Date   

Re: Consumer-grade 3D printers hit the mainstream

Charles Harris
 

Hi

Living in New Zealand I would appreciate some information. Video or what ever. Happy to pay for something.


I would like to see what equipment available, accuracy .05mm or less stepping etc. Recommended design software etc.

Best way to design the curved front areas like F units etc. Something better that Sketchup but the same price ! Or something reasonably priced. Even a nose component that you can change easily the shapes.

I think someone in the industry needs to sell the components (component software) for GM doors, GE doors, Cabs, etc, etc. Horns, steps, walkways, etc. We can then do the basic design for our unique loco and add in the components.

Who do we send design to for quote on printing.

Thanks

Charlie Harris





Charlie Harris


From: Jack Burgess
Sent: Wednesday, May 18, 2011 5:07 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Re: Consumer-grade 3D printers hit the mainstream



There will be two clinics on rapid prototyping at the X2011 West NMRA
Convention in July (see my previous post on the RPM meet). One will be
presented by Rene Gourley of Proto87 fame and he will talk about getting a
first model printed, the process for developing the design and obtaining the
model, and the finishing that was required.

The second will be by Bill Brisko of Pacific Locomotive Works
(www.pacificlocomotive.com) who does this commercially and has his own
printer.

Jack Burgess
Newark, CA


Re: NMRA convention

Jack Burgess
 

Gene asked:
<Would posting clinics on the web become a reason NOT to attend a
<convention because the clinic part would later be available for free or
<little cost?

That is definitely a consideration for convention committees since the goal
of putting on a Convention (or a RPM meet) is not to make a profit but to
not lose money. Knowing that clinics will be available later online would
certainly be a problem. Think of Naperville and Cocoa Beach...if enough
modelers choose not to attend thinking they can see all of the clinics
online, this type of convention might cease to exist (although the
interaction with other modelers can't be experienced online although that
could be added).

But there are ways of having non-attendees pay for the privilege of seeing
the clinics they would otherwise get to experience at a convention so that
the cost is somewhat comparable to attending. (I don't buy tunes on iTunes
but I'm assuming that if you buy a song, you can't share it with anyone
else. That would be a requirement for any online clinic presentations.)

I look forward to the ability to present clinics online (for a small
reimbursement to the presenter) online. At every convention, I look at the
list of presenters and subject matter to decide how to spend my time. Long
ago I stopped going to "beginner" clinics and those which don't match my
interests. However, I also look at the list of presenters and typically
attend clinics presented by "experts" that I recognize such as Tony
Thompson, Richard Hendrickson, and many others. So, I would think we are not
that far from a "website" with a list of clinics to "purchase" for a
one-time view as long as there was also a handout to supplement the clinic.

<
<I can imagine that if I were involved in putting on a convention I might
<be reluctant to allow such filming. Yes, I know the NMRA films some
<clinics and then does what with them?

I'm assuming that those are available to NMRA members although I've never
looked into that issue...

Jack Burgess


Re: Underrepresented roads and car types

Gene <bierglaeser@...>
 

OK, Bruce Smith in message 100189 and Tony Thompson in message 100192 have set me straight.

In my own case, using the Landmesser hot box list may lead me astray. To be on the list, which was created in 1948, 1949 and 1950, a car had to be set out or delay a train for some reason such as a hot box.

This list provides evidence that a specific car was on the M&StL and usually also gives train # and load. That latter piece of info is interesting, useful and, in many cases, something I couldn't have thought of for myself.

The question is, were these hot box cars evenly distributed throughout all the car types and railroads that had cars on the M&StL? For example, of a total of 1331 entries there are 39 NYC cars and 68 PRR cars. Does that mean nearly twice as many PRR cars as NYC cars on the M&StL or were PRR cars more prone to hot boxes? (No insult of PRR intended.) Is one car type more prone to hot boxes than another?

In line with what has been said in other posts more than half were box cars.

74 flat cars (26 of which are M&StL)
112 gondolas (18 are M&StL)
53 hopper cars (36 are M&StL)
8 covered hoppers (all M&StL)
130 refrigerator cars (none M&StL)
12 stock cars (10 M&StL)
97 tank cars (none M&StL)
5 ventilated box cars (none M&StL)
750 box cars (88 M&StL)
85 unknown types (none M&StL)

This won't quite add up to 1331 because cabooses with hot boxes were not included above.

In the case of covered hoppers and stock cars, I know just what I should do. Beyond that ? ? ?

Or is all this academic? After all, short of scratch building one can only have the models that exist whether RTR or kit.

Gene Green


Re: NMRA convention (was Re: Consumer-grade 3D printers hit the mainstream)

seaboard_1966
 

Darn Tim, I thought I was doing good to buy a digital projector for the Marion Meet this year. Now you are wanting folks to tape the clinics and the like and post them on YouTube!!!

Denis Blake
North Hamlet Shops, Ohio



2011 Central Ohio Prototype Modelers Meet, May 19-21

http://www.hansmanns.org/meet/

http://www.facebook.com/pages/manage/#!/pages/Central-Ohio-Prototype-Modelers-Meet/326645470797

-----Original Message-----
From: Tim O'Connor
Sent: Tuesday, May 17, 2011 6:21 PM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: [STMFC] Re: NMRA convention (was Re: Consumer-grade 3D printers hit the mainstream)


Ya know... almost any smart phone can now take HD video & audio good
enough to post to Youtube. It would be great if the NMRA or just anyone
would simply "tape" each clinic and post it to Youtube. I'd LOVE to be
able to travel to Sacramento and attend the meet, but I can't. I'd be
happy to make a small donation to a fund that supported such an effort.

Same comment applies to RPM meets like Naperville, Cocoa Beach, etc. We
(as a whole) are slow to adopt these wonderful web-based sharing services.

Tim O'Connor



For those of us with a keen interest in the subject but are unable to attend the convention, is there a way we can plug into the information presented, maybe in summary form? Is there a Web site that might present such information post-convention? Just hoping. . . .
Thanks much,
Brian Chapman
Evansdale, Iowa


------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links


Re: Rivets

Kurt Laughlin <fleeta@...>
 

I emailed Woody of Archer because I have worked with him on several projects and asked him if we wanted to say anything about the Micro Mark product. He replied:

Dear Kurt,


Archer is a small, family owned and operated business that pioneered the process of producing resin objects onto clear decal film in 2007 and we have been marketing these products continuously since then. Our resin products are precise scale, researched and approved by knowledgable modelers to meet their highest quality standards. Archer will not compromise on quality and will continue to serve the modeling community by expanding our selection of resin details on a regular basis.


Archer's resin details are produced using a proprietary process. We do not license our process to any other company or individual. Archer's resin details are manufactured in our facility in the United States and we must conform to strict government and environmental regulations particularly those regarding the use and disposal of hazardous materials. Our production costs are very high and this is reflected in the price.


Archer fully understands that our level of dedication and quality may exceed the needs of the casual modeler and respects the freedom of all consumers to spend their money as they wish.


Archer is proud to be an innovator and participant in a free market society and I hope my comments address your concerns.


Best wishes,


Woody Vondracek, owner
ARCHER FINE TRANSFERS

He also sent along a blow-up of one of the MM sets and it is exactly as others have noted: Cleanly applied black ink patterns over what appears to be more or less random gobs of a clear material. It would be interesting if the fellow who was so impressed with the MM product would show photos of the applied and painted "details", along with his opinion of the results.

KL


Re: Top 20 North American Freight Car Fleets, January 1949

devansprr
 

--- In STMFC@..., "Bruce Smith" <smithbf@...> wrote:

Dave,

Would you accept a PRR engineman's time book? Gene Steffy writes in the
Keystone, vol 24, no 4 that on Jan 4, 1944, he took " a solid N&W coal
train" from Enola to Morrisville as the fireman on the 6755 (M1a, later
converted to M1b and preserved at Strasburg PA) which was the 2nd loco
of a double header. That train had come up the Cumberland Valley Branch
of the PRR from Hagerstown and subsequently the train went to Meadows,
obviously bound for NY or points beyond.

Regards
Bruce Smith
Auburn, AL
Bruce,

I would - and based on the tonnages loaded at Hampton Roads, it must have happened. While the lack of photos (this was WWII) is not totally unexpected, one would think there would be at least one picture showing a few of the 10,000 C&O/N&W/VGN loads per month moving through either Pot yard or Hagerstown. Just points out the risk of using photos to determine fleet distribution - at least for WWII.

Dave


Re: Underrepresented roads and car types

Gene <bierglaeser@...>
 

--- In STMFC@..., Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:
<snip>
Not necessarily. Jack Parker, and I think, Richard Hendrickson, built
what amounts to mainline dioramas as layouts -- Not operations per se,
but a platform for running trains through a scene.
<snip>
Tim O'Connor
Yep, I can see how, in the above described situation, such proportional representation would be exactly the thing to do.

Gene Green


Re: NMRA convention

Gene <bierglaeser@...>
 

Tim,
I've put on a few clinics myself but never had the opportunity to object to filming which I guess is an opinion about the value of my clinic. I've gone both ways - kept my cards close to my vest for a later magazine article and turned it loose for the world to see and use.

Gene Green

--- In STMFC@..., Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:


Gene, if one's interest is to make money from one's research, why on
earth would one present it for free to an NMRA audience? One can do
what many others have done, and publish the information in a magazine
or as a book, or produce a video for sale.

And I suspect that if the presenter objects to cameras, that is within
his rights to do so.

Tim O'Connor



Would posting clinics on the web become a reason NOT to attend a convention because the clinic part would later be available for free or little cost?

I can imagine that if I were involved in putting on a convention I might be reluctant to allow such filming. Yes, I know the NMRA films some clinics and then does what with them?

Gene Green


Re: Top 20 North American Freight Car Fleets, January 1949

Bruce Smith
 

"Dave Evans" <devans1@...> 05/17/11 7:02 PM >>>
It all depends on the era. As for coal hoppers, I came across an
interesting book about WWII Transportation (American >Wartime
transportation by Rose), that includes stats that by 1943 Hampton Roads
coal shipments fell to 1/2 pre-war levels - >a combination of U-boat
activity and reassignment of some colliers. Much of this coal was bound
for New York and New >England. Instead it was moved by rail. So one
would expect pictures of N&W, C&O and Virginian hopper strings moving
through Potomac yard and Hagerstown Md. But I have yet to see such a
photo.

Dave,

Would you accept a PRR engineman's time book? Gene Steffy writes in the
Keystone, vol 24, no 4 that on Jan 4, 1944, he took " a solid N&W coal
train" from Enola to Morrisville as the fireman on the 6755 (M1a, later
converted to M1b and preserved at Strasburg PA) which was the 2nd loco
of a double header. That train had come up the Cumberland Valley Branch
of the PRR from Hagerstown and subsequently the train went to Meadows,
obviously bound for NY or points beyond.

Regards
Bruce Smith
Auburn, AL


Re: NMRA convention

Tim O'Connor
 

Gene, if one's interest is to make money from one's research, why on
earth would one present it for free to an NMRA audience? One can do
what many others have done, and publish the information in a magazine
or as a book, or produce a video for sale.

And I suspect that if the presenter objects to cameras, that is within
his rights to do so.

Tim O'Connor

Would posting clinics on the web become a reason NOT to attend a convention because the clinic part would later be available for free or little cost?

I can imagine that if I were involved in putting on a convention I might be reluctant to allow such filming. Yes, I know the NMRA films some clinics and then does what with them?

Gene Green


Re: NMRA convention

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Tim O'Connor wrote:
You're right Richard, that's a ripoff, but it has nothing to do with the media involved. They could have (and may have) photocopied
your document and handed those out too -- or even sold them. They had no right to do that.
Tim, read what Richard said again. He said the electronic media make it all too easy to do this, not that it couldn't be done any other way. I think he's right, and the way photos often spread virally around the world on the net shows the same thing. The web is NOT just another publishing medium.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: NMRA convention

Gene <bierglaeser@...>
 

Would posting clinics on the web become a reason NOT to attend a convention because the clinic part would later be available for free or little cost?

I can imagine that if I were involved in putting on a convention I might be reluctant to allow such filming. Yes, I know the NMRA films some clinics and then does what with them?

Gene Green

--- In STMFC@..., Anthony Thompson <thompson@...> wrote:

Tim O'Connor wrote:
Ya know... almost any smart phone can now take HD video & audio good
enough to post to Youtube. It would be great if the NMRA or just
anyone would simply "tape" each clinic and post it to Youtube.
Fair comment, Tim, and one which comes up often. But it ignores
the fact that many clinics contain material such as photographs, for
which the user has a "fair use" right for a presentation but NOT,
repeat NOT, for what is effectively publication on the web, such as
YouTube. And there are those clinicians who prefer NOT to have their
material "out of their control," as one person put it. I don't
personally hold with the latter viewpoint, I'm just reporting it.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Top 20 North American Freight Car Fleets, January 1949

devansprr
 

--- In STMFC@..., Anthony Thompson <thompson@...> wrote:


Talk about "doing it all again." Armand still does not believe
the evidence provided by Gilbert and Nelson. That's okay, Armand,
there are still people who deny global warming.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
Tony,

It all depends on the era. As for coal hoppers, I came across an interesting book about WWII Transportation (American Wartime transportation by Rose), that includes stats that by 1943 Hampton Roads coal shipments fell to 1/2 pre-war levels - a combination of U-boat activity and reassignment of some colliers. Much of this coal was bound for New York and New England. Instead it was moved by rail. So one would expect pictures of N&W, C&O and Virginian hopper strings moving through Potomac yard and Hagerstown Md. But I have yet to see such a photo. And the quantities were not small - we are talking over 10,000 car loads per month. Much of the shipments went to NJ piers on New York Harbor - some for NYC metro area use, and some barged up Long Island Sound into New England. Other coal was moved into New England by rail only. One must assume that this meant crossing the Hudson at Albany or Poughkeepsie. Yet still no pictures....

So I am not convinced that photos are very authoritative.

And, sigh... Tony I must now temper my acceptance of your posts, since I am a proud member of Ted Koppel's flat earth society since I do not buy into the anthropogenic global warming hype - again it is about the era. Lets see, Greenland was once farmland - but I guess we did something to turn it into a block of ice - and even now we haven't melted it... It all depends on the era you select to analyze the very limited data - just like freight car distribution.... sigh.

Dave Evans


Re: C&O Hoppers was Underrepresented roads and car types

water.kresse@...
 

The C&O around the First World War continually had more coal traffic heading west than to Tidewater.  Around this time the C&O was considering absorbing either the Erie or Nickle Plate for moving east- west traffic north of Columbus.  Presque Isle had 5-6 percent VGN , N&W, L&N and a couple other roads coal cars regularly up thru the early-1960s (even with N&W getting their Sandusky access from the Pennsy ).  It would not be unusual to see N&W and C&O coal cars in Cleveland coal yards in the wintertime.



Yes, the Virginian was primarily a conveyor belt to Tidewater.



Al Kresse

----- Original Message -----
From: "Bruce Smith" < smithbf @auburn. edu >
To: STMFC @ yahoogroups .com
Sent: Tuesday, May 17, 2011 3:27:28 PM
Subject: [ STMFC ] C&O Hoppers was Underrepresented roads and car types

Folks,

Now, while the fires of boxcar distribution get fanned again, I think  
that the vast majority of us agree that hoppers had a much more local  
distribution.  I hope we also agree that depth of variation depends  
significantly on location.  For example, on a C&O branch serving coal  
mines, the hopper fleet is likely to be nearly 100% C&O, but that  
might be lower on PRR branch.  On the PRR main, with both home road  
coal and neighbor road coal, the mix was more diverse still, but with  
perhaps 75% PRR cars.  One thing we've taken as a matter of faith  
though (along with photographic evidence) is that among the foreign  
cars on the PRR , C&O hoppers were very very rare.  This has been held  
as an example of how the C&O moved coal from the mines to tidewater  
on their own rails.

Imagine my surprise this past weekend at the PRRT &HS meeting in  
Columbus Ohio to see multiple photos of STRINGS of C&O hoppers on the  
PRR ( PY &A), headed for north for the port of Ashtabula (and back  
towards home rails empty)!  In the greater scheme, this probably  
represents a minority traffic for the C&O, but it also seems clear  
that C&O coal did go other places than C&O served ports... veerrrrry  
interesting....

Regards
Bruce

Bruce F. Smith
Auburn, AL
https ://www5. vetmed .auburn. edu /~ smithbf /

"Some days you are the bug, some days you are the windshield."
                            __
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   __<+--+>________________&#92;__/___   ________________________________
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  | / 4999  PENNSYLVANIA   4999 &#92; | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Multigenerational Search for Truth

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Tim O'Connor wrote:
JP, consider:
Tony Thompson wrote "G-N"
Bruce Smith wrote "N-G"
I do use the abbreviation, but only when I've also used the full names in the same post. It's my recollection that Tim originated the ideas, developed them pretty fully, and reported them several times in depth to this list, and that Dave added considerable weight to the concept with more data. (If that's not right, someone please correct me.) In the research environment where I was trained, the proper order of the credit would then be Gilbert-Nelson.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: NMRA convention

Tim O'Connor
 

You're right Richard, that's a ripoff, but it has nothing to do
with the media involved. They could have (and may have) photocopied
your document and handed those out too -- or even sold them. They
had no right to do that.

On the other extreme, I've received MANY requests simply to use a
quote from an email that I posted to this list!! Now, this is a public
forum, and when I post here I have absolutely no intention of claiming
that I own the copyright to my email messages. But many people seem
to bend over backwards, and ask for permission to quote me out of
sheer politeness I guess. Of course I always say yes, sure, go ahead
and use the quote, for what it's worth.

Which I guess is my way of saying that if I wrote something that I
wanted to publish and copyright, I would NOT post it here first. :-)

Tim O'Connor

-----------------------------------------------

I will add to this that it has recently come to my attention that a
model RR club has published on its website, intact, the handout for a
clinic I did several years ago. No problem there; I gave the clinic
for the purpose of disseminating information. However, on the club
website there is NO credit given, no acknowledgment of the source, no
mention of my name. It's as though the handout text was originated
by some nameless club member, or perhaps it sprang forth from the
right hand of God and is therefore automatically in the public
domain. And that's not okay. The electronic media provide entirely
too generous an opportunity for rip-offs of this sort.
Richard Hendrickson


Re: C&O Hoppers was Underrepresented roads and car types

Mike Fleming
 

Tim,
Grew up in Trimble which is about halfway between Athens and Corning Ohio. Corning was the old division point between the K&M and the T&OC. I was born in 57 and by 1960 all of the on line business in Ohio south of Columbus had pretty well dried up except for Peabody Coal's Sunnyhill Mine in Claybank. Previously almost all of the on line business was coal and bricks. All the trains I saw were bridge traffic from the WV mines and chemical cars from the Kanawha valley chemical plants. There was little interchange traffic at deepwater then due to the N&W/VGN merger. The coal trains I saw were a mix of the usra and offset side 55 ton hoppers and the 70 ton AAR hoppers of which the Bowser/Stewart model is extremely close for the price. All those predate the 1960 cutoff for this group.

I have railfan friends in the area and the trains are still the same today. Except that for the last several years they have been getting the RBBB Circus train at least once a year (it was about 2 weeks ago). The NS keeps the line in great shape and even replaced a couple of bridges last year which tells me the line is in their operating plans for the forseeable future.

Mike Fleming
Superintendent, Bluff City Div. SER, NMRA
President Emeritus, Memphis Society of Model Railroaders
Vice President, Memphis Railroad and Trolley Museum Model Railroad Club, a 100% NMRA Member Club

---------- Original Message ----------
From: Tim O'Connor <@timboconnor>
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] C&O Hoppers was Underrepresented roads and car types
Date: Tue, 17 May 2011 18:31:41 -0400



The part of the NYC I grew up watching was almost exclusively coal and
chemicals. The coal was almost 100% NYC hoppers. We also saw all sorts of
tank cars and various box cars, I never saw a reefer... Mike Fleming

And Mike, from that description, I guess you grew up around Charleston, WV.
Isn't that amazing? Sometimes traffic patterns are so specific to a location
that all you have to do is describe them, and a perfect stranger might be
able to guess where you come from.

Tim O'Connor

P.S. I only thought of this because on my visit to Charleston in 1994, all
I saw on the ex-NYC Conrail line was tank cars, and coal hoppers.




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Underrepresented roads and car types

Tim O'Connor
 

Richard

Actually, since the tower is just east of diamonds, I don't intend
to model the diamonds themselves. Hence, UP and Santa Fe trains can
be modeled simply by use of signals. :-) (The cross tracks in other
words will be on the backdrop.)

Tim O'


And, one assumes, the numerous Santa Fe and UP trains that crossed
that diamond, as well. You aren't going to pretend they don't exist,
are you, Tim?
Richard Hendrickson


Re: NMRA convention

Tim O'Connor
 

No argument with that Jack. A video of a clinic is not the same
as the clinic itself. And a printable/publishable document is an
entirely different animal.

But there are some excellent "clinics" on Youtube. Here's one that
really illustrates the power of the medium:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0SXhF_NMW-w

Tim O'Connor

----------------------------------

Tony wrote this post as I was replying but I will address his last point.
I've presented a lot of clinics over the years and, many times, elements of
those clinics later become the basis of magazine articles. I thus want to
keep my material under my control. As such, while I will allow taping of my
clinics if there are no prototype photos, I won't provide copies of my
PowerPoint presentations when asked although I do provide handouts. Just my
nature...
Jack Burgess


Re: NMRA convention

Tim O'Connor
 

Tony

That's true -- I was most thinking of "how to" clinics, not slide show
clinics. While the slide shows and roster clinics are great fun, I don't
know that they would make for compelling Youtubery... :-)

But editing an MPEG is now quite easy with free or inexpensive software
tools, so a copyrighted image could easily be "blanked". Youtube expects
its users to comply with copyrights.

Tim O'Connor

Tim O'Connor wrote:
Ya know... almost any smart phone can now take HD video & audio good
enough to post to Youtube. It would be great if the NMRA or just
anyone would simply "tape" each clinic and post it to Youtube.
Fair comment, Tim, and one which comes up often. But it ignores
the fact that many clinics contain material such as photographs, for
which the user has a "fair use" right for a presentation but NOT,
repeat NOT, for what is effectively publication on the web, such as
YouTube. And there are those clinicians who prefer NOT to have their
material "out of their control," as one person put it. I don't
personally hold with the latter viewpoint, I'm just reporting it.

Tony Thompson