Date   

Re: HO-Accuracy of Overland B&O Wagontop Boxcar?

proto48er
 

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "proto48er" <atkott@...> wrote:
....However, the "O" scale version of the double door M-15l is bad -
it
has the double doors directly across from each other, at one end of
the car! They should be staggered, so that if you look at one side
of the car, it looks the same as the other side - not with the
doors
on the left on one side and on the right on the other! I told this
to Overland when they imported them (bought some), and they said to
PROVE that the doors were staggered and not directly across from
each
other. I sent them a copy of the ORER which said "staggered doors"
for the M-15l entry, and they asked me to remove the floor from my
M-
15l body and return it to them. I did so, and was totally
surprised
about a month later when they sent me a correct body! I probably
have the only correct model! If they imported the HO scale models
later, they may all be correct....
A.T. Kott
Guys -

This is a correction to my previous post about B&O M-15L double door
boxcars made in "O" scale by Overland. The HO models were apparently
made correctly.

Overland mis-marked the box "M-15K" for the double door cars in "O"
scale. They apparently DID make a corrected carbody available for
these cars (the original carbody had the doors directly across from
each other!) One of these corrected carbodys is on Ebay as item
#140102477890. The box states "M15K (4-door new body)", and the body
is correct - mine scales out to the diagram dimensions. It came
without an underframe, so the body in the auction was apparently for
replacement if anyone requested it of Overland.

If any "O" scalers want a cheap (at least, for now) brass model of
this car, here it is! With the complete model, you would have to
totally re-work the underframe, so the absence of the underframe is
not too much of a loss! (No connection with seller). A.T. Kott


Re: question about truss rods and brake wheel staffs - Wrong ques...

Guy Wilber
 

Malcolm asked:

1. When were the rules changed so that truss rods alone would not do ? --
requiring steel center sill.
In 1925 the ARA's Arbitration Committee amended Rule 3, section (i) to read:

Cars built new on or after January 1, 1927, will not be accepted from owner
unless equipped with steel underframe having a minimum cross-sectional area
of 24 square inches between the draft stops.

The definition of "steel underframe" as presented within Rule 3 was
clarified by the Committee in 1929:

"The attention of the Arbitration Committee has been called form time to
time to various types of cars purporting to be of steel underframe construction
with request for advice as to whether or not such types of construction meet
the requirements of Rule 3, Section (u), paragraph (1). Your committee's
definition of a steel underframe as contemplated in this requirement of Rule 3,
is an underframe not dependent upon truss rods for support, having steel
center sills with a minimum cross sectional area of 24 square inches, steel body
bolsters and steel cross bearers, suitably tied together. If end or side
sills are used, they must also be of steel.

After that time, truss rods might still have been used for additional
support.

See definition above.

2. At what time were strength requirements for underframes increase to the
extent that the additional support provided by truss rods became irrelevant.

January 1, 1927

Kind Regards,

Guy Wilber
West Bend, WI







************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.


Re: Reefer Door Nomenclature

Andy Sperandeo <asperandeo@...>
 

Interesting question, Bob,

I took a quick look in two Car Builder's Cyclopedias, the 1940 and 1953
editions. In the earlier edition, there's no particular name applied to
refrigerator car doors at all. They are just "doors," as thick as the walls
of the car and similarly insulated, fitting flush with the sides, and
generally having an angled overlap so there's no thinner section of
insulation where the two swinging doors meet.

In the 1953 edition, what modelers usually call "plug doors" are referred to
as sliding doors, and of course they are just as thick and just as
well-insulated as the swinging doors. Sometimes they are called "sliding
flush doors," but again, the swinging doors also fit flush.

It might be useful for modelers to distinguish the two types as swinging
flush doors and sliding flush doors, since both types of doors "plug" the
door openings with insulation. I didn't find any other prototypical terms to
distinguish between the two types, although admittedly my search was fast
and not exhaustive. I don't recall what terms might be used either in Tony
Thompson's PFE book or in the Santa Fe reefer book by Keith Jordan &
company. I've thought for some time, though, that "plug door " isn't an
adequate term for the later sliding flush doors, since it leads to a false
distinction (because the swinging doors are also flush-fitting plugs).

So long,

Andy

Andy Sperandeo
Executive Editor
Model Railroader magazine
asperandeo@mrmag.com
262-796-8776, ext. 461
FAX 262-796-1142


Reefer Door Nomenclature

Bob Chaparro <thecitrusbelt@...>
 

Question for the group: Until the later days of the ice bunker reefers
when plug doors came into use, reefers had a small pair of double doors
that open on hinges attached to the car sides.

I heard of this type of door arrangement referred to as both "leaf
doors" and "swing doors".

Does anyone know which is the correct nomenclature for these doors, as
favored by the ARA, AAR or Master Car Builders Association?

Thanks.

Bob Chaparro
Mission Viejo/Hemet, CA


Branchline RTR cars - crass commercial announcment

branchline@...
 

Folks,

The latest group of RTR Blueprint cars is shipping to dealers starting today. This group include 40' wood reefers, 40' AAR boxcars and single window coaches.

All cars include Kadee #5 couplers and turned metal wheelsets. Coach roofs are removable for access to the interior.

For a complete list see http://www.branchline-trains.com/blueprint/rtr/rtr4.htm

Bill Schneider
Branchline Trains


Re: BRANCHLINE LifeLike Red Caboose & Intermountain HO RTR Freightcars

branchline@...
 

Jason,

All the Branchline RTR cars are coming in with Kadee #5's installed.

For those (like me) that prefer #58's the coupler lids are glued in place but can be removed with a gentle pry.

Bill Schneider
Branchline Trains

----- Original Message -----
From: JASON SANFORD
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 12:25 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re:BRANCHLINE LifeLike Red Caboose & Intermountain HO RTR Freightcars


On the reefers, how are the coupler lids attached? Screws? I would want to replace the couplers with Kadee's. Thanks.


Jason Sanford

---------------------------------
We won't tell. Get more on shows you hate to love
(and love to hate): Yahoo! TV's Guilty Pleasures list.


Re: BRANCHLINE LifeLike Red Caboose & Intermountain HO RTR Freightcars

ogdentowebercanyon
 

On the reefers, how are the coupler lids attached? Screws? I would want to replace the couplers with Kadee's. Thanks.


Jason Sanford


---------------------------------
We won't tell. Get more on shows you hate to love
(and love to hate): Yahoo! TV's Guilty Pleasures list.


Keith Jordan

Norman+Laraine Larkin <lono@...>
 

Hi,
If Keith Jordan is lurking out there, would you please contact me off-line.
Thanks,
Norm Larkin


Re: SP A-50-6 AB Brakes

Charles Morrill
 

Woo0ps! Just reread the previous message and see the RMC photo is the hog fuel rebuild. So "never mind".
Charlie

----- Original Message -----
From: "Charles Morrill" <badlands@srcaccess.net>
To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 8:15 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] SP A-50-6 AB Brakes


Maybe this will help. The 3/55 issue of RMC had a SP company photo of
A-50-6 number 52199 as part of a construction article. The car is freshly
painted and has AB brakes with a 10-51 weight date. The position of the
reservoir in the photo would indicate brake placement to be similar to that
shown in the A-50-18 photo mentioned earlier.
Charlie

----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Brock" <brockm@brevard.net>
To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 7:25 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] SP A-50-6 AB Brakes


Tony Thompson writes:

"If you want to
choose a car number, Mike, I'll look it up and tell you what month and
year it got AB brakes--and at which shop <g>. But I don't have a brake
diagram."

I'm really more interested in 1953 than 1950. The ORER for that yr shows
51
cars still on the roster but, unfortunately, no individual numbers are
listed. If you happen to have easy access to the those surviving numbers
in
'53, that would be appreciated. If not, don't worry about it.

Mike Brock





Yahoo! Groups Links







Yahoo! Groups Links




Re: SP A-50-6 AB Brakes

Charles Morrill
 

Maybe this will help. The 3/55 issue of RMC had a SP company photo of A-50-6 number 52199 as part of a construction article. The car is freshly painted and has AB brakes with a 10-51 weight date. The position of the reservoir in the photo would indicate brake placement to be similar to that shown in the A-50-18 photo mentioned earlier.
Charlie

----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Brock" <brockm@brevard.net>
To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 7:25 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] SP A-50-6 AB Brakes


Tony Thompson writes:

"If you want to
choose a car number, Mike, I'll look it up and tell you what month and
year it got AB brakes--and at which shop <g>. But I don't have a brake
diagram."

I'm really more interested in 1953 than 1950. The ORER for that yr shows 51
cars still on the roster but, unfortunately, no individual numbers are
listed. If you happen to have easy access to the those surviving numbers in
'53, that would be appreciated. If not, don't worry about it.

Mike Brock





Yahoo! Groups Links




Re: SP A-50-6 AB Brakes

Storey Lindsay
 

Mike,

While I don't have individual car numbers within classes, contained within the list of Southern Pacific's "Pacific Lines Standard Gauge Freight Equipment As Of July 31, 1955", page 4 of 9 pages, is a listing for TWO A-50-6 cars in the number series from 67272 to 67476. I would surmise from this information that the two existing cars were numbers 67272 and 67476.

Perhaps this will help...

Storey Lindsay
Celje, Slovenia

----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Brock" <brockm@brevard.net>
To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, March 30, 2007 14:25
Subject: Re: [STMFC] SP A-50-6 AB Brakes


Tony Thompson writes:

"If you want to
choose a car number, Mike, I'll look it up and tell you what month and
year it got AB brakes--and at which shop <g>. But I don't have a brake
diagram."

I'm really more interested in 1953 than 1950. The ORER for that yr shows 51
cars still on the roster but, unfortunately, no individual numbers are
listed. If you happen to have easy access to the those surviving numbers in
'53, that would be appreciated. If not, don't worry about it.

Mike Brock





Yahoo! Groups Links



Re: BRANCHLINE LifeLike Red Caboose & Intermountain HO RTR Freightcars

Bill Navari
 

_http://stores.ebay.com/BESSEMER-HOBBIES_BRANCHLINE-RTR-FREIGHT-CARS_W0QQcolZ2
QQdirZQ2d1QQfsubZ7524574QQftidZ2QQtZkm?refid=store_
(http://stores.ebay.com/BESSEMER-HOBBIES_BRANCHLINE-RTR-FREIGHT-CARS_W0QQcolZ2QQdirZQ2d1QQfsubZ7524574QQ
ftidZ2QQtZkm?refid=store)


The Branchline cars are very nice indeed. Those interested in seeing them
can veiw some at the above link.

Bill



************************************** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.


Re: SP A-50-6 AB Brakes

Mike Brock <brockm@...>
 

Tony Thompson writes:

"If you want to
choose a car number, Mike, I'll look it up and tell you what month and
year it got AB brakes--and at which shop <g>. But I don't have a brake
diagram."

I'm really more interested in 1953 than 1950. The ORER for that yr shows 51 cars still on the roster but, unfortunately, no individual numbers are listed. If you happen to have easy access to the those surviving numbers in '53, that would be appreciated. If not, don't worry about it.

Mike Brock


Re: SP A-50-6 AB Brakes

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Mike Brock wrote:
This message is no doubt for Tony Thompson. I'm completing construction on a resin SP A-50-6 and I'm curious about the time in which the car would have received AB brakes. In 1950 there were, apparently still 783 cars on the SP roster plus 302 on the T&NO. The photo caption on pg 93 of SP Frt Cars Vol 3 indicates that A-50-6 converted to "hog-fuel" 52199 received AB brakes in '48 prior to conversion to a "hog-fuel" car in 1951. Is it likely that all were converted during '48? Any idea how the layout of the AB system might have been? Might the layout be similar to the photo of A-50-18 on pg 135?
I have not seen diagrams or clear photos of the AB brake arrangements on these cars. The A-50-18 layout is a good guess.
SP was converting a great many older box and auto cars to AB brakes in 1947-1950. Through the car ledgers, I suppose one could construct an exact table of number converted per year. If you want to choose a car number, Mike, I'll look it up and tell you what month and year it got AB brakes--and at which shop <g>. But I don't have a brake diagram.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


SP A-50-6 AB Brakes

Mike Brock <brockm@...>
 

This message is no doubt for Tony Thompson. I'm completing construction on a resin SP A-50-6 and I'm curious about the time in which the car would have received AB brakes. In 1950 there were, apparently still 783 cars on the SP roster plus 302 on the T&NO. The photo caption on pg 93 of SP Frt Cars Vol 3 indicates that A-50-6 converted to "hog-fuel" 52199 received AB brakes in '48 prior to conversion to a "hog-fuel" car in 1951. Is it likely that all were converted during '48? Any idea how the layout of the AB system might have been? Might the layout be similar to the photo of A-50-18 on pg 135?

Mike Brock


Re: question about truss rods and brake wheel staffs - Wrong question ??

bill_d_goat
 

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, Malcolm Laughlin <mlaughlinnyc@...>
wrote:

Perhaps asking when truss rods were outlawed is asking the wrong
question. The more relevant questions are:

1. When were the rules changed so that truss rods alone would not
do ? -- requiring steel center sill.

After that time, truss rods might still have been used for
additional suupport.

2. At what time were strnght requirements for underframes
increase to the extent that the additional support provided by truss
rods became irrelevant.



Malcolm Laughlin, Editor 617-489-4383
New England Rail Shipper Directories
19 Holden Road, Belmont, MA 02478

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Good questions!
I know GN had rebuilt reefers with steel underframes which still
retained trussrods. Was it done that way because it was cheaper than
rebuilding with stronger steel underframes (and it was allowed) or
was there another reason?
Bill Williams


Re: question about truss rods and brake wheel staffs - Wrong question ??

Malcolm Laughlin <mlaughlinnyc@...>
 

Perhaps asking when truss rods were outlawed is asking the wrong question. The more relevant questions are:

1. When were the rules changed so that truss rods alone would not do ? -- requiring steel center sill.

After that time, truss rods might still have been used for additional suupport.

2. At what time were strnght requirements for underframes increase to the extent that the additional support provided by truss rods became irrelevant.



Malcolm Laughlin, Editor 617-489-4383
New England Rail Shipper Directories
19 Holden Road, Belmont, MA 02478


2007 New England/Northeast Prototype Meet is June 1 and 2 ...

Dave Owens
 

... Collinsville, Conn.

For more information, contact Dave Owens at daowens@gmail.com or visit
our website:

http://www.trainweb.org/neprototypemeet/

Please pass the word about the meet.

Thanks,

Dave Owens


ADMIN: Duplicate messages

Mike Brock <brockm@...>
 

As many of you are no doubt aware, Yahoo is having some problems with duplicate messages. The STMFC has thankfully not been affected very much by this but there are a few. I have taken no action as a result of our low number of duplicates.

Mike Brock
STMFC Owner


Fun Yard photos

James Eckman
 

Go to:
http://memory.loc.gov/ammem/collections/habs_haer/ (LIBRARY of Congress)

Look for the Browse Collection header,
select subject then yards!!! Includes maps as well as photos, mysteriously with a fair number of freight cars.

Delaware, Lackawanna & Western Railroad, Scranton Yards
Baltimore & Ohio Railroad, Mount Clare Shops

Plus others

Don't get lost for too long ;)

Jim

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