 

I started out a couple of months ago needing several colors, and found most of them, but the silver is the color I need before the others can be used.  Does anyone have leads on shops that:

  1. Might carry Scalecoat 1 and
  2. have enough stock that they’d be likely to have the silver.

I have checked most of the usual suspects, Des Plaines, Caboose in Lakewood CO (closed) and a few others.  Minuteman Scale Models, the manufacturer, hasn’t answered the phone, probably due to “stay at home” orders, for as long as I’ve been looking.  If they did “pick up at our door,” I could drive up there to get it, but . . .

 

Perhaps best to use the “Reply to sender” link below.

 

Thanks

 

Schuyler


Re: CORRECTED COPY Re: [RealSTMFC] USRA and other rebuilt single sheated box cars

spsalso
 

Don,

You are correct in believing that the GN car is a foobie.

It has been my belief that Atlas did many foobie schemes on these cars.  And that they did NOT on the 1932 ARA boxcar.  Belief, of course, is not fact.

RPC 24 has an article on the rebuilds, with lotsa photos.


Ed

Edward Sutorik


Re: Boxcars Labeled "Vehicle" Or "Carriage"

akerboomk
 

In the B&MRRHS reprint of lettering diagrams for 1900 and 1907, there are lettering plans for 3 series labelled “Carriage”.

 

1900 numbers:

12400-12549

12561-12599 (w/ end door)

12400-12549 (yes, I know they overlap above) (also labelled “Hoosac Tunnel Route”)

 

1907 numbers:

12400-12409

12523-12599 (w/ end door)

 

and one labelled “Automobile” in 1907

12423-12472

 

There is at least one photo – see

https://www.bmrrhs.org/box_1893bm_12400_series/

(although you’ll have to get a copy of the B&MRRHS bulletin to see it, but it might be available elsewhere)

 

Ken A.

 

 


--
Ken Akerboom


Re: CORRECTED COPY Re: [RealSTMFC] USRA and other rebuilt single sheated box cars

Tony Thompson
 

Just use a Sharpy to add a shadow and it looks better. Of course YMMV.
Tony Thompson 


On May 22, 2020, at 6:24 PM, spsalso via groups.io <Edwardsutorik@...> wrote:

Thank you, Ben.

I expect, if Atlas ever does the car in Frisco, I'll accept the side sills being weak.  I suppose, if I had a fit, I could re-do the side sill.  But I don't feel one coming on.........


Ed

Edward Sutorik


Re: CORRECTED COPY Re: [RealSTMFC] USRA and other rebuilt single sheated box cars

Brian Carlson
 

In the (limited) research I have done so far. 8 panel sides were earlier than the 10 panel sides. One could surmise, the 8 panel sides just didn’t hold up as well in use. 

Btw don’t buy the Pennsy. The end is wrong, the roof is wrong, the step at the end of the side is wrong, and they managed to paint it wrong. 
But the 10 panels are correct. (Grin) if you want a Pennsy X26 buy the F&C or kitbash. 

Brian J. Carlson 

On May 22, 2020, at 10:26 PM, Donald B. Valentine via groups.io <riverman_vt@...> wrote:


Ben Hom wrote:

"The Atlas models with Murphy roof, 8-panel sides, 5/5/5 Murphy ends, and fishbelly underframe are closest to the SL-SF and ACL/C&WC rebuilds; however, the side sills are poorly rendered, with incorrect support brackets and too-shallow relief.  Your call if this bothers you, but at these models' high MSRP (exceeding the Sunshine kits original MSRP and on par with Funaro's current prices), it makes them a poor value".


      Well, maybe. Like so many things in this hobby it depends upon one's opinion. I avoided these cars when they first came out due to negative comments about the bottom of the sides. I agree the support brackets might have been better done as a separate add on part but suggest the relief may be more accurate than Ben is suggesting based on personal observation of one of these cars that wandered around the VTR in work service for some years. The first Sunshine Kit I ever built was one of the ACL versions
of these cars and I was less than impressed compared to ANY Westerfield car of that period. Finally, who pays MRSP for ANYTHING in this hobby? These cars can presently be found on Greedbay for prices as low as $15 each. With patience probably 
in the exact roadname you want as well. What I am trying to figure out is why those for some roads have eight panel sides and others have ten panel sides and which roads had which style. Without photo of such cars from each road this is not an easy task, which is the chief reason for my questions about these cars this morning. Atlas, for example, offers the model in GN paint, which I am reasonably certain is a complete "foobie". I can't help but wonder if this is the case for the Sou. Pac. (Tony?) and Wes. Pac. as well as neither road took any USRA double sheathed cars but they might have rebuilt non-USRA double sheathed cars of which I am not aware.

Cordially, Don Valentine




Re: CORRECTED COPY Re: [RealSTMFC] USRA and other rebuilt single sheated box cars

Donald B. Valentine
 

Ben Hom wrote:

"The Atlas models with Murphy roof, 8-panel sides, 5/5/5 Murphy ends, and fishbelly underframe are closest to the SL-SF and ACL/C&WC rebuilds; however, the side sills are poorly rendered, with incorrect support brackets and too-shallow relief.  Your call if this bothers you, but at these models' high MSRP (exceeding the Sunshine kits original MSRP and on par with Funaro's current prices), it makes them a poor value".


      Well, maybe. Like so many things in this hobby it depends upon one's opinion. I avoided these cars when they first came out due to negative comments about the bottom of the sides. I agree the support brackets might have been better done as a separate add on part but suggest the relief may be more accurate than Ben is suggesting based on personal observation of one of these cars that wandered around the VTR in work service for some years. The first Sunshine Kit I ever built was one of the ACL versions
of these cars and I was less than impressed compared to ANY Westerfield car of that period. Finally, who pays MRSP for ANYTHING in this hobby? These cars can presently be found on Greedbay for prices as low as $15 each. With patience probably 
in the exact roadname you want as well. What I am trying to figure out is why those for some roads have eight panel sides and others have ten panel sides and which roads had which style. Without photo of such cars from each road this is not an easy task, which is the chief reason for my questions about these cars this morning. Atlas, for example, offers the model in GN paint, which I am reasonably certain is a complete "foobie". I can't help but wonder if this is the case for the Sou. Pac. (Tony?) and Wes. Pac. as well as neither road took any USRA double sheathed cars but they might have rebuilt non-USRA double sheathed cars of which I am not aware.

Cordially, Don Valentine




Re: CORRECTED COPY Re: [RealSTMFC] USRA and other rebuilt single sheated box cars

spsalso
 

Thank you, Ben.

I expect, if Atlas ever does the car in Frisco, I'll accept the side sills being weak.  I suppose, if I had a fit, I could re-do the side sill.  But I don't feel one coming on.........


Ed

Edward Sutorik


Boxcars Labeled "Vehicle" Or "Carriage"

Bob Chaparro
 

Boxcars Labeled "Vehicle" Or "Carriage"

The attached photo Pere Marquette Boxcar 42794 is the only one I've seen of a boxcar labeled "Vehicle".

I was told such a label was not all that uncommon around 1900 and that some boxcars were labeled "Carriage" as well because their usual loads were wagons and carriages. This was slightly before the popular introduction of horseless carriages.

Has anyone see more examples of these "Vehicle" boxcars or the even more elusive "Carriage" boxcars?

Thanks.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


Re: LVTs was SHPX ORER help needed

Hudson Leighton <hudsonl@...>
 
Edited

They float, so they need the internal volume to displace the water.

Compare to the Duplex drive Sherman with the folding canvas screens.

The weight of US WWII combat vehicles was limited by the capacity of the ship cranes, about 20 tons.

This is one of the reasons the US did not field a heavy tank, they did not  have a way to transport them.

-Hudson


LVTs was SHPX ORER help needed

Bruce Smith
 

LVTs make excellent steam era freight car loads. In HO scale, the LVT(a)-4 and LVT-4 are produced by Artitec. Here are one each, test loaded on a P2K flat car. What is interesting to me is the sheer size of these vehicles compared to the Sherman tank, for example.

Regards,
Bruce Smith
Auburn, AL


From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> on behalf of Daniel A. Mitchell <danmitch@...>
Sent: Thursday, May 21, 2020 3:12 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] SHPX ORER help needed
 
Minor point …

The LVT4 had no significant gun nor armor. It was an open-top troop transport vehicle, with a stern ramp.

The first successful LVT was the LVT1 that was a militarized version of an amphibious swamp buggy, the “Alligator”. The LVT1 completely changed amphibious assaults, but as a military vehicle it left a LOT to be desired. Among other problems, it had no stern ramp (Marines had to jump over the side to get out). It was soon followed by a much improved version, the LVT2 which also lacked a stern ramp.

The came the LVT4 which did include a stern ramp making for safer and faster exit.

The need for firepower resulted in the so called “Amtanks” with gun turrets and some (not much) armor. First were the LVTA-1 (37mm gun), and later  LVTA-4 (75mm short barreled howitzer).

All these types saw considerable service in the pacific invasions. The later LVT4 and LVTA-4 were mainly used at Iwo Jima and Okinawa.

Dan Mitchell


Re: Kits for sale

gastro42000 <martincooper@...>
 

On May 22, 2020 at 5:38 PM bnpmodeler <bnchmark63@...> wrote:
hi: please send list. Thanks. Marty Cooper

Greetings group;

I have a bunch of unwanted kits for sale from most of the major producers including Sunshine, Speedwitch, F&C, Westerfield and others, available for bargain prices. If you would like a copy of the list (which is a Word document) please reply to me OFF-LIST at bnchmark63_AT_Comcast_DOT_net. As it is a holiday weekend, I will do my best to get the list to you in a timely fashion but do know that nothing can ship until mid-next week at the earliest. I will accept checks, money orders and PayPal (friends & family), and will ship via USPS Priority Mail, ONLY, with postage paid by the purchaser. I will be happy to ship internationally but be advised shipping has risen dramatically recently. This is a Covid- and smoke-free home. I look forward to hearing from anyone interested, and be sure to include a shipping address for accurate postage quoting. Thanks in advance;

Jim Harr
High Bridge, NJ



Re: Need Scalecoat paint

Schuyler Larrabee
 

My first email to him was four weeks ago . . .

 

No Response.

 

S

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Pierre Oliver
Sent: Friday, May 22, 2020 4:24 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Need Scalecoat paint

 

Use the email address on the website 

Shaun is usually pretty good at returning emails 



On May 22, 2020, at 3:53 PM, Schuyler Larrabee via groups.io <schuyler.larrabee@...> wrote:



Sorry for this not perfectly on topic post, but . . .

 

I need one bottle of Scalecoat 1 Silver paint.  

 

I started out a couple of months ago needing several colors, and found most of them, but the silver is the color I need before the others can be used.  Does anyone have leads on shops that:

  1. Might carry Scalecoat 1 and
  2. have enough stock that they’d be likely to have the silver.

I have checked most of the usual suspects, Des Plaines, Caboose in Lakewood CO (closed) and a few others.  Minuteman Scale Models, the manufacturer, hasn’t answered the phone, probably due to “stay at home” orders, for as long as I’ve been looking.  If they did “pick up at our door,” I could drive up there to get it, but . . .

 

Perhaps best to use the “Reply to sender” link below.

 

Thanks

 

Schuyler


CORRECTED COPY Re: [RealSTMFC] USRA and other rebuilt single sheated box cars

Benjamin Hom
 

Ed Sutorik asked:
"I'm having trouble seeing where the Atlas rebuilt USRA cars are wrong for the SL-SF 127000-130499 cars.  They look to match in the photos.  What am I missing?"

The Atlas models with Murphy roof, 8-panel sides, 5/5/5 Murphy ends, and fishbelly underframe are closest to the SL-SF and ACL/C&WC rebuilds; however, the side sills are poorly rendered, with incorrect support brackets and too-shallow relief.  Your call if this bothers you, but at these models' high MSRP (exceeding the Sunshine kits original MSRP and on par with Funaro's current prices), it makes them a poor value.


Ben Hom


Re: Rutland Stock Car in Neutral Yellow Primer

Dave Parker
 

Bill:

Looks great as always.  My only question is do you plan to do anything about the uniformly scribed roofing (basically V-groove siding), that really doesn't look like the prototype roof at all?  See attached pic of R 1906 off to the left.  Other than rebuilding it board-by-board, have you given any thought as to how it might be improved?

With best regards.
--
Dave Parker
Swall Meadows, CA


Re: USRA and other rebuilt single sheated box cars

spsalso
 

Brian,


I'm having trouble seeing where the Atlas rebuilt USRA cars are wrong for the SL-SF 127000-130499 cars.  They look to match in the photos.  What am I missing?


Ed

Edward Sutorik


Kits for sale

bnpmodeler
 

Greetings group;

I have a bunch of unwanted kits for sale from most of the major producers including Sunshine, Speedwitch, F&C, Westerfield and others, available for bargain prices. If you would like a copy of the list (which is a Word document) please reply to me OFF-LIST at bnchmark63_AT_Comcast_DOT_net. As it is a holiday weekend, I will do my best to get the list to you in a timely fashion but do know that nothing can ship until mid-next week at the earliest. I will accept checks, money orders and PayPal (friends & family), and will ship via USPS Priority Mail, ONLY, with postage paid by the purchaser. I will be happy to ship internationally but be advised shipping has risen dramatically recently. This is a Covid- and smoke-free home. I look forward to hearing from anyone interested, and be sure to include a shipping address for accurate postage quoting. Thanks in advance;

Jim Harr
High Bridge, NJ


Re: Need Scalecoat paint

fire5506
 

Try Minuteman again,

 This is on their website.
"
Covid-19
Covid-19 Update

 


Company Status - COVID-19 Update (5/19/2020)

 

 

 


MinuteMan Scale Models has resumed operations after our limited operations due to Covid-19

Orders are bening handled on a first come, first served basis. Please expect delays from shipping carriers, especially for shipments to Canada.

Also please anticipate delayed response times for emails and phones. We are working to go through and respond to all emails and voicemails, but this will take some time.

MinuteMan Scale Models is a small family run business, we only have one full time employee (myself) and 3 part time employees, my parents and my daughter.
As you may expect after being closed for 2 months our production of paint will be affected, we will get back to normal production in the coming weeks.

 

You can still place orders online, but please expect delays on shipping.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

We apologize for any inconvenience this may cause. Thank you for your understanding and patience.

 

Our thoughts and prayers are with you, your families, our first responders and all those essential employees on the frontlines."


 

Thank you for your interest in our products.