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Re: Seatrain Ships
Bob Webber
There's also an article in Warships International on some of
the ships' service in WW II - as can be imagined, they were excellent in
terms of moving heavy land vehicles (and landing same). If I'm not
mistaken, these were "chartered" by the Army - not the
Navy. The Army attempted to garner the whole fleet.
They also were used to haul freight cars to France and other overseas destinations.. This had the benefit of not having to knock down the built "kits" to be rebuilt ashore. And then..some of those cars had kits as loads within. At least some of the kits and built up kits were from Bessemer. There is also an image of a load of reefers no one of the ships..where THAT one is can not be recalled at the moment. At 10:39 AM 12/16/2019, you wrote: Seatrain Ships Bob Webber
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Re: MONON gon spiral end
Bill Keene
Are decals available to model this car?
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Thanks & Happy Modeling, Bill Keene Irvine, CA
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New Resin Car Works mini-kit
Ken Soroos
Gentlemen -
I’m sorry for this last thread being posted to the RealSTMFC website. It was meant to be a personal reply to Eric, but I used the post from the site and neglected to change the address.. My fault completely. Ken
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Re: New Resin Car Works mini-kit
Ken Soroos
Hi Eric -
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Not a problem. These things are usually listed on the kit inserts, but with the Mini-Kits that space has been taken up with the background information. Have a great Holiday Season! Ken
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Seatrain Ships
Seatrain Ships At the risk of going overboard on this topic, here are some links with more information, photos and diagrams on the Seatrain car ferries. The film is especially interesting. Bob Chaparro Port of Hemet, CA ++++ Popular Science Article, 1929 https://books.google.com/books?id=bCoDAAAAMBAJ&pg=PA53&hl=en#v=onepage&q&f=true Popular Mechanics Articel, 1947 https://books.google.com/books?id=0N4DAAAAMBAJ&pg=PA122#v=onepage&q&f=true Film: Seatrain New Orleans Film made in 1929. A lot of footage showing cars being moved inside the ship. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vBE9mzU_9OQ Loading Illustration https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f4/Seatrain_Method.jpg Seatrain ferry loading 1956 http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=3153401 The specialist crane hoist the cradle loaded with an ATSF boxcar from the Seatrain Louisiana Seatrain Loader, Belle Chasse, LA http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=1846297 http://www.rrpicturearchives.net/showPicture.aspx?id=4624402
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Re: New Resin Car Works mini-kit
Eric Hansmann
My fault on this one. I had updated the info but forgot to upload the new page. This should now list the correct kit credits. Hit refresh if some names are still in bold lettering. http://resincarworks.com/extras/extras_minikit3-01_IC_1927xm.htm
Eric Hansmann Murfreesboro, TN
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Ken Soroos
Sent: Monday, December 16, 2019 9:11 AM To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] New Resin Car Works mini-kit
Hi Eric -
Looking over this post on the website, I noticed that Ted Culotta is listed as having done the decals. I actually did them for the IC car this time.
Ken
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Open Top loads
In response to Tony's question, and to share with everyone, I have created a
folder in the Op Sig group files section titled "AAR open top car loading rules" This may be found at https://groups.io/g/Ry-ops-industrialSIG/files/AAR%20Car%20Codes/AAR%20Open% 20Top%20Car%20Loading%20Rules In it I have uploaded copies of the AAR booklets for Rules Governing loading open top cars, which I recently acquired. Section 1 Rules 1988 Section 2 Loading Pipe 1987 Section 3 Road Farm Equipment 1987 Section 4 Misc Machinery 1987 Section 5 Forest Products 1983 & 1987 (1983 version has more pages) Section 6 DOD Military 1984 Section 7 TOFC Containers 1987 They were scanned, creating searchable pdfs, totaling about 190mb. This will not answer Tony's questions about hoppers and covered hoppers, but should give an excellent idea of what was transported in gons. More important these booklets have drawings showing the proper way to load and secure a wide variety of loads. Great for modeling ideas. If you are not able to access the Op Sig group files, let me know. I can load them to the this group files. Doug Harding www.iowacentralrr.org Visit our extended files area at: https://groups.io/g/OPS-INDfiles
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Re: New Resin Car Works mini-kit
Ken Soroos
Hi Eric -
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Looking over this post on the website, I noticed that Ted Culotta is listed as having done the decals. I actually did them for the IC car this time. Ken
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Re: Odd (to me) Monon car
Mont Switzer
My apologies to the STMF group for the trucking stuff in this message. I didn't know that response was going to the entire group.
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Montford L. Switzer President Switzer Tank Lines, Inc. Fall Creek Leasing, LLC. mswitzer@switzertc.com (765) 836-2914
-----Original Message-----
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Mont Switzer Sent: Monday, December 16, 2019 8:02 AM To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io Cc: William Darnaby <wdarnaby@att.net>; Tim Bachus <lvc420@yahoo.com>; Ron Marquardt <marquardt@bluemarble.net> Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Odd (to me) Monon car Ron, We ran into the rider caboose issue when modeling the Transfer at Monon. When/how were the rider cars moved to the Transfer house for loading of LCL before going out on locals? I asked Cookie and he told me they never did use the "baggage" end of the rider cars for LCL. LCL was loaded in clean dry boxcars, preferably with doors that worked easily. Every time I looked in one of the rider cars the "baggage" end was full of tools of the trade: cables, re-railers, knuckles and assorted junk. One wag even had an overstuffed reclining easy chair strategically located near the large door opening. Tough duty. After the recliner episode I thought I had seen it all until one was removed from a conventional GMC (small day cab) semi-tractor at Bender & Loudon Motor Freight, Inc. I still don't know how the driver assigned to the tractor got it in there because the shop had a hell of a time getting it out. Company policy was only one seat per tractor and it was reserved for the driver. Mont Montford L. Switzer President Switzer Tank Lines, Inc. Fall Creek Leasing, LLC. mswitzer@switzertc.com (765) 836-2914 -----Original Message----- From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Penny Simunic Sent: Sunday, December 15, 2019 5:38 PM To: main@realstmfc.groups.io Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Odd (to me) Monon car Monon rider car. Used in Indiana to allow LCL shipments. Also to accommodate the extra conductor, for extra crewman in Indiana. Not sure how it ended up out West. In later years used as tool car. RonS
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Re: Odd (to me) Monon car
Mont Switzer
Bill Darnaby's explanation of the SP&S Alco RS and what the Monon called:
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1. rider cars 2. head end cabooses Is spot on. The rider cars, a total of 8 were built on low side stone gon frames. These gons, built by Pullman Standard in Michigan City in 1926. Other than their all wood interiors which were required for cut stone loading the riveted steel portions were virtually indestructible. In addition to the head end cabooses these frames were used to make ten 40 ft. flat cars, 40 piggy-back flats, upwards of 30 coke racks, and countless company service cars of all sizes and shapes. Some cars even survived as built in MofW service until the L&N merger in 1971. A recent review of disposition (destroyed due to damage) records for these cars seem to indicate that In the steam era they could be seen all over the eastern half of the USA almost certainly hauling cut limestone to large building projects. This was back in the day when many large building projects had a temporary rail siding built right up to the job site. Others had draymen moving the cut stone pieces to the job sites. Mont Montford L. Switzer President Switzer Tank Lines, Inc. Fall Creek Leasing, LLC. mswitzer@switzertc.com (765) 836-2914
-----Original Message-----
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Craig Zeni Sent: Sunday, December 15, 2019 3:48 PM To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Odd (to me) Monon car On Dec 15, 2019, at 3:31 PM, main@RealSTMFC.groups.io wrote: 6a. Odd (to me) Monon carNot opinion, but fact...it's not Oregon. It's Salem, Indiana. The Monon leased a few SP&S RS-2s in the 1960s. The odd car is what's called a Rider Caboose...a 'front end' caboose was required by Indiana state law for trains longer than 65 cars. Forgot to sign the first one... Craig Zeni Cary NC
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MONON gon spiral end
USRA gon with spiral end http://monon.org/bygone_site/mines/CIL33149LittleBettyLinton-0001.jpg parts from Shapeway https://www.shapeways.com/product/VFHH88RYT/monon-spiral-gondola-end-ho-scale
Doug Harding www.iowacentralrr.org
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Re: Odd (to me) Monon car
Mont Switzer
Ron,
toggle quoted messageShow quoted text
We ran into the rider caboose issue when modeling the Transfer at Monon. When/how were the rider cars moved to the Transfer house for loading of LCL before going out on locals? I asked Cookie and he told me they never did use the "baggage" end of the rider cars for LCL. LCL was loaded in clean dry boxcars, preferably with doors that worked easily. Every time I looked in one of the rider cars the "baggage" end was full of tools of the trade: cables, re-railers, knuckles and assorted junk. One wag even had an overstuffed reclining easy chair strategically located near the large door opening. Tough duty. After the recliner episode I thought I had seen it all until one was removed from a conventional GMC (small day cab) semi-tractor at Bender & Loudon Motor Freight, Inc. I still don't know how the driver assigned to the tractor got it in there because the shop had a hell of a time getting it out. Company policy was only one seat per tractor and it was reserved for the driver. Mont Montford L. Switzer President Switzer Tank Lines, Inc. Fall Creek Leasing, LLC. mswitzer@switzertc.com (765) 836-2914
-----Original Message-----
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Penny Simunic Sent: Sunday, December 15, 2019 5:38 PM To: main@realstmfc.groups.io Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Odd (to me) Monon car Monon rider car. Used in Indiana to allow LCL shipments. Also to accommodate the extra conductor, for extra crewman in Indiana. Not sure how it ended up out West. In later years used as tool car. RonS
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Re: Photo: NKP Boxcar 27664
Ray Breyer
Nice shot! I need to work it into an article at some point. NKP 27664 was one of 1,000 cars built for the NKP by Haskell & Barker in 1908. A basic Vanderbilt syndicate car design, it was one of 4,300 identical boxcars built for the NKP in 1907 and 1908 (the largest single group of identical freight cars owned by that road). Originally an all-wood car, it was rebuilt in the early 1920s with a Hutchins roof, I-beam crash posts on the ends, and a steel center sill underframe. The car is also wearing its third lettering scheme. The cars were all retired by 1939 by the NKP, but several hundred were retained for the road's MOW fleet. Several hundred more were sold to Hyman-Michaels, who sold them to several small roads just before WWII. The largest group, 300 cars, went to the M&StL. That road re-sold several to other roads, including the ITC, NdeM, and US Army (for use in munition plants). Up to four of these cars still survive. One is a stablemate of NKP 765, one is in the collection of the recently-imploded railroad museum in Noblesville IN, and two of the former M&StL cars MAY still survive as part of the Boone & Scenic RR's collection in Iowa. I wrote a lengthy article on the NKP's wood boxcar fleet for the Winter 2014 issue of the Nickel Plate Road Magazine, and a modeling article on the 25000s in the June 2015 issue of the Nickel Plate Road Modeler's Notebook. The decals for these cars available from RCW were based on my research and the art talent of Dr. Dave Campbell. Ray Breyer Elgin, IL
On Sunday, December 15, 2019, 04:28:54 PM CST, lrkdbn via Groups.Io <lrkdbn@...> wrote:
Another car I've been looking for! Ray Breyer at the NKP group knows a lot about these cars,and the NKPHTS modeler's on line magazine has articles. Decals can be had from Resin Car Works. Larry King
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Odd (to me) Monon car
Andy Carlson
Lacking a freight car (my apologies) though a wooden head end car, here is another SP&S RS 2 #64 in Indiana. Taken in 1966. -Andy Carlson Ojai CA
On Sunday, December 15, 2019, 12:15:18 PM PST, spsalso via Groups.Io <edwardsutorik@...> wrote:
In the slide below, there's an odd looking Monon car just behind the loco. Photo was taken at Salem, Oregon. https://www.ebay.com/itm/Duplicate-Slide-SP-S-Spokane-Portland-Seattle-ALCO-RS2-64-W-Train-Salem-OR/401998668873?hash=item5d98fce449:g:WpkAAOSwzNFd9eyG I'm curious what the car is and why it was in Oregon. Any opinions? Ed Edward Sutorik
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Re: Odd (to me) Monon car
william darnaby
Actually, the Monon leased two of the SP&S engines while the Monon was upgrading their own nine engines (2 at a time) with new prime movers and improved electrical gear to make them more compatible with the 628’s so one could be run as a sandwich between two 628’s to create a HP/tractive effort combination more appropriate for Monon conditions.
The first 4 of these rider cars were built in ’46 and saw service behind steam. The second 4 were built in ‘52 after converted troop kitchen cars were considered unsatisfactory in this service. All were built on cut limestone service flats…actually low side composite gons…from the 20’s. The Monon had 500 of these gons at one time but the Depression kind of killed that type of construction except for some government buildings.
Bill Darnaby
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Dave Strahlendorf
Yeah, that slide is mis-labeled. That is not on SP&S rails, but on the Monon. The Monon faced a power shortage in 1966 due to their return of several Alco C628s to the manufacturer, and had to lease these SP&S engines until Alco could produce the 628s replacement.
The car trailing the locomotive is a 'Rider' car that was required by State Law for 'locals' exceeding a certain size. These were home built by the Monon at the Lafayette, Indiana Shops Mont Switzer can provide a more thorough description of these cars.
In HO, at one time they were offered by Overland Models.
Dave Strahlendorf Erlanger, Ky
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Re: Odd (to me) Monon car
william darnaby
In the late 60’s I took a photo of one of the B&O’s cars in Indianapolis made from an M26. It had a side step for the door and caboose grab and ladder type equipment. Other roads just used an extra caboose at the head end. Some extended the steam engine cab for the extra seat and a notable one had a tender dog house. The Monon and NKP found it useful to have the boss at the head end on locals and made cars for that because it was handy to have the conductor right there when the engine stopped at the depot to see the agent, particularly when the train had some length. Saved walking or backing and forthing.
Bill Darnaby
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Seth Lakin via Groups.Io
Craig wrote:” a 'front end' caboose was required by Indiana state law for trains longer than 65 cars.”
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Re: West India Fruit & Steamship Company Historic Film
mel perry
well that explsins all.the double handling shown in the.video, problem still.exsists today on the west coast, that's the main reason, why tbe port of portland.no longer exists, with everything.being trucked to the ports in seattle or tacoma, cut off the nose to spite the face mel perry
On Sun, Dec 15, 2019, 5:08 PM Bob Chaparro via Groups.Io <chiefbobbb=verizon.net@groups.io> wrote:
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Re: West India Fruit & Steamship Company Historic Film
Ships - Don, you may find some of the ships on-line. Before West India Fruit and Steamship Company, Seatrain Lines (the operating name for the Over-Seas Shipping Company) shipping by using entire loaded rail cars between ports in the United States and Havana, Cuba, with the first shipment in December 1928 aboard a specially designed ship, Seatrain. This original ship, later renamed Seatrain New Orleans, was capable of carrying 95 fully loaded rail cars. The company built two larger specialized ships in 1932, Seatrain New York and Seatrain Havana with greater rail car capacity. In 1939 two more ships were added, Seatrain Texas and Seatrain New Jersey. The original 1928 shipment aboard Seatrain caused a labor issue that foretold similar issues later with container ships when Cuban stevedores demanded that they not only unload the rail cars from the ship but unload and repack the rail car contents before turning the cars over to Cuban railways. In 1951 Seatrain Lines added two additional railcar carriers, the Seatrain Georgia and Seatrain Louisiana. That year Seatrain also ceased operations to and from Cuba, and renamed its ship Seatrain Havana to Seatrain Savannah to reflect the suspension of service. In 1953 Seatrain sold its operating authority to trade between the US and Cuba to the West India Fruit and Steamship Company, along with its first ship, the Seatrain New Orleans, which was renamed Sea Level. West India Fruit & Steamship Company already had been in operation from 1946.
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Re: Odd (to me) Monon car
Seth Lakin
Craig wrote:” a 'front end' caboose was required by Indiana state law for trains longer than 65 cars.”
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Re: Odd (to me) Monon car
spsalso
Ask a question--get an answer.
Wow! And thanks to all. Very interesting. Though not as interesting as it would have been in Oregon. Ed Edward Sutorik
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