Re: Vulcan Trucks
Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
Tom Madden wrote:
Is this the Ulrich truck you mean, Dennis? (Scroll down in the listing for an enlarged view.)That's a T-section truck, not a Vulcan. Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA 2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com (510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com Publishers of books on railroad history
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Re: Vulcan Trucks
pullmanboss <tgmadden@...>
Here is what he needs:Is this the Ulrich truck you mean, Dennis? (Scroll down in the listing for an enlarged view.) http://cgi.ebay.com/ULRICH-40-GS-GONDOLA-Southern-Pacific-SP-91976_W0QQitemZ230448409129 Tom Madden
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Re: 50' MDC single sheathed box cars (was Roundhouse 50' End door Boxcar)
Richard Hendrickson
On Mar 16, 2010, at 2:53 PM, Anthony Thompson wrote:
Richard Hendrickson wrote:That's because the models were entirely bogus. When the T&P rebuiltYeah, I could, but that's why I wrote the article and published allI can't find in the article any mention of the single-door those cars with wider single doors, they also steel sheathed them. Richard Hendrickson
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Re: New Kadee Trucks
Richard Hendrickson
On Mar 16, 2010, at 3:25 PM, soolinehistory wrote:
Would anyone care to measure the centerplate height of these newDennis, the bolster height appears to be the same as on their older trucks. Richard Hendrickson
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Re: New Kadee Trucks
Richard Hendrickson
On Mar 16, 2010, at 3:17 PM, pierreoliver2003 wrote:
One question about the new trucks, Richard.No, I weighed a new one and an old one with my postal scale, and they're almost exactly the same, just about 1/4 oz. each. Richard Hendrickson
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Re: New Kadee Trucks
Dennis Storzek
--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, Richard Hendrickson <rhendrickson@...> wrote:
I should mention, since we have some manufacturers who inhabit this list, that Kadee has a patent on this centering device, and while I haven't looked at it for years, I suspect it is still active. Would anyone care to measure the centerplate height of these new trucks? It would be interesting to know if they are still holding with the obsolete NMRA RP specified 5/16" (.3125")or if they've joined everybody else at the more prototypical .293"/.298". The lower height would be more useful, since it is no big deal to shim a body UP, but lowering it is often a lot of work. Dennis
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Re: New Kadee Trucks
pierreoliver2003 <pierre.oliver@...>
One question about the new trucks, Richard.
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
Are they much lighter than the old metal style? Pierre Oliver
--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, Richard Hendrickson <rhendrickson@...> wrote:
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Re: Vulcan Trucks
Dennis Storzek
--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, Richard Hendrickson <rhendrickson@...> wrote:
Here is what he needs:Also, who else makes Vulcan trucks?Ulrich at one time (many years ago) made some fairly decent cast http://www.irm.org/gallery/CWI1185/aab These are U section trucks, as I believe the old Ulrich trucks were, but it's been a couple decades since I've seen a pair. At least the Kadee Vulcans will have the distinctive shape at the ends of the sideframes over the boxes. IIRC, Canada Hobbycraft offered archbar trucks in their TruLine Trains line that had very nice Simplex bolsters. It may be possible that their bolster will fit other sideframes. One can always hope. Dennis
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Re: Vulcan Trucks
Rhbale@...
Attached is a Vulcan truck from the 1919 Car Builders Cyclopedia. Note the
size of the rail spikes. Richard Bale In a message dated 3/16/2010 6:42:53 P.M. Pacific Daylight Time, tgmadden@worldnet.att.net writes: Tom, that's an Ulrich truck, but not a Vulcan; it's a Bettendorf T-Lack of freight car immersion showing... Tom "but I can sure tell the difference between 2410 and 2411 Pullman trucks" Madden [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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Re: Vulcan Trucks
Richard Hendrickson
On Mar 16, 2010, at 1:37 PM, behillman wrote:
Trying to locate some accurate, HO scale, Vulcan trucks, as used on[snip] I have seen Bethlehem Car Works Vulcan trucks, Walthers #718-1220,Since the Kadee trucks can be dismantled, the bolster ends can be modified with a file. As in the case of Andrews trucks, which came in as many or more variants, the name Vulcan identified a construction principle - cast steel side frames with pedestals into which separate journal boxes were bolted. ASF made Vulcan trucks over a long period of time, and side frame configurations varied a lot. Early Vulcan side frames were L-section, then progressed to a combination of L-section and U- section, and finally to entirely U-section, as represented by the Kadee models. Ulrich at one time (many years ago) made some fairly decent cast metal Vulcan trucks in HO scale, and if you can find a pair on the second-hand market, their side frames may be closer to what you want. Richard Hendrickson
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Re: 50' MDC single sheathed box cars (was Roundhouse 50' End door Boxcar)
Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
Richard Hendrickson wrote:
Yeah, I could, but that's why I wrote the article and published all those photos in the first place . . .I can't find in the article any mention of the single-door cars. Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA 2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com (510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com Publishers of books on railroad history
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Re: 50' MDC single sheathed box cars (was Roundhouse 50' End door Boxcar)
Richard Hendrickson
On Mar 16, 2010, at 12:07 PM, Garth G. Groff wrote:
Tim,Yeah, I could, but that's why I wrote the article and published all those photos in the first place. Been there, done that, and I have better things to do with my time than produce what amounts to a reprint for subscribers to the STMFC list. Richard Hendrickson
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New Kadee Trucks
Richard Hendrickson
I just received in this afternoon's mail several samples of Kadee's
new HO scale HGC trucks. They are even better than they appear in the photos, which is saying a lot. We can rejoice that the wimpy "working" springs and largely vacant spaces in the side frames below the bolsters are gone; springs are now molded into the side frames, giving a much more realistic appearance, and the "working" springs never really worked anyway. The new HGC material produces sharp, precisely molded side frames and bolsters, and an ingenious split-bolster design provides slight equalization - ample to handle any reasonable track irregularities - without excessive slop. Equally novel is the mounting arrangement; the trucks come with precision centering sleeves and mounting screws. They rotate freely around the mounting screws when the car is on the track but, when the car is picked up, the trucks center, automatically lining up with the rails and thus rendering re-railing cars a fumble-free no-brainer. Mounting instructions call for the removal of truck centering protrusions on the bolsters, where present; these have often been a problem in the past when changing trucks because, depending on the manufacturer of the car model, they have often varied in diameter and height. The Kadee trucks are intended to be mounted on bolster surfaces which are smooth and flat, with clearances between the bolster, centering sleeve, and mounting screw precisely controlled. Brake rigging is completely modeled, and the brake shoes line up properly with the wheel treads. All the trucks come with Kadee's familiar 110 contour cast metal wheels on nylon axles, which provide very good rolling qualities (though perhaps not quite as good as machined metal wheels on machined metal axles). Those of us who have adopted code 88 semi- scale wheels as a personal standard should urge Kadee to produce code 88 wheels as a better looking and closer-to-scale alternative. The 70 ton Barber S-2-B solid bearing trucks are new (Kadee calls them "friction bearing" trucks, an error for which I'll forgive them, though only barely). They have appropriately larger journal boxes and the correct 5'8" wheelbase (in contrast to the 5'6" wheelbase common to most 50 ton trucks), and three springs per side are nicely represented, as well as the Barber stabilizing wedges inside the bolster ends. This is probably the truck that serious steam and transition era freight car modelers have needed most, and it is a welcome addition to the Kadee line. The other trucks are replacements for HO scale trucks that Kadee has produced for decades, and that used to be regarded as state of the art. They include Arch Bar trucks with ribbed-back wheel sets and ASF A-3 and "Bettendorf" trucks with both ribbed-back and smooth-back wheel sets. In each case, the side frames are essentially the same as on the former trucks, and are accurately represented. I could wish Kadee had dropped the inaccurate "Bettendorf" label for what are more accurately described as AAR double truss self-aligning spring- plankless trucks, but since they have sold the older version as "Bettendorf" for so many years, one can understand a reluctance to confuse customers who aren't especially knowledgeable about prototype trucks. Presumably, if these new trucks are as well received as they should be, similar replacements for Kadee's cast metal Andrews, Bettendorf T-section, Vulcan, and Pennsylvania 2D-F8 will follow. I certainly hope so, as the early L-section Andrews and Vulcan trucks, especially, aren't available from any other source. These new trucks from Kadee are truly revolutionary and, along with the fine HO scale trucks we've been getting recently from Brian Leppert at Tahoe Model Works, are a major step forward in both prototype accuracy and performance. Richard Hendrickson
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Battleship Iowa (Re: Good News and new Flatcar Load from Winterail)
Benjamin Hom
Brian Chapman wrote:
"Why off topic? The topic is how the railroads delivered material to the east coast building docks." True; however, I recommend we take further discussion off-list as the Navy part of this really isn't on topic. "I have a quote from the skipper who brought Iowa out of retirement for the Korean War. On a trip from San Francisco to Hawaii, Capt. Smedberg (who nearly put Iowa on the Alcatraz rocks, an interesting story in itself, which comes from a USNI oral history project) told a delegation from the state of Iowa that the Iowa Class, because of its superior maneuverabilty and 33 knot speed, were really "Super Cruisers." This is not the lone Super Cruiser reference to these ships." I'll take your word for it; however, I'll make a couple of points: - As far as late-war US Navy capital ships go, "super cruiser" more accurately describes the ALASKA-class "large cruisers", 12-inch gunned ships built in response to a purported class of Japanese battlecruisers that didn't exist. - Regarding terminology, what Admirals and ship's Commanding Officers will tell constituents state delegations and how the Navy conducts business internally are definitely two different things. I definitely don't impugn Captain Smedberg; however, having given more than my fair share of tours during visit ship, I can tell you that you sometimes have to draw analogies to explain something to folks who don't know the Navy. Having taken his quote out of context, I'm not sure why he described Iowa as a "super cruiser". - Google "super cruiser" and "fast battleship" and see what comes up. "The Iowas, because of hull form and 212,000 SHP, were faster (as well as heavier, and the only US Navy ships to carry 16"/50 caliber rifles, so better gunned, too) than the South Dakotas and North Dakotas." Nobody argued that point. However, these three classes of ships are referred to as "Fast Battleships" in contast to the pre-Washington Treaty battle line of the US Navy, which consisted of ships with maximum speeds of 20-21 knots. This is my last on-list post on this subject. Ben Hom
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Vulcan Trucks
Paul Hillman
Trying to locate some accurate, HO scale, Vulcan trucks, as used on the Haskell & Barker, C&WI wood gondola, at the Illinois RR Museum.
These were identified by Richard Hendrickson as Vulcan Trucks with Simplex truck-bolsters, all made by American Steel Foundries. The name "Simplex" is cast on the end of the truck-bolster. (Thank you Richard.) I have seen Bethlehem Car Works Vulcan trucks, Walthers #718-1220, and Kadee Vulcan trucks, Walthers #380-515 (for references). The Bethlehem Car Works Vulcan trucks seem to have a name cast on the end of the bolster but can't read it in "zooming", but the side-frames are "flatter" on top than the Kadee trucks, which have a different type truck-bolster. I can't find better picture references, yet, for Vulcan trucks. Did Vulcan (ASF) make more than one side-frame design, IE) as Bethlehem versus Kadee styles? Also, who else makes Vulcan trucks? Thanks, Paul Hillman
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Re: 50' MDC single sheathed box cars (was Roundhouse 50' End door Boxcar)
Andy Carlson
You remembered wrong. WP's cars were all Pullman radial roofed.
-Andy Carlson Ojai CA ________________________________ From: Jon Miller <atsf@izap.com> What about the roofs? The ones on ebay were radial however I seem to remember the WP cars were flat roofs.
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Battleship Iowa (Re: Good News and new Flatcar Load from Winterail)
cornbeltroute <cornbeltroute@...>
so better gunned, too) than the South Dakotas and North Dakotas. <Obviously, I meant North Carolina.
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Battleship Iowa (Re: Good News and new Flatcar Load from Winterail)
cornbeltroute <cornbeltroute@...>
Why off topic? The topic is how the railroads delivered material to the east coast building docks.
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
I have a quote from the skipper who brought Iowa out of retirement for the Korean War. On a trip from San Francisco to Hawaii, Capt. Smedberg (who nearly put Iowa on the Alcatraz rocks, an interesting story in itself, which comes from a USNI oral history project) told a delegation from the state of Iowa that the Iowa Class, because of its superior maneuverabilty and 33 knot speed, were really "Super Cruisers." This is not the lone Super Cruiser reference to these ships. The Iowas, because of hull form and 212,000 SHP, were faster (as well as heavier, and the only US Navy ships to carry 16"/50 caliber rifles, so better gunned, too) than the South Dakotas and North Dakotas. Illinois was laid down at Philly? OK. But, that's why I added "IIRC," which indicated, I thought, that I might not recall correctly. I did not consult my files before posting . . . I was chatting, no more. I have spent years gathering information and writing about the Iowa (during my journalism days). I am in no way an expert. But, what I put forward here as information is sourced. I own a copy of Friedman's book, purchased from the USNI, as well as several other books that deal with the Iowa Class and U.S. battleships in general. I don't believe the misconceptions are mine. Geesh. -Brian Brian Chapman Evansdale, Iowa
We're wandering well off topic, but some misconceptions need to be cleared up right off:
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Re: 50' MDC single sheathed box cars (was Roundhouse 50' End door Boxcar)
Jon Miller <atsf@...>
Garth,
What about the roofs? The ones on ebay were radial however I seem to remember the WP cars were flat roofs. Jon Miller AT&SF For me time stopped in 1941 Digitrax, Chief/Zephyr systems, JMRI user NMRA Life member #2623 Member SFRH&MS
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Battleship Iowa (Re: Good News and new Flatcar Load from Winterail)
Benjamin Hom
Brian Chapman wrote:
"For some time I've wondered about railroad transportation and the building of the last battleships ever built -- the Iowa Class (Iowa, New Jersey, Missouri, and Wisconsin -- because of their great speed, also known as super-cruisers)." We're wandering well off topic, but some misconceptions need to be cleared up right off: WTF did you get "super-cruisers"? They, along with ealier SOUTH DAKOTA and NORTH CAROLINA-class battleships, were commonly referred to as "fast battleships". "Two uncompleted Iowas - Illinois and Kentucky - were laid down in Norfolk, IIRC." Not quite true. ILLINOIS (BB 65) was a Philadelphia ship; KENTUCKY (BB 66) was a Norfolk ship. "A colossal project. The railroads had to be intimately involved. Mustn't there have been marshaling yards for the big east coast building docks? Logistics must have been pretty carefully orchestrated, wouldn't you think?" Yes. The Pennsy ran a wartime ad "A Carrier Travels by Rail before it Goes to Sea" showing a painting of an aerial view of a rail yard filled with cars carrying ship components. "In Iowa's and Missouri's case, I'd guess much of the material arrived in New Jersey ports and were shipped to the NY Navy Yard? Not necessarily. Remember that New York City was served by an extensive carfloat operation. Freight arriving in New Jersey could be ferried across the harbor via car float to the Navy Yard, and the Navy Yard was serviced by an extensive railway: http://www.trainweb.org/bedt/milrr/bny.html "For some time I've thought that the story of building these ships would be interesting. Anyone have thoughts or information to offer?" For more information, I recommend Norman Friedman's U.S. Battleships: An Illustrated Design History (Naval Institute Press, ISBN-13 978-0870217159). Ben Hom
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