Date   

Re: Tsunami sound for GN Y-1 (PRR FF2)

Daniel A. Mitchell
 

I’l somewhat dispute the sounds. While I never got to see an MILW “Joe” ins service, I did spend some time around the CSS&SB “800s” (don’t call them “Little Joes”). I even got a short ride around the Michigan City yard. The description of the  basic noises (compressor and gear noise) are fine, HOWEVER, these things have TREMENDOUS blowers. When hey get hot the thermostatic blowers cut in and ROAR like crazy. They'll blow small rocks around the track, and you cannot talk and be heard near the loco. The blowers are thermostatically controlled and spin up and down as cooling is needed. A “hot” loco parked in the yard would intermittently howl while totally unattended, until it cools off.

Dan Mitchell
==========

On May 6, 2020, at 6:11 PM, Dennis Storzek <destorzek@...> wrote:

Yeah but... those are DC machines, so the only real sound is gear noise and the occasional clacking of the control contactors, much like a diesel as it makes transition. The GN Y-1s were AC machines with a big motor-generator set to supply DC to the traction motors. I would suspect it made a continuous monotonous drone, similar to traction motor blowers, but exactly what it sounded like is anybody's guess.

Dennis Storzek


Re: Accurate measured cutting of styrene sheets

Andy Carlson
 

I have found that dropping the blade handle super fast helps in getting less curl. Makes me fill like I am reinacting the French Revolution. I also place the cuts furthest out to where the blade is dropping down with less angle to the cut.

I will try an experiment where I am cutting a long, slim piece.
-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA

On Wednesday, May 6, 2020, 4:35:29 PM PDT, Claus Schlund \(HGM\) <claus@...> wrote:


Hi Andy,
 
I have used a paper cutter in the past myself. One thing I found is that when cutting long narrow strips, there is a tendency for the styrene to develop a bit of a curl, and then it is difficult to use the strip as a long straight piece because the curl makes it want to lift up and/or not lay straight when used. Have you also had this experience? If so, how do you handle this?
 
Claus Schlund
 
 
From: Andy Carlson
Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2020 5:38 PM
To: STMFC
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Accurate measured cutting of styrene sheets
 
I have acquired three paper cutters over the last 5 years. One was a little used large model with a cast steel slicer and a hard wood deck.
 
I have found myself using the cutter more and more for making styrene pieces. My go-to method in the past was to use a dedicated dial caliper with one of the jaw points sharpened. I could scribe a full length line by dragging the non-sharpened jaw along the styrene edge, with the other jaw leaving a nice line. Place an exacto knife point into the scribe, and place the metal straight edge up to the knife blade and an accurate cut was assured. I did have to make a cheat compensation from the measured to exact differences, which in my case 0.003".
 
Now I simply use the depth pointer on the dial caliper to extend the caliper from the cutting edge of the paper cutter and slide the styrene sheet to the blocking point of the depth gauge. Aligning the styrene to the square lines on the base platform keeps the squareness assured. The beauty of this is the measurements are exact!
 
Another beauty of this paper cutter is the nice, straight edges without any left behind relic items which need follow up attention. The accuracy I achieve is down to 0.001". I have cut up to 0.040" though I am concerned that perhaps thicker styrene may hasten the dulling of the steel blade.
 
I needed to make a scale 1/2 inch by 2 inch door track protector, which was 5 foot long, on a wooden box car. I needed to make 4 or more attempts to get the perfect cut, but I was super pleased with the results. With this small of a cut, I simply eyeballed the sizes and kept trying to get to where I was satisfied. For this door track piece, I sliced an Avery peel and stick address label. When finished with the slicing, I peeled off the backing and the tiny track strip went down with good adhesion. I am super pleased with the scale size and strength.
 
I am 68 years old and I am still learning and trying new ideas!
 
-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA


Re: Accurate measured cutting of styrene sheets

Richard Brennan
 

At 02:38 PM 5/6/2020, Andy Carlson wrote:
One was a little used large model with a cast steel slicer and a hard wood deck. <snip>
Agree 100%:
The most useful, albeit probably not the most important 'find' in my Mother's estate:
was the 19in by 19in Martin-Yale Premiere paper cutter with the green cross-hatched 3/4in wood base and HEAVY steel cutting edge.
From the back of the spring-loaded pivot to the end of the handle, the cutting arm is 27 inches long!
Finger guard? WHAT finger guard???

With the exception of corrugated cardboard and light foamcore... I don't cut more than 0.030 / 1/32 in.
It makes short and accurate work of anything rigid enough to align with the metal back fence;
including styrene, card stock, decal paper and up to 10 sheets of laser bond.

I need to be careful with glassine paper and tissue, as they tend to creep as the cut progresses...
but if I really needed them to be exact, I could just sandwich them between sheets of cover stock, and then cut.

The down-side; Taking-up nearly 4 square feet of flat surface.
The redemption, with the cutting arm down and secured, it fits vertically between the leg of a table and the wall!

Next time you see one... ask if it might be available!


--------------------
Richard Brennan - San Leandro CA
--------------------


Re: Accurate measured cutting of styrene sheets

Claus Schlund \(HGM\)
 

Hi Andy,
 
I have used a paper cutter in the past myself. One thing I found is that when cutting long narrow strips, there is a tendency for the styrene to develop a bit of a curl, and then it is difficult to use the strip as a long straight piece because the curl makes it want to lift up and/or not lay straight when used. Have you also had this experience? If so, how do you handle this?
 
Claus Schlund
 
 

From: Andy Carlson
Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2020 5:38 PM
To: STMFC
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Accurate measured cutting of styrene sheets
 
I have acquired three paper cutters over the last 5 years. One was a little used large model with a cast steel slicer and a hard wood deck.
 
I have found myself using the cutter more and more for making styrene pieces. My go-to method in the past was to use a dedicated dial caliper with one of the jaw points sharpened. I could scribe a full length line by dragging the non-sharpened jaw along the styrene edge, with the other jaw leaving a nice line. Place an exacto knife point into the scribe, and place the metal straight edge up to the knife blade and an accurate cut was assured. I did have to make a cheat compensation from the measured to exact differences, which in my case 0.003".
 
Now I simply use the depth pointer on the dial caliper to extend the caliper from the cutting edge of the paper cutter and slide the styrene sheet to the blocking point of the depth gauge. Aligning the styrene to the square lines on the base platform keeps the squareness assured. The beauty of this is the measurements are exact!
 
Another beauty of this paper cutter is the nice, straight edges without any left behind relic items which need follow up attention. The accuracy I achieve is down to 0.001". I have cut up to 0.040" though I am concerned that perhaps thicker styrene may hasten the dulling of the steel blade.
 
I needed to make a scale 1/2 inch by 2 inch door track protector, which was 5 foot long, on a wooden box car. I needed to make 4 or more attempts to get the perfect cut, but I was super pleased with the results. With this small of a cut, I simply eyeballed the sizes and kept trying to get to where I was satisfied. For this door track piece, I sliced an Avery peel and stick address label. When finished with the slicing, I peeled off the backing and the tiny track strip went down with good adhesion. I am super pleased with the scale size and strength.
 
I am 68 years old and I am still learning and trying new ideas!
 
-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA


Re: Accurate measured cutting of styrene sheets

Eric Hansmann
 

IIRC, Wayne Wesoloski had an article in RMC years ago that converted a disc blade paper cutter to work with sheet styrene. I do not remember the exact issue. 


Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN

On May 6, 2020, at 5:25 PM, Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:


Andy, I totally agree. I liked my rotary paper cutter so much that I bought a larger one - 18". Blades can be replaced
when they wear out, so I don't worry about that.
_._,_._,_


Re: Accurate measured cutting of styrene sheets

Tim O'Connor
 


Andy, I totally agree. I liked my rotary paper cutter so much that I bought a larger one - 18". Blades can be replaced
when they wear out, so I don't worry about that.



On 5/6/2020 5:38 PM, Andy Carlson wrote:
I have acquired three paper cutters over the last 5 years. One was a little used large model with a cast steel slicer and a hard wood deck.

I have found myself using the cutter more and more for making styrene pieces. My go-to method in the past was to use a dedicated dial caliper with one of the jaw points sharpened. I could scribe a full length line by dragging the non-sharpened jaw along the styrene edge, with the other jaw leaving a nice line. Place an exacto knife point into the scribe, and place the metal straight edge up to the knife blade and an accurate cut was assured. I did have to make a cheat compensation from the measured to exact differences, which in my case 0.003".

Now I simply use the depth pointer on the dial caliper to extend the caliper from the cutting edge of the paper cutter and slide the styrene sheet to the blocking point of the depth gauge. Aligning the styrene to the square lines on the base platform keeps the squareness assured. The beauty of this is the measurements are exact!

Another beauty of this paper cutter is the nice, straight edges without any left behind relic items which need follow up attention. The accuracy I achieve is down to 0.001". I have cut up to 0.040" though I am concerned that perhaps thicker styrene may hasten the dulling of the steel blade.

I needed to make a scale 1/2 inch by 2 inch door track protector, which was 5 foot long, on a wooden box car. I needed to make 4 or more attempts to get the perfect cut, but I was super pleased with the results. With this small of a cut, I simply eyeballed the sizes and kept trying to get to where I was satisfied. For this door track piece, I sliced an Avery peel and stick address label. When finished with the slicing, I peeled off the backing and the tiny track strip went down with good adhesion. I am super pleased with the scale size and strength.

I am 68 years old and I am still learning and trying new ideas!

-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: Accurate measured cutting of styrene sheets

Rob & Bev Manley
 

Andy,
Some of the tricks we do are so matter of fact that we never think of passing it on to the rest of the group. When I've done my Pan Pastel clinics I am amazed at the questions that are asked. I am also honored that the group is asking me. I have a similar paper cutter from my printing days. I used mine to cut sheet lead harvested from a roof vent that came off my house. It was for my CB&Q coal gons. They were a perfect fit and all sides were square. 

Rob Manley
"Better modeling through personal embarrassment"


On Wednesday, May 6, 2020, 04:39:01 PM CDT, Andy Carlson <midcentury@...> wrote:


I have acquired three paper cutters over the last 5 years. One was a little used large model with a cast steel slicer and a hard wood deck.

I have found myself using the cutter more and more for making styrene pieces. My go-to method in the past was to use a dedicated dial caliper with one of the jaw points sharpened. I could scribe a full length line by dragging the non-sharpened jaw along the styrene edge, with the other jaw leaving a nice line. Place an exacto knife point into the scribe, and place the metal straight edge up to the knife blade and an accurate cut was assured. I did have to make a cheat compensation from the measured to exact differences, which in my case 0.003".

Now I simply use the depth pointer on the dial caliper to extend the caliper from the cutting edge of the paper cutter and slide the styrene sheet to the blocking point of the depth gauge. Aligning the styrene to the square lines on the base platform keeps the squareness assured. The beauty of this is the measurements are exact!

Another beauty of this paper cutter is the nice, straight edges without any left behind relic items which need follow up attention. The accuracy I achieve is down to 0.001". I have cut up to 0.040" though I am concerned that perhaps thicker styrene may hasten the dulling of the steel blade.

I needed to make a scale 1/2 inch by 2 inch door track protector, which was 5 foot long, on a wooden box car. I needed to make 4 or more attempts to get the perfect cut, but I was super pleased with the results. With this small of a cut, I simply eyeballed the sizes and kept trying to get to where I was satisfied. For this door track piece, I sliced an Avery peel and stick address label. When finished with the slicing, I peeled off the backing and the tiny track strip went down with good adhesion. I am super pleased with the scale size and strength.

I am 68 years old and I am still learning and trying new ideas!

-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA


Re: Tsunami sound for GN Y-1 (PRR FF2)

Dennis Storzek
 

Yeah but... those are DC machines, so the only real sound is gear noise and the occasional clacking of the control contactors, much like a diesel as it makes transition. The GN Y-1s were AC machines with a big motor-generator set to supply DC to the traction motors. I would suspect it made a continuous monotonous drone, similar to traction motor blowers, but exactly what it sounded like is anybody's guess.

Dennis Storzek


Re: Tsunami sound for GN Y-1 (PRR FF2)

Scott Kremer
 

Ted is right. My wife and I chased a Little Joe for a long way West from Missoula in 1973. I recorder them. There was virtually no sound, except for the bell and whistle, a little hum if you got close enough.

Scott Kremer


Accurate measured cutting of styrene sheets

Andy Carlson
 

I have acquired three paper cutters over the last 5 years. One was a little used large model with a cast steel slicer and a hard wood deck.

I have found myself using the cutter more and more for making styrene pieces. My go-to method in the past was to use a dedicated dial caliper with one of the jaw points sharpened. I could scribe a full length line by dragging the non-sharpened jaw along the styrene edge, with the other jaw leaving a nice line. Place an exacto knife point into the scribe, and place the metal straight edge up to the knife blade and an accurate cut was assured. I did have to make a cheat compensation from the measured to exact differences, which in my case 0.003".

Now I simply use the depth pointer on the dial caliper to extend the caliper from the cutting edge of the paper cutter and slide the styrene sheet to the blocking point of the depth gauge. Aligning the styrene to the square lines on the base platform keeps the squareness assured. The beauty of this is the measurements are exact!

Another beauty of this paper cutter is the nice, straight edges without any left behind relic items which need follow up attention. The accuracy I achieve is down to 0.001". I have cut up to 0.040" though I am concerned that perhaps thicker styrene may hasten the dulling of the steel blade.

I needed to make a scale 1/2 inch by 2 inch door track protector, which was 5 foot long, on a wooden box car. I needed to make 4 or more attempts to get the perfect cut, but I was super pleased with the results. With this small of a cut, I simply eyeballed the sizes and kept trying to get to where I was satisfied. For this door track piece, I sliced an Avery peel and stick address label. When finished with the slicing, I peeled off the backing and the tiny track strip went down with good adhesion. I am super pleased with the scale size and strength.

I am 68 years old and I am still learning and trying new ideas!

-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA


Re: Tsunami sound for GN Y-1 (PRR FF2)

Ted Schnepf
 

Hello,

My railroad career started for the Milw Road in Montana/Idaho, which had electrified locomotives. I can tell you from expierence they are almost sound less. A little gear noise, occasional air compressor and at speed, a little wheel/rail noise and at the correct spots bell or whistle. They can be soundless machines. specially coming down grade.

The trailing freight cars can make more noise, than the locomotive.

Ted Schnepf
126 Will Scarlet,
Elgin, Ill. 60120


847=697-5353

On Wednesday, May 6, 2020, 04:26:58 PM CDT, Scott Kremer <skremer@...> wrote:


I installed a tsunami as I recall that was a rather generic electric.  The truth is that all I really wanted was the bell and the whistle for operating sessions.  I will tell you that if you have the PFM Y-1’s there is very little room.  The good news is that it will pull my O-8, with coasting drive, and 30 cars plus up a 2.2% grade.  Love watching it under catenary. No power on the steam engine, just the electric.

Scott Kremer

On May 6, 2020, at 5:19 PM, Ray Hutchison <rayhutchison2@...> wrote:

I have several Great Northern Y-1s (that later became the FF2s) and would like to add DCC and sound.  I have not been able to locate sound files for the engine and am wondering if anyone could point me to where they can be found?  

One suggestion from another list was to look for sound files for European heavy electrics because they might be the same, but I don't want to do that (except as last resort).  

Would the GG1 sound files be t all close to the FF2?

Thank you for any leads and suggestions!

Ray Hutchison
Green Bay WI


Re: Tsunami sound for GN Y-1 (PRR FF2)

Scott Kremer
 

I installed a tsunami as I recall that was a rather generic electric.  The truth is that all I really wanted was the bell and the whistle for operating sessions.  I will tell you that if you have the PFM Y-1’s there is very little room.  The good news is that it will pull my O-8, with coasting drive, and 30 cars plus up a 2.2% grade.  Love watching it under catenary. No power on the steam engine, just the electric.

Scott Kremer

On May 6, 2020, at 5:19 PM, Ray Hutchison <rayhutchison2@...> wrote:

I have several Great Northern Y-1s (that later became the FF2s) and would like to add DCC and sound.  I have not been able to locate sound files for the engine and am wondering if anyone could point me to where they can be found?  

One suggestion from another list was to look for sound files for European heavy electrics because they might be the same, but I don't want to do that (except as last resort).  

Would the GG1 sound files be t all close to the FF2?

Thank you for any leads and suggestions!

Ray Hutchison
Green Bay WI


Tsunami sound for GN Y-1 (PRR FF2)

Ray Hutchison
 

I have several Great Northern Y-1s (that later became the FF2s) and would like to add DCC and sound.  I have not been able to locate sound files for the engine and am wondering if anyone could point me to where they can be found?  

One suggestion from another list was to look for sound files for European heavy electrics because they might be the same, but I don't want to do that (except as last resort).  

Would the GG1 sound files be t all close to the FF2?

Thank you for any leads and suggestions!

Ray Hutchison
Green Bay WI


Errata - The Spring issue of The Keystone Modeler is available

Bruce Smith
 

Folks,

A small typo slipped into the most recent edition!  

The link for the North Carolina RPM Carolinas School of Railroad Modeling Techniques in UPCOMING EVENTS event is incorrect. It should be:

September 25-26, 2020 Winston Salem, North Carolina RPM Carolinas School of Railroad Modeling Techniques https://sissonstony.wixsite.com/rpm-carolina

An "n" slipped past making it .con, when it should be .COM

Regards,
Bruce
Bruce Smith
Auburn, AL


From: Bruce F. Smith <smithbf@...>
Sent: Monday, May 4, 2020 7:41 AM
To: the-keystone-modeler@... <the-keystone-modeler@...>
Cc: RealSTMFC@groups.io <RealSTMFC@groups.io>; PRR@PRR.groups.io <PRR@PRR.groups.io>; PRRPro@groups.io <PRRPro@groups.io>
Subject: The Spring issue of The Keystone Modeler is available
 
Folks,


The Spring, 2020 issue (#112) of The Keystone Modeler is now available on the PRRT&HS web site at: http://www.prrths.com/newprr_files/newPRRKeystoneModeler.htm


A gentle reminder - If you don't see the issue listed, reload the web page so as to refresh your cache.


Regards,

Bruce 

Bruce Smith, Assistant webmaster, PRRT&HS


Re: [Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] Was: Three Flat Cars And A Lot Of People! Now more on excess dimensions and weight

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Bruce, folks;

I found extremely interesting when researching various cars that did not fit within the mold of, "if it fits, and is not too heavy...", the approach taken by each railroad, in light of:

a) the presence of one or more customers needing a potentially expensive car not as useful (if at all) for "general" service;

b) the profit needed to support an approach (or, for example "we'll go to your competitor, if you don't x, y, z");

c) the hope that some other (originating) road would do it, and all you'd have to do was figure out how to accommodate it.

The latter was always the hope, but for some roads, the PRR being the most extreme (I have found), it was a series of:

1) If we don't make or modify a car to do this, what is the consequence;

2) Can our engineers or industry come up with a reasonable ($$) solution;

3) Can we just avoid this?

PRR's approach was extremely apprehensive, and odd, sometimes, in its approach to each problem.

For example, PRR built TENS of thousands of drop end gondolas, post-USRA drop end gon, in many, MANY classes, for loads expected to extend beyond the ends of even a 65-foot gondola. As Jack Consoli points out, the PRR's G26 class alone (followed up by G26A, G27, G28, G30, G31 A,B,C, and several G33 sub-classes, which were ALL drop end), G26 exceeded the numbers of 65-foot gondolas on ALL other railroads. What were they thinking? What other RR came close to following this philosophy? At any scale?

The F28 flat car, a strange hybrid of depressed and shallow well, was virtually forced on them by the Westinghouse Corporation's insistence that PRR create a car specifically for their needs. PRR was dragged kicking and screaming into their first "depressed center" flat car. Other roads did not seem to take this approach. In its infancy, Look at NYC, P&LE, Mesta, and others.

The PRR F22 and F23 were extremely short HD flats, for one purpose: shipment of extremely long gun tubes. They were meant to incorporate pivots from the get go. Did other railroads do this? Who?

The PRR F25 well flat had deep wells but were not depressed center in that era. Why no other roads in that era (teens)? What loads did PRR get that neighbors did not?

So, PRR expected many, many loads to extend beyond the ends of the cars. Why so many, and why don't we see more pics?

And why did PRR roster SO many HD flats in all sizes? Was it just a matter of PRR having way more customers with "High and Wides", and HD loads?

Do you all have actual examples or correspondence on these issues?

Elden Gatwood

-----Original Message-----
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Bruce Smith
Sent: Wednesday, May 6, 2020 1:53 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] You Can Model This Scene With Just Three Flat Cars And A Lot Of People!

Folks,

Examining the 1933 version of ARA Rules Governing the Loading of Commodities on Open Top Cars, figures 53-61, it is immediately apparent that this long load is most likely secured in compliance with ARA guidelines.

Long, rigid loads, could be secured at each pivot point to the pivot blocking, with no additional blocking needed.

If the loads had reasonable "sag", they might require intermediate blocking, not to stop movement, but to act as "sliders" to allow the load to move across the deck of the car without damaging the car.

Regards,
Bruce
Bruce Smith
Auburn, AL


Re: SR 1944 AAR Boxcar -- C&BT Upgrade

Bob Chapman
 

Fenton Wells writes:
What ladders did you use?

Hi, Fenton --

The ladders are Kadee -- to my eye about as nice as the fabricated ones from Yarmouth, and avoids some make-work. I did a bit of chopping at their top to even out the stiles from the staggered PS-1 look. 

Regards,
Bob Chapman




Re: Photo Gallery: PPKX 5568 (Poultry Car)

Bob Chaparro
 

Doug Harding commented...

"That is the poultry car that is at the Transportation Museum in St Louis. The only known poultry car to still exist. It was a Poultry Palace Car. The car is now sitting in the back of a building, almost inaccessible with no known plans to restore. This is a nice set of photos, apparently taken when the car was still outside."


Re: You Can Model This Scene With Just Three Flat Cars And A Lot Of People!

Bruce Smith
 

Folks,

Examining the 1933 version of ARA Rules Governing the Loading of Commodities on Open Top Cars, figures 53-61, it is immediately apparent that this long load is most likely secured in compliance with ARA guidelines.

Long, rigid loads, could be secured at each pivot point to the pivot blocking, with no additional blocking needed.

If the loads had reasonable "sag", they might require intermediate blocking, not to stop movement, but to act as "sliders" to allow the load to move across the deck of the car without damaging the car.

Regards,
Bruce
Bruce Smith
Auburn, AL


Re: SR 1944 AAR Boxcar -- C&BT Upgrade

Lester Breuer
 

Fine model work.  Thanks for sharing.
Lester Breuer


Re: AAR Closed Car Loading Guide

Allen Cain
 

Bob,

I have a collection of the AAR loading pamphlets but not all and each is specific to a particular commodity.

Issue and revision dates range from 1936 to 1959 with most in the 1940s.

If you can narrow down your request to a specific commodity I think I can help you.

Contact me off list and we will see what we can do.

Allen Cain

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