Date   

Re: Upcoming Intermountain models

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Mar 8, 2006, at 6:07 PM, luzhin1 (Greg Smith) wrote:

Richard,

Your comments below are, as usual, well-informed.  But are you saying
that the new IM gondolas are inaccurate altogether, or simply
inaccurate for post-depression modelers?  In other words, are the
cars as modeled and lettered by Intermountain accurate for the 1920s?
Apologies for not making this clearer. As Tony Thompson posted, the IM
gondola kits are quite accurate for the cars as built, so for a 1920s
modeler the issue is whether the lettering is correct for that era. As
I noted, the MC model has early '20s lettering and some of the others
are probably okay for the late 1920s (after the 1925 change in AAR
lettering standards), though you might have to change the reweigh
dates.

Richard Hendrickson


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Lake Erie based salt mine

up4024 <thekays100@...>
 

Actually it is used to mine salt. It is run by Morton Salt and is
still in operation. The salt is used to de ice roads, etc, not for
table use.


SKay

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, RUTLANDRS@... wrote:

There was one at Fairport Harbor/Grand River Ohio 32 miles East of
Cleveland. B&O had a fair sized yard there in the 50's. I think that
now the salt mine is used for LP gas storage.
Chuck Hladik

-----Original Message-----
From: ed_mines <ed_mines@...>
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wed, 08 Mar 2006 17:27:28 -0000
Subject: [STMFC] Lake Erie based salt mine


There was a salt mine alone Lake Erie (actually beneath the lake)
in
Ohio, near Cleveland I think.

This was written up in RMC some time ago.

Ed







Yahoo! Groups Links






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: Upcoming Intermountain models

Tim Gilbert <tgilbert@...>
 

Schuyler Larrabee wrote:

Thanks, Richard. So, I'm down to buying a couple of Shells and/or SHPX.

Has IM done the gons with steel sides instead of wood? I'd like to see the C&NW and/or the W&LE
done.
Schuyler,

The replacement of the wood sides with steel on IM's USRA Gon should be relatively easy on a kit. The steel framing (done in a plastic) is a separate piece from the laser printed wood sides. Styrene could easily be substituted for these wood sides.

In rebuilding USRA gons, many roads preferred to replace with original USRA steel ends with more modern steel ends. How the replacement of the ends can be accomplished on the IM model may prove much more difficult than substituting steel for wood on the gon's sides.

Tim Gilbert


Re: Covered hopper bulk loads

Schuyler Larrabee
 

there are certainly a number of special types
(asbestos cement, for example).

Kind regards,

Garth G. Groff
Yeah, and refractory cement, too.

SGL


Re: Covered hopper bulk loads

Schuyler Larrabee
 

Jerry Dziedzic


I'm certain that shipping costs made this movement
undesirable for Penn Dixie. I don't know how it was
justified, but here are some theories. P-D may have been
performing maintenance work at one of the Lehigh District
mills, temporarily reducing capacity there. It's also
possible that Lehigh operations were affected by a labor
dispute. In either case, they may have had to fulfill
contract delivery obligations.
Interesting theories, Jerry, but here's some other stuff to chew on: Not all cement is the same!
First of all, there is a variability in the compressive strength of concrete. Some of this comes
from what aggregate is used, but some of it comes from the particular properties of cement. There
are other varieties: Cement that will cure under water; high-early-strength; low-heat generation;
color variations; others I can't think of now (it's been a damn long time since that course in
college!). It's possible that some mills could produce some varieties, and others could not. A
chemist, or a certain materials expert on this list might be able to agree or blow this notion out
of the water.

Incidentally, here's a chance for me to pick on the materials nit that bugs me the most. Cement
does NOT equal concrete. Concrete is made of aggregates, including sand, plus cement. Please don't
tell me about the cement walk in front of your house, or I'll assume you have a walk made of
Ambroid. You have a concrete walk.

SGL


Re: Upcoming Intermountain models

Schuyler Larrabee
 

Thanks, Richard. So, I'm down to buying a couple of Shells and/or SHPX.

Has IM done the gons with steel sides instead of wood? I'd like to see the C&NW and/or the W&LE
done.

SGL

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Richard Hendrickson
Sent: Tuesday, March 07, 2006 11:49 PM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Upcoming Intermountain models

On Mar 7, 2006, at 6:37 PM, Schuyler Larrabee wrote:

What is the accuracy quotient (or lack thereof) for these
models, due
out this fall?

<http://www.intermountain-railway.com/flyer45w.jpg>
Both 8000 and 10000 gal cars there . . .
The SHPX, CGTX and Shell Chemical 8K gal. cars are okay
(though I didn't check to make sure that IM's car numbers are
accurate). The Globe car existed, if at all, only for a very
short time, as Globe disappeared in the petroleum industry
mergers/buyouts/bankruptcies that took place during the depression.

Among the 10K gal. cars, the WRNX Gulf models are okay for
the '60s (but not earlier), Pan-Am Oils (like Globe)
disappeared in the 1930s, the Belcher models are bogus
(Belcher's small fleet were all 10K gal.
Type 21s as correctly modeled by Life-Like), and - as Tony
Thompson has already pointed out - the Southern Pacific cars
are totally bogus as well.

<http://www.intermountain-railway.com/flyer46w.jpg>
Correct for the road names offered?
Almost all of these USRA gondolas were either extensively
rebuilt or retired before/during WW II. The MC model has
'20s lettering; all of these cars were rebuilt by the NYC
with steel bodies during the '30s.
Most of the C&NW and MP cars were rebuilt in the '30s with
Dreadnaught ends and other betterments. The C&O cars,
ex-Hocking Valley, were rebuilt in the '30s with steel sides
and Dreadnaught ends, likewise the W&LE cars and the NC&StL
cars (rebuilt in 1939/'40). The Southern cars were gone from
the roster by the end of WW II, if not earlier. Only the KCS
cars survived in more or less original form until after WW
II, and by 1953 most of them had their wood side sheathing
and floors replaced with steel.

In short, not a lot of good news for prototype modelers here.

Richard Hendrickson







Yahoo! Groups Links







Re: Upcoming Intermountain models

Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Greg Smith wrote:
Your comments below are, as usual, well-informed. But are you saying
that the new IM gondolas are inaccurate altogether, or simply
inaccurate for post-depression modelers? In other words, are the
cars as modeled and lettered by Intermountain accurate for the 1920s?
The model is pretty accurate for an "original" USRA gondola, and there were roads which left them that way. Richard was, as I understood his message, only commenting on the six new paint schemes shown by Intermountain.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Re: Upcoming Intermountain models

luzhin1
 

Richard,

Your comments below are, as usual, well-informed. But are you saying
that the new IM gondolas are inaccurate altogether, or simply
inaccurate for post-depression modelers? In other words, are the
cars as modeled and lettered by Intermountain accurate for the 1920s?

Greg Smith


--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, Richard Hendrickson <rhendrickson@...>
wrote:

Almost all of these USRA gondolas were either extensively rebuilt or
retired before/during WW II. The MC model has '20s lettering; all of
these cars were rebuilt by the NYC with steel bodies during the '30s.
Most of the C&NW and MP cars were rebuilt in the '30s with Dreadnaught
ends and other betterments. The C&O cars, ex-Hocking Valley, were
rebuilt in the '30s with steel sides and Dreadnaught ends, likewise the
W&LE cars and the NC&StL cars (rebuilt in 1939/'40). The Southern cars
were gone from the roster by the end of WW II, if not earlier. Only
the KCS cars survived in more or less original form until after WW II,
and by 1953 most of them had their wood side sheathing and floors
replaced with steel.

In short, not a lot of good news for prototype modelers here.

Richard Hendrickson




Re: ART 1936 reefers in 1950s paint?

Gregg Mahlkov <mahlkov@...>
 

Scott,

Clover House (Russ Clover) makes excellent dry transfer sets for several ART reefers, including the MP-WAB versions. They are available in several scales, including HO, N, and O. See www.cloverhouse.com for information on how to get a catalog.

Russ is a GREAT source for steam era lettering sets.

Gregg Mahlkov
Florida's Forgotten Coast

----------
Scott Pitzer wrote:


Could Oddballs set #546 (for a WOOD reefer, 1950) do the trick, used in combination with another set? Or is the Wabash flag the wrong size?


Re: ART 1936 reefers in 1950s paint?

Scott Pitzer
 

Could Oddballs set #546 (for a WOOD reefer, 1950) do the trick, used in combination with another set? Or is the Wabash flag the wrong size?

Scott Pitzer

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, Scott Pitzer <scottp459@...> wrote:

The Intermountain PFE R-40-10 is very close to some ART cars of
1936, but has it been offered in, or can you get lettering for, the
early 1950s scheme with the MP and Wabash logos?

Scott Pitzer


Re: ART 1936 reefers in 1950s paint?

Scott Pitzer
 

In that article (based on the R-40-23 kit, since at the time it was the closest match available in styrene) he used Champ decals for the as-built "ART shield only" scheme. He indicated "the larger Wabash flag" was the problem with doing the 1950s scheme.
Maybe another article appeared later in a different publication?
Scott Pitzer

-----Original Message-----
From: jerryglow2 <jerryglow@comcast.net>
Sent: Mar 8, 2006 3:10 PM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [STMFC] Re: ART 1936 reefers in 1950s paint?

Charlie Duckworth did an article on modeling one in I believe RPC #2
and used Oddballs decals.


Re: ART 1936 reefers in 1950s paint?

jerryglow2
 

Charlie Duckworth did an article on modeling one in I believe RPC #2
and used Oddballs decals. The car, of course, represents those cars
built before ART went on a building/buying spree on the horizontal
seam cars.

Jerry Glow

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, Scott Pitzer <scottp459@...> wrote:

The Intermountain PFE R-40-10 is very close to some ART cars of
1936, but has it been offered in, or can you get lettering for, the
early 1950s scheme with the MP and Wabash logos?

Scott Pitzer


Re: Union Pacific B-50-19 boxcar details

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Mar 8, 2006, at 2:16 PM, Mark Heiden wrote:

Thanks to all who provided information and, especially, photos of
these cars.  I have a couple more questions I should have added to my
first posting.  They are:

1. Were the underframe and trucks painted the same color as the
carbody in the as-delivered paint scheme?
Yes.

2. What is a good paint match/mix for the original color?  I prefer
Modelflex and Polly Scale paint, but I will use others.
As I seldom use anything but solvent-based paints, I can only recommend
Scalecoat II Oxide Red.

Richard Hendrickson


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Re: And you thought Ebay had all the wildly inflated prices!

Brian Termunde
 

No thanks, both the Amarillo Club and I are trying to quit! <VBG>

Take Care!

Brian R. Termunde
West Jordan, UT
"Ship and Travel the Grand Canyon Line!"

Grand Canyon Railway
Utah District

-----Original Message-----
From: Brian Paul Ehni <behni@comcast.net>
To: STMFC List <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wed, 08 Mar 2006 15:13:15 -0600
Subject: Re: [STMFC] And you thought Ebay had all the wildly inflated prices!

Decimal point, anyone?
--
Thanks!

Brian Ehni


Re: Lake Erie based salt mine

Charles Hladik
 

There was one at Fairport Harbor/Grand River Ohio 32 miles East of Cleveland. B&O had a fair sized yard there in the 50's. I think that now the salt mine is used for LP gas storage.
Chuck Hladik

-----Original Message-----
From: ed_mines <ed_mines@yahoo.com>
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wed, 08 Mar 2006 17:27:28 -0000
Subject: [STMFC] Lake Erie based salt mine


There was a salt mine alone Lake Erie (actually beneath the lake) in
Ohio, near Cleveland I think.

This was written up in RMC some time ago.

Ed







Yahoo! Groups Links


Re: Union Pacific B-50-19 boxcar details

Mark Heiden
 

Hello everyone,

Thanks to all who provided information and, especially, photos of
these cars. I have a couple more questions I should have added to my
first posting. They are:

1. Were the underframe and trucks painted the same color as the
carbody in the as-delivered paint scheme?

2. What is a good paint match/mix for the original color? I prefer
Modelflex and Polly Scale paint, but I will use others.

Thanks
Mark Heiden


Re: And you thought Ebay had all the wildly inflated prices!

Scott Pitzer
 

At first I thought they had a couple of prototype cars for sale (and the insulated PFE might be worth 3x as much as the FW&D box, if you wanted to build a layout in it.)
But they're both sold out items, so maybe that's the "I'll let you have mine if you really, REALLY want it!" price.
Scott Pitzer

-----Original Message-----
From: Brian Paul Ehni <behni@comcast.net>
Sent: Mar 8, 2006 1:13 PM
To: STMFC List <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: Re: [STMFC] And you thought Ebay had all the wildly inflated prices!

Decimal point, anyone?
--
Thanks!

Brian Ehni


ART 1936 reefers in 1950s paint?

Scott Pitzer
 

The Intermountain PFE R-40-10 is very close to some ART cars of 1936, but has it been offered in, or can you get lettering for, the early 1950s scheme with the MP and Wabash logos?

Scott Pitzer


Re: And you thought Ebay had all the wildly inflated prices!

Brian Paul Ehni <behni@...>
 

Decimal point, anyone?
--
Thanks!

Brian Ehni

From: Scott Pitzer <scottp459@earthlink.net>
Reply-To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Wed, 8 Mar 2006 13:10:14 -0800 (GMT-08:00)
To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: [STMFC] And you thought Ebay had all the wildly inflated prices!

http://amarillorailmuseum.com/pfe_r_40_10.html

Scroll down to the bottom part of the page...

Scott Pitzer






Yahoo! Groups Links







And you thought Ebay had all the wildly inflated prices!

Scott Pitzer
 

http://amarillorailmuseum.com/pfe_r_40_10.html

Scroll down to the bottom part of the page...

Scott Pitzer

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