Date   

Re: Update on PrototypeRails 2010

SUVCWORR@...
 

Can't open the document, Mike. You posted a Word 2007 formatted document which is not backward compatible with early versions of Word. Anyone who has not shelled out the money for an upgrade to Office 2007 won't be able to read this.

Rich Orr

-----Original Message-----
From: Mike Brock <brockm@brevard.net>
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tue, Oct 27, 2009 10:19 pm
Subject: [STMFC] Update on PrototypeRails 2010










I have placed the latest flyer including an update on the list of clinicians
that will perform at Prototype Rails in Cocoa Beach next Jan.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/STMFC/files/PR2010FlyerWDOct14.docx

Mike Brock




------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links


Re: Update on PrototypeRails 2010

jerryglow2
 

I've spent more time trying to view this than building some of my models (slight exageration). How do we view it? Or better yet, why not just an Excel file like in the past?

Jerry Glow

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Brock" <brockm@...> wrote:

I have placed the latest flyer including an update on the list of clinicians
that will perform at Prototype Rails in Cocoa Beach next Jan.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/STMFC/files/PR2010FlyerWDOct14.docx

Mike Brock


Re: Wine Tank Cars

Dennis Storzek
 

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, Richard Hendrickson <rhendrickson@...> wrote:

On Oct 26, 2009, at 9:04 PM, soolinehistory wrote:


No guesswork necessary. It was definitely a 6,500 gal. Type V (the
smallest of both the Type V and Type X cars were 6,500 gal., not
6,000 gal.).
Thanks, Richard.

Force of habit, I guess. The first place I ran into these cars (well, the Class X variant with the underframe)the Gregg reprint of the 1906 Car Builder's Dictionary, lists them as 6000 gal., obviously just the nominal capacity.


Sorry, I don't have these, so I can't help.

Richard Hendrickson
They're not lost, just MIA. They'll turn up.

Dennis


Re: Wine Tank Cars

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Oct 27, 2009, at 8:02 PM, <steve.sandifer@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

So when would a car like this have been removed from service?
Most surviving UTL Class V cars were retired in the 1930s, though
some were put back into service during WW II and a few lasted into
the early 1950s. In any case, most of the survivors were restricted
to carrying "non-regulatory" commodities - i.e., liquids that
wouldn't explode, burn, or corrode.

Richard Hendrickson


Update on PrototypeRails 2010

Mike Brock <brockm@...>
 

I have placed the latest flyer including an update on the list of clinicians that will perform at Prototype Rails in Cocoa Beach next Jan.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/STMFC/files/PR2010FlyerWDOct14.docx

Mike Brock


Re: Wine Tank Cars

Steve SANDIFER
 

So when would a car like this have been removed from service?
______________
J. Stephen (Steve) Sandifer
mailto:steve.sandifer@sbcglobal.net
Home: 12027 Mulholland Drive, Meadows Place, TX 77477, 281-568-9918
Office: Southwest Central Church of Christ, 4011 W. Bellfort, Houston, TX 77025, 713-667-9417

----- Original Message -----
From: Anthony Thompson
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, October 27, 2009 4:19 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: Wine Tank Cars


Richard Hendrickson wrote:
> Note that this car was built - and probably converted to a three
> compartment car - before the 1917 tank car specs. were adopted by
> the ARA.

I'm sure this is true, but lest it become accepted that double
rivet-row joints = post-1917 tank cars, I'd point out that the double
riveting was recommended as early as 1904, and at least some buyers of
tank cars did order their cars that way. The 1910 adoption of these
various "Class II" MCB recommendations as standard provided that HEAD
seams (the joining of the tank ends to the cylindrical body) SHOULD be
double-riveted, but that was not yet required until 1917.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Wine Tank Cars

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Richard Hendrickson wrote:
Note that this car was built - and probably converted to a three compartment car - before the 1917 tank car specs. were adopted by the ARA.
I'm sure this is true, but lest it become accepted that double rivet-row joints = post-1917 tank cars, I'd point out that the double riveting was recommended as early as 1904, and at least some buyers of tank cars did order their cars that way. The 1910 adoption of these various "Class II" MCB recommendations as standard provided that HEAD seams (the joining of the tank ends to the cylindrical body) SHOULD be double-riveted, but that was not yet required until 1917.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Bituminous mystery car

PBowers
 

There is an old tank from a tank car at an abandoned plant in Owen Sound, ON Canada. Originally there were two but one was scrapped many years ago.

These cars in their last use was use to store bituminous (tar) by a local contractor. In the last years their has been lettering starting to appear though the silver paint and tar. While no number or id has appeared it appears that part of the wording on the left hand side includes "Bituminous." It looks like the same lettering is under the first so it is likely the lettering is from the days when it was in revenue service.

So my question is, does any one know of a company that lettered their cars with bituminous on the left hand side. Writing is more of a written italic like style although letters appear as individual letters.

http://www.uer.ca/locations/show.asp?locid=22114 and http://www.uer.ca/locations/viewgal.asp?picid=74497 show the tank car location.

Peter Bowers



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Re: Wine Tank Cars

Tim O'Connor
 

Thanks Richard. So that is an excellent spotting feature to
recognize a pre-1917 multi-dome rebuild tank car! :-)

Tim

At 10/27/2009 04:25 PM Tuesday, you wrote:
On Oct 26, 2009, at 8:59 PM, Tim O'Connor wrote:

The majority of 3-dome tank car photos I have show two
rivet seams between each pair of domes where the interior
bulkheads are attached -- Yet a couple of them show (like
this car) only a single rivet seam. Wouldn't each of the
compartments require a separate bulkhead, instead of
sharing a single bulkhead? Is it because this car is a
rebuild?
Note that this car was built - and probably converted to a three
compartment car - before the 1917 tank car specs. were adopted by the
ARA. The intermediate rivet courses were in exactly the same
location as they were on the original single dome tank, so the easy
way to convert the car would have been to fit single diaphragms
between the compartments at the point where the tank and bottom sheet
were already drilled for rivets. Later conversions done in the 1920s
and '30s had two diaphragms between each compartment with a small air
space in between, as required by the more rigorous 1917 specs.

Richard Hendrickson


Re: Wine Tank Cars

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Oct 26, 2009, at 9:04 PM, soolinehistory wrote:

Richard,

Want to hazard a guess if it's a 6, 8, or 10,000 gallon car? If
it's a 6,000 gal, it would be an interesting conversion for the
Blackstone Models frameless NG car that has supposedly been
announced. From the look of the side bearings, it doesn't appear
to be a 10,000 gal car; photos show those bolster / saddle castings
to have differently shaped side bearing extensions.
No guesswork necessary. It was definitely a 6,500 gal. Type V (the
smallest of both the Type V and Type X cars were 6,500 gal., not
6,000 gal.). The internal diaphragms were even riveted into the tank
at exactly the same place as the original rivet courses for the three
section tank, so it would be a pretty easy conversion. How many such
cars there were is another question, however. Certainly not many.
I've never seen an in-service photo of one, though I do have one
photo of a Type X converted to a two compartment car (with domes the
same size but one compartment larger than the other).

By the way, when we were both talking to Bill McKown about doing
Van Dyke cars in brass, did you ever get a set (2) of my photos of
the one used as a storage tank at an oil jobber? I now can't seem
to locate the originals, and would sure like to have scans, if you
have the images.
Sorry, I don't have these, so I can't help.

Richard Hendrickson


Re: Wine Tank Cars

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Oct 26, 2009, at 8:59 PM, Tim O'Connor wrote:

The majority of 3-dome tank car photos I have show two
rivet seams between each pair of domes where the interior
bulkheads are attached -- Yet a couple of them show (like
this car) only a single rivet seam. Wouldn't each of the
compartments require a separate bulkhead, instead of
sharing a single bulkhead? Is it because this car is a
rebuild?
Note that this car was built - and probably converted to a three
compartment car - before the 1917 tank car specs. were adopted by the
ARA. The intermediate rivet courses were in exactly the same
location as they were on the original single dome tank, so the easy
way to convert the car would have been to fit single diaphragms
between the compartments at the point where the tank and bottom sheet
were already drilled for rivets. Later conversions done in the 1920s
and '30s had two diaphragms between each compartment with a small air
space in between, as required by the more rigorous 1917 specs.

Richard Hendrickson


Re: Missing links

lrkdbn
 

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, richtownsend@... wrote:


1. I'll echo Tony's call for the enterprise GS gon.

2. Multi-dome tank cars. AC&F, others?

3. High-walkway AC&F tank cars. I'll be happy with single dome; others may want more.

With these, in plastic, I would be happy.

Richard Townsend
Lincoln City, Oregon

I'd add to these the NYC USRA steel boxcar/automobile car family of the 20's-these were as common as PRR X-29's up until the 1960's-and please, NOT FROM CHINA!!!
LR King









Re: missing links

lrkdbn
 

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "ed_mines" <ed_mines@...> wrote:

Considering all the resin cars we have of this type this may not rock our worlds but I think a 1920's built single sheathed Pratt truss box car would go over big with most steam era model railroaders who like something different.

classic SAL cars, B&M, L&N, SP .........

Look at Funaro and Camerlengo's web site-they just came out with the L&N
car.
LR King


Re: Proto 2000 8K tanks cars - are arch bars possible?

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Oct 26, 2009, at 6:06 PM, Brian J Carlson wrote:

One additional point, the SUN OILS car on page 101 of Kaminski's
book is a
10k car (should have noted that) The reporting marks are DR&U RR,
Delaware
River and Union RR built 1923. I have no idea how long the DR&U
reporting
marks lasted.
At least through mid-1926, but changed to SUNX by 3/28.


Richard Hendrickson


Re: Re Ventilated Boxcars

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Bill McCoywrote:
A friend of mine was a clerk for the RF&P in the tower at Potomac Yard. Droves of empty vent boxes came back south returing to the SAL and ACL at Richmond and were humped into the classification bowl. Jim noticed huge black clouds would come up when additional cars were humped into tracks with vent empties already in them.

A clerk was sent to investigate and discovered they were clouds of fruit flies feasting on the broken and bad mellons left in the cars. They would fly up with each hard coupling.
This fits exactly with what retired PFE people told me in interviews for the PFE book: the receivers of produce typically left all the spoiled or unsold produce right in the car, and even threw in the trash lying around on the platform, such as rotten fruit of a kind not even in the original cargo, along with dunnage, broken boxes, paper, etc. Obviously it was efficient trash service for them, as a switch crew would come soon and take it all away!
Cleaning returning empties was therefore an important job with reefers.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re Ventilated Boxcars

Bill McCoy
 

A friend of mine was a clerk for the RF&P in the tower at Potomac Yard. Droves of empty vent boxes came back south returing to the SAL and ACL at Richmond and were humped into the classification bowl. Jim noticed huge black clouds would come up when additional cars were humped into tracks with vent empties already in them.

A clerk was sent to investigate and discovered they were clouds of fruit flies feasting on the broken and bad mellons left in the cars. They would fly up with each hard coupling.

I hope no one at BLI reads this since this may be their next action toy.

Bill McCoy
Jax, FL.
at


Re: Skid and Cover Cars

water.kresse@...
 

Remind me next week after Naperville.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Elden J SAD Gatwood" <elden.j.gatwood@usace.army.mil>
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, October 27, 2009 6:58:56 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
Subject: RE: [STMFC] RE: Skid and Cover Cars

Thanks, Al!  I have never seen a pic (or in person) one of those C&O cars,
only the later Evans cars.

Elden Gatwood
 

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
water.kresse@comcast.net
Sent: Monday, October 26, 2009 2:07 PM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [STMFC] RE: Skid and Cover Cars

  



The C&O in the mid-50s converted regular C&O and PM 70-ton gondola cars into
these.  They reference the PRR skid system longitudinal shocks absorber
springs in their experiments.  They even made one with canvass covers.

Al Kresse

----- Original Message -----
From: "Garth G. Groff" <ggg9y@virginia.edu <mailto:ggg9y%40virginia.edu> >
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com <mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, October 26, 2009 11:37:20 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
Subject: Re: [STMFC] RE: Skid and Cover Cars

Gatwood, Elden J SAD wrote:
 
Folks;

As I dig up more and more info on the gons converted to skid & cover
service, I continue to be astounded at why we do not have a model of
these great cars, even in resin form.

As an aside to the great story about how these cars came into being,
these cars were very numerous and important cars on a variety of roads
that includes B&O, NKP, Erie, NYC, PRR, P&WV and others.  They ran all
over the country, and were seen any place there was a user of sheet
steel, like can, appliance and auto manufacturers.

What do we need to do to get some manufacturer interested?

Oh, and if any of you have any info on the cars as run on your
railroad, could you share it with us?

Lastly, it would also be interesting to hear what you know of other
cars on your RRs in other types of steel service, like gons with covers,
and such.

Lets get somebody hooked on doing them!

Thanks!

Elden Gatwood


------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links



 
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Skid and Cover Cars

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Thanks, Al! I have never seen a pic (or in person) one of those C&O cars,
only the later Evans cars.

Elden Gatwood

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
water.kresse@comcast.net
Sent: Monday, October 26, 2009 2:07 PM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [STMFC] RE: Skid and Cover Cars





The C&O in the mid-50s converted regular C&O and PM 70-ton gondola cars into
these. They reference the PRR skid system longitudinal shocks absorber
springs in their experiments. They even made one with canvass covers.

Al Kresse

----- Original Message -----
From: "Garth G. Groff" <ggg9y@virginia.edu <mailto:ggg9y%40virginia.edu> >
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com <mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, October 26, 2009 11:37:20 AM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
Subject: Re: [STMFC] RE: Skid and Cover Cars

Gatwood, Elden J SAD wrote:

Folks;

As I dig up more and more info on the gons converted to skid & cover
service, I continue to be astounded at why we do not have a model of
these great cars, even in resin form.

As an aside to the great story about how these cars came into being,
these cars were very numerous and important cars on a variety of roads
that includes B&O, NKP, Erie, NYC, PRR, P&WV and others. They ran all
over the country, and were seen any place there was a user of sheet
steel, like can, appliance and auto manufacturers.

What do we need to do to get some manufacturer interested?

Oh, and if any of you have any info on the cars as run on your
railroad, could you share it with us?

Lastly, it would also be interesting to hear what you know of other
cars on your RRs in other types of steel service, like gons with covers,
and such.

Lets get somebody hooked on doing them!

Thanks!

Elden Gatwood


------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links




New ART reefer available

asychis@...
 

Hi y'all,

The Amarillo Railroad Museum and the Missouri Pacific Historical Society
are pleased to announce that the third run of ART ice reefers produced for us
by InterMountain will be arriving in the next week. These are the 32000
series ART cars with the lap side horizontal rivet strip.

We've done the 24000 series in the ART herald only scheme, and the 32000
series with Preco fans in the classic ART three herald scheme. These runs
sold out quickly. The 33000 series represents original 24000 cars with
Equipco air circulating fans. These are also in the classic three herald scheme
that was used from 1950 to around 1958 when the colored heralds were
replaced by black outline heralds (probably our next run). However, the scheme
used on these cars lasted well into the 1960s era (albeit on somewhat
weathered cars). We will have six numbers available on assembled cars, and kits
with no numbers but a decal set included to number the cars as you prefer.
Note, that the kits can also represent the 32000 series with no
modification except the number. The Preco and Equipco fans used by ART were not
visible although some 32000 series cars with Preco fans had a circular stencil
noting that the cars were so equipped, or even a circular metal plate in
place of the stencil where cars such as PFE R40-25s had an actual fan pulley
cover.

For prices, and information on ordering, check out the Amarillo Railroad
Museum website (_www.amarillorailmuseum.com_
(http://www.amarillorailmuseum.com/) ). I expect the cars to be announced later this week on the website.
This is an advanced notice,and we'll need time to sort and inventory the
cars. MPHS and ARM members receive a 10% discount.

Thanks,

Jerry Michels
Amarillo Railroad Museum


Re: Missing Links-Resin

al_brown03
 

No ... the V-9 (SAL 28000-29249 and 89000-89899) and V-10 (SAL 79000-79999) ventilators were 36' double-sheathed wood cars. See Goolsby in Lines South, 1st/98, pp 22-25. Sunshine kit 21.23 models 40' steel express vents (SAL 700-754) converted from 1932 ARA box cars in class B-6. See Culotta's '32 ARA book, pp 194-205. The express vents weren't stencilled with a class of their own, and I don't know if they had one. Seaboard was less than manic about re-classifications.

The V-9 and V-10 were different enough from other roads' vents that they would be bears to kit-bash. Resin kits would be most welcome! :-)

Al Brown, Melbourne, Fla.

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, va661midlo@... wrote:


Bill,

The unofficial Sunshine Models list provided by Jim Hayes shows that kit no. 21.23, SAL Express Ventilator A.R.A 1932 boxcar is still available. Would this kit be either the V-9 or the V-10 that you were seeking?

Other resin kits of ventilator boxcars not mentioned in the current thread include the following from Westerfield (I was unable to access that website to determine current availability):

#6301, FEC as delivered 1920, fruit service
#6302, FEC as modernized, sugar service
#70001, ACL as delivered 1921 (Atlantic Coast Dispatch logo)
#7002, ACL as built, 1929 lettering (Atlantic Coast Dispatch logo)
#7004, ACL modernized, 1954 lettering (Atlantic Coast Line logo)
# 7005, ACL rebuilt circa 1936 (Atlantic Coast Dispatch logo)
# 7006, ACL modernized1947 lettering (bottom door rollers)(Atlantic Coast Dispatch logo)

Ken Montero



----- Original Message -----
From: "lnbill" <fgexbill@...>
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, October 26, 2009 1:19:16 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern
Subject: [STMFC] Missing Links-Resin






The talk of Ventilated cars makes me pine for the SAL vents in resin, hopefully both the V-9 and V-10, but even one would be nice.

Bill Welch




[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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