Date   

Re: Weaver Models 40' SS boxcar - prototype match

Mark Mathu
 

Ben Hom wrote:
http://www.weavermodels.com/page37.html
Unfortunately, there aren't that many "Pratt truss"
8 ft 7 in IH prototypes (B&M/MTC, L&N, SAL), and none
with Dreadnaught ends or 13-carline roofs. You can use
this model as a stand-in for the B&M/MTC, L&N and SAL
cars, but be advised that roof and ends do not match
these prototypes.
To the untrained eye (such as mine), how can a person identify the Weaver Models boxcar as 8'-7" IH?
____
Mark Mathu


Re: Decaling our Steam Era Freight Cars

Tim O'Connor
 

Labeling requirements are even stricter in Canada. I remember George Bishop had to change his labels on Accupaint
entirely due to very stringent requirements for goods crossing the border.

----- Original Message -----
From: "John Sykes" <John.Sykes@...>

True, but I think the labeling and posting requirements have made some manufacturers gun-shy. That is one reason why Athearn moved out of California a long time ago. Possibly the manufacturers' legal eagles have told them that they are more open to liability issues with a Prop 65 item in the product, I really don't know. I work for the Florida DEP and we are always laughing at what is going on in California. But I'll shut up before I get all the Californians mad at me.

-- John


Looking to Trade Sunshine Kit UTLX 10K for 6.5 or 8K

erict1361 <erict1361@...>
 

If anyone has an extra 62.5 UTLX X-3 6.5K kit or 62.2 8K Lg Diameter Kit, that they would like to trade for a 62.1 UTLX 10K X-3, Please contact me Off List.

Thanks,

Eric Thur


Re: Weaver Models 40' SS boxcar - prototype match

David
 

--- In STMFC@..., "benjaminfrank_hom" <b.hom@...> wrote:
SAL Classes B-3, B-4, and B-5. HO scale kits available from Sunshine:
http://www.sunshinekits.com/sunimages/sun91c.pdf
Were available, at least. Present and future availability is still an open question, to my knowledge.

David Thompson


Re: Decaling our Steam Era Freight Cars

Douglas Harding
 

Perhaps John is thinking of Horizon Hobby, the distribution company who
bought Athearn and Model Die Casting. Horizon is based in Champaign,
Illinois.



Doug Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org


Re: Weaver Models 40' SS boxcar - prototype match

Misc Clark
 

Thanks, Ben! Murphy XLA sounds more accessible!


On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 10:13 AM, Benjamin Hom <b.hom@...> wrote:

**


Staffan Ehnbom wrote:
"The Great Northern had a "Pratt truss" 40' box series 31000-31499 built
1927 with Dreadnaught ends although they were 3/5 instead of 4/4, 9 ft IH.
They had 13 carline roofs (Murphy pivoted flex) and to start with wood
doors with the metal band a little further down (accomodated the Faceing
Goat herald on the door). Received Youngstown steel doors in the 1930's.
The side braceing was Z-shape rather than hat sections and the metal brace
at the bottom corners of the side were triangular steel plates. The GN cars
had a shallow fish belly underframe.

There is a George Werkema photo in the GNRHS archives:

http://www.gn-npjointarchive.org/Lists/GN_Werkema_Photos/DispForm.aspx?ID=451&Source=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Egn%2Dnpjointarchive%2Eorg%2FLists%2FGN%5FWerkema%5FPhotos%2FAllItems%2Easpx%3FView%3D%7BA9C8C7C7%2D0FFE%2D4010%2DA4E5%2D691AB90827E8%7D%26FilterField1%3DEquipment%255Fx0020%255FType%26FilterValue1%3DBox%2520car%26FilterField2%3DEquip%255Fx0020%255FNo%255Fx002e%255F%26FilterValue2%3D31388&ContentTypeId=0x0100FDAB9398FE439241A3F56A0D93FDCC1B

Clark Cone asked:

"Hi Staffan - you said "They had 13 carline roofs (Murphy pivoted flex)"...
I am not familiar with that roof style...can you point me to an online
reference(s)?"

Also known as Murphy XLA.
FWIW, Sunshine offers kits for the GN 31000-series cars in HO scale:
http://www.sunshinekits.com/sunimages/sun77.pdf

Ben Hom



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Weaver Models 40' SS boxcar - prototype match

Benjamin Hom
 

Staffan Ehnbom wrote:
"The Great Northern had a "Pratt truss" 40' box series 31000-31499 built
1927 with Dreadnaught ends although they were 3/5 instead of 4/4, 9 ft IH.
They had 13 carline roofs (Murphy pivoted flex) and to start with wood
doors with the metal band a little further down (accomodated the Faceing
Goat herald on the door). Received Youngstown steel doors in the 1930's.
The side braceing was Z-shape rather than hat sections and the metal brace
at the bottom corners of the side were triangular steel plates. The GN cars
had a shallow fish belly underframe.

There is a George Werkema photo in the GNRHS archives:
http://www.gn-npjointarchive.org/Lists/GN_Werkema_Photos/DispForm.aspx?ID=451&Source=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Egn%2Dnpjointarchive%2Eorg%2FLists%2FGN%5FWerkema%5FPhotos%2FAllItems%2Easpx%3FView%3D%7BA9C8C7C7%2D0FFE%2D4010%2DA4E5%2D691AB90827E8%7D%26FilterField1%3DEquipment%255Fx0020%255FType%26FilterValue1%3DBox%2520car%26FilterField2%3DEquip%255Fx0020%255FNo%255Fx002e%255F%26FilterValue2%3D31388&ContentTypeId=0x0100FDAB9398FE439241A3F56A0D93FDCC1B


Clark Cone asked:
"Hi Staffan - you said "They had 13 carline roofs (Murphy pivoted flex)"...
I am not familiar with that roof style...can you point me to an online
reference(s)?"

Also known as Murphy XLA.
FWIW, Sunshine offers kits for the GN 31000-series cars in HO scale:
http://www.sunshinekits.com/sunimages/sun77.pdf


Ben Hom


Re: Decaling our Steam Era Freight Cars

Greg Martin
 

Aaaahhhh, John,

Athearn never moved out of California, they have moved around in
California, but they are still based there. They have moved their production to
China, but join the club as even ACCURAIL dabbled in China.

Model Die Caster left California for Nevada, maybe that is what you were
thinking?

Greg Martin

Eventually all things merge into one and a river runs through it.
Norman Maclean


_John.Sykes@... (mailto:John.Sykes@...) writes:

True, but I think the labeling and posting requirements have made some
manufacturers gun-shy. That is one reason why Athearn moved out of California
a long time ago. Possibly the manufacturers' legal eagles have told them
that they are more open to liability issues with a Prop 65 item in the
product, I really don't know. I work for the Florida DEP and we are always
laughing at what is going on in California. But I'll shut up before I get all the
Californians mad at me.

-- John


Re: Weaver Models 40' SS boxcar - prototype match

Misc Clark
 

Hi Staffan - you said "They had 13 carline roofs (Murphy pivoted flex)"...
I am not familiar with that roof style...can you point me to an online
reference(s)?
TIA,
(another "Clark"), Clark Cone


On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 8:28 AM, Staffan Ehnbom <staffan.ehnbom@...>wrote:

**


The Great Northern had a "Pratt truss" 40' box series 31000-31499 built
1927 with Dreadnaught ends although they were 3/5 instead of 4/4, 9 ft IH.
They had 13 carline roofs (Murphy pivoted flex) and to start with wood
doors with the metal band a little further down (accomodated the Faceing
Goat herald on the door). Received Youngstown steel doors in the 1930's.
The side braceing was Z-shape rather than hat sections and the metal brace
at the bottom corners of the side were triangular steel plates. The GN cars
had a shallow fish belly underframe.

There is a George Werkema photo in the GNRHS archives:


http://www.gn-npjointarchive.org/Lists/GN_Werkema_Photos/DispForm.aspx?ID=451&Source=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Egn%2Dnpjointarchive%2Eorg%2FLists%2FGN%5FWerkema%5FPhotos%2FAllItems%2Easpx%3FView%3D%7BA9C8C7C7%2D0FFE%2D4010%2DA4E5%2D691AB90827E8%7D%26FilterField1%3DEquipment%255Fx0020%255FType%26FilterValue1%3DBox%2520car%26FilterField2%3DEquip%255Fx0020%255FNo%255Fx002e%255F%26FilterValue2%3D31388&ContentTypeId=0x0100FDAB9398FE439241A3F56A0D93FDCC1B

Staffan Ehnbom


----- Original Message -----
From: benjaminfrank_hom
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Thursday, April 18, 2013 12:23 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Weaver Models 40' SS boxcar - prototype match

Mark Mathu wrote:
"Has anyone identified the closest prototype match for Weaver Models' O
scale outside braced (...single sheathed, let's not go down _that_
path...) 6-panel 40' boxcar? Any suggestions for a close match?"
http://www.weavermodels.com/page37.html

Unfortunately, there aren't that many "Pratt truss" 8 ft 7 in IH
prototypes (B&M/MTC, L&N, SAL), and none with Dreadnaught ends or 13-
carline roofs. You can use this model as a stand-in for the B&M/MTC,
L&N and SAL cars, but be advised that roof and ends do not match these
prototypes.

Ben Hom





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Decaling our Steam Era Freight Cars

John
 

True, but I think the labeling and posting requirements have made some manufacturers gun-shy. That is one reason why Athearn moved out of California a long time ago. Possibly the manufacturers' legal eagles have told them that they are more open to liability issues with a Prop 65 item in the product, I really don't know. I work for the Florida DEP and we are always laughing at what is going on in California. But I'll shut up before I get all the Californians mad at me.

-- John

--- In STMFC@..., "Jack Burgess" <jack@...> wrote:

John stated:
[snip]
(someone told me today that Walthers changed the active
<ingredient because of Prop 65 or whatever it is in California - however,
<they are finding out that the new ingredient is even more
<hazardous, duh!).

Proposition 65 is totally a mess but it doesn't ban any chemicals but only
requires that businesses post a warning at the entrance that "hazardous"
chemicals are used inside the business. Of course, today there are hundreds
of such chemicals being used but not all are actually being used in a way
that could harm you unless you are working in a factory that makes chrome
parts. <g> I suspect that 99.9% of Californians see those postings and
ignore them. Stupid proposition!

Jack Burgess
Newark, CA


SAL Class B-3/B-4/B-5 SS XM (was Re: Weaver Models 40' SS boxcar)

Benjamin Hom
 

Clark Propst wrote:
"Off the top of my head a 'look alike' might be possible using a F&C
B&M kit? Maybe adding a X29 roof? Micro Scale makes/made SAL decals."

Funaro does a version with the "X29 roof":
http://www.fandckits.com/HOFreight/6000.html

I'd still do a side-by-side of the Funaro kit with the SAL cars to
verify the changes that need to be made, but this opens up another
option to model these cars in HO.


Ben Hom


Re: Weaver Models 40' SS boxcar - prototype match

Clark Propst
 

Off the top of my head a 'look alike' might be possible using a F&C B&M kit? Maybe adding a X29 roof? Micro Scale makes/made SAL decals.
Clark Propst

--- In STMFC@..., "Scott H. Haycock " <shhaycock@...> wrote:

Sorry
Yahoo deleted my signature from my query to Ben. (I would hate to wind up in the anonymity cell- How would I order lunch? )


Scott Haycock
Modeling Tarheel country in the Land of Enchantm ent
----- Original Message -----








Ben Hom

Ben,

Anytime I see SAL mentioned, my ears perk up!

Could you advise me of the series numbers of the cars you're referencing, and any HO models that might work for these cars?

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Weaver Models 40' SS boxcar - prototype match

Staffan Ehnbom <staffan.ehnbom@...>
 

The Great Northern had a "Pratt truss" 40' box series 31000-31499 built 1927 with Dreadnaught ends although they were 3/5 instead of 4/4, 9 ft IH. They had 13 carline roofs (Murphy pivoted flex) and to start with wood doors with the metal band a little further down (accomodated the Faceing Goat herald on the door). Received Youngstown steel doors in the 1930's. The side braceing was Z-shape rather than hat sections and the metal brace at the bottom corners of the side were triangular steel plates. The GN cars had a shallow fish belly underframe.

There is a George Werkema photo in the GNRHS archives:

http://www.gn-npjointarchive.org/Lists/GN_Werkema_Photos/DispForm.aspx?ID=451&Source=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Egn%2Dnpjointarchive%2Eorg%2FLists%2FGN%5FWerkema%5FPhotos%2FAllItems%2Easpx%3FView%3D%7BA9C8C7C7%2D0FFE%2D4010%2DA4E5%2D691AB90827E8%7D%26FilterField1%3DEquipment%255Fx0020%255FType%26FilterValue1%3DBox%2520car%26FilterField2%3DEquip%255Fx0020%255FNo%255Fx002e%255F%26FilterValue2%3D31388&ContentTypeId=0x0100FDAB9398FE439241A3F56A0D93FDCC1B

Staffan Ehnbom

----- Original Message -----
From: benjaminfrank_hom
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Thursday, April 18, 2013 12:23 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Weaver Models 40' SS boxcar - prototype match



Mark Mathu wrote:
"Has anyone identified the closest prototype match for Weaver Models' O
scale outside braced (...single sheathed, let's not go down _that_
path...) 6-panel 40' boxcar? Any suggestions for a close match?"
http://www.weavermodels.com/page37.html

Unfortunately, there aren't that many "Pratt truss" 8 ft 7 in IH
prototypes (B&M/MTC, L&N, SAL), and none with Dreadnaught ends or 13-
carline roofs. You can use this model as a stand-in for the B&M/MTC,
L&N and SAL cars, but be advised that roof and ends do not match these
prototypes.

Ben Hom


Re: Weaver Models 40' SS boxcar - prototype match

Benjamin Hom
 

I wrote:
"Unfortunately, there aren't that many "Pratt truss" 8 ft 7 in IH
prototypes (B&M/MTC, L&N, SAL)..."

Scott Haycock asked:
"Anytime I see SAL mentioned, my ears perk up!
Could you advise me of the series numbers of the cars you're
referencing, and any HO models that might work for these cars?"

SAL Classes B-3, B-4, and B-5. HO scale kits available from Sunshine:
http://www.sunshinekits.com/sunimages/sun91c.pdf


Ben Hom


Re: Weaver Models 40' SS boxcar - prototype match

Scott H. Haycock
 

Sorry
Yahoo deleted my signature from my query to Ben. (I would hate to wind up in the anonymity cell- How would I order lunch? )


Scott Haycock
Modeling Tarheel country in the Land of Enchantm ent

----- Original Message -----








Ben Hom

Ben,

Anytime I see SAL mentioned, my ears perk up!

Could you advise me of the series numbers of the cars you're referencing, and any HO models that might work for these cars?

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Weaver Models 40' SS boxcar - prototype match

Scott H. Haycock
 

Unfortunately, there aren't that many "Pratt truss" 8 ft 7 in IH
prototypes (B&M/MTC, L&N, SAL), and none with Dreadnaught ends or 13-
carline roofs. You can use this model as a stand-in for the B&M/MTC,
L&N and SAL cars, but be advised that roof and ends do not match these
prototypes.
Ben Hom

Ben,

Anytime I see SAL mentioned, my ears perk up!

Could you advise me of the series numbers of the cars you're referencing, and any HO models that might work for these cars?


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Weaver Models 40' SS boxcar - prototype match

Benjamin Hom
 

Mark Mathu wrote:
"Has anyone identified the closest prototype match for Weaver Models' O
scale outside braced (...single sheathed, let's not go down _that_
path...) 6-panel 40' boxcar? Any suggestions for a close match?"
http://www.weavermodels.com/page37.html

Unfortunately, there aren't that many "Pratt truss" 8 ft 7 in IH
prototypes (B&M/MTC, L&N, SAL), and none with Dreadnaught ends or 13-
carline roofs. You can use this model as a stand-in for the B&M/MTC,
L&N and SAL cars, but be advised that roof and ends do not match these
prototypes.


Ben Hom


Weaver Models 40' SS boxcar - prototype match

Mark Mathu
 

Has anyone identified the closest prototype match for Weaver Models' O scale
outside braced (...single sheathed, let's not go down _that_ path...)
6-panel 40' boxcar? Any suggestions for a close match?
http://www.weavermodels.com/page37.html
____
Mark Mathu


Re: Decaling our Steam Era Freight Cars

Jack Burgess
 

John stated:
[snip]
(someone told me today that Walthers changed the active
<ingredient because of Prop 65 or whatever it is in California - however,
<they are finding out that the new ingredient is even more
<hazardous, duh!).

Proposition 65 is totally a mess but it doesn't ban any chemicals but only
requires that businesses post a warning at the entrance that "hazardous"
chemicals are used inside the business. Of course, today there are hundreds
of such chemicals being used but not all are actually being used in a way
that could harm you unless you are working in a factory that makes chrome
parts. <g> I suspect that 99.9% of Californians see those postings and
ignore them. Stupid proposition!

Jack Burgess
Newark, CA


Re: Decaling our Steam Era Freight Cars

John
 

You will never find another bottle of Champ. They closed up shop about three years ago now. Maybe somebody at a train show would have an unopened bottle.

That being said, the active ingredient in Champ Decal Set was butyl cellosolve, however, I have yet to figure out the concentration.

Since 1-1/2 to 2 oz of butyl cellosolve added to a pint of 91% isopropyl alcohol will take the paint off the model, the decal setting solution is probably 1% or less in water.

Butyl cellosolve can be bought by the gallon from Sherwin Williams paint stores. At a cost of about $45, a gallon of the stuff ought to last you 50 years or so. It use to be the active ingredient in Solvaset before they changed it (someone told me today that Walthers changed the active ingredient because of Prop 65 or whatever it is in California - however, they are finding out that the new ingredient is even more hazardous,duh!).

-- John

--- In STMFC@..., Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:


Dear "Mad John" -- any idea what is in Champ's solution? My bottle
is half gone and I fear I'll never find another... It remains my all
time favorite; powerful stuff.

Tim O'Connor



More bad news. I looked it up today and found that the "new" solvent in Solvaset has a vapor pressure 10 times higher than the "old" solvent. That means it has 10 times the propensity to evaporate if you leave the top off the bottle. Another reason why it seems to get weaker with age. It's not your imagination! Don't know if the faster evaporation helps or harms the decaling process.

-- John