Date   

Re: EARLY LV "wrong way" box

Schuyler Larrabee
 

Unfortunately, no, nor did a good bit of web surfing looking for one succeed.  Sorry.

 

Schuyler

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Eric Hansmann
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2020 5:17 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] EARLY LV "wrong way" box

 

Based upon the car data lettering and lack of full 1911 Safety Appliance Act amendment hardware, this photo is 100+ years old. Was it on the Library of Congress site? If so, it’s public domain.

 

Do you have a link to share?

 

 

Eric Hansmann

Murfreesboro, TN

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Schuyler Larrabee via groups.io
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2020 3:48 PM
To: RealSTMFC@groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] EARLY LV "wrong way" box

 

We’ve recently been advised that more roads than just the Lehigh Valley owned “wrong way” box cars.  This is a snip from a larger photo titled “Buffalo NY 1910 Kellog Company.”  I am not sure just how I got that photo, but I noticed this LV box car on a siding at the very bottom edge of the image.

 

 

The overall photo is interesting, but I am not sure of the permissions to share the entire image.  It shows an active steam pile driver and new concrete silos under construction using slip forms.

 

Schuyler


Re: Dry Ice Refrigerator Car Test

Bill Welch
 

In looking at the grills on WFEX 67564 is probably a Thermo-King equipped car. Truckers were fine with their gas powered T-K's but the RR's did not like them because gas is more flammable. Many outside the FGE/WFE/BRE System would not accept them for interchange and this was probably why the Frigidaire eventually is what they adopted system wide.

Bill Welch


Re: Dry Ice Refrigerator Car Test

lsittler
 

Further in regard to Bill Welch’s comments, attached is builder’s photo from FGE files showing WFE 67564 in which Thermo-King heating and cooling unit was installed. Transmittal memo attached to photo is dated at Alexandria Virginia,  March 12, 1949. Les Sittler
 

From: Bill Welch
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2020 4:25 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Dry Ice Refrigerator Car Test
 
Interesting find Bob. Although the test facility was at FGE, I am pretty certain they did not use A Fruit Growers car. In the years after WWII feeling the pressure from trucks equipped with Thermo-King Mechanical FGE began experimenting with several mechanical and non-mechanical systems in an attempt to find an effective and economical way to transport frozen commodities at Zero and below. One system used Dry Ice. While the system could effectively maintain Zero, the cost was prohibitive and they quickly moved on to alternative technologies.

By 1952 FGE had a small fleet of 40-foot Mechs powered both by Diesel (Frigidaire) and Gasoline (Thermo-King) and a few 50-footers being evaluated. In 1953 the FGE shops at Alexandria began building what would eventually by 1957 number 1,100 All-Temperature 50-ft Mechs for FGE, WFE, and BRE. the largest Mechanical fleet operated by any Refrigerator Car entity at the time. A modern model of these is very desirable i think, but i am prejudiced.

Model on Ya'll
Bill Welch

Virus-free. www.avg.com


Re: C&O MW Tenders

mel perry
 

garth:
were the fuel bunkers converted also?
thanks
mel perry


On Wed, Jun 10, 2020, 1:50 PM Garth Groff and Sally Sanford <mallardlodge1000@...> wrote:
Friends,

Attached are four views of former C&O steam locomotive tenders downgraded to MW service, which makes them "sort-of freight" cars. 

From the photos Bill McClure shared a few weeks back, I gather that most C&O outfit trains included at least one tender. Possibly the size of the tender varied with the size of the train. They probably carried coal for heating and/or cooking stoves until this was switched to natural gas, and likely also carried water for showers. I'm not sure if the water was fit to drink; MW tank cars for this purpose on some roads were marked "potable water". I see no such markings here.

All four cars were located together in Gordonsville, Virginia, around 1985-1986. There was quite a bit of old MW equipment held here at that time for eventual scrapping.

Enjoy the photos. Comments are always welcome.

Next time, Burro cranes.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff  🦆


Attachments:


Re: Tank Car United States Army USAX 16503

mel perry
 

which leads to the question, what were
the rules, as far as train make up goes,
prior to the rule changes, was there a
national standard that each rr followed
or each rr had their own rules/ideas?,
and if there was a prior national
standard what was it?
thanks
mel perry

On Wed, Jun 10, 2020, 2:26 PM Tony Thompson <tony@...> wrote:
mel perry wrote:

i stand corrected, apparently in the 50's
railroader's were expendable, wonder
what changed that thinking? OSHA?

   Not expendable, but expected to use common sense on their own. Occasional failures to do so led to OSHA.

Tony Thompson




Re: Tank Car United States Army USAX 16503

Tony Thompson
 

mel perry wrote:

i stand corrected, apparently in the 50's
railroader's were expendable, wonder
what changed that thinking? OSHA?

   Not expendable, but expected to use common sense on their own. Occasional failures to do so led to OSHA.

Tony Thompson




Re: Tank Car United States Army USAX 16503

mel perry
 

i stand corrected, apparently in the 50's
railroader's were expendable, wonder
what changed that thinking? OSHA?
mel perry


On Wed, Jun 10, 2020, 12:01 PM Tony Thompson <tony@...> wrote:
mel perry wrote:

i believe, in the real world, that's a no-no

  In later years, yes. In the 1950s, no.

Tony Thompson




Re: EARLY LV "wrong way" box

Eric Hansmann
 

Based upon the car data lettering and lack of full 1911 Safety Appliance Act amendment hardware, this photo is 100+ years old. Was it on the Library of Congress site? If so, it’s public domain.

 

Do you have a link to share?

 

 

Eric Hansmann

Murfreesboro, TN

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Schuyler Larrabee via groups.io
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2020 3:48 PM
To: RealSTMFC@groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] EARLY LV "wrong way" box

 

We’ve recently been advised that more roads than just the Lehigh Valley owned “wrong way” box cars.  This is a snip from a larger photo titled “Buffalo NY 1910 Kellog Company.”  I am not sure just how I got that photo, but I noticed this LV box car on a siding at the very bottom edge of the image.

 

 

The overall photo is interesting, but I am not sure of the permissions to share the entire image.  It shows an active steam pile driver and new concrete silos under construction using slip forms.

 

Schuyler


Re: C&O MW Tenders

Jim King
 

Garth … I saw several Vanderbilt tenders (4- and 6-axle) in MOW service while living in Virginia in the 80s.  Definitely “eye catching” in a consist of old boxcars and passenger cars.  There were a few floating around Gladstone and Clifton Forge back then.

 

Jim King

http://smokymountainmodelworks.com/

 


Re: Dry Ice Refrigerator Car Test

Tony Thompson
 

Schuyler Larrabee  wrote:

Attached, not the specific car referenced in Bob’s post but an image of a dry ice reefer, which my records show “scrapped, June 58.”

    Actually, no, this is not a "dry ice reefer," but a car used to TRANSPORT dry ice. 

Tony Thompson




Re: Tank Car United States Army USAX 16503

Paul Koehler
 

Mel:

 

What’s a no no?  Can you site a Tariff or special instructions?  Thanks

 

Paul C. Koehler

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of mel perry
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2020 10:21 AM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Tank Car United States Army USAX 16503

 

i believe, in the real world, that's a no-no

mel perry

 

 

On Wed, Jun 10, 2020, 10:16 AM Paul Koehler <koehlers@...> wrote:

All:

 

Not true, MTS Brass car with the Aluminum tanks, I can run anywhere in a train and any length train.  Three cars to over thirty, as you can see it’s first out in front of the caboose in this train.

 

Paul C. Koehler

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of gastro42000
Sent: Tuesday, June 09, 2020 11:34 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io; Tony Thompson <tony@...>
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Tank Car United States Army USAX 16503

 

 

On June 9, 2020 at 2:04 PM Tony Thompson <tony@...> wrote:  po

Marty Cooper wrote:hi: yep. I wanted one, I got one. It makes a nice static display, but it is too heavy to run without pulling the rest of the cars off the track. Marty Cooper 

 

Hi: it also makes a nice brass car, but very heavy. Marty Cooper 

 

     There was at least one brass version which had turned aluminum tanks.

 

Tony Thompson

 

 

 


 

Attachments:


C&O MW Tenders

Garth Groff and Sally Sanford <mallardlodge1000@...>
 

Friends,

Attached are four views of former C&O steam locomotive tenders downgraded to MW service, which makes them "sort-of freight" cars. 

From the photos Bill McClure shared a few weeks back, I gather that most C&O outfit trains included at least one tender. Possibly the size of the tender varied with the size of the train. They probably carried coal for heating and/or cooking stoves until this was switched to natural gas, and likely also carried water for showers. I'm not sure if the water was fit to drink; MW tank cars for this purpose on some roads were marked "potable water". I see no such markings here.

All four cars were located together in Gordonsville, Virginia, around 1985-1986. There was quite a bit of old MW equipment held here at that time for eventual scrapping.

Enjoy the photos. Comments are always welcome.

Next time, Burro cranes.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff  🦆



Re: Dry Ice Refrigerator Car Test

Schuyler Larrabee
 

Attached, not the specific car referenced in Bob’s post but an image of a dry ice reefer, which my records show “scrapped, June 58.”

 

Schuyler

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Bob Chaparro via groups.io
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2020 1:53 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Dry Ice Refrigerator Car Test

 

Dry Ice Refrigerator Car Test

Here is some "dry" reading if you have the time and inclination:

https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=coo.31924003645607&view=1up&seq=19

This is a 1952 technical paper from the USDA reporting on a refrigerator car equipped with dry ice system of refrigeration.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


EARLY LV "wrong way" box

Schuyler Larrabee
 

We’ve recently been advised that more roads than just the Lehigh Valley owned “wrong way” box cars.  This is a snip from a larger photo titled “Buffalo NY 1910 Kellog Company.”  I am not sure just how I got that photo, but I noticed this LV box car on a siding at the very bottom edge of the image.

 

 

The overall photo is interesting, but I am not sure of the permissions to share the entire image.  It shows an active steam pile driver and new concrete silos under construction using slip forms.

 

Schuyler


Re: Photo: PRL&P Pulpwood Car 1977

William Canelos
 

Back in the day "cordwood"  was sold at various outlets or could be delivered to your home for heating purposes.  pulp wood was left whole(not split like seen in the photo).

Cheers & Beers,

Bill


Re: Photo: Reefers At Michigan Central Yard - Detroit

Bill Welch
 

Very helpful photo with the wood roof. I am doing a Board x Board Roof Pattern to fit the Tichy reefer kit.

Bill Welch


Re: Dry Ice Refrigerator Car Test

Bill Welch
 

Interesting find Bob. Although the test facility was at FGE, I am pretty certain they did not use A Fruit Growers car. In the years after WWII feeling the pressure from trucks equipped with Thermo-King Mechanical FGE began experimenting with several mechanical and non-mechanical systems in an attempt to find an effective and economical way to transport frozen commodities at Zero and below. One system used Dry Ice. While the system could effectively maintain Zero, the cost was prohibitive and they quickly moved on to alternative technologies.

By 1952 FGE had a small fleet of 40-foot Mechs powered both by Diesel (Frigidaire) and Gasoline (Thermo-King) and a few 50-footers being evaluated. In 1953 the FGE shops at Alexandria began building what would eventually by 1957 number 1,100 All-Temperature 50-ft Mechs for FGE, WFE, and BRE. the largest Mechanical fleet operated by any Refrigerator Car entity at the time. A modern model of these is very desirable i think, but i am prejudiced.

Model on Ya'll
Bill Welch


Re: Photo: Reefers At Michigan Central Yard - Detroit

Tony Thompson
 

Bob Chaparro wrote:

Comparing these three PFE cars, two have a platform surrounding the hatch cover, one does not.


      PFE reefers with wood roofs did not have ice hatch platforms, as you see here. Platforms were for outside metal roofs.

Tony Thompson




Re: Photo: Loading Packard Automobile Crates

Ralph W. Brown
 

Hi Garth,
 
Some, perhaps most, automobiles were shipped as “kits” circa 1905.
 
Nice shot of the truck.  Too bad we can’t see more of the boxcars.
 
Pax,
 
 
Ralph Brown
Portland, Maine
PRRT&HS No. 3966
NMRA No. L2532

rbrown51[at]maine[dot]rr[dot]com
 

From: Garth Groff and Sally Sanford
Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2020 2:30 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Loading Packard Automobile Crates
 
Bob,
 
Unless those crates contain spare parts, or are part of a "kit", they are far too small for a whole car.
 
In the early days before Evans racks, autos were sometimes shipped in crates (via freight cars; mandatory content). I wonder if this continued into later times for overseas shipments. Recently I was watching a Smithsonian channel documentary on the Raj in India. One of the sahibs had a very nice Packard auto, pretty much a luxury car for the time. Would this have been crated for shipment? I suspect so.
 
I owe my life to a 1948 Packard semi-limo my father bought used around 1954. We were rear-ended while stopped by a drunk driver in a Cadillac the police estimated was going well over 60 miles an hour. Our car went airborne, and was thrown all the way across a 4-lane intersection. We all had minor injuries, but my father was able to nurse the car the ten or so miles to our home. The Caddie was winched up onto a flatbed and hauled off to the junkyard. My father immediately bought another used Packard. Those autos were built like the tanks Packard engines powered during the war.
 
But I digress.
 
Yours Aye,
 
 
Garth Groff  🦆
 
On Wed, Jun 10, 2020 at 1:59 PM Bob Chaparro via groups.io <chiefbobbb@...> wrote:

Photo: Loading Packard Automobile Crates

A 1905 photo from the Wayne State University Libraries:

https://digital.library.wayne.edu/item/wayne:CFAIEB01e765

Click on "Open Image in Viewer".

This image can be enlarged quite a bit but loads slowly.

Description: "1921-22 Packard truck, left side view, unloading Packard crates into boxcars."

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA


Re: Photo: PRL&P Pulpwood Car 1977

akerboomk
 

I like all the cars

1st car – cut (dimensional?) wood on bulkhead flat

2nd/3rd cars – random pieces parts

4th car – most of it looks like the parts that are cut off the outside of the log before they cut the dimensional lumber.  Up near the top, there looks to be a cut piece (about) the size of a railroad tie.

 

Could it be for firing a boiler of some sort?

 

Ken


--
Ken Akerboom

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