Date   

Re: Freight Car numbers by road - 1950 (UNCLASSIFIED)

Bruce Smith
 

Elden,

I think JP wanted the top 20 Railroads, not the top 20 per railroad <VBG> , although that data would be even more useful, and it is certainly the approach that you, I and others have taken in persuading manufacturers to do specific PRR cars.

Regards
Bruce Smith
Auburn, AL

On May 16, 2011, at 12:51 PM, Gatwood, Elden SAW wrote:

Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: NONE

JP;

You need a message title, so...

For the PRR, closest date I have - July 1949; TOP 20:

H21A, X29, GLA, GS, GLCA, X31A, X26, X25, G22, H21E, H25, G27, X28A, GR,
X26C, G25, X38, X29B, G29

BTW, this changes dramatically for 1955.....

Elden Gatwood


-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of JP
Barger
Sent: Monday, May 16, 2011 1:39 PM
To: stmfc@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [STMFC]



Hi-- Tony Thompson's last message made me think that a 'pareto' list of the
top twenty RR's total freight car ownership in 1950 would be most useful in
thinking about what is under- and what is overrepresented in model form.
Does someone have this data? Thanks in advance.

JP Barger






Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: NONE




------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links



Top 20 North American Freight Car Fleets, January 1949

Benjamin Hom
 

JP Barger asked:
"Hi-- Tony Thompson's last message made me think that a 'pareto' list of the
top twenty RR's total freight car ownership in 1950 would be most useful in
thinking about what is under- and what is overrepresented in model form.
Does someone have this data?"

Data compiled by John Nehrich from January 1949 ORER:

Railroads (22 - CN/CP included for comparison)
Pennsylvania - 214,799 revenue freight cars
New York Central - 129,369 cars
Baltimore & Ohio - 102,190 cars
Canadian National - 90,733 cars
Canadian Pacific - 82,397 cars
Chesapeake & Ohio - 80,881 cars
Atchison, Topeka & Santa Fe - 78,904 cars
Louisville & Nashville - 68,319 cars
Norfolk & Western - 60,178 cars
Milwaukee Road - 57,475 cars
Illinois Central - 56,516 cars
Southern - 55,368 cars
Southern Pacific - 51,042 cars
Chicago Burlington & Quincy - 49,499 cars
Union Pacific - 46,608 cars
Chicago & North Western - 46,227 cars
Great Northern - 40,480 cars
Northern Pacific - 35,787 cars
Missouri Pacific - 35,022 cars
Reading - 32,032 cars
Chicago, Rock Island & Pacific - 27,997 cars
St. Louis - San Francisco - 26,760 cars
 
Private Car Owners:
Union Tank Car - 42,316 cars
General American Transportation - 41,521 cars
Pacific Fruit Express - 37,635 cars
 
I also compiled a comparison of boxcar fleets for January 1950 and formatted it
on a slide for my clinics - Brian Carlson used it last for his presentation at
the last Greensburg meet.  I'll post it to the files section latetr tonight if
it's not already there.
 
 
Ben Hom


Re: Freight Car numbers by road - 1950 (UNCLASSIFIED)

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: NONE

JP;

You need a message title, so...

For the PRR, closest date I have - July 1949; TOP 20:

H21A, X29, GLA, GS, GLCA, X31A, X26, X25, G22, H21E, H25, G27, X28A, GR,
X26C, G25, X38, X29B, G29

BTW, this changes dramatically for 1955.....

Elden Gatwood

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of JP
Barger
Sent: Monday, May 16, 2011 1:39 PM
To: stmfc@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [STMFC]



Hi-- Tony Thompson's last message made me think that a 'pareto' list of the
top twenty RR's total freight car ownership in 1950 would be most useful in
thinking about what is under- and what is overrepresented in model form.
Does someone have this data? Thanks in advance.

JP Barger

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: NONE


(No subject)

JP Barger
 

Hi-- Tony Thompson's last message made me think that a 'pareto' list of the
top twenty RR's total freight car ownership in 1950 would be most useful in
thinking about what is under- and what is overrepresented in model form.
Does someone have this data? Thanks in advance.



JP Barger


Re: Underrepresented roads and car types

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Does the lack of UP freight cars have anything to do . . .
What's all this UP sensitivity? It's an interesting and in some ways glamorous railroad, but stands around 14th or 15th in terms of size of freight car fleet, as of the early 1950s.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: NYCSHS New e-zine NYCentral Modeler

Brian <cornbeltroute@...>
 

Might I be bold enough to suggest the NEB& W site? -Armand Premo <
Sure ;-)

Actually, I'm a dues-paying member. Haven't been to the site for some time. Maybe I better re-explore.

-Brian Chapman
Evansdale, Iowa


Re: Consumer-grade 3D printers hit the mainstream

Brian <cornbeltroute@...>
 

. . . It sounds to me like the current state of the art is not particularly good for fine modeling. . . . -Chuck Soule <
I've been collecting 3D printing information as I trip across it. There are several processes out there, some of which do a very fine job of reproducing fine detail. Some years ago I was able to examine first hand an N scale GP38 shell from Mark4Design (New Zealand) and thought it to be a match for Kato N scale shells.

Recently, I have heard third hand that a fellow at TT Nut (a TT scale forum) used Shapeways to create a GP7 shell; it was not entirely successful, according to the judgment of that third party.

I am 3D modeling a first gen EMD loco in TT scale and will CNC cut the sub-assemblies here. But, certain items, such as air horns, I am hoping to 3D print. Hope some of the finer 3D printing technology is up to it.

-Brian Chapman
Evansdale, Iowa


Re: NYCSHS New e-zine NYCentral Modeler

Armand Premo
 

Might I be bold enough to suggest the NEB& W site?.Armand Premo

----- Original Message -----
From: Brian
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, May 16, 2011 12:39 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Re: NYCSHS New e-zine NYCentral Modeler



> . . . We will only be as successful if we have articles from modelers. -Noel <

Noel,

From a Midwesterner who is captivated by upstate New York and New England topography and history, I (selfishly) wish you high success. I moved on from the Boston & Albany (to the B&M and CV) as a modeling subject when I discovered how difficult it is -- for me, anyway -- to dredge up NYC information.

So, a question if I may: Do you have a membership that is now ready to embrace modeling as a way to preserve NYC history? Or, are you and a few others hoping to develop an interest in modeling that is, at the moment, lacking?

A few years ago, I posted a question or two about the B&A at the NYC-Railroad yahoo group and received zero responses. This, in combination with finding little other B&A information online, motivated me to leave the B&A behind.

(I have collected a large amount of B&A documentation from the Conrail era, but my modeling focus is the 1950s. Which means the double-track B&A is a problem for me. . . .)

BTW, is the NYC-Railroad the leading NYC information forum out there?

Thanks much,

Brian Chapman
Evansdale, Iowa






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Re: NYCSHS New e-zine NYCentral Modeler

Brian <cornbeltroute@...>
 

. . . We will only be as successful if we have articles from modelers. -Noel <
Noel,

From a Midwesterner who is captivated by upstate New York and New England topography and history, I (selfishly) wish you high success. I moved on from the Boston & Albany (to the B&M and CV) as a modeling subject when I discovered how difficult it is -- for me, anyway -- to dredge up NYC information.

So, a question if I may: Do you have a membership that is now ready to embrace modeling as a way to preserve NYC history? Or, are you and a few others hoping to develop an interest in modeling that is, at the moment, lacking?

A few years ago, I posted a question or two about the B&A at the NYC-Railroad yahoo group and received zero responses. This, in combination with finding little other B&A information online, motivated me to leave the B&A behind.

(I have collected a large amount of B&A documentation from the Conrail era, but my modeling focus is the 1950s. Which means the double-track B&A is a problem for me. . . .)

BTW, is the NYC-Railroad the leading NYC information forum out there?

Thanks much,

Brian Chapman
Evansdale, Iowa


Re: Underrepresented roads and car types (UNCLASSIFIED)

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: NONE

Tom;

Who told you pattern makers were unpaid?

Elden Gatwood

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
pullmanboss
Sent: Sunday, May 15, 2011 3:47 PM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Underrepresented roads and car types



Tim O'Connor wrote:

There are lots of neglected prototype railroads -- including some that
may surprise you.
[snip]

Not one UP postwar box car except for that one PS-1, until you get to
the 1960's. And that -includes- resin!

UP has been much neglected in resin as well. Sunshine must have done 5
CB&Q models and 10 Santa Fe models for every UP model they did. :-)
I doubt that Walthers/P2K or InterMountain has to take into account the
interests of their [paid] designers and toolmakers when selecting prototypes.
Resin producers are very much dependent on the interests of their [generally
unpaid, except for the few kits they might receive] patternmakers. I can't
see Charlie Slater, for example, agreeing to make the patterns for an
Escanaba & Northern 1935 reefer (if such a thing even existed) for Martin
Lofton in exchange for a few kits of that car. So we get the Santa Fe models
from Charlie's patterns, and the mid-America ones from Frank's. In the resin
world, it always comes down to the willingness of interested modelers to make
patterns of their favorite road's cars.

Tom Madden





Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: NONE


Re: Underrepresented roads and car types (UNCLASSIFIED)

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: NONE

I am always surprised at the lack of representation in hoppers, and to a
lesser degree, in flat cars. Gondolas have had a big surge in interest, in
resin, but not in plastic. We still do not have a number of box car designs,
but they are certainly more box car offerings than all the others. Tank car
models lag behind the curve, in plastic, but also in resin.

Based on the numbers that were out there, the B&O, C&O, NYC, and many other
northeastern roads are poorly represented, as well as several southern roads
such as L&N, N&W and others. Many of these roads did cars to their own
design, or like B&O, had odd (low IH) cars, with Duryea underframes, so are
not easy to do in plastic.

Perhaps because of their higher ratios of box cars, which everyone loves and
buys scads of, many Midwestern and western roads are well represented, and
also because several industrious resin pattern makers model those roads.

Perhaps also due to the availability of resources for doing research, and the
roads they are most interested in representing, there is also bias in terms
of what ultimately gets done. This is certainly true of PRR projects. We
help, and we get PRR motive power and freight cars.

Lastly, one arena I continue to be surprised is not better represented, are
the steel-hauling/industry-related railroads, like B&LE, EJ&E, and others.
Their cars went all over the place, and it wasn't until this year that we saw
a car or two to represent them. Maybe soon...

Elden Gatwood

Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: NONE


Re: Underrepresented roads and car types (UNCLASSIFIED)

Gene <bierglaeser@...>
 

I find it odd that the Union Pacific is under represented when it comes to freight car models. Although I wasn't really aware of any such under representation, I believe those who assert that it is true.

We have locomotives peculiar to the Union Pacific ad nauseum.

European modelers seem to think the only railroad in the US is the Union Pacific. Look at Märklin's clumsy efforts.

Gene Green


Re: Underrepresented roads and car types (UNCLASSIFIED)

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: NONE

Mark;

That is not the only reason, and the truth of the agreement is somewhere in
between the extremes, but it is a reason none of the manufacturers I know
will bite...

Elden Gatwood

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
Rossiter, Mark W
Sent: Monday, May 16, 2011 9:16 AM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Underrepresented roads and car types



Does the lack of UP freight cars have anything to do with the licensing
nonsense they tried (with some success) to pull a few years ago where anyone
wanting to use any part or parcel of UP and predecessor roads'
logos, reporting marks, etc. had to give up their first-born child to do so?
Inquiring minds want to know.

- -Mark

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





Classification: UNCLASSIFIED
Caveats: NONE


Re: Underrepresented roads and car types

Rossiter, Mark W <Mark.Rossiter@...>
 

Does the lack of UP freight cars have anything to do with the licensing
nonsense they tried (with some success) to pull a few years ago where
anyone wanting to use any part or parcel of UP and predecessor roads'
logos, reporting marks, etc. had to give up their first-born child to do
so? Inquiring minds want to know.



- -Mark


Re: NYCSHS New e-zine NYCentral Modeler

Noel Widdifield <NYCBigFour@...>
 

Dave,
Thanks for your good wishes. Hopefully, we will fulfill your desire for
modeling info. We will only be as successful if we have articles from
modelers.
Thanks, Noel

On 5/16/11 12:36 AM, "ealabhan0" <ealabhan0@live.com> wrote:






--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com <mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com> , Eddie Walters
wrote: "Good luck from me too. I'd offer a suggestion to put articles that are
relevant to modelers outside the NYC. As a Pennsy modeler, some guidance on
selecting and modeling relevant NYC freight cars would be very helpful."

Noel, you're taking on a daunting task, and I join the many who wish you all
the best in this endeavor. Let me heartily 'second the motion' on Eddie's
excellent suggestion above. Although a modeler of the far West, I nevertheless
download and save all available railroad Society e-zine issues for reference
and inspiration. Some of my most interesting freight car projects have been
'foreign road' interchange cars straight from the pages of The B&O Modeler,
The Chicago & North Western Modeler, The Keystone Modeler, and The
Seaboard-Coast Line Modeler. I look forward to the NYCentral Modeler helping
me to fill the unfortunate lack of NYC freight cars in my model fleet, and I'm
sure others will appreciate you providing the information that we all need to
accurately model the NYC and create more prototypically representative
interchange fleets. Good luck, and happy modeling! Dave Sieber, Reno NV





Re: The High Line before it became a park

robertb@smartchat.net.au
 

Tim,

That building is the St Johns Park freight terminal, which was opened with
the line.

Regards,

Robert Bogie

Original Message:
-----------------
From: Tim O'Connor timboconnor@comcast.net
Date: Mon, 16 May 2011 01:30:51 -0400
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [STMFC] Re: The High Line before it became a park



Tom, any idea what this building was? From the size and number of tracks
I'll guess a freight terminal of some kind -- must be fairly new, too, if
the incredible clean tracks & right of way is an indication. No date but
I'll guess 1930's or 1940's.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3457/3250740015_844a977c76_b.jpg?rand=1387157
79

Tim O'


One of the photos in the link in Tim's original post shows the West Side
Freight Line going right through the Bell Telephone Laboratories building
on West Street in New York. That location was still active when I joined
Bell Labs at one of its suburban NJ locations in 1960. When I joined the
employees model RR club, I was told "Yeah, our layout is pretty small, but
you should see the train set they have at our New York location."

Tom Madden


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Re: The High Line before it became a park

Tim O'Connor
 

Tom, any idea what this building was? From the size and number of tracks
I'll guess a freight terminal of some kind -- must be fairly new, too, if
the incredible clean tracks & right of way is an indication. No date but
I'll guess 1930's or 1940's.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3457/3250740015_844a977c76_b.jpg?rand=138715779

Tim O'

One of the photos in the link in Tim's original post shows the West Side Freight Line going right through the Bell Telephone Laboratories building on West Street in New York. That location was still active when I joined Bell Labs at one of its suburban NJ locations in 1960. When I joined the employees model RR club, I was told "Yeah, our layout is pretty small, but you should see the train set they have at our New York location."

Tom Madden


Re: NYCSHS New e-zine NYCentral Modeler

David Sieber
 

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, Eddie Walters wrote: "Good luck from me too. I'd offer a suggestion to put articles that are relevant to modelers outside the NYC. As a Pennsy modeler, some guidance on selecting and modeling relevant NYC freight cars would be very helpful."

Noel, you're taking on a daunting task, and I join the many who wish you all the best in this endeavor. Let me heartily 'second the motion' on Eddie's excellent suggestion above. Although a modeler of the far West, I nevertheless download and save all available railroad Society e-zine issues for reference and inspiration. Some of my most interesting freight car projects have been 'foreign road' interchange cars straight from the pages of The B&O Modeler, The Chicago & North Western Modeler, The Keystone Modeler, and The Seaboard-Coast Line Modeler. I look forward to the NYCentral Modeler helping me to fill the unfortunate lack of NYC freight cars in my model fleet, and I'm sure others will appreciate you providing the information that we all need to accurately model the NYC and create more prototypically representative interchange fleets. Good luck, and happy modeling! Dave Sieber, Reno NV


Re: The High Line before it became a park

pullmanboss <tcmadden@...>
 

ronald parisi wrote:

The name High Line is the creation of the public relations firm that was
enlisted to make its original name trendy and hip.

The West Side Freight Line just didn't do it for the developers.
One of the photos in the link in Tim's original post shows the West Side Freight Line going right through the Bell Telephone Laboratories building on West Street in New York. That location was still active when I joined Bell Labs at one of its suburban NJ locations in 1960. When I joined the employees model RR club, I was told "Yeah, our layout is pretty small, but you should see the train set they have at our New York location."

Tom Madden


Re: The High Line before it became a park

ronald parisi
 

The name High Line is the creation of the public relations firm that was
enlisted to make its original name trendy and hip.

The West Side Freight Line just didn't do it for the developers.

Ron Parisi

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