Date   

Steam Era Freight Cars Reference Manual Vol. 2: Tank Cars

Ted Culotta <tculotta@...>
 

I have added this new book to the web site. If you have the first
volume on box and auto cars, this is more of the same, but tank
cars. 160+ pages and $35. Here's the link:

http://www.speedwitch.com/Books.htm

Regards,
Ted Culotta

Speedwitch Media
645 Tanner Marsh Road
Guilford, CT 06437
(203) 453-6174
info@speedwitch.com


Re: 36' Fowler/Dominion cars and "almosts"...

al_brown03
 

BAR 9000-9699*, 9800-10399
BAR 9838: NEB&W Guide, 96.2 edition, p133
BAR 10045: MRR 3/99 p139 (in "State of Maine" paint!)

NC&StL 16100-16599*, 13500-15099, 15100-16099
NC&StL 15454: "Focus on Freight Cars v 1", p46
NC&StL 15337: "Steam Era Freight Cars Reference Manual v1", p12

CNJ 14000-14499 (drawing seems to suggest it)
CNJ 14087: Kline and Culotta, "Postwar Freight Car Fleet", p27

M&StL 26000-26400
M&StL 26250: RP CYC 4 p5
Double-sheathed car with truss rods.

Ann Arbor 69000-69286
AA 69109: PRM 2 p7. Double sheathed.

B&M 12138-12258, 12301-12392, 64682-68247, 68317, 68333-68390
B&M 65387: Jones, "B&M: Forest River & Mountain", p152
B&M 65815: Nimke, "Rutland v7", p129
Double sheathed.

CIL 2000-3600 (or were these the Monon SU cars?)
CI&L 3516: MM 4/86 p57

More later.

Al Brown, Melbourne, Fla.


Wooden Craftsman Kits

Paul Catapano
 

Tight Bond III glue.

Paul Catapano
Littlerock Subdivision
Atlantic Inland Railway Co.

"All it takes to start an insane asylum
is a big room and the right kind of people"


Re: WOW- New HO rubber freight car brake hoses

Paul Lyons
 

Andy and List,

When?I first saw them at the NMRA National show several months ago, I was also "brown away". However, after experimenting with them for the last two weeks, I have to say there?are some issues. The big issue is their attachment. There is a "pin" that is part of the moulding that I am assuming is for their attachment to the underframe. I have not spoken to Jimmy about this because I am?traveling?as usual, and again out of the country, but the "pin" has some benefits and some problems. The?"pin" is located?very close to the angle cock and thus when mounted the projection of the hose?from the end is no where near prototypical.?Great for operations, but?leaving a lot to be desired for prototypical looks.?However, I have one car completed this way and it looks pretty good. What I am presently trying to?do is "marry" these hoses with the "new"?PSC bracket casting?and then I think we might at last have the FINAL answer to an age old problem. The problem with trying to mount the hose to the bracket is that the "pin" is now in the way. I am in the process of trimimng the "pin" down to a size where it will pop through the hole in the bracket, but not be able to back itself out----sort of like the way Kadee attaches parts on their PS-1. It am also trying all kinds of adheasives to see what will work will real rubber. Any thoughts here woud be greatly appreicated. On the completed car I used Cool Chem to mount the noses and that seems to have worked fine, but it is one of my least favorite glues.?I am?yet to paint them?to see if they will "hold" paint-I have my doubts.

In closing, these are a far better idea than plastic or brass air hose if we can make them work. Please buy some, the more folks working on the issues the better.

Paul Lyons
Laguna Niguel, CA

-----Original Message-----
From: Andy Carlson <midcentury@sbcglobal.net>
To: Steam Era <stmfc@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tue, 4 Nov 2008 10:14 am
Subject: [STMFC] WOW- New HO rubber freight car brake hoses






I have come away from this year's Naperville gathering with a great discovery. Jim Booth, who attended this year's gathering, blew me away with his injected molded extremely flexable freight car brake hoses. He is selling a package of 6 pairs (enough for 6 cars) for a retail of $4.95. The glad hands and angle cocks are integrally molded with the hoses. According to Jim, they take paint well.

These hoses can be viewed at Jim's web site www.hitechdetails.com and can be ordered through his web shopping cart. Those who like discounted prices can wait a few days longer for my large stock to arrive.

I can be contacted off-list at <midcentury@sbcglobal.net>

-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA


Re: AAR Interchange dates

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Guy Wilber wrote:
There was no date within the scope of this list that required owners to replace wood running boards other than when cars were rebuilt in kind or when an existing wood roof was replaced my a metal roof. Tank cars were under the same stipulation. When rebuilt or a complete new underframe was applied the running boards were to be changed to AAR approved metal or aluminum.
I photographed tank cars in the late 1980s with wood running boards, which fits with Guy's facts.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: 36' Fowler/Dominion cars and "almosts"...

destron@...
 

Thanks to everyone for the replies.

Does anyone know of photos of the Roberval-Saguenay, Quebec Rly Light &
Power, DW&P and Sydney & Louisburg cars? Also, whether they were Fowlers
or not, I'd be interested in locating photos of the Wyandotte Terminal
cars in the list.

Charlie, what number series were the SM18s? If they're that close to the
CN Fowler stock cars, I think there could be a model there.

Frank Valoczy
Vancouver, BC

I don't know how they fit into the taxonomy of "Fowler" cars, but
comparing the Fowler CN cars with a CB&Q SM18 36' stock car they are very
close structurally and architecturally, varying
only in spacing of slats and placards, door style, etc..
They share the nearly the same steel side truss arrangement and have
almost identical top caps over the end braces. The Q cars may just have
these similarities by accident,
(they were built on underframes salvaged from early steel GS bottom dump
gons) as the SM18s look like they evolved from earlier classes of
composite and wood cars.... but the Fowlers look to me closer in
appearance than other road's stock cars overall.
Charlie Vlk




------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links




!DSPAM:1291,4910952289282037018051!

Frank Valoczy
Vancouver, BC


Re: 36' Fowler/Dominion cars and "almosts"...

Charlie Vlk
 

I don't know how they fit into the taxonomy of "Fowler" cars, but comparing the Fowler CN cars with a CB&Q SM18 36' stock car they are very close structurally and architecturally, varying
only in spacing of slats and placards, door style, etc..
They share the nearly the same steel side truss arrangement and have almost identical top caps over the end braces. The Q cars may just have these similarities by accident,
(they were built on underframes salvaged from early steel GS bottom dump gons) as the SM18s look like they evolved from earlier classes of composite and wood cars.... but the Fowlers look to me closer in appearance than other road's stock cars overall.
Charlie Vlk


WOW- New HO rubber freight car brake hoses

Andy Carlson
 

I have come away from this year's Naperville gathering with a great discovery. Jim Booth, who attended this year's gathering, blew me away with his injected molded extremely flexable freight car brake hoses. He is selling a package of 6 pairs (enough for 6 cars) for a retail of $4.95. The glad hands and angle cocks are integrally molded with the hoses. According to Jim, they take paint well.

These hoses can be viewed at Jim's web site www.hitechdetails.com and can be ordered through his web shopping cart. Those who like discounted prices can wait a few days longer for my large stock to arrive.

I can be contacted off-list at <midcentury@sbcglobal.net>

-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA


Re: Wooden Craftsman Kits

Denny Anspach <danspach@...>
 

I have long savored the satisfaction of building refined wood car kits (Ambroid, Northeastern, Weaver, Suncoast, etc.), and the very best glue to use these days is white glue, either the fancy kind such as Canopy Cement or Microscale MicroClear, or the cheapest kind such as Elmer's or a clone. These glues are forgiving, hold up very well, and are easily cleaned up with water alone. The latter is a special advantage inasmuch as the slower set up allows the builder to completely clean/soak up spills or squeeze-outs with damp or wet Q- tips, pipe cleaners, etc.

All the white glues are "water-resistant". What this means is that ultimately the set-up glue will always be water soluble, but it will always take some time to be so- a circumstance that in practicality makes this feature a moot issue in the building of wood kits that will not ordinarily be immersed in water, or will not be residing in a Turkish bath.

To avoid allowing glue (any kind) spills or squeeze outs from soaking into the wood before they can be sponged away, all the wood should be first sealed, most easily with a very fine sanding sealer (still available at R-C hobby sources= "Hot Fuel Proof"). Such sealers are essentially clear lacquer loaded with pumice or talc. If this very important preliminary step is performed, the kit builder has a clear road ahead in creating extremely clean and sharp glue joints free of glue, or glue effects outside the joint itself.

Of course, this preliminary sealing of all the wood is also what ultimately will make the difference between a model that can be quite outstanding, versus one that can be beautifully built, but which will never be able to be satisfactorily painted.

I also have models built years ago with Ambroid cement. This holds up well, but most models built with it are spoiled because the glue was so difficult to clean up, AND the glue soaked right in to wood that was never sealed. I have salvaged one model by soaking it in an acetone bath, which quite effectively "re-kitted" the completed model.

Denny
Denny S. Anspach MD
Sacramento


Re: is this another new 70 ton truck?

Brian Leppert <b.leppert@...>
 

I think it is. However, ore cars typically have five foot wheel base trucks, instead of the normal 5'-8" for a 70 ton truck. 70 ton features on a short w.b. gives the proportions of a truck on steroids.

InterMountain's new truck under their new 2 bay covered hopper represents a 70 ton Barber S-2 with spring plank.

Brian Leppert
Carson City, NV

----- Original Message -----
From: "Tim O'Connor" <timboconnor@comcast.net>
To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 02, 2008 5:00 PM
Subject: [STMFC] is this another new 70 ton truck?


http://www.walthers.com/exec/productinfo/932-40501

Tim O'Connor


Re: 36' Fowler/Dominion cars and "almosts"...

Michael Aufderheide
 

--- On Tue, 11/4/08, destron@vcn.bc.ca <destron@vcn.bc.ca> wrote:


<CIL 2000-3600 (or were these the Monon SU cars?)The SU cars were different cars, the 8000 series, retired by the end of 1940.  The 36 ft howe truss cars were in three series due to rebuilding:Originally 2000-2899 blt Haskell & Barker 1912-14 (gone by 1942)
3149-3339 rebuilt from 2000 series 1927 (new ends) (gone by 1942)3400-3600 rebuilt from 2000 series  1927 (no reason why on diagram) (gone by 1949)
 Some were also converted to stock cars: 6200-6249.The boxcars are similar to the NC&StL 15100-16099  series (XM-17?)and there has been speculation that the Monon piggybacked an order with them.  The Monon cars are 1" shorter at 8'-0" and have a cu ft of  2482 built in 1912-14.  I don't know what the NC&StL build dates are for comparison.
Regards,Mike Aufderheide





















[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: 36' Fowler/Dominion cars and "almosts"...

Dennis Storzek
 

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, destron@... wrote:

I've been poking around trying to compile a list of 36' "Fowler" cars...
I've gotten to a stage now where I've got a short list of definitely
Fowler/Dominion cars, and a longer list of possibles (of which I'm
sure a
number are actually DS cars, but can't tell that from the ORER info...)

SOO 12800-14298*
Correct.

Now, the others I'm not certain of, but tend to assume so based on
evidence of other Fowler series with the road (or with the parent/close
relative road):
DSS&A 11067-11569
DS wood underframe cars. The South Shore had no single sheathed cars
whatsoever.

SOO 28312+28456, 106600-107908, 108056-109908
28300-28498 (even) 30 ton DS wood automobile cars built by AC&F in 1910

106600-107908 (even) 30 ton DS boxcars built in 1905 - 06 for
Wisconsin Central and renumbered; can't find the builder without the
original WC numbers.

108056-109908 (even) 30 ton DS boxcar built in 1908 - 09 for WC.


Dennis


Re: 36' Fowler/Dominion cars and "almosts"...

rockroll50401 <cepropst@...>
 

M&StL 26000-26400
These were DS cars with TR underframes and at least 3 different ends.
There's a photo of one in an RP Cyc.
Clark Propst


Re: Wooden Craftsman Kits

ed_mines
 

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "lnerj72" <lnerj72@...> asked:
what would be the best glue to use
for the wooden portions?
I liked to use white glue when I first started building wood models 30
years ago but I found that some model railroad paints (Floquil)
wouldn't cover the glue joints.

Prior to assembly I now seal wood with diluted Scalecoat sanding sealer
(without stiring in the pigment from the bottom) or diluted Ambroid
cement (MEK as thinner). Usually I sprayed both sides of the wood with
either of the coating solutions; in the beginning the wood will soak it
up like a sponge soaks up water. If you only coat one side it is apt to
curl up.

I like to use Ambroid cement for assembly. Some of the newer ones
mentioned might be as good or even better.

Don't spray car assembled with Ambroid cement with either of the
coatings mentioned above. The MEK will dissolve the glue joints.

Sealing the wood is important. I've seen wood sides shrink enought so
gaps between pieces can easily be seen. I had sides warp from decal
setting solution too.

In additions to the sealents mentioned above I successfully used a
waterborne sealent sold by Floquil, shellac, and a polyurethane wood
sealer - all for sealing wood. Don't mix them though. MEK redissolved
the polyurethane sealent ruining some wood parts.

Ed


Re: 36' Fowler/Dominion cars and "almosts"...

Mark P.
 

Frank,

Here's a photo of Erie 86554 to add to your collection. <http://replica.palni.edu/u?/winona,38> This was taken on the Winona [IN] Railroad in northern Indiana.

Mark Plank

----- Original Message -----


I've been poking around trying to compile a list of 36' "Fowler" cars...
<big snip>
Erie 86000-86999, 93000-93999*
--
Be Yourself @ mail.com!
Choose From 200+ Email Addresses
Get a Free Account at www.mail.com


Re: Wooden Craftsman Kits

Ray Meyer
 

Whatever you use, sealing the wood before painting is absolutely necessary
for long term survival, especially in humid climates. Shellac is my
choice. My experience with sanding sealers is that the car in the end looks
like a plastic or resin car; my use of wood is to avoid that specifically.
[I'm of the "only wood looks like wood" persuasion. Yeah, I know many
others differ.]







--
Atty Raymond G. Meyer
110 E. Main St
Port Washington, WI 53074
262-284-5566
rgmeyer2@gmail.com


36' Fowler/Dominion cars and "almosts"...

destron@...
 

I've been poking around trying to compile a list of 36' "Fowler" cars...
I've gotten to a stage now where I've got a short list of definitely
Fowler/Dominion cars, and a longer list of possibles (of which I'm sure a
number are actually DS cars, but can't tell that from the ORER info...)

For the cars I'm sure are Fowlers or almost-those, the list is (* marks
those I've got photos for):

CN, various series
CP, various series

Algoma Central 3001-3020, 3051-3080
BAR 9000-9699*, 9800-10399
DW&P 400800-401549
Erie 86000-86999, 93000-93999*
Fc. Mexicano 8100-8199*
GTW 417500-420149*, 440300-440627
NC&StL 16100-16599*, 13500-15099, 15100-16099
NdeM 65700-65800*
New York, Susquehanna & Western 1500-1563*
Piedmont & Northern 12000-12074*
Quebec Central 3100-3198*
Quebec Rly, Light & Power 1016-1029, 1100-1109, 1110-1119
Roberval-Saguenay 536-537
SOO 12800-14298*
Sydney & Louisburg 102-115
TEM 80000-80098, 80100-80198, 80200-80398, 80400-80498*
TH&B 3000-3132, 4000-4301*
WM 28002-28003 (ex-Erie)

Now, the others I'm not certain of, but tend to assume so based on
evidence of other Fowler series with the road (or with the parent/close
relative road):

BAR 8100-8599, 8700-8799
CNJ 14000-14499 (drawing seems to suggest it)
CV 70731-71730, 71800-72049
DSS&A 11067-11569
NC&StL 24500-24599
SOO 28312+28456, 106600-107908, 108056-109908
M&StL 26000-26400
WAB 78000-78199 (read about these, are they 36' or 40'?)

And these are the "just guessing" that might well be DS cars or other
unrelated things:

Ala., Tenn. & Northern 15001-15150
Ann Arbor 69000-69286
B&M 12138-12258, 12301-12392, 64682-68247, 68317, 68333-68390
Belt Rly of Chicago 802-850, 852-862
C&EI 37002-37748, 635-699
Canton RR 400-420
CIL 2000-3600 (or were these the Monon SU cars?)
Clinchfield 3300-3833
Delaware & Northern 501-551
Detroit & Mackinac 2751
DMIR 5342-5390
FW&D 4400-5299
GM&O 43000-43299 (or were these SU cars?)
Kentucky & Tennessee 304-306
L&A 1851-1859
L&N 4000-5049, 5350-5549, 5050-5199, 5300-5349, 5550-5999, 6001-6999,
7000-7182, 7300-7499, 9000-9799
Lake Superior & Ishpeming 2026
Manistique & Lake Superior 50-52
Manufacturers Junction 1040-1049
Minnesota, Dakota & Western 3004-3005
Mississippi Central 4000-4109
MKTT 170000-170228
MN&S 2501-2510
Montana, Wyoming & Southern 326-569
NdeM 44000-44016, 13503-13515
NdeT 2010-3595
NKP 97000-97999
NYO&W 9201-9907
Reading 2000-3999, 14500-14999, 15700-15999, 17500-18479, 18500-18699
SN 2101-2105, 2249
SPdeM 8304-8820
Tremont & Gulf 476, 666, 674
Wyandotte Terminal 38, 80, 82, 84

Frank Valoczy
Vancouver, BC


Re: Wooden Craftsman Kits

Schuyler Larrabee
 

I have Ambroid kits I built 40 years ago. I used Ambroid's cement without
incident . . . . *snip*

Rich Orr
Well, different strokes for different folks. I detest Ambroid cement.

SGL


Re: Pere Marquette freight cars in N scale

destron@...
 

You'll need 1 - 1 1/2 foot extensions added to the top of the "standard"
car.

Al Kresse
Which "standard" car?

Frank Valoczy
Vancouver, BC


-------------- Original message --------------
From: destron@vcn.bc.ca

First off a question: they aren't in the Revenue Freight cars book, but do
Atlas' 70-ton ore cars in Pere Marquette lettering (#39990A, road #CF1512;
#39991A, road #CF1523) have a prototype?

Beyond that, I've started poking through what's available in N scale to
determine what could be used as basis models for modelling PM freight
cars... here's the list I've made so far. If anyone has tips for others,
or better solutions to the ones I've listed, I'd love to hear it!

13000-13999
14000-14499 - Microtrains twin hopper: The picture on the website is
small, but looks right at a quick inspection.

16000-16099 - Red Caboose USRA flatcar: overall a good basis I think, only
would have to rearrange the stake pockets and the brake staff to make an
accurate model.

17000-17249
17250-17649 - Intermountain USRA drop-bottom gon: I think this will need a
little bit of tweaking, but the general appearance looks right. I picked
one of these kits up today, so will be attempting to build one of these
cars first.

20000-20024
20025-20049
20050-20149 - Deluxe Innovations ACF 2-Bay covered hopper: The pictures on
the website are small, but overall look right enough to use as a basis for
these PM cars

72200-72399 - Intermountain 50' AAR double-door boxcar: this would I think
be a standin at best, judging from the photos of the model (which are
here, too, almost uselessly small on the website, so it may be better than
I think, or conversely worse than I think).

80000-81999 - Atlas USRA double-sheath car: pretty much as-is, I think,
apart from detailing.

82000-83499 - Red Caboose X29 with Dreadnaught ends and Youngstown doors:
the handbrake and roof are wrong, but this is probably fixable. The
dimensions of the X29 and the 82000srs cars are pretty close (in the April
1942 ORER), and appearance-wise, it looks like this model could serve
(with modification) to represent the first PM all-steel boxcars.

83500-83649
83650-83799
83800-83999
84100-84399 - Intermountain 40' 1937 AAR boxcar. With IM's interchangeable
parts, the differences in ends and doors shouldn't be an issue, I don't
think, if they have a 4/5 W end and both 7-panel Superior and 5-7-5
Youngstown doors.

85000-85999
86000-87499 - Atlas USRA double-sheath car: for the single-door versions
the Atlas car could serve as a starting point for a kitbash. The Vulcan
and Hutchins ends would of course have to be scratchbuilt, and steel-door
versions would need the doors changed... even the door-and-a-half versions
could be done, I think, with the Atlas model as a basis. I'm planning to
do several of these over the next while (as I can get my hands on the
models!)

That's it for now, still need to look at available steel gondola models.
If there's one or two available that could serve as basis models, I think
with a bit of effort a good representation of the PM's freight car fleet
can be made in 1:160. :)

Frank Valoczy
Vancouver, BC

Frank Valoczy
Vancouver, BC







------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links




!DSPAM:1291,490f6d2589289238716453!

Frank Valoczy
Vancouver, BC


Re: Wooden Craftsman Kits

Schuyler Larrabee
 

I had a few cars that curled up from decaling water like that. Not much fun trying to reassemble a
car on the fly while also trying to make sure the decals are in the right place and not getting
folded over. The worst one was an Olympia Beer reefer kit (manufacturer long since forgotten). The
decals were bedsheets across the sides, so it took a LOT of water to a) get them off the backer
sheets, and b) float them into position on the sides.

My decal-application techniques have improves a little (!) since then, but I later learned (on the
next car, for instance) that a couple coats of sanding sealer (model aircraft "dope" works really
well) along with some sanding to get a smooth surface seals the wood sufficiently that you don't
have nearly so much chance of having the car sides curl up on you. Just be sure to use the back of
an X-acto knife to clear out the scribing, or it gets full of dust which the next coat of sealer
makes a pretty permanent part of the siding. Don't get too aggressive with the knife and rescribe
everything too deeply - you can split the wood (and how does he know that, I wonder?). Just clean
out the grooves. If it does split, glue some paper to the back side, and seal that, too. I used
400 grit paper at the end of the process, starting with 220 or 320.

This also has a tendency to make the scribing a bit more subtle, which is a good thing, and pretty
much eliminates raised grain issues which can really make a car look like s***.

Seal both sides, before you start assembling anything. Roof and floor, too, but you probably can
skip the end blocks.

Oh, right, the original question was about glue: Elmer's yellow carpenter glue. Sets up fairly
quickly and is VERY strong. Better, IMHO, than white.

SGL

From: Earl T. Hackett

The oldest wooden models I have on the layout are about 30 years old.
I built them with plain old Elmer's White Glue. The stuff holds up
well over the years. However, if you apply decals to an assembled
model, it will come apart. White glue is water soluble. The water
also swells the wood and that doesn't help things either. To avoid
this problem paint and decal the sides or other components before
assembly.

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com <mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com> , "lnerj72" <lnerj72@...> wrote:

Hi Everyone,
A quick question, I am about to start on some wooden
freight car kits from various manufacturers (Pacific Pike, Ambroid,
Juneco, etc) and I was wondering what would be the best glue to use
for the wooden portions?


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