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Re: gn caboose

gastro42000
 

thanks for your response. i had hoped it would be the 30' cars built at that time.marty cooper

----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Haas" <Goatfisher2@...>
To: "STMFC" <STMFC@...>
Sent: Saturday, May 11, 2013 1:07:32 PM
Subject: RE: [STMFC] gn caboose

 





<<hi: in the sept 1944 model railroader there are plans for GN caboose. can
anyone tell me which caboose? the index for this issue (available in the
model railroader  index) states only GN caboose. Thanks. Marty Cooper>>

Marty,

X611 is the lettering on the drawing.

HTH!

Best regards,

Steve Haas
Snoqualmie, WA




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Railway Prototype Cyclopedia's

Brad Andonian
 

Fellas,

With the recent posts on these, I thought I would again mention that I am seeking issue #20. Please contact me if you have an issue to sell.

Thank you and Happy Mother's Day to your wife's, daughters and Mom's---

Brad Andonian

Re: BREX 326-329, express refrigerator cars

Rupert & Maureen <gamlenz@...>
 

Gary

Thanks for looking. From your description, the cream compartment is on the
left of the picture, which is the same view as the Burlington Bulletin
photo. The search continues ...

Rupert Gamlen
Auckland NZ

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of gary
laakso
Sent: Sunday, 12 May 2013 1:13 p.m.
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: BREX 326-329, express refrigerator cars

On page 44 there is a cropped 1 5/16" x 2 1/4" photo of the "B" end that
just includes enough of the side to show the full letters RE and a partial F
with the text noting that only reverse Dreadnaught ends the author has seen
was in a picture of Burlington express reefer shown in the 1943 Car
Cyclopedia and that 29 of the fifty food cars were in service in 1949.

gary laakso


From: Rupert & Maureen
Sent: Saturday, May 11, 2013 8:15 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Re: BREX 326-329, express refrigerator cars


During a previous discussion of these cars, it was stated that there was
"something" about them in Mainline Modeller of February 1987. Would anyone
have this issue?

Rupert Gamlen
Auckland NZ

Re: BREX 326-329, express refrigerator cars

gary laakso
 

On page 44 there is a cropped 1 5/16” x 2 1/4” photo of the “B” end that just includes enough of the side to show the full letters RE and a partial F with the text noting that only reverse Dreadnaught ends the author has seen was in a picture of Burlington express reefer shown in the 1943 Car Cyclopedia and that 29 of the fifty food cars were in service in 1949.

gary laakso


From: Rupert & Maureen
Sent: Saturday, May 11, 2013 8:15 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Re: BREX 326-329, express refrigerator cars


During a previous discussion of these cars, it was stated that there was
"something" about them in Mainline Modeller of February 1987. Would anyone
have this issue?

Rupert Gamlen
Auckland NZ

-----Original Message-----
From: mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com [mailto:mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
Douglas Harding
Sent: Sunday, 12 May 2013 10:38 a.m.
To: mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com
Subject: [STMFC] Re: BREX 326-329, express refrigerator cars

Ed according some postings on the BRHS list three years ago the doors are
"cream compartments"

Re: Post War Stock Cars

Guy Wilber
 

Greg Martin wrote:




"I suspect that there was a real difference in the amount of miles per haul
in trucks versa rail because I just can't imagine (and I could be wrong)
given there was approximately three trucks to the car, by these numbers...
there would have been 1,922,904 truck hauls in 1940 versa 640'968 rail
hauls. !Any numbers out there on the amount of livestock trucks registered
nationwide in 1940?"


Without a doubt truck hauls were of shorter distance. By 1955 the average truck mileage for cattle was 120 miles to terminal markets and 80 miles to packing houses. I haven't seen numbers for earlier years, or found any statistics regarding the number of livestock trucks registered though I can tell you that there were 4,590,386 trucks registered in 1940 with a capacity over 1,500 pounds.


"Am I the only one that sees this as a staggering number of truck hauls of
livestock in short and long haul trucks movements in 1936?"

Staggering as they may seem, the numbers are supported by both AAR and USDA statistics.


"We sometimes forget that both truck and rail business was heavily
regulated in these eras, in an attempt to keep each mode in check."

The highest percentage of trucks used for livestock hauls were exempt from nearly all regulation due to the so-called agriculture commodities exemptions within the Motor Carrier Act of 1935. Those hauling strictly livestock, farmers owning their own rigs and owners operating solely within one state were all exempt from regulations except those regarding operating hours and safety of the truck. Most of the safety requirements were largely ignored by operators and not fully enforced by the largely understaffed ICC. Additionally, none of the listed operators were required to file tariffs though they had full access to the railroad rates which they could, and did, undercut in order to procure the business. The railroads argued for years that those hauling agricultural products should have been placed under the same regulations as the railroads or that they (railroads) should have been extended the same privileges while handling the same commodities.

Regards,

Guy Wilber
Reno, Nevada












[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: Post War Stock Cars used for something else

Ken Soroos
 

OK, Ray. The letters are 5 scale inches high and the "Burlington" is 13 1/2 scale feet long. Since I don't have an actual car here, can you confirm that it will fit in the space on the actual car inside the rivets as shown in the PDF? If so, I'll prepare the art for Don Manlick. Do you need decals with different compression and spacing too (like the original for passenger cars maybe)?

For now, Ken

On May 11, 2013, at 7:14 PM, "David Henderson" <upchuckit@...> wrote:

Group...

At 4minutes, 10 seconds into the documentary, the N&W's "Operation Fast Freight" (found on youtube), it shows a stock car being loaded with...bricks.

Check it out. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7xf9CTEG5hE

Regards...Davie Henderson
Sacramento, Ca.

--- In STMFC@..., "Steven D Johnson" <tenncentralrwy@...> wrote:

While this is not really "post war," I thought the following information
would be of interest.



I am co-authoring a book about the Cadiz Railroad, a now-defunct short line
which was built to connect the towns of Cadiz and Gracey in western
Kentucky. The line interchanged with the Illinois Central RR at Gracey.



The Cadiz RR hauled out a lot of green cross ties, loaded in or on whatever
types of cars were available - boxcars, gondolas, flat cars, and even stock
cars. We have a photo of derailment on the line in February 1942. Directly
behind the locomotive is a stock car, but I can't discern the reporting
marks. The back of the photo has the information "Stock car is loaded with
cross ties due to box car shortage."



The Cadiz RR handled stock cars from a variety of roads. We have a copy of a
letter from the short line's General Manager to the ICRR agent in
Evansville, IN, dated December 20, 1934, which states:



"Dear Sir.-



If you can, will you please furnish this office with live stock contracts on
the following cars shipped from your station which were finally destined
Cadiz, Ky.:



Sept. 27/34

U.P. 46381

N&W 27318

N&W 27678

N&W 27545

S.P. 75167

C&S 2?0?6

U.P. 44827

N&W 27625

U.P. 45032

U.P. 46708

S.P. 72080

S.P. 70905

U.P. ?2947

FWD 3572



The Federal Surplus Relief Corporation is demanding these contracts before
payment will be authorized for freight, and we would like to have them as
early as possible."



Steve Johnson



From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of
mopacfirst
Sent: Friday, May 10, 2013 11:29 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Post War Stock Cars used for something else





How common was it for stock cars to be temporarily / permanently converted
to other loads? This means cleaning out the critter leavings and straw, to
get to a more-or-less clean floor, and installing (or not) an interior
lining so the car could essentially become a boxcar.

I have a photo of a Rock Island (ex-MKT?) stock car with solid (plywood?)
lining sitting in a yard in Wichita so there was no clue if was converted
for grain service or some other more general loading.

As noted in the other thread on stock cars, I'm really thinking about the
end of the time period of this list.

Ron Merrick





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: BREX 326-329, express refrigerator cars

Rupert & Maureen <gamlenz@...>
 

During a previous discussion of these cars, it was stated that there was
"something" about them in Mainline Modeller of February 1987. Would anyone
have this issue?

Rupert Gamlen
Auckland NZ

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of
Douglas Harding
Sent: Sunday, 12 May 2013 10:38 a.m.
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Re: BREX 326-329, express refrigerator cars

Ed according some postings on the BRHS list three years ago the doors are
"cream compartments"

Re: Post War Stock Cars used for something else

David Henderson
 

Group...

At 4minutes, 10 seconds into the documentary, the N&W's "Operation Fast Freight" (found on youtube), it shows a stock car being loaded with...bricks.

Check it out. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7xf9CTEG5hE

Regards...Davie Henderson
Sacramento, Ca.

--- In STMFC@..., "Steven D Johnson" <tenncentralrwy@...> wrote:

While this is not really "post war," I thought the following information
would be of interest.



I am co-authoring a book about the Cadiz Railroad, a now-defunct short line
which was built to connect the towns of Cadiz and Gracey in western
Kentucky. The line interchanged with the Illinois Central RR at Gracey.



The Cadiz RR hauled out a lot of green cross ties, loaded in or on whatever
types of cars were available - boxcars, gondolas, flat cars, and even stock
cars. We have a photo of derailment on the line in February 1942. Directly
behind the locomotive is a stock car, but I can't discern the reporting
marks. The back of the photo has the information "Stock car is loaded with
cross ties due to box car shortage."



The Cadiz RR handled stock cars from a variety of roads. We have a copy of a
letter from the short line's General Manager to the ICRR agent in
Evansville, IN, dated December 20, 1934, which states:



"Dear Sir.-



If you can, will you please furnish this office with live stock contracts on
the following cars shipped from your station which were finally destined
Cadiz, Ky.:



Sept. 27/34

U.P. 46381

N&W 27318

N&W 27678

N&W 27545

S.P. 75167

C&S 2?0?6

U.P. 44827

N&W 27625

U.P. 45032

U.P. 46708

S.P. 72080

S.P. 70905

U.P. ?2947

FWD 3572



The Federal Surplus Relief Corporation is demanding these contracts before
payment will be authorized for freight, and we would like to have them as
early as possible."



Steve Johnson



From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of
mopacfirst
Sent: Friday, May 10, 2013 11:29 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Post War Stock Cars used for something else





How common was it for stock cars to be temporarily / permanently converted
to other loads? This means cleaning out the critter leavings and straw, to
get to a more-or-less clean floor, and installing (or not) an interior
lining so the car could essentially become a boxcar.

I have a photo of a Rock Island (ex-MKT?) stock car with solid (plywood?)
lining sitting in a yard in Wichita so there was no clue if was converted
for grain service or some other more general loading.

As noted in the other thread on stock cars, I'm really thinking about the
end of the time period of this list.

Ron Merrick





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: BREX 326-329, express refrigerator cars

Douglas Harding
 

Ed according some postings on the BRHS list three years ago the doors are
"cream compartments"



Charlie

The cream compartment cars were 326-329, built at Plattsmouth in 1937. The
photo in Bulletin 16 (the same photo as that in Bulletin
12) notes that these were the last four cars of the group so perhaps the
compartment was an afterthought. Logic certainly dictates
that the compartment was only at one end and that the doors on the "other"
side were the same as the viewed side (but it would be
nice to know).

It's interesting that the four cream cars were not separately listed in the
ORER, although a separate compartment would have reduced
the cubic capacity, whilst 304 and 321 were listed by themselves. Thinking
about the 3/8 inch reduced inside height and 1/8 inch
reduced door height of these two cars, I wonder if they had an experimental
ceiling installed, or something!

Interesting to note that sometime between 1941 and 1945, the number range
for
the express reefers was amended in the ORER's from
300-329 to 300-399, although no more express reefers were added actually to
the roster. Presumably someone considered that those
numbers would be needed or the ORER wouldn't have been changed. How much
freedom did BREX have within the Fruit Growers Express
organization when it came to car building?

Rupert

----- Original Message -----
From: "cvlk" <cvlk@...>
To: <CBQ@...>
Sent: Saturday, May 29, 2010 12:46 PM
Subject: Re: [CBQ] Cream compartments

Never having seen anything except the builders photos of the cars both
with
and without the "Cream Door", I have no idea what the
idea was behind them.
I'm not sure what the arrangement was for the "compartment" with the ice
bunker, air circulation within the car, etc...

I am looking at a 1950 OER and BREX shows passenger refrigerator cars
300-399 (total of 29 cars) with an outside length of
51'=11". Cars 304, 321 have very slightly different interior dimensions.

The 1940 OER is more illuminating; it shows cars 300 to 329 for a total of
30 cars; all listed together with no notes that might
sort them out. It seems to me I once knew which cars had Cream Doors and
which didn't; why or how I am not sure at this time.

BREX 300 is conventional; BREX 326 has the "Cream Compartment" according
to
builders photos taken of the same side of both cars.
The 326 was built at Plattsmouth July 1937. The extra door seems to be set
flush with the inside wall of the ice bunker and there
is nothing different otherwise between the two cars other than a the doors
and stirrup steps to access them.

Charlie Vlk


Doug Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

Re: Rail Prototype Cyclopedias for sale

tchenoweth@...
 

Over a month ago I wrote this group and told you that I had volumes 1, 2,
3, 4, 8, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 18. Tom Chenoweth tchenoweth@...

BREX 326-329, express refrigerator cars

Edward
 

I am trying to solve a mystery about these four 50' steel express refrigerator cars built by the Burlington Route in 1937.

They had two sets of doors on each side. One in the center and a second set, seen at the left end from photo of a car at its "B" end.

Was the door near the end on the other side directly opposite this door, or was it diametrically opposite in the other corner?

A prototype photo taken from the "A" end could help solve that. So might a company diagram for that class of car, of which there were only four I understand.

A Burlington Bulletin in which I saw a prototype photo of one of them wasn't able to answer that question. I think it dated from the 1980s.

But it was helpful in other matters. The door sets on each side were two different heights with the lower set near the end. A photo showed one car equipped for passenger service: steam line, air and signal lines, buffers and riding on short wheelbase BX type express trucks.

While apparently painted yellow and maybe box car red (?) like BREX freight reefers, the color of the lettering in that photo suggested it was not black but possibly dark red. It included the words Express Refrigerator in place of Ventilator - Refrigerator.

ORER issues I have from 1943 and 1953 do not call out anything specific about these four cars that relate to the doors, other than being equipped for stage icing.

Does anyone know if Railway Age or a similar contemporary industry journal may have run an article about them in 1937/38?

So far I've found three citations in this group about these cars: Numbers 92911 of 8/11/2011, 61539 of 3/20/2007 and 51362 of 2/9/2006. None answer the door placement question.

Walthers produced their O gauge kit for these cars in 1941, not long after the prototypes were built. It was kit number 3842 and the instructions do not mention anything about the opposite side door placement. Walthers showed one in their catalog with BREX freight lettering, an incorrect freight number (74780)and riding on Bettendorf style trucks.

Any suggestions in resolving the door placement mystery will be truly appreciated!

Thank you,
Ed Bommer

Re: How to get that greasy look

Jim Williams <wwww5960@...>
 

________________________________
From: "richtownsend@..." <richtownsend@...>
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Thursday, April 18, 2013 11:43 AM
Subject: [STMFC] How to get that greasy look



 
I've been trying to come up with ideas for painting parts of some tank cars to get that greasy look some of them had, such as some that served packing plants. Any suggestions?

Richard Townsend
Lincoln City, Oregon

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

Re: gn caboose

Steve Haas
 

<<hi: in the sept 1944 model railroader there are plans for GN caboose. can
anyone tell me which caboose? the index for this issue (available in the
model railroader  index) states only GN caboose. Thanks. Marty Cooper>>


Marty,

X611 is the lettering on the drawing.

HTH!

Best regards,


Steve Haas
Snoqualmie, WA

Re: Post War Stock Cars used for something else

Steven D Johnson
 

While this is not really "post war," I thought the following information
would be of interest.



I am co-authoring a book about the Cadiz Railroad, a now-defunct short line
which was built to connect the towns of Cadiz and Gracey in western
Kentucky. The line interchanged with the Illinois Central RR at Gracey.



The Cadiz RR hauled out a lot of green cross ties, loaded in or on whatever
types of cars were available - boxcars, gondolas, flat cars, and even stock
cars. We have a photo of derailment on the line in February 1942. Directly
behind the locomotive is a stock car, but I can't discern the reporting
marks. The back of the photo has the information "Stock car is loaded with
cross ties due to box car shortage."



The Cadiz RR handled stock cars from a variety of roads. We have a copy of a
letter from the short line's General Manager to the ICRR agent in
Evansville, IN, dated December 20, 1934, which states:



"Dear Sir.-



If you can, will you please furnish this office with live stock contracts on
the following cars shipped from your station which were finally destined
Cadiz, Ky.:



Sept. 27/34

U.P. 46381

N&W 27318

N&W 27678

N&W 27545

S.P. 75167

C&S 2?0?6

U.P. 44827

N&W 27625

U.P. 45032

U.P. 46708

S.P. 72080

S.P. 70905

U.P. ?2947

FWD 3572



The Federal Surplus Relief Corporation is demanding these contracts before
payment will be authorized for freight, and we would like to have them as
early as possible."



Steve Johnson



From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of
mopacfirst
Sent: Friday, May 10, 2013 11:29 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Post War Stock Cars used for something else





How common was it for stock cars to be temporarily / permanently converted
to other loads? This means cleaning out the critter leavings and straw, to
get to a more-or-less clean floor, and installing (or not) an interior
lining so the car could essentially become a boxcar.

I have a photo of a Rock Island (ex-MKT?) stock car with solid (plywood?)
lining sitting in a yard in Wichita so there was no clue if was converted
for grain service or some other more general loading.

As noted in the other thread on stock cars, I'm really thinking about the
end of the time period of this list.

Ron Merrick

Re: Post War Stock Cars used for something else

Charles Etheredge
 

--- In STMFC@..., "mopacfirst" <ron.merrick@...> wrote:

How common was it for stock cars to be temporarily / permanently converted to other loads? This means cleaning out the critter leavings and straw, to get to a more-or-less clean floor, and installing (or not) an interior lining so the car could essentially become a boxcar.

I have a photo of a Rock Island (ex-MKT?) stock car with solid (plywood?) lining sitting in a yard in Wichita so there was no clue if was converted for grain service or some other more general loading.

As noted in the other thread on stock cars, I'm really thinking about the end of the time period of this list.

Ron Merrick
Ron, here in Central Texas and east toward the coast there were a LOT of watermelon production, especially around Hempstead and Luling. Don Hand, in his great article in the Fall SPHTS magazine, he had a picture ( cica 1910) of mule led wagons of melons along side of TNO stock cars in Hempstead. The caption stated that up to 1800 carloads of melons were shipped in one year from here. Certainly a seasonal thing but not a rarity by any means in that era. Into the 1940's, melons were still shipped by rail though perhaps not to this extent.

Charles Etheredge

gn caboose

gastro42000
 

hi: in the sept 1944 model railroader there are plans for GN caboose. can anyone tell me which caboose? the index for this issue (available in the model railroader  index) states only GN caboose. Thanks. Marty Cooper

Ping: Jerry Glow

Phillip Blancher <pblancher@...>
 

With apologies to the list:

Attention Jerry Glow. Please contact me offlist re 9-month old decal
order. The only time you seem to acknowledge my emails is after I post
them here to STMFC.

Thank you.

Phillip Blancher
pblancher@...

Re: Post War Stock Cars used for something else

lstt100
 

From 1942 thru the middle 50's, during the southeast watermelon season, the AAR Car Service Division directed western carriers to send stock cars to the southeast for watermelon loading. This was to supplement ventilator equipped boxcars.

Dan Holbrook

The Keystone Modeler, Spring 2013

Benjamin Hom
 

The Spring 2013 issue of The Keystone Modeler is available for download at
http://www.prrths.com/newprr_files/newPRRKeystoneModeler.htm
featuring the following articles"
- “As-Built” BLI T1 Duplex Review (Tim Garner)
- Enhancing BLI I1SA Decapods (Barry Yankolonis)
- FGE 1921-22 Wood Reefer (Bruce Smith)

Ben Hom