Date   

Re: Freight Car Distribution on smaller RRs

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Feb 6, 2009, at 6:01 AM, devansprr wrote:
--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Brock" <brockm@...> wrote:
What does this do for the MWR car? Well, nothing. The 1953 ORER
shows 100
MWR box cars. For me to have one MWR box car and match the N-G data
base, I
would need 7400 box cars.













So, given the size of your freight car fleet, you could run it maybe
once or twice a year over Sherman Hill without getting raised
eyebrows. Same is true for your Tennessee Central hopper. .But
certainly not in every operating session.



**************************************

...N-G DOES NOT apply to branch lines, or even medium sized lnes that
were not "trunking" the nation's traffic, in part because some (or
many) cars may be in captive service.






My point exactly. My remarks were directed specifically at the issue
of whether an MWR box car was even remotely plausible on Jack
Burgess' Yosemite Valley layout, to which the answer remains a
resounding NO.

For what it's worth, I have a model of an MWR box car which, when
built, I will include VERY occasionally in one of the trains on my
diorama representing the Santa Fe main line in Southern Calif. in
1947. Odd-ball cars did turn up occasionally on main line trunk
railroads, so there's nothing wrong with modeling them if you don't
overdo it. But it is very easy to overdo it, and the temptation to
overdo it seems almost irresistible to some modelers who are
fascinated by the obscure.


Richard Hendrickson


Re: Freight Car Distribution on smaller RRs

Tim O'Connor
 

Mike, your sample of 18 trains represents what... about
0.1% (or 1/1000) of the total freight trains passing over
Sherman Hill in 1956?

I'm sorry, but statistical analysis applies equally to
trains as to cars. Your sample is simply TOO SMALL to
have any statistical significance.

The hypothesis of 'random distribution' of foreign cars
on major main lines, subject to local variances, is not
ultimately 'proveable' by any scientific method. But it
is not inconsistent with known prototype practices of
the time, as well as a wealth of anecdotal evidence and
prototype studies and reports regarding car supply and
traffic and interchange data. There is also a wealth of
contrary data, especially of the anecdotal variety or
limited samples of conductor records.

As many have noted, as modelers with layouts, we can
create a traffic model for our operations (origins &
destinations & volumes) and simply let the (car) cards
fall where they may. Known examples of car assignments,
prototype train schedules, etc, can skew our layouts'
mix in any direction it takes us. There will NEVER BE
A SCIENTIFIC PROOF of any of this. It is POINTLESS for
us as modelers to question other modelers' preferences.

What we can do perhaps is answer specific questions
about specific prototype operations, traffic, etc at
specific places at specific times. What people choose
to do with that information is almost as random as the
car distribution model we're talking about.

I'll give you an example. I gave someone on this list a
prototypically correct kit the other day, and even went
so far as to identify EXACTLY the prototype class, and
paint scheme, car number, details, etc. That person then
built the kit and painted it INCORRECTLY because they
chose not to believe the information I had given them.
(I had also given them a correct set of hard to find
decals for the car.)

The example I think speaks volumes about our hobby!
People like Jack Burgess are indeed RARE -- someone
who truly models a prototype as faithfully as humanly
possible. The rest of us are pretty much doing what we
feel like doing, rationalizing the results, and calling
it prototype modeling. I'm not knocking it, I just think
it is what it is.

Tim O'Connor


Mike Brock wrote

Right. I could simply strongly over weight the number of SP box cars in
order to be able to generate X4005. Also, the other data shows a much
greater representation of SP box cars so it would not be a problem. The 1956
box car data [ 18 trains ] shows:

UP: 157
PRR: 48
NYC: 45
SP: 43
Milw: 22
CNW: 17
GN: 17
SR: 13
B&O:13
NP: 13
ATSF:11


Re: AMB Wheels Masks

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Feb 6, 2009, at 10:34 AM, Tim O'Connor wrote:
Those AMB wheel masks look great. Modeler's Choice makes
less expensive masks that let you paint 8 at a time. Or
buy 5 sets for the price of 2 AMB sets and paint 40 at a
time instead of 8. (I only say this because generally it
is best to let the wheels dry before removing them from
the mask.)

Most steam era wheel faces were caked with oil or dirt+oil.










Tim makes a most important point here, especially since the photos on
the AMB website show the wheels in their jig painted a uniform rust
color. Okay for wheels in roller bearing trucks, but definitely NOT
okay on steam era freight cars with solid bearings. Oil leaking past
the primitive seals at the back of the journal boxes ran out onto the
wheel faces, which distributed it all over the underside of the car
and, in stripes, up the ends of adjacent cars. The oil, of course,
collected grime, with the result that the wheel faces were a dirty
dark gray. Wheel backs and axles, on the other hand were a dirty
rust color. Though there is an abundance of photographic evidence
for this, I repeatedly see models of steam era freight cars at RPM
meets or in photos with rusty wheels, though I suppose that's better
than shiny metal wheels popped into the trucks just as they come out
of the box.


Richard Hendrickson


Re: MKT SS box cars

ed_mines
 

Thanks to all who answered.

My interest was to justify a BCR car just after WWII. The yellow cars
stand out too much.

But if Richard Hendrickson has a photo of a car painted BCR in the
early '40s, then I guess BCR is OK.

Ed Mines

...trying to rewrite railroad history to suit my own tastes.....


Re: AMB Wheels Masks

Tim O'Connor
 

Those AMB wheel masks look great. Modeler's Choice makes
less expensive masks that let you paint 8 at a time. Or
buy 5 sets for the price of 2 AMB sets and paint 40 at a
time instead of 8. (I only say this because generally it
is best to let the wheels dry before removing them from
the mask.)

Most steam era wheel faces were caked with oil or dirt+oil.

http://www.modelerschoice.com/masks.htm

Tim

At 2/6/2009 10:51 AM Friday, you wrote:
I never could get over the use of masks, use of masking tape, etc. I
kept a couple pair of "shop" trucks, put the wheelsets in them and
painted. A pipe cleaner dipped in thinner done immediately cleaned the
treads. It usually even left a thin edge of the weathering on the outer
edge of the tread.

Jerry Glow

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "itc_725" <emfour@...> wrote:

Finally - a durable, cleanable (acrylic AND solvent-based paints),
flexible wheel mask with a built-in handle. Might not be able to paint
more than four wheelsets at a time, but with the ease of
loading/unloading, one should be able to paint just as many in the
same amount of time as using other, more unwieldy masks. Having less
mask material in the way of the airbrush stream is also a big plus.

http://www.rgspemkt.com/WheelMask.html

Mike Fortney

Disclaimer: Yeah, I'll confess to being one of the culprits nagging
AMB for years to produce this!


Re: Mainline Modeler back issues

rdietrichson
 

Claus,
Check with Railpub.
Rick Dietrichson

----- Original Message -----
From: Claus Schlund (HGM)
To: STMFC
Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2009 8:00 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Mainline Modeler back issues


Hi,

I believe Mainline Modeler went belly-up soem time back.

Does anyone know if there is some good source of back issues of this magazine?

I'm trying to locate a copy of the Feb 2005 issue.

Thanks - Claus Schlund


Re: Freight Car Distribution on smaller RRs

Mike Brock <brockm@...>
 

Dave Evans writes:

"One way to use the N-G distribution model is to assess "plausibility"
for the presence of foreign road box cars on your layout. Needing one
train with 15 SP box cars doesn't instantly drive you into a huge box
car fleet."

Right. I could simply strongly over weight the number of SP box cars in order to be able to generate X4005. Also, the other data shows a much greater representation of SP box cars so it would not be a problem. The 1956 box car data [ 18 trains ] shows:

UP: 157
PRR: 48
NYC: 45
SP: 43
Milw: 22
CNW: 17
GN: 17
SR: 13
B&O:13
NP: 13
ATSF:11

Note the much higher % of SP box cars compared to Pennsy and NYC. Both Pennsy and NYC cars should be double that of SP if the G-N theory holds. BTW, the '49 data supports this relation between SP, PY, and NYC.

"But unless the train ran several times a day, it makes a
strong case for letting the X4005 train stay in staging some days, and
perhaps fiddling the other box cars in that train. If you want to
emulate N-G, then I would simply segregate the SP cars dedicated to
this train from the rest of your fleet balance targets. So now you
need 15 SP cars for X4005, and 100 for the rest of your trains to
maintain N-G."

Which is exactly what I do. Great minds....

"To my thinking, the intent of N-G is make a model railroad visit more
like a stop along the prototype's track. If you randomly stoped along
sherman hill in your era for 3 hours (more if you run a fast clock),
would you expect to see X4005 every visit? IF yes - run it every session."

Possibly...but it wouldn't look the same.

"As for the MWR car, same concept, how may 3 hour visits to sherman
hill before you spot it? One, ten, one hundred?"

Well...each visit would for our purposes see 8 trains...about 240 box cars. If randomly distributed, in each group of 7400 box cars I would expect to see one MWR car. That would be 247 frt trains. IOW, I could expect to have to do 31 visits to expect to see one MWR car. UP, however, is moving 35 frt trains in one day, 1050 box cars, and the MWR car should appear once in each 7400 or once each 7 days [ the shortened time span from 10 to 7 is due to an increase in 1953 to 100 MWR cars from 75 ]. So, while a bum sitting beside the tracks might see an MWR car every 7 days [ and wonder what the heck it is doing there ], our illustrious frt car evaluation team, being whimps and only checking during a 3 hour time period, would expect to observe for 31 days to see what the bum saw in 7. Makes you wonder who should be in charge...

"Stats would suggest it
would be pretty infrequent."

Yep. And if you dozed off...

"Same for the Ann Arbor, D&H and other
small roads (although they would appear much more often than the MWR,
but certainly these roads would not be seen every visit)."

D&H? 2963 cars. In every group of 7400 box cars, 30 D&H cars, 185 trains, 23 visits....To fit the N-G theory I would need about 2 cars if I had a 500 box car population. In my current population....8 trains, about 100 box cars...alas...I could only have a fifth of 2 cars...perhaps everything but the trucks.

"My lessons learned from this thread are:

1) N-G should apply to mainline trunk routes where the nation's
traffic is traversing a layout."

I agree if one applies the "Close Association SP Syndrome" fudge factor.

"6) Having cars from small roads is perfectly acceptable - but they
should be fiddled in - it could be on a dice roll, or more analytic.
It seems that having an extra 30-60 box cars from smaller lines (and
some of these may be well known lines for a smaller fleet), is all
that is required to provide some sense of "randomness" to trains
entering the layout from staging."

I agree.

"I think the concept has some very positive merit. The good news is
that having 50% of your fleet from the 11 major roads is probably
pretty easy to accomplish, unless your fleet is primarily resin, in
which case I think you can do whatever you want ;-)"

"The interesting finding is that because 50% of the boxcar fleet was in
11 roads, the "fiddle" pools do not need to be huge - 30-60 cars
depending on the size of the layout and the length of the PP's memory
(don't let them collect on-layout wheel reports!) And it is quite
reasonable to run that MWR car once every few sessions. Just don't put
it in a string of D&H, B&M, D&LW, AA, and RDG box cars, or no one may
notice it!"

Yep.

Mike Brock


Re: Mainline Modeler back issues

S. Busch
 

Claus,

For your Feb. 2005 Mainline Modeler, you might want to contact Railroad Treasures / Stevens Railroad History in Talbot, Tennesee, at 1-877-694-8366. They have many RR magazine back issues for sale.

http://www.railroadtreasures.com/

Regards,
Steve Busch


Re: Roster of 40' riveted 12 panel AAR box cars

Roland Levin
 

Hi Earl



I don’t know if you have seen this page with info about DRGW box cars. I
think you can fill in some of the gaps in your list.



http://www.drgw.org/data/freight/1960/boxcars.htm





Roland Levin

Vällingby, Sweden

hem.bredband.net/drgw







Från: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] För Earl Tuson
Skickat: den 6 februari 2009 15:41
Till: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Ämne: [STMFC] Roster of 40' riveted 12 panel AAR box cars



I have uploaded a preliminary roster of 40' riveted 12 panel AAR box cars to
the groups files area. I am not sure if this has been compiled elsewhere
previously. If you have a moment, please review this and offer any additions
and corrections you may have. My data on the D&RGW and DL&W cars is a bit
sketchy in particular. It is titled 12PANELAAR.pdf. Thank you for your
assistance,

Earl Tuson_._,___



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Freight Car Distribution on smaller RRs - Calif. Zinc Ore

Jack Burgess
 

Tim wrote:
Very interesting! So now the question is did those
gondolas travel the ATSF-WP-GN inside gateway route
to Great Falls, or SP-UP-MILW? :-)
That's easy...the switch lists show that, after weighing, the loaded cars
were taken to the SP interchange...

Jack Burgess
www.yosemitevalleyrr.com


Re: AMB Wheels Masks

jerryglow2
 

I never could get over the use of masks, use of masking tape, etc. I
kept a couple pair of "shop" trucks, put the wheelsets in them and
painted. A pipe cleaner dipped in thinner done immediately cleaned the
treads. It usually even left a thin edge of the weathering on the outer
edge of the tread.

Jerry Glow

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "itc_725" <emfour@...> wrote:

Finally - a durable, cleanable (acrylic AND solvent-based paints),
flexible wheel mask with a built-in handle. Might not be able to paint
more than four wheelsets at a time, but with the ease of
loading/unloading, one should be able to paint just as many in the
same amount of time as using other, more unwieldy masks. Having less
mask material in the way of the airbrush stream is also a big plus.

http://www.rgspemkt.com/WheelMask.html

Mike Fortney

Disclaimer: Yeah, I'll confess to being one of the culprits nagging
AMB for years to produce this!


Stan's reefers

Clark Propst <cepropst@...>
 

Stan Rydarowicz has several reefer kits for sale. His latest are two NWX reefers. One rebuilt with wood sides in 1953 and the other with steel sides rebuilt in 1955. Anyone interested in this two kits please contact me off list at:
cepropst@netconx.net
Clark Propst
Mason City Iowa


Roster of 40' riveted 12 panel AAR box cars

Earl Tuson
 

I have uploaded a preliminary roster of 40' riveted 12 panel AAR box cars to the groups files area. I am not sure if this has been compiled elsewhere previously. If you have a moment, please review this and offer any additions and corrections you may have. My data on the D&RGW and DL&W cars is a bit sketchy in particular. It is titled 12PANELAAR.pdf. Thank you for your assistance,

Earl Tuson


Re: Mainline Modeler back issues

Andy Sperandeo <asperandeo@...>
 

Hi Claus,

Try railpub.com. Railpub is a used book and magazine dealer specializing in railroad and model railroad titles.

So long,

Andy

Andy Sperandeo
Executive Editor
Model Railroader magazine
asperandeo@mrmag.com
262-796-8776, ext. 461
FAX 262-796-1142


AMB Wheels Masks

Mike Fortney
 

Finally - a durable, cleanable (acrylic AND solvent-based paints),
flexible wheel mask with a built-in handle. Might not be able to paint
more than four wheelsets at a time, but with the ease of
loading/unloading, one should be able to paint just as many in the
same amount of time as using other, more unwieldy masks. Having less
mask material in the way of the airbrush stream is also a big plus.

http://www.rgspemkt.com/WheelMask.html

Mike Fortney

Disclaimer: Yeah, I'll confess to being one of the culprits nagging
AMB for years to produce this!


Re: Freight Car Distribution on smaller RRs

devansprr
 

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Mike Brock" <brockm@...> wrote:


Consider: I model only a tiny part of Sherman Hill and only about 3
hrs of
traffic during one op session. 8 frt trains in all. I compress both the
layout and the frt trains...from 75 to 30 cars. About 100 box
cars....or 12
per train if they were applied equally which they were not. Using
the % of
the entire box car fleet, I should have 4 SP box cars. However, in
order to
model the infamous X4005 train with its 36 SP box cars...very close
to 50%
of the known train...I would need 15 SP box cars [ 50% of a 30 car
train ].
To do that and stay within the N-G envelope of 4% of the national
fleet, I
would need 375 box cars. But...I will need more SP box cars to populate
other trains so I'll go with 20 SP box cars. I now need 500 box
cars. The
question then is...how do I apply these 500 box cars to my 8 frt
trains and
their average of 12 per train? In any session the number of box cars
should
be about 100...leaving 400 in their boxes.

What does this do for the MWR car? Well, nothing. The 1953 ORER
shows 100
MWR box cars. For me to have one MWR box car and match the N-G data
base, I
would need 7400 box cars.

Mike Brock
Mike,

One way to use the N-G distribution model is to assess "plausibility"
for the presence of foreign road box cars on your layout. Needing one
train with 15 SP box cars doesn't instantly drive you into a huge box
car fleet. But unless the train ran several times a day, it makes a
strong case for letting the X4005 train stay in staging some days, and
perhaps fiddling the other box cars in that train. If you want to
emulate N-G, then I would simply segregate the SP cars dedicated to
this train from the rest of your fleet balance targets. So now you
need 15 SP cars for X4005, and 100 for the rest of your trains to
maintain N-G.

To my thinking, the intent of N-G is make a model railroad visit more
like a stop along the prototype's track. If you randomly stoped along
sherman hill in your era for 3 hours (more if you run a fast clock),
would you expect to see X4005 every visit? IF yes - run it every session.

As for the MWR car, same concept, how may 3 hour visits to sherman
hill before you spot it? One, ten, one hundred? Stats would suggest it
would be pretty infrequent. Same for the Ann Arbor, D&H and other
small roads (although they would appear much more often than the MWR,
but certainly these roads would not be seen every visit).

My lessons learned from this thread are:

1) N-G should apply to mainline trunk routes where the nation's
traffic is traversing a layout.

2) N-G applies to general merchandise deliveries from staging to
almost any industry where captive cars were not used, for most layouts
that received traffic from around the country.

3) It is very doubtful that N-G applies to empties delivered to small
branch lines by a larger road. When/where MTs were in surplus the
large road might send what would take them the longest to get rid of.

4) N-G may apply to MT box cars passing across a layout. It is
doubtful, depending on the era and location, that it would apply to
MTs arriving from staging for use at a specific on-layout yard that
was collecting MT's for distribution.

5) It DOES NOT apply to branch lines, or even medium sized lnes that
were not "trunking" the nation's traffic, in part because some (or
many) cars may be in captive service.

6) Having cars from small roads is perfectly acceptable - but they
should be fiddled in - it could be on a dice roll, or more analytic.
It seems that having an extra 30-60 box cars from smaller lines (and
some of these may be well known lines for a smaller fleet), is all
that is required to provide some sense of "randomness" to trains
entering the layout from staging.

7) It may be worth creating three pools - one of the dominant road's
cars, where nearly all are used all the time (assuming the layout can
handle your collection), one from lines that appear less then every
session, but were numerous. Depending on the extent of your
collection, 20-50% of these cars would be fiddled in each session. The
third pool would be the rarities (e.g. MWR on your UP mainline). If
you had 20 of these cars, you might randomly draw two per op session.

We need to ponder if some of the "attraction" to the rare car is, in
fact, because they were spotted so rarely on the prototype. I would
guess that when 50% of the WWII fleet was owned by 11 roads, spotting
the rare car would be a memorable event. But if you rail-fanned
sherman hill, based on your conductors reports, and saw 8 trains go
by, just how many of the cars would be from fleets smaller than say
the 20th road (C&O)? N-G would suggest that 25% of the cars would be
from these "smaller" lines (SOO, WAB, Erie, N&W, SAL, PM, GTW, RDG,
ACL, SAL, NYNH, DL&W, and over 100 others) Yet the 12 lines listed
have 100 times as many box cars as MWR.

I think the concept has some very positive merit. The good news is
that having 50% of your fleet from the 11 major roads is probably
pretty easy to accomplish, unless your fleet is primarily resin, in
which case I think you can do whatever you want ;-)

And it would not take a large fleet of cars from smaller roads to
create a "prototypical" sense of the occasional rare car passing
through your layout.

The one down side to this is that you need to be able to fiddle your
trains in staging so you can provide a prototypical sense of
"randomness" (I hate to breach the subject of rare car classes and how
often they should appear... Nevermind.)

The interesting finding is that because 50% of the boxcar fleet was in
11 roads, the "fiddle" pools do not need to be huge - 30-60 cars
depending on the size of the layout and the length of the PP's memory
(don't let them collect on-layout wheel reports!) And it is quite
reasonable to run that MWR car once every few sessions. Just don't put
it in a string of D&H, B&M, D&LW, AA, and RDG box cars, or no one may
notice it!

Dave Evans


Re: Freight Car Distribution on smaller RRs - Calif. Zinc Ore

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Dave Nelson wrote (answering Tim's question):
Very interesting! So now the question is did those gondolas travel the ATSF-WP-GN inside gateway route to Great Falls, or SP-UP-MILW?
Either Richard or Tony might be able to find the answer as they have the GN:WP exchange books that cover several periods of time.
Yes, we have books for one month out of each of two years, 1947 and 1952 (if memory serves). But note that this is AFTER the zinc mine shut down, so any of the zinc traffic would be pretty unlikely to be in those books.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Freight Car Distribution on smaller RRs - Calif. Zinc Ore

Dave Nelson
 

Tim O'Connor wrote:
Steve

Very interesting! So now the question is did those gondolas travel
the ATSF-WP-GN inside gateway route to Great Falls, or SP-UP-MILW?
:-)

Tim O'Connor
Either Richard or Tony might be able to find the answer as they have the
GN:WP exchange books that cover several periods of time.

Dave Nelson


Re: Freight Car Distribution on smaller RRs

Dave Nelson
 

Mike Brock wrote:

Yes. Modeling the UP on Sherman Hill over a three hour time period
with its 35 frt trains doesn't match well with, for example, a yr's
worth of data.
I have never said a year long sample was required. I have always suggested
that a minimum of 1000 foreign road boxcars be counted and always felt more
comfortable w/ something closer to 1500. On some secondary line, seeing
1000 foreign road boxcars might take a rather long time, tho I still think a
year is way too long. On Sherman Hill, I suspect 1000 foreign road cars
would be seen in days.

Moving on, Mike, you continue to toss out the argument that since your data
has 1 train w/ a large number of SP boxcars in it that the distribution
hyposthesis isn't very useful. I have countered numerous times that 1) one
train does not make a sample and 2) the distribution hypothesis has nothing
whatsoever to say about the composition of a single train. I will fall
back, once again, on my Yoplait Yogurt in the shopping car example: I do not
purchase Yoplait at regular prices (tho my daughter may slip in one or two
when I'm not looking); However when they are half off I but a whole lot of
them. The composition of my carts therefore varies considerably when
examined individually but the average number of yoplaits I buy over numerous
trips is probably pretty constant over time if enough trips are recorded and
analyzed.

What does this do for the MWR car? Well, nothing. The 1953 ORER shows 100
MWR box cars. For me to have one MWR box car
and match the N-G data base, I would need 7400 box cars. Anyone think I'll
make it? Incidentally, using the 500 box car data base, I
could not use a box car if a RR had less than 1480 box cars. Whew. SP&S
barely makes it in. Tucson, Cornelia, and Gila Bend with
their 3 cars missed the cut along with the Montana, Wyoming &
Southern...which might be over represented due to their close proximity
to the UP except for the fact that they had no box cars.
That is all correct. Which is why Hendrickson was hyperventilating earlier
today about absurdites. Fortunately, yours is a hobby, not a job, so if you
want to enjoy a MWR car, go ahead. Just keep it out of sight when Richard
visits. 8-) Or leave it over on the shelf in a nice display, where it
probably belongs all of the time.

Let me return to discuss a point I mentioned earlier today, which is,
really, which hobby: The problems most often raised on this subject are the
problems of (physical) model railroads, not of the distribution hypothesis
itself (that does have objections but they're mentioned less often). I
operate a (virtual) model railroad and can have many hundreds of 60, 70, 80
car consists composed, in total, of thousands of individual cars. My
constraint is the limited availablity of models, not the number of them (and
certainly not the cost... As they are all free), and that makes for a very
big difference in the utility of the distribution hypothesis.

Dave Nelson


Re: MKT SS box cars

Gene Deimling <losgatos48@...>
 

I noticed your comment about MKT single sheathed surviving in Sloan
Yellow into the 1950s. I am working on patterns for this car and
have photos of a fair number of cars taken in the 1960s still in
Yellow. A quick check of the pictures shows 95038,95680 and
96264. In the background of 95038, there appears to be string of
cars in yellow. The photo was taken in Fort Worth around 1969.
I am not disputed the statement that "few if any cars survived in
yellow". It does give photographic proof that cars lasted a long
time in this color scheme.

Gene Deimling

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, Richard Hendrickson <rhendrickson@...>
wrote:

On Feb 3, 2009, at 9:34 AM, ed_mines wrote:

I asked this question before - how common were BC red, SS MKT box
cars
just after WWII?

I saw a 1958-59 NKP video on TV yesterday with an aforementioned
BCR
car.






I have photographic evidence of a yellow car repainted in 6-48 and
a
BCR car repainted in 4-49 (as well as several BCR cars repainted
in
the early '50s). So by the '58-'59 date of the video, few (if
any)
Katy SS box cars would have survived in yellow. And cars started
to
be repainted yellow ca. 1942 - I have a photo of a car repainted
BCR
in 10-41- so some BCR cars doubtless lasted into the early prewar
era, especially considering the deferred maintenance of the war
years.


Richard Hendrickson



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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