Date   

Re: new products (was BLI vs. Walthers express reefers)

Richard Hendrickson
 

On Sep 22, 2005, at 6:27 AM, Robert Bogie wrote:

Richard,

Do you know if someone is working on a plastic model of the NYC's boxcars
based on the USRA all steel box car, ie like NYC Lot 439-B? Considering how
many were built, this would have to be as good a choice as an X-29 or M-53.
I know that it's being seriously considered, but AFAIK no one is cutting tooling as yet.

Richard Hendrickson


Re: new products (was BLI vs. Walthers express reefers)

Jon Miller <atsf@...>
 

The type V is the "Van Dyke" frameless tank car. These
are offered by Precision Scale in an injection molded kit, but the
model is really of a narrow gauge car that had been converted from a
standard gauge car<
These are actually sold in both gauges. I have two of the standard
gauge kits. The quality of the tank molding was not the greatest but it
works. Most of the fitting are brass.

but the MDC
car needs a completely new frame<
Athearn (via Horizon) is the new owner. I wonder if they might do so
work on this car?

IM and P2K AC&F frames --sic--two relatively accurate frames<
I'm not impressed with the IM frame and thought there had been many
comments on it? We were supposed to get a new one in resin but it never
happened.

Jon Miller
AT&SF
For me time has stopped in 1941
Digitrax, Chief/Zephyr systems, JMRI user
NMRA Life member #2623
Member SFRH&MS


Beer Tank Cars? (was Wine car ops)

benjaminfrank_hom <b.hom@...>
 

Armand Premo wrote:
"Now if beer had been transported in tank cars, I might be
interested."

Larry Jackman replied:
"It is is it not? Coors ships a lot of beer to the east coast for
bottling. How does it go there?"

What's in those CORX tank cars isn't beer - at least not while it's
being shipped. It's wort, which essentially is non-fermented beer
(NOT "beer concentrate" as stated in the following website):
http://www.trainweb.org/midrail/Photos/MISCPhotos/MISCequipstock2.html

FWIW, here's more on the beer making process:
http://www.travelportland.com/media/mbmedkit/mb_brew_process.html

I'm not sure if this was done during our era of interest. There were
far more independent local breweries in existence during the 1950s
than there are today, and Anheuser-Busch was just builing/acquiring
its system of satellite breweries during that decade (Newark 1951,
Los Angeles 1954, Tampa 1959). Until the 1970s, Coors was very much
a regional beer - remember the whole premise of "Smokey and the
Bandit" was to rush a trailer load of Coors back east.


Ben Hom


Re: B&O stenciling and decal nitpicking

lnbill <bwelch@...>
 

Thanks for responding Bob

I will nudge Ted to consider this little detail decal. It makes the
most sense to combine this with other desireable little decal details
of a similar nature. More ideas would be appreciated form others I am
sure.

Bill

--- In STMFC@..., "rwitt_2000" <rmwitt@i...> wrote:
Bill Welch wrote:
I am in the process of decaling Sunshine's B&O's M27f and M15k
and I
notice that near the handgrabs on the left end of each side there
is is
a small rectangular stencil

This is not included in the decals of either. Does a decal exit
for
this stencil somehwere in another set?
Bill,

I believe the answer is no, something for the B&OHS to consider. It
is
a stencil with the painting information: such as the manufacturer
use,
the date, etc. My understanding is that Chris Barkan did the
masters
for Sunshine and in our prior discussions he was unaware of this
stencil.

I possibly have the raw material to make decals as I have copied
this
information from probably over 100 cars, mostly box cars, from my
field observations made in the 1960s. I have examples for cars last
painted in 1955 and 1956. I also have the sheet that explains the
information in the stencil. Unfortunately, many photographs have too
little resolution to resolve this small lettering.

Just last evening I was looking at some Xerox copies of M-55 boxcars
someone kindly sent me and it looks like there may be a start date
just after WWI when the B&O actually began to apply this stencil.

If there are well resolved photos may be Ted Culotta can perform his
magic and create decals from the photos. It would be a nice
addition
for lettering B&O cars for the 1950s, unfortunately beyond the
period
modeled by both Ted and Chris.

Always more question than answers ...

I hope this helps.

Regards,

Bob Witt

P.S. Remember the Class M-15K only ran until ~1955. After 1955 all
these wagon-top boxcars received new AAR style underframes and
received new sub-classes. This happened all at once so there is
very
little overlap where both types of cars ran concurrently.


Re: new products (was BLI vs. Walthers express reefers)

Tim O'Connor
 

Bruce, I like this idea! Maybe it's a good idea for a Sunshine
mini-kit. If there was a rivet-wrapper for the IM body and a
couple of dome castings, would that resemble any prototype?

Tim O.

Multi-dome tanks for the IM and P2K AC&F frames (type 27 and 21
respectively). Again, it seems unlikely that we will see a variety
of multidome tanks, yet we now have two relatively accurate frames
that could accept after-market resin tanks.


Re: Wine car ops

Miller,Andrew S. <asmiller@...>
 

If you believe their current TV ad, they ship their beer in a special
stainless steel train with a bullet-nose steam engine leaking
refrigerant from every car!


regards,

Andy Miller

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of
ljack70117@...
Sent: Thursday, September 22, 2005 9:36 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Wine car ops


On Sep 22, 2005, at 7:47 AM, armand wrote:

Now if beer had been transported in tank cars,I might be
interested.Armand Premo
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tim Gilbert" <tgilbert@...>
To: <STMFC@...>
Sent: Thursday, September 22, 2005 4:36 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Wine car ops
It is is it not? Coors ships a lot of beer to the east coast for
bottling. How does it go there? Although you use the term Beer very
very loosely when you use it with the name Coors.
Thank you
Larry Jackman
ljack70117@...


Re: new products (was BLI vs. Walthers express reefers)

Bruce Smith <smithbf@...>
 

On Sep 22, 2005, at 7:58 AM, Marcelo Lordeiro wrote:

Thanks Tim,
Let's think on some cars and choose one(tank car ?).
Which one?
Regards
Marcelo Lordeiro
Marcelo,

Think about the following:

AC&F type 11 - This was offered by Sunset in brass as the PRR TM8, then in multiple bogus schemes. The Sunset model is "coarse" by today's standards. This was an extremely common tank car for its time, but may be unlikely to get produced in styrene because it is a little too "old". WWII era and after modelers won't need very many to add to their fleets, but they will need one or two. Folks modeling 1911 to the Great Depression will need lots more.

UTLX type X - The type X is the MDC old time tank car, but the MDC car needs a completely new frame. Once could simply offer the frame and detail parts, and let the modeler buy the MDC model for the tank! This is another "old time" tank car that saw service past the middle of the 20th century.

UTLX type V - The type V is the "Van Dyke" frameless tank car. These are offered by Precision Scale in an injection molded kit, but the model is really of a narrow gauge car that had been converted from a standard gauge car. You can convert these kits BACK to their std gauge appearance, but there might be room here for a true std gauge car kit. Again, this is an "old time" car that saw service well past the midpoint of the 20th century.

Multi-dome tanks for the IM and P2K AC&F frames (type 27 and 21 respectively). Again, it seems unlikely that we will see a variety of multidome tanks, yet we now have two relatively accurate frames that could accept after-market resin tanks.

Finally, a completely off the wall suggestion...

Fireless Cooker (aka "Thermos Bottle") - these were steam locomotives that were charged with pressurized steam from an external source and could run for 4-6 hours before needing more steam. Typically they were used in areas where an open flame (ie a firebox) might be dangerous. The most common configuration appears to be 0-6-0. Fireless steam engines were in service up to 1980 (or so)!!


Regards
Bruce

Bruce F. Smith
Auburn, AL
http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/

"Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin
__
/ &#92;
__<+--+>________________&#92;__/___ ________________________________
|- ______/ O O &#92;_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ |
| / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 &#92; | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||
|/_____________________________&#92;|_|________________________________|
| O--O &#92;0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0


Re: Wine car ops

ljack70117@...
 

On Sep 22, 2005, at 7:47 AM, armand wrote:

Now if beer had been transported in tank cars,I might be
interested.Armand Premo
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tim Gilbert" <tgilbert@...>
To: <STMFC@...>
Sent: Thursday, September 22, 2005 4:36 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Wine car ops
It is is it not? Coors ships a lot of beer to the east coast for bottling. How does it go there? Although you use the term Beer very very loosely when you use it with the name Coors.
Thank you
Larry Jackman
ljack70117@...
I wish the buck stopped here as I could use a few


Re: new products (was BLI vs. Walthers express reefers)

Robert Bogie <rbogie@...>
 

Richard,

Do you know if someone is working on a plastic model of the NYC's boxcars
based on the USRA all steel box car, ie like NYC Lot 439-B? Considering how
many were built, this would have to be as good a choice as an X-29 or M-53.

Regards,

Robert Bogie

----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard Hendrickson" <rhendrickson@...>
To: <STMFC@...>
Sent: Thursday, September 22, 2005 5:12 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] RE: new products (was BLI vs. Walthers express reefers)


On Sep 21, 2005, at 10:18 AM, @timboconnor wrote:
Let me predict that -someone- is working on a B&O Wagontop in
plastic. How could they not be? :-) The question remains, will anyone
ever wake up and give us the AAR alternate standard offet hopper?
Yes to both.

Richard Hendrickson





Yahoo! Groups Links





Re: new products (was BLI vs. Walthers express reefers)

Miller,Andrew S. <asmiller@...>
 

I have been kit bashing 4k tank cars for a while. So now that I have
what I need, its time for a manufacturer to make magnificent models in
plastic for $1.95

See
http://www.steamfreightcars.com/modeling/models/millera/ebax3064.html

regards,

Andy Miller

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of
Marcelo Lordeiro
Sent: Thursday, September 22, 2005 8:58 AM
To: STMFC@...
Subject: Re: [STMFC] RE: new products (was BLI vs. Walthers express
reefers)

Thanks Tim,
Let's think on some cars and choose one(tank car ?).
Which one?
Regards
Marcelo Lordeiro
----- Original Message -----


Re: Wine car ops

Brian Paul Ehni <behni@...>
 

Larry has already mentioned one leaking in a yard; how do you think they got
that way?

Seriously, I was using a camera at the time.
--
Thanks!

Brian Ehni

From: "Miller,Andrew S." <asmiller@...>
Reply-To: <STMFC@...>
Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2005 08:53:35 -0400
To: <STMFC@...>
Conversation: [STMFC] Wine car ops
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Wine car ops

Brian,

Is shooting a 40' Pfaudler milk car like shooting an intruder, or like
shooting the bull ? ;-)


regards,

Andy Miller

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of
Brian Paul Ehni
Sent: Wednesday, September 21, 2005 11:44 PM
To: STMFC List
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Wine car ops

Not entirely useless. Chateau Martin owned at least one Pfaudler steel
40'
car, which I shot in Pine Bluff, AK. #CMWX 1008

Sadly, the date falls outside the range of this discussion group (Jan
75).
--

Brian Ehni


Re: new products (was BLI vs. Walthers express reefers)

Marcelo Lordeiro <mrcustom@...>
 

Thanks Tim,
Let's think on some cars and choose one(tank car ?).
Which one?
Regards
Marcelo Lordeiro

----- Original Message -----
From: @timboconnor
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Wednesday, September 21, 2005 5:16 PM
Subject: [STMFC] RE: new products (was BLI vs. Walthers express reefers)


Marcelo, Rule #1: Don't produce limited-run resin/brass kits for cars
that are eventually going to be produced in plastic. There are hundreds
(thousands?) of cars which might sell just a few hundred copies. Any
list would include mechanical reefers (esp a 40 footer), oddball gondolas,
the Utah Coal Route gondolas :-) , small tank cars (PLEASE), and so on.
If you're all set on a hopper car, how about the 3-bay War Emergency
cars? I believe a nice set of drawings exists from a magazine article...
Alternatively, one of the varieties of 4-bay offset hoppers.

Tim O'Connor


> Tim,
> Where can I find the drawings for the AAR alternate standard offset hopper? I
> want to produce a serie of 200 exact to scale cars ( mix of resin and
> photoetching and brass castings ) and could start with this hopper or the 6-dome
> wine car or any other car that you guys could help to choose.
> Marcelo Lordeiro


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Re: Wine car ops

Miller,Andrew S. <asmiller@...>
 

Brian,

Is shooting a 40' Pfaudler milk car like shooting an intruder, or like
shooting the bull ? ;-)


regards,

Andy Miller

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@... [mailto:STMFC@...] On Behalf Of
Brian Paul Ehni
Sent: Wednesday, September 21, 2005 11:44 PM
To: STMFC List
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Wine car ops

Not entirely useless. Chateau Martin owned at least one Pfaudler steel
40'
car, which I shot in Pine Bluff, AK. #CMWX 1008

Sadly, the date falls outside the range of this discussion group (Jan
75).
--

Brian Ehni


Re: Wine car ops

Tim O'Connor
 

I wonder sometimes whether the "abundant photographic evidence"
is more related to the oddity of a car than to quantity.
Tim Gilbert
Of course! But the fact remains that bulk wine travelled quite far
and wide for the reasons Richard explained, and so the cars may be
uncommon, but nevertheless -did- travel many routes. In fact there
are still wine tank cars in service today, but they are big, black
anonymous looking 25,000 gallon jobs (e.g. CWCX 00005, photographed
at Canandiagua Wine in NY in 2004).

Tim O'Connor


Re: Wine car ops

Brian Paul Ehni <behni@...>
 

Obviously, I made a mistake. AR is the abbreviation for Arkansas, not AK!

LOL!

(At least I know someone is reading these!!!!)
--
Thanks!

Brian Ehni

From: Old Sourdough <pmeaton@...>
Reply-To: <STMFC@...>
Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2005 00:17:35 -0800
To: <STMFC@...>
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Wine car ops


At 10:44 PM 9/21/2005 -0500, Brian wrote:
"Not entirely useless. Chateau Martin owned at least one Pfaudler steel 40'
car, which I shot in Pine Bluff, AK. #CMWX 1008

Sadly, the date falls outside the range of this discussion group (Jan 75)."
--

Brian Ehni
======================
Brian,

I wish that I had known you were in Alaska photographing wine cars. I
would have shown you a few other oddities that your camera may have
liked. Many of those would have fit the time frame of this list, even in
1975. I would have had a great deal of trouble finding Pine Bluff,
though. I don't think we have a town by that name here.

Paul Eaton
The Old Sourdough
Ruksakinmakiak, Alaska, US of A


Re: Wine car ops

armprem
 

Now if beer had been transported in tank cars,I might be
interested.Armand Premo

----- Original Message -----
From: "Tim Gilbert" <tgilbert@...>
To: <STMFC@...>
Sent: Thursday, September 22, 2005 4:36 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Wine car ops


Richard Hendrickson wrote:


Wine tank cars would certainly not have been seen on branch lines in
places like Kansas or Georgia. But there is abundant photographic
evidence of them in the trains of the major transcontinental carriers
that served California such as the Santa Fe, Union Pacific/C&NW, and
Southern Pacific/Rock Island/T&NO/SSW, sometimes several of them at one
time, en route to widely scattered destinations.
I wonder sometimes whether the "abundant photographic evidence" is more
related to the oddity of a car than to quantity.

Tim Gilbert





Yahoo! Groups Links









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Re: Wine car ops

ljack70117@...
 

On Sep 22, 2005, at 4:36 AM, Tim Gilbert wrote:

Richard Hendrickson wrote:



Wine tank cars would certainly not have been seen on branch lines in
places like Kansas or Georgia. But there is abundant photographic
evidence of them in the trains of the major transcontinental carriers
that served California such as the Santa Fe, Union Pacific/C&NW, and
Southern Pacific/Rock Island/T&NO/SSW, sometimes several of them at one
time, en route to widely scattered destinations.
I wonder sometimes whether the "abundant photographic evidence" is more
related to the oddity of a car than to quantity.

Tim Gilbert
We had one come through the Emporia Ks yard on the Santa Fe one night. It was leaking. Interesting night that night.
Thank you
Larry Jackman
ljack70117@...
It is said that if you line up all the cars in the world end to end, someone would be stupid enough to try to pass them.


Re: Wine car ops

Tim Gilbert <tgilbert@...>
 

Richard Hendrickson wrote:


Wine tank cars would certainly not have been seen on branch lines in
places like Kansas or Georgia. But there is abundant photographic
evidence of them in the trains of the major transcontinental carriers
that served California such as the Santa Fe, Union Pacific/C&NW, and
Southern Pacific/Rock Island/T&NO/SSW, sometimes several of them at one
time, en route to widely scattered destinations.
I wonder sometimes whether the "abundant photographic evidence" is more related to the oddity of a car than to quantity.

Tim Gilbert


Re: Wine car ops

Old Sourdough <pmeaton@...>
 

At 10:44 PM 9/21/2005 -0500, Brian wrote:
"Not entirely useless. Chateau Martin owned at least one Pfaudler steel 40'
car, which I shot in Pine Bluff, AK. #CMWX 1008

Sadly, the date falls outside the range of this discussion group (Jan 75)."
--

Brian Ehni
======================
Brian,

I wish that I had known you were in Alaska photographing wine cars. I
would have shown you a few other oddities that your camera may have
liked. Many of those would have fit the time frame of this list, even in
1975. I would have had a great deal of trouble finding Pine Bluff,
though. I don't think we have a town by that name here.

Paul Eaton
The Old Sourdough
Ruksakinmakiak, Alaska, US of A


Re: Wine car ops

PBowers <waiting@...>
 

At 11:38 PM 9/21/05, you wrote: If we can get injection-molded styrene
"conversation pieces" like Pfaudler milk reefers, which are entirely
useless to modelers of southern, southwestern, and western RRs, why not
six compartment wine tank cars? - Richard Hendrickson
Richard,
Thank you for your excellent response! I have no problem with the production of models of any car. I also now better understand that the car fits well into more areas than I thought it would. Maybe not into Canada but definitely into the areas you mention.

I know that each area can claim cars that would never fit into a lot of areas. Before the local Canadian Pacific line to Owen Sound was abandoned we had "L" cars used for transporting glass. These assigned service cars were mostly MP cars, 6 MP and 1 CP car if I remember correctly. These cars were all modified bulk end flat cars. I doubt if this one has been modelled often.

Outside of these cars, about the only conversation piece in our area was a vinegar car.

I guess it all comes down to if someone is willing to produce a car, even if it fits on to only one line, someone will buy it. Being a hobby we can be as prototypical or off the wall as we want to be. What is obscure to one is common to another. One of the many things that makes this hobby so interesting!

Peter Bowers


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