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Re: Shirts at Prototype Rails

Brian Carlson
 

I'm finally looking forward to collecting that beer / adult beverage mike Brock owes me from a few years back
Brian Carlson
On Jan 8, 2013, at 9:03 PM, "Bill Schneider" <bschneider424@comcast.net> wrote:

I’m Bill Schneider, and I look forward to testing the accuracy of this message!

Off on Amtrak tomorrow AM.... Hope they don’t have any Red Switches.... (inside joke...)

Bill

From: Mike Brock
Sent: Tuesday, January 08, 2013 8:57 PM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [STMFC] Shirts at Prototype Rails

I will also report that the high temp during each of the 4 days...Jan
10-13...will be 80° on every day.

I'm Mike Brock and I approve of this message.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: UP box car and USRA single sheathed outside braced box car decal questions

Bill Welch
 

Does anyone know how to acquire photos by or owned by Jim Parker? Many of the dates I see associated with his photos are "in my wheelhouse."

Bill Welch

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Benjamin Scanlon" wrote:


Now if you were modelling the Georgia RR in 1954, odds are that you would have many silver-sided cars and a few oxide red. In this case, the oxide red cars would be the odd ones!

Steve Lucas.

quite probably. GA / West Point Route had a variety of cars painted silver, including

AAR 1937 boxes: http://rr-fallenflags.org/awp/awp38011ajs.jpg

USRA SS rebuilds: http://rr-fallenflags.org/grr/ga19733jpa.jpg

and these, though i've no idea what they are ... a version of their 1923 or 1924 ARA Pratt truss rebuilds, given the 7/8 end?

http://rr-fallenflags.org/grr/ga29382ajs.jpg

even their MOW stuff got silver paint at some point, though a whiter shade.

ben
Re: Shirts at Prototype Rails

Bill Schneider
 

I’m Bill Schneider, and I look forward to testing the accuracy of this message!

Off on Amtrak tomorrow AM.... Hope they don’t have any Red Switches.... (inside joke...)

Bill

From: Mike Brock
Sent: Tuesday, January 08, 2013 8:57 PM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [STMFC] Shirts at Prototype Rails


I will also report that the high temp during each of the 4 days...Jan
10-13...will be 80° on every day.

I'm Mike Brock and I approve of this message.





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Shirts at Prototype Rails

Mikebrock
 

Guys, just to be perfectly clear, I will be wearing a shirt. I suggest others do the same...at least during clinics. OH...the lunch begins at noon on Sat.

I will also report that the high temp during each of the 4 days...Jan 10-13...will be 80� on every day.

I'm Mike Brock and I approve of this message.
Re: UP box car and USRA single sheathed outside braced box car decal questions

Benjamin Scanlon
 


Now if you were modelling the Georgia RR in 1954, odds are that you would have many silver-sided cars and a few oxide red. In this case, the oxide red cars would be the odd ones!

Steve Lucas.

quite probably. GA / West Point Route had a variety of cars painted silver, including

AAR 1937 boxes: http://rr-fallenflags.org/awp/awp38011ajs.jpg

USRA SS rebuilds: http://rr-fallenflags.org/grr/ga19733jpa.jpg

and these, though i've no idea what they are ... a version of their 1923 or 1924 ARA Pratt truss rebuilds, given the 7/8 end?

http://rr-fallenflags.org/grr/ga29382ajs.jpg

even their MOW stuff got silver paint at some point, though a whiter shade.

ben
Re: SE version of the 40' war emergency composite boxcar

Benjamin Scanlon
 


Who's your vendor? Railpub has both issues at $US5 each.
http://www.railpub.com/Catalogs/us_rr_model_magazines.pdf
https://www.railpub.com/Ordering/faq.html
http://www.railpub.com


Ben Hom

hmm, they did not come up in my search. i've contacted them and inquired. they charge $5 domestic p&h ... often, the sting in the tail is when when you ask for international mail rates. let us see.
Re: SE version of the 40' war emergency composite boxcar

Benjamin Hom
 

I wrote:
"See the August and September 1994 issues of Mainline Modeler for
drawings and articles by Richard Hendrickson."

Ben Scanlon replied:
"Thank you. I will look out for it, but I should point out that I
live in the UK and accessing these back issues is not easy. Hence
why I like online diagrams. The Sept issue *is* available but
$US12.50 (less p&h) for a plan is a bit steep for me at this point in
time."

Who's your vendor? Railpub has both issues at $US5 each.
http://www.railpub.com/Catalogs/us_rr_model_magazines.pdf
https://www.railpub.com/Ordering/faq.html
http://www.railpub.com


Ben Hom
Re: SE version of the 40' war emergency composite boxcar

Benjamin Scanlon
 


See the August and September 1994 issues of Mainline Modeler for
drawings and articles by Richard Hendrickson.
Thank you. I will look out for it, but I should point out that I live in the UK and accessing these back issues is not easy. Hence why I like online diagrams. The Sept issue *is* available but $US12.50 (less p&h) for a plan is a bit steep for me at this point in time.

So I hope folk don't mind if I focus on what I can dig up online or via scans or a plan from some other source.



"I am wondering where the 6" height was pruned from ... was at the top of the walls, by just using shorter trusses and a thinner plank, or is there a more fundamental difference i'm missing?"

Shorter trusses. This is what makes lowering height for SS boxcar
kitbashes difficult - in most cases, you can't simply cut down a
carbody becasue you cut off the top of the truss.

I once knew a guy who did very delicate surgery cutting a car about three times horizontally through the side and end to remove 1' of height. (I think he felt a single cut would have been too obvious in that the diagonal trusses wouldn't have aligned correctly.)

Fortunately for his sanity he made a master out of the shortened side and end.

Best regards

Ben
Re: Unusual cars (was Re: UP box car etc) (UNCLASSIFIED)

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: NONE

Great discussion, guys! Just had this same discussion with a friend about a WIF box car and an MDC reefer...

Having seen in person, and heard many more examples of "oddballs" (cars you don't expect to see somewhere, not necessarily a type of car) showing up unexpectedly, I created a drawer for cars that I have show up unexpectedly, but not by whim; I have some reason (d100 die roll each operating session):

Flat car with rebuilt transformer for power plant (determined by d100);
Partially reloaded reefer from downtown Pgh's reefer heaven, going to a local supermarket distributor facility;
Bad-order car(s) destined to be set out somewhere, based on sharp eyes of operators;
Mis-directed car that does not belong in a consist;
Open hopper from some far away location that is statistically SOOO unlikely to be there...;
Ditto for box car;
Ditto for gon;
Very unusual load for local team track, with empty for cycle back;
Shifted load car, also for spotting by some sharp-eyed operator;
Cars that are damaged in some way, and should be bad-ordered or not used for intended service (i.e., gon with missing sections of flooring, flat cars with same, etc.)

There could be dozens more.

So, in my world, a string of "expected" hoppers sometimes gets an addition of that one SP (or ATSF, DRGW, or IC) hopper that "just does not belong there", just so it looks more real, maybe only to me,

Elden Gatwood

P.S. Any idea why a six-done "wine" tank car might be on the P&WV?

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of al_brown03
Sent: Tuesday, January 08, 2013 2:01 PM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [STMFC] Unusual cars (was Re: UP box car etc)



Frank Peacock gave a most interesting talk at Cocoa Beach last year, to the effect most every mainline through freight train contains one "outlier": a car whose probability of being there is low. Examples I remember include a Midland Valley boxcar, and a Green Bay & Western reefer; the latter was an outlier *in context* because it was westbound over Sherman Hill *empty*. It makes perfect sense to have a pool of such cars, and use a select few per operating session.

Al Brown, Melbourne, Fla.

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com <mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com> , "midrly" wrote:

Which I why I was so glad that the Georgia RR USRA steel rebuild boxcar that my wife innocently gave me the Tichy kit for was painted in freight car red two years before my model layout era! Silver painted cars are pretty obvious.

I have a True Line model of one of CN's three aluminum-sheathed 40' boxcars, but have many regular CN 40' boxcars to blend it in with. Not so for my models of Gerogia RR cars--exactly one car.

Now if you were modelling the Georgia RR in 1954, odds are that you would have many silver-sided cars and a few oxide red. In this case, the oxide red cars would be the odd ones!

Steve Lucas.

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com <mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com> , Richard Hendrickson wrote:

On Jan 7, 2013, at 1:11 PM, timboconnor@ wrote:

Tony,

I subscribe to the contrary philosophy, that says if your layout contains NO unusual cars, then it's not
very representative of most railroads, since one can often spot unusual cars in photos of the prototype.
Yeah, Tim, but if you're going to have one or two odd-ball cars on a layout, they should be OBVIOUS odd balls (e.g., helium tank, dry ice reefer, drop-center flat car, etc.) Otherwise, who knows they're odd-balls? I'll bet the number of modelers, even on this list, who would recognize that the boxcar in the passing train was the one-and-only Union Pacific B-50-18 is very small (and I'll bet I could name most of them). For all but those very few viewers, where's the verisimilitude in having a stealth odd-ball that no one recognizes as such?

Richard Hendrickson








Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: NONE
Unusual cars (was Re: UP box car etc)

al_brown03
 

Frank Peacock gave a most interesting talk at Cocoa Beach last year, to the effect most every mainline through freight train contains one "outlier": a car whose probability of being there is low. Examples I remember include a Midland Valley boxcar, and a Green Bay & Western reefer; the latter was an outlier *in context* because it was westbound over Sherman Hill *empty*. It makes perfect sense to have a pool of such cars, and use a select few per operating session.

Al Brown, Melbourne, Fla.

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "midrly" wrote:

Which I why I was so glad that the Georgia RR USRA steel rebuild boxcar that my wife innocently gave me the Tichy kit for was painted in freight car red two years before my model layout era! Silver painted cars are pretty obvious.

I have a True Line model of one of CN's three aluminum-sheathed 40' boxcars, but have many regular CN 40' boxcars to blend it in with. Not so for my models of Gerogia RR cars--exactly one car.

Now if you were modelling the Georgia RR in 1954, odds are that you would have many silver-sided cars and a few oxide red. In this case, the oxide red cars would be the odd ones!

Steve Lucas.

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, Richard Hendrickson wrote:

On Jan 7, 2013, at 1:11 PM, timboconnor@ wrote:

Tony,

I subscribe to the contrary philosophy, that says if your layout contains NO unusual cars, then it's not
very representative of most railroads, since one can often spot unusual cars in photos of the prototype.
Yeah, Tim, but if you're going to have one or two odd-ball cars on a layout, they should be OBVIOUS odd balls (e.g., helium tank, dry ice reefer, drop-center flat car, etc.) Otherwise, who knows they're odd-balls? I'll bet the number of modelers, even on this list, who would recognize that the boxcar in the passing train was the one-and-only Union Pacific B-50-18 is very small (and I'll bet I could name most of them). For all but those very few viewers, where's the verisimilitude in having a stealth odd-ball that no one recognizes as such?

Richard Hendrickson



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Re: Official SHIRT colors for ProtoRails 2012

Bill Schneider
 

Red, black, yellow, tan, blue... sounds like I need to remember my sunglasses fro more than just outside wear!

Bill Schneider

From: Marty
Sent: Tuesday, January 08, 2013 1:21 PM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Official SHIRT colors for ProtoRails 2012


Hey, I know I'll be late to my own funeral (plan to, in fact....) but in this case I have to claim I'm only guilty of replying to the original post . . .

Marty

--- In mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com, "Pierre" wrote:

Marty
You appear to be a year late.
2013?
:-)
Pierre Oliver

--- In mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com, "Marty" wrote:

To protest being left off the formal schedule, all members of the exclusive "Yellow Friends of the Freight Car Shirt" club are invited to proudly display their "really bright yellow" on each and every day of the meet.

Marty



--- In mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com, "Pierre" wrote:

Damn!
I have to repack my luggage. :-)
Pierre Oliver

--- In mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com, "sctry" wrote:

In order to enhance our Steam Era Freight Car modeling experience at the forthcoming ProtoRails 2013 – Cocoa Beach, the following thread from the recently defunct "Shirt Club Discussion Group" is passed along: "….the Fraternal Order of the SHIRTS membership selection committee chairman while relaxing with a refreshing Leinenkugels has declared that Cocoa Beach shall be a RED SHIRT Friday and BLACK SHIRT Saturday". All inductees and members in good standing of FOotS (a.k.a. Hawaiian Shirt Club, Chicago Shirt Mafia, Polish National Touring Bowling Team, Those Guys in the Crazy Shirts, Hey- Nice Shirt; where can I get one, The Shirt Club, etc.) to proudly wear their colors while participating in the ProtoRails events. Official alternate colors of TAN or BLUE are also permitted.

In keeping with past practices there will be NO banquet dinner this year. Inductees (you know who you are) shall gather on Thursday night at 2400 hrs 50 yards east of the surf line. If you have not remitted your dues by January 8th, don't worry, there aren't any!

J. Greedy
(Unofficial) Recording Secretary
Re: Official SHIRT colors for ProtoRails 2012

Marty McGuirk
 

Hey, I know I'll be late to my own funeral (plan to, in fact....) but in this case I have to claim I'm only guilty of replying to the original post . . .

Marty

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Pierre" wrote:

Marty
You appear to be a year late.
2013?
:-)
Pierre Oliver

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Marty" wrote:

To protest being left off the formal schedule, all members of the exclusive "Yellow Friends of the Freight Car Shirt" club are invited to proudly display their "really bright yellow" on each and every day of the meet.

Marty



--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Pierre" wrote:

Damn!
I have to repack my luggage. :-)
Pierre Oliver

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "sctry" wrote:

In order to enhance our Steam Era Freight Car modeling experience at the forthcoming ProtoRails 2013 – Cocoa Beach, the following thread from the recently defunct "Shirt Club Discussion Group" is passed along: "….the Fraternal Order of the SHIRTS membership selection committee chairman while relaxing with a refreshing Leinenkugels has declared that Cocoa Beach shall be a RED SHIRT Friday and BLACK SHIRT Saturday". All inductees and members in good standing of FOotS (a.k.a. Hawaiian Shirt Club, Chicago Shirt Mafia, Polish National Touring Bowling Team, Those Guys in the Crazy Shirts, Hey- Nice Shirt; where can I get one, The Shirt Club, etc.) to proudly wear their colors while participating in the ProtoRails events. Official alternate colors of TAN or BLUE are also permitted.

In keeping with past practices there will be NO banquet dinner this year. Inductees (you know who you are) shall gather on Thursday night at 2400 hrs 50 yards east of the surf line. If you have not remitted your dues by January 8th, don't worry, there aren't any!

J. Greedy
(Unofficial) Recording Secretary
Re: SE version of the 40' war emergency composite boxcar

Benjamin Hom
 

Ben Scanlon wrote:
"i've looked at the sunshine models pdfs for war emergency boxcars and
the SE [Southeastern] war emergency version which is 10' high, 6"
lower than standard."

Be careful with designating car heights as "standard" - significant
numbers of 10 ft IH boxcars were being built at the same time as 10
ft 6 in IH boxcars.


"i can find an outline diagram of the 10'6" car ... sounds like a
good place to start in building one."

See the August and September 1994 issues of Mainline Modeler for
drawings and articles by Richard Hendrickson.


"I am wondering where the 6" height was pruned from ... was at the top of the walls, by just using shorter trusses and a thinner plank, or is there a more fundamental difference i'm missing?"

Shorter trusses. This is what makes lowering height for SS boxcar
kitbashes difficult - in most cases, you can't simply cut down a
carbody becuase you cut off the top of the truss.


Ben Hom
Re: Manor Model R.R. Products

john.allyn@...
 

You may want to inquire over at the Vintage HO group.


John B. Allyn

----- Original Message -----
From: "Gene" <bierglaeser@yahoo.com>
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, January 8, 2013 11:56:24 AM
Subject: [STMFC] Manor Model R.R. Products

 




I bought a Manor pickle car kit on eBay just out of curiosity. Never heard of that company before. The kit appears to be the typical wood kit of the 1940s and early 1950s.

Does anyone know any history of this company?

The box also advertised box cars, reefers, gondolas, flat cars and hoppers. Does anyone have any of these other cars?

Can anyone comment on fidelity to prototype (if any)?
Green
Re: UP box car and USRA single sheathed outside braced box car decal questions

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

David Thompson wrote:
I like the d20 method. If you roll a 20, pull the aluminum reefer out of its box, put it on the layout for that session, then put it back in the box at the end of the day. Next time you roll a 20, pull out the UP ARA box, or the RF&P stock car.
Exactly, a sound approach. But I would be pulling out that MNS box car, or Crystal Car Lines red tank car, or the General Electric covered hopper, all of which are representatives of small fleets of cars but are by no means unique or two-of-a-kind.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history
Manor Model R.R. Products

Gene <bierglaeser@...>
 

I bought a Manor pickle car kit on eBay just out of curiosity. Never heard of that company before. The kit appears to be the typical wood kit of the 1940s and early 1950s.

Does anyone know any history of this company?

The box also advertised box cars, reefers, gondolas, flat cars and hoppers. Does anyone have any of these other cars?

Can anyone comment on fidelity to prototype (if any)?
Green
Re: Official SHIRT colors for ProtoRails 2012

Pierre <pierre.oliver@...>
 

Marty
You appear to be a year late.
2013?
:-)
Pierre Oliver

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Marty" wrote:

To protest being left off the formal schedule, all members of the exclusive "Yellow Friends of the Freight Car Shirt" club are invited to proudly display their "really bright yellow" on each and every day of the meet.

Marty



--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Pierre" wrote:

Damn!
I have to repack my luggage. :-)
Pierre Oliver

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "sctry" wrote:

In order to enhance our Steam Era Freight Car modeling experience at the forthcoming ProtoRails 2013 – Cocoa Beach, the following thread from the recently defunct "Shirt Club Discussion Group" is passed along: "….the Fraternal Order of the SHIRTS membership selection committee chairman while relaxing with a refreshing Leinenkugels has declared that Cocoa Beach shall be a RED SHIRT Friday and BLACK SHIRT Saturday". All inductees and members in good standing of FOotS (a.k.a. Hawaiian Shirt Club, Chicago Shirt Mafia, Polish National Touring Bowling Team, Those Guys in the Crazy Shirts, Hey- Nice Shirt; where can I get one, The Shirt Club, etc.) to proudly wear their colors while participating in the ProtoRails events. Official alternate colors of TAN or BLUE are also permitted.

In keeping with past practices there will be NO banquet dinner this year. Inductees (you know who you are) shall gather on Thursday night at 2400 hrs 50 yards east of the surf line. If you have not remitted your dues by January 8th, don't worry, there aren't any!

J. Greedy
(Unofficial) Recording Secretary
Re: Official SHIRT colors for ProtoRails 2012

Marty McGuirk
 

To protest being left off the formal schedule, all members of the exclusive "Yellow Friends of the Freight Car Shirt" club are invited to proudly display their "really bright yellow" on each and every day of the meet.

Marty

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Pierre" wrote:

Damn!
I have to repack my luggage. :-)
Pierre Oliver

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "sctry" wrote:

In order to enhance our Steam Era Freight Car modeling experience at the forthcoming ProtoRails 2013 – Cocoa Beach, the following thread from the recently defunct "Shirt Club Discussion Group" is passed along: "….the Fraternal Order of the SHIRTS membership selection committee chairman while relaxing with a refreshing Leinenkugels has declared that Cocoa Beach shall be a RED SHIRT Friday and BLACK SHIRT Saturday". All inductees and members in good standing of FOotS (a.k.a. Hawaiian Shirt Club, Chicago Shirt Mafia, Polish National Touring Bowling Team, Those Guys in the Crazy Shirts, Hey- Nice Shirt; where can I get one, The Shirt Club, etc.) to proudly wear their colors while participating in the ProtoRails events. Official alternate colors of TAN or BLUE are also permitted.

In keeping with past practices there will be NO banquet dinner this year. Inductees (you know who you are) shall gather on Thursday night at 2400 hrs 50 yards east of the surf line. If you have not remitted your dues by January 8th, don't worry, there aren't any!

J. Greedy
(Unofficial) Recording Secretary
Re: CV 40000 series WAS 40'IL 8'IH 7 panel Howe Z-bar truss (aka Fowler) box cars

Marty McGuirk
 

The CV 40000-series boxcars were some of the earliest examples of what are sometimes called "alternate" ARA cars.

If anyone is interested, I included a post on my blog about those cars:
http://centralvermontrailway.blogspot.com/2012/10/cv-40000-series-howe-truss-boxcars.html?m=0

I welcome any comments or feedback on the post.

Marty McGuirk

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Benjamin Scanlon" wrote:


http://www.rr-fallenflags.org/acfx/ic171500asw.jpg

San Juan Car Company has an exquisite model of the D&RGW car in O scale, while Westerfield offers this in HO. The
former may be a resource itself, while the latter's web page can help with lettering for many of the roads' cars (see the
4400 and 6400 series of kits.)

End of old draft.

Earl Tuson
hullo earl

thank you for the detail. this is very informative for me.

on the illinois central car, in TTnut a similar photo of a CV car was posted.

it looks a little too high for the 'fowler clone' represented by the gold coast TT kit, which i think is supposed to be 8' IH? however it is a very interesting car.

i have found on one of the rock island mail lists that a few of the composite ended early RI 'fowler clones' were still on their roster in 1962, but had gone by 1965. these are the ones with 18 thin roof ribs described in the O scale magazine article as 'mullions', as opposed to the 15 on the gold coast model.

(RI had later similar cars with steel ends and other variations in corner bracing, i think in the B-2 classification. i do not know if these were the same height as the earlier cars but they look similar.)

regards, ben
SE version of the 40' war emergency composite boxcar

Benjamin Scanlon
 

i've looked at the sunshine models pdfs for war emergency boxcars and the SE war emergency version which is 10' high, 6" lower than standard.

i can find an outline diagram of the 10'6" car ... sounds like a good place to start in building one.

I am wondering where the 6" height was pruned from ... was at the top of the walls, by just using shorter trusses and a thinner plank, or is there a more fundamental difference i'm missing?

regards

ben
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