Date   

Re: Cotton Belt

Jim Betz
 

Gene,
  Great shot.  The car is 30 years old and still ready to serve.  I found
that stencil on the left door "This Door Is Stationary" ... interesting,
velly interesting (credit to Laugh In).
                                                                                        - Jim


Re: Sugar Beets in Cattle Cars

Richard Townsend
 

At least at the sugar plants I am aware of in Colorado, beets were not crushed into pulp. They were put through a slicer that cut them into “cossettes” that resembled French fries but with a triangular cross-section. They then went through various cooking and centrifugal processes to extract the sugar. At each stage the result was some form of liquid with more or less sugar content. I haven’t heard of any of the juices being shipped to other places outside the originating sugar factory. They did ship molasses in tank cars as it was considered to be a waste product. The remains of the beets came out as a pulp but that was a result of the refining process, not any initial crushing like with sugar cane.


On Oct 26, 2020, at 7:09 PM, Tony Thompson <tony@...> wrote:


Thomas Birkett wrote:

I hesitate to mention the cars I leased out for beet juice that were last contained sodium hydroxide, not clean. We don't buy beet derived sugar at our house.
Another question: in the steam era were beets crushed and the juice sent to another location for final processing? Always looking for a tank car connection for layout industries.

      Sugar beets were partially steam cooked and shredded, and the pulp was the source of sugar. (Done all at one plant.) I would think that "beet juice" would be a vegetable juice, not from sugar beets at all. 

Tony Thompson




Re: Sugar Beets in Cattle Cars

Tony Thompson
 

Thomas Birkett wrote:

I hesitate to mention the cars I leased out for beet juice that were last contained sodium hydroxide, not clean. We don't buy beet derived sugar at our house.
Another question: in the steam era were beets crushed and the juice sent to another location for final processing? Always looking for a tank car connection for layout industries.

      Sugar beets were partially steam cooked and shredded, and the pulp was the source of sugar. (Done all at one plant.) I would think that "beet juice" would be a vegetable juice, not from sugar beets at all. 

Tony Thompson




Re: RGM and available time

Schuyler Larrabee
 

.  It's hard enough already to carve out adequate time at the modeling bench.

 

AMEN!!  It’s hard enough to find the time to deal with the posts on a daily basis.  I increasingly delete some topics en masse simply because the first two posts let me know there’s nothing I am really interested in .

 

And I’m now retired, with ?? LOTS of spare time???

 

Schuyler

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Dave Parker via groups.io
Sent: Monday, October 26, 2020 8:09 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] RGM

 

I'm OK with Facebook but, let's face it, groups.io is a vastly superior vehicle for sharing information, contacting individuals, archiving photos and files, etc., etc.  Search functions work great.

I now belong to 7 groups, and they all have something to offer (despite widely differing levels of activity).  Accordingly, I just can't see investing any time in Facebook groups.  It's hard enough already to carve out adequate time at the modeling bench.
--
Dave Parker
Swall Meadows, CA


Re: Sugar Beets in Cattle Cars

Thomas Birkett
 

I hesitate to mention the cars I leased out for beet juice that were last contained sodium hydroxide, not clean. We don't buy beet derived sugar at our house.
Another question: in the steam era were beets crushed and the juice sent to another location for final processing? Always looking for a tank car connection for layout industries.
Tom Birkett, Bartlesville, OK



Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S® 6, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone

-------- Original message --------
From: James SANDIFER <steve.sandifer@...>
Date: 10/26/20 6:13 PM (GMT-06:00)
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Sugar Beets in Cattle Cars

They lined stock cars with cardboard and used them to ship grain, so why worry about sugar beets? Nothing like high protein corn flakes.

Steve Sandifer

On Mon, Oct 26, 2020 at 11:34 AM, Jerry Michels
<gjmichels53@...> wrote:
Wouldn't stock cars used for sugar beets and cabbage be cleaned out beforehand?  They were cleaned out after a cattle shipment.  Regarding sugar beets.  They are refined to such an extent that no contamination would remain.  It is a pretty neat process I saw at the Holly Sugar plant in Hereford, TX, before it closed.  Dirty beets go in, pure white sugar comes out.  Jerry Michels


Re: OIL CAR

Matthew Metoyer
 

It's nice to know oil was recycled in the 30's, but useless for the original question about the photo from the early 1900's. The oil cars belong to a Milwaukee Road predecessor, correct? Maybe someone from their historical society has other documents that can help?

Here is the link again: https://bloximages.chicago2.vip.townnews.com/siouxcityjournal.com/content/tncms/assets/v3/editorial/a/f8/af8ad4b3-f4cc-5521-9314-a0c07d569482/536574c6681e5.image.jpg

Matthew Metoyer
Santa Maria CA


Cotton Belt

Gene Deimling
 

I found this shot in my files. It is a scan of a print that I purchased from Ted Culotta.

Gene Deimling


Re: OIL CAR

Brent Greer
 

My father always kept a 5 gallon can of reclaimed motor oil to run through our chainsaws.  Part of what kept out house warm through the winter months in Virginia.

Brent

Dr. J. Brent Greer


From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> on behalf of Richard Townsend via groups.io <richtownsend@...>
Sent: Monday, October 26, 2020 7:08 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] OIL CAR
 
Used motor oil also used to be spread on dirt roads for dust control. That was a great way to get lead and other toxins into the environment. That's why the practice was ended.

Richard Townsend
Lincoln City, OR


-----Original Message-----
From: Garth Groff and Sally Sanford <mallardlodge1000@...>
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Sent: Mon, Oct 26, 2020 3:53 pm
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] OIL CAR

Friends,

When I was much younger, many filling stations, especially locally-owned stations, sold reclaimed oil in bulk for automobile use. My father used to keep a couple of five-gallon cans of the stuff to pour into his Packards. Selling reclaimed oil pretty much disappeared with the homogenization of retail gas stations in the 1960s (which also ended distribution by local wholesalers who received petroleum products in freight cars--mandatory FC content). Of course, old oil is still recycled, but is rarely sold at retail, and most gas stations are now convenience stores that make more money selling snack food. 

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff  🦆

On Mon, Oct 26, 2020 at 4:11 PM Mont Switzer <MSwitzer@...> wrote:
Used oil also makes pretty good fuel for some applications and was transported for such.  Mont Switzer

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] on behalf of CJ Riley via groups.io [cjriley42=yahoo.com@groups.io]
Sent: Monday, October 26, 2020 12:23 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] OIL CAR


A quick Google search led me to a site that stated oil recycling began in the 30s and grew substantially during WWII. Oil doesn’t wear out. It gets dirty and loses some of its components. Used oil can be filtered and additives replaced.



Re: RGM

Dave Parker
 

I'm OK with Facebook but, let's face it, groups.io is a vastly superior vehicle for sharing information, contacting individuals, archiving photos and files, etc., etc.  Search functions work great.

I now belong to 7 groups, and they all have something to offer (despite widely differing levels of activity).  Accordingly, I just can't see investing any time in Facebook groups.  It's hard enough already to carve out adequate time at the modeling bench.
--
Dave Parker
Swall Meadows, CA


Re: OIL CAR

erieblt2
 

Many must know this, but I’ll mention it here. The Navy cleans, tests, and recycles all lubricating oil. The old diesel subs(ie Bonefish, Blueback, Barbel-the ‘B’ sisters) even recycled the oil from the Fairbanks-Morse propulsion diesels. But it’s not economical commercially- except in huge amounts. I use to use ‘Wolfs Head’ Recycled oil in my old Ford Falcon! Fill up the gas and add a quart or two of oil! Bill S.


On Oct 26, 2020, at 4:08 PM, Richard Townsend via groups.io <richtownsend@...> wrote:


Used motor oil also used to be spread on dirt roads for dust control. That was a great way to get lead and other toxins into the environment. That's why the practice was ended.

Richard Townsend
Lincoln City, OR


-----Original Message-----
From: Garth Groff and Sally Sanford <mallardlodge1000@...>
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Sent: Mon, Oct 26, 2020 3:53 pm
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] OIL CAR

Friends,

When I was much younger, many filling stations, especially locally-owned stations, sold reclaimed oil in bulk for automobile use. My father used to keep a couple of five-gallon cans of the stuff to pour into his Packards. Selling reclaimed oil pretty much disappeared with the homogenization of retail gas stations in the 1960s (which also ended distribution by local wholesalers who received petroleum products in freight cars--mandatory FC content). Of course, old oil is still recycled, but is rarely sold at retail, and most gas stations are now convenience stores that make more money selling snack food. 

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff  🦆

On Mon, Oct 26, 2020 at 4:11 PM Mont Switzer <MSwitzer@...> wrote:
Used oil also makes pretty good fuel for some applications and was transported for such.  Mont Switzer

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] on behalf of CJ Riley via groups.io [cjriley42=yahoo.com@groups.io]
Sent: Monday, October 26, 2020 12:23 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] OIL CAR


A quick Google search led me to a site that stated oil recycling began in the 30s and grew substantially during WWII. Oil doesn’t wear out. It gets dirty and loses some of its components. Used oil can be filtered and additives replaced.



Re: Sugar Beets in Cattle Cars

Steve SANDIFER
 

They lined stock cars with cardboard and used them to ship grain, so why worry about sugar beets? Nothing like high protein corn flakes.

Steve Sandifer

On Mon, Oct 26, 2020 at 11:34 AM, Jerry Michels
<gjmichels53@...> wrote:
Wouldn't stock cars used for sugar beets and cabbage be cleaned out beforehand?  They were cleaned out after a cattle shipment.  Regarding sugar beets.  They are refined to such an extent that no contamination would remain.  It is a pretty neat process I saw at the Holly Sugar plant in Hereford, TX, before it closed.  Dirty beets go in, pure white sugar comes out.  Jerry Michels


Re: OIL CAR

Richard Townsend
 

Used motor oil also used to be spread on dirt roads for dust control. That was a great way to get lead and other toxins into the environment. That's why the practice was ended.

Richard Townsend
Lincoln City, OR


-----Original Message-----
From: Garth Groff and Sally Sanford <mallardlodge1000@...>
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Sent: Mon, Oct 26, 2020 3:53 pm
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] OIL CAR

Friends,

When I was much younger, many filling stations, especially locally-owned stations, sold reclaimed oil in bulk for automobile use. My father used to keep a couple of five-gallon cans of the stuff to pour into his Packards. Selling reclaimed oil pretty much disappeared with the homogenization of retail gas stations in the 1960s (which also ended distribution by local wholesalers who received petroleum products in freight cars--mandatory FC content). Of course, old oil is still recycled, but is rarely sold at retail, and most gas stations are now convenience stores that make more money selling snack food. 

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff  🦆

On Mon, Oct 26, 2020 at 4:11 PM Mont Switzer <MSwitzer@...> wrote:
Used oil also makes pretty good fuel for some applications and was transported for such.  Mont Switzer

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] on behalf of CJ Riley via groups.io [cjriley42=yahoo.com@groups.io]
Sent: Monday, October 26, 2020 12:23 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] OIL CAR


A quick Google search led me to a site that stated oil recycling began in the 30s and grew substantially during WWII. Oil doesn’t wear out. It gets dirty and loses some of its components. Used oil can be filtered and additives replaced.



Re: OIL CAR

Garth Groff and Sally Sanford <mallardlodge1000@...>
 

Friends,

When I was much younger, many filling stations, especially locally-owned stations, sold reclaimed oil in bulk for automobile use. My father used to keep a couple of five-gallon cans of the stuff to pour into his Packards. Selling reclaimed oil pretty much disappeared with the homogenization of retail gas stations in the 1960s (which also ended distribution by local wholesalers who received petroleum products in freight cars--mandatory FC content). Of course, old oil is still recycled, but is rarely sold at retail, and most gas stations are now convenience stores that make more money selling snack food. 

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff  🦆

On Mon, Oct 26, 2020 at 4:11 PM Mont Switzer <MSwitzer@...> wrote:

Used oil also makes pretty good fuel for some applications and was transported for such.  Mont Switzer


From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] on behalf of CJ Riley via groups.io [cjriley42=yahoo.com@groups.io]
Sent: Monday, October 26, 2020 12:23 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] OIL CAR


A quick Google search led me to a site that stated oil recycling began in the 30s and grew substantially during WWII. Oil doesn’t wear out. It gets dirty and loses some of its components. Used oil can be filtered and additives replaced.



OIL CAR

David
 

FYI, Union Pacific was reclaiming the distillate fuel from the lube oil in their McKeen cars during the late 1920s, and renewing the lube oil.

David Thompson


Re: Sugar Beets in Cattle Cars

Jerry Michels
 

One more comment on sugar beets, but  a little different.  In Wyoming the BN served a number of sugar beet plants.  Lovell, Sheridan, Worland, Torrington, and perhaps some others.  These were all active during the steam era.  Most were transported in two-bay hoppers.  A curious by-product was shipping tare soli (that dirt coming off the beets after harvest) from one Holly Sugar plant to another and giving the soil to the local farmers. Sadly, the Wpr;and area sugar beet area was infested with the sugarbeet root maggot, Torrington was not.  In the later 1970s, The Torrington area became infested with the maggot.  An intense survey of the insect revealed that the infestation site was the Holly refinery tare soil dump.

Jerry Michels


Re: RGM

Dave Nelson
 

FWIW, Facebook has rapidly evolved from its origins as a college social board and now is a top notch site for hobby enthusiasts of all stripes.

The Pre-Depression Era railroads is particularly good for posting photos of freight cars from that era (and if you doubt my judgement then ask Ben Hom who in that group).

 

I’d say there is a group for every steam era railroad as well as some modern stuff said to be about railroads… and if that isn’t enough there are loads of historical groups, game groups, silent movies, birding, native plants… the list goes on and on.

 

It’s not very good for archival purposes – the search is pretty lousy – but for casual viewing, say, once a day, it is very nice.

 

Dave Nelson

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of mel perry
Sent: Monday, October 26, 2020 1:10 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] RGM

 

same name/web site? or different?

sorry i don't do any social media

thanks

mel perry


Re: OIL CAR

Mont Switzer
 

Used oil also makes pretty good fuel for some applications and was transported for such.  Mont Switzer


From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] on behalf of CJ Riley via groups.io [cjriley42@...]
Sent: Monday, October 26, 2020 12:23 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] OIL CAR


A quick Google search led me to a site that stated oil recycling began in the 30s and grew substantially during WWII. Oil doesn’t wear out. It gets dirty and loses some of its components. Used oil can be filtered and additives replaced.



Re: RGM

mel perry
 

same name/web site? or different?
sorry i don't do any social media
thanks
mel perry


On Mon, Oct 26, 2020, 12:35 PM Scott <repairman87@...> wrote:
Bill S,  Rio Grande Models posted it on thier Facebook page.  I am excited to see it I still need a NG ballast spreader.

Scott McDonald


Re: RGM

erieblt2
 

I guess I’m gonna have get back into Facebook(had a bad experience). Everyone is migrating to FB. Bill S


On Oct 26, 2020, at 12:35 PM, Scott <repairman87@...> wrote:

Bill S,  Rio Grande Models posted it on thier Facebook page.  I am excited to see it I still need a NG ballast spreader.

Scott McDonald


Re: Sugar Beets in Cattle Cars

Garth Groff and Sally Sanford <mallardlodge1000@...>
 

Ray and Friends,

To echo what Jerry said, I have been inside a sugar plant and saw how the refining process works. This was the C&H plant at Crockett, California, which processed cane sugar, but the process for beet sugar is similar. Essentially, the sugar source is ground to a pulp, which is then washed several times to remove all the possible sugar, and also to float off impurities. The solution is then boiled and centrifuged to kill any little beasties and remove any additional impurities. The sugar went through this process multiple times, so it was essentially sterilized several times during the process.

Now for Fun Part #1: C&H collected all the drips from their pipes in buckets, plus the mop water from cleaning the floors, and poured it back into the process. It was all pure in the end.

Fun Part #2: C&H also put up various types of raw and turbinado sugar for the health food trade. This was the same sugar, just not boiled and spun as many times. This left more molasses in the sugar, plus as the tour guide explained, a bit more dirt and rat droppings. All still sterilized though. Yum!

Fun Part #3: With cane sugar, including that grown and refiled in Louisiana and Texas, the crushed pulp (called bagasse) could be used as fuel to run the sugar mill, ground and returned to the fields as mulch, or  in later years sold as a by-product to be used as an industrial additive or for chemical extraction. (C&H received their sugar as syrup from Hawaii, delivered every two weeks by ship, so bagasse was not an issue here). Used pulp from beet sugar tended to pile up into large mountains. I used to work across the street from the Holly Sugar plant at Dyer (near Sant Ana, California). They had a huge mountain of this stuff that was daily sculpted by bulldozers. I was told the waste was loaded with toxins. I wonder what became of the piles when this plant closed.

Fun Part #4: Sugar used to be heavily subsidized by the government until price supports were removed by Congress in favor of the high-fructose corn syrup industry in the 1980s. Look at the previous list of plant closures, many of which happened at that time. Thanks to the subsidies, cheaper high-fructose corn syrup became the sweetener of choice for the soft drink industry (remember 'New Coke'?) and in processed foods.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff  🦆

On Mon, Oct 26, 2020 at 12:34 PM Jerry Michels <gjmichels53@...> wrote:
Wouldn't stock cars used for sugar beets and cabbage be cleaned out beforehand?  They were cleaned out after a cattle shipment.  Regarding sugar beets.  They are refined to such an extent that no contamination would remain.  It is a pretty neat process I saw at the Holly Sugar plant in Hereford, TX, before it closed.  Dirty beets go in, pure white sugar comes out.  Jerry Michels

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