Date   

Re: PRR AAR 65 foot gondola

Todd Sullivan
 

Tim,

Your observation is correct, and I noticed it too, although the photo is pretty fuzzy when you enlarge it. 

I once photographed a 52' gon in Port Jervis in the mid-1970s that was painted PC green and lettered PC.  It has all the features of a NYC/Greenville standard 52'-6" drop end mill gon except for rebuild solid ends, but had a class of G31T, which seemed like a PRR class.  I never heard about PRR picking up any of the Greenville gons, so maybe the class was a PC invention.  Who knows?  Unfortunately, I just tossed my copy of PC car diagrams during the move to Texas last week.  Maybe someone out there has a copy, or someone on the PC list.  

Todd Sullivan.


Re: PRR AAR 65 foot gondola

Tim O'Connor
 


Thanks Todd. It's definitely NOT a G26 but the G33 (see attached photo) appears to have several
beefier side posts (a common feature of 1950's gondolas) - but maybe this PC car was rebuilt?

Tim O'Connor



G33?  Blt in or before 1948 and has all full height ribs.

The G26 and G26a had shorter ribs on the side (same length) except for 2 each side where the diagonal part fo the side sheet straightens out at the bottom.

Todd Sullivan.
_._,_._,_

--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: UP B-50-40 from IM UP B-50-52 kits?

Tim O'Connor
 


Richard, I agree - if you already have 'em, go with it.

The only modifications I made to the McKean car - besides better detail parts and the roof hatches -
was the tabs on the side sill. The ends were already riveted (correct) and as you say the roof is correct
too. And the lettering is excellent. The kits come with AAR underframes but that's not important enough
to toss out the models.

Tim O'



On 6/3/2019 12:04 PM, Richard Townsend via Groups.Io wrote:
Which is why I suggested the Evergreen Roundhouse car. Right roof, good graphics, for a car the OP said didn't need to be exact. YMMV. These were just suggested options. If I didn't already have three of the Evergreen Roundhouse cars I would get the Kadee car myself, but I do so I won't.

And just to be clear, the photo posted of the Evergreen B-50-40 is of one paint scheme, but it also came with the earlier scheme. Also, the roof hatches on that car were an option suggested in one of the kits. Both schemes are shown in this eBay listing: https://www.ebay.com/itm/2-McKean-Evergreen-Roundhouse-HO-40-PS-1-Boxcar-Kit-Union-Pacific-NEW-TRUCKS/333213295470?hash=item4d950f636e:g:qsIAAOSwHDlc68~p

Richard Townsend
Lincoln City, OR


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: PRR AAR 65 foot gondola

Brian Carlson
 

Shoot. Couldn’t tell on phone. Todd is probably correct. 

Brian J. Carlson 

On Jun 3, 2019, at 12:12 PM, Bruce Smith <smithbf@...> wrote:

Brian,

I thought exactly the same thing, but the car in the photo has full-length sides stakes at every location, so it is neither G26 or G26A. 

Regards
Bruce


On Jun 3, 2019, at 10:35 AM, Brian Carlson via Groups.Io <prrk41361@...> wrote:

G26 or 26a can’t tell based on the small pic on my phone. They are similar but different to the AAR. Sides stakes is the most obvious difference. 
http://prr.railfan.net/diagrams/PRRdiagrams.html?sel=gon&sz=sm&fr=

Brian J. Carlson 

On Jun 3, 2019, at 11:09 AM, Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:


This surprised me - I didn't think PRR owned any AAR 65 foot gondolas.

Anyone have builder/class data?

https://www.flickr.com/photos/66415287@N02/47970166157/

Tim O'Connor



--
*Tim O'Connor*
*Sterling, Massachusetts*





Re: PRR AAR 65 foot gondola

Bruce Smith
 

Brian,

I thought exactly the same thing, but the car in the photo has full-length sides stakes at every location, so it is neither G26 or G26A. 

Regards
Bruce


On Jun 3, 2019, at 10:35 AM, Brian Carlson via Groups.Io <prrk41361@...> wrote:

G26 or 26a can’t tell based on the small pic on my phone. They are similar but different to the AAR. Sides stakes is the most obvious difference. 
http://prr.railfan.net/diagrams/PRRdiagrams.html?sel=gon&sz=sm&fr=

Brian J. Carlson 

On Jun 3, 2019, at 11:09 AM, Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:


This surprised me - I didn't think PRR owned any AAR 65 foot gondolas.

Anyone have builder/class data?

https://www.flickr.com/photos/66415287@N02/47970166157/

Tim O'Connor



--
*Tim O'Connor*
*Sterling, Massachusetts*





Re: PRR AAR 65 foot gondola

Todd Sullivan
 

G33?  Blt in or before 1948 and has all full height ribs.

The G26 and G26a had shorter ribs on the side (same length) except for 2 each side where the diagonal part fo the side sheet straightens out at the bottom.

Todd Sullivan.


Re: UP B-50-40 from IM UP B-50-52 kits?

Richard Townsend
 

Which is why I suggested the Evergreen Roundhouse car. Right roof, good graphics, for a car the OP said didn't need to be exact. YMMV. These were just suggested options. If I didn't already have three of the Evergreen Roundhouse cars I would get the Kadee car myself, but I do so I won't.

And just to be clear, the photo posted of the Evergreen B-50-40 is of one paint scheme, but it also came with the earlier scheme. Also, the roof hatches on that car were an option suggested in one of the kits. Both schemes are shown in this eBay listing: https://www.ebay.com/itm/2-McKean-Evergreen-Roundhouse-HO-40-PS-1-Boxcar-Kit-Union-Pacific-NEW-TRUCKS/333213295470?hash=item4d950f636e:g:qsIAAOSwHDlc68~p

Richard Townsend
Lincoln City, OR


-----Original Message-----
From: Benjamin Hom <b.hom@...>
To: main <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Sent: Mon, Jun 3, 2019 8:50 am
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] UP B-50-40 from IM UP B-50-52 kits?

Richard Townshend wrote:
"True enough, but at three times the price."

...and a lot less rework required.  When you start bringing up hacking roofs off of other carbodies (frankly, it's just easier removing the corrugations), the point of diminishing returns comes up on you pretty quick. 


Ben Hom


Re: UP B-50-40 from IM UP B-50-52 kits?

Benjamin Hom
 

Richard Townshend wrote:
"True enough, but at three times the price."

...and a lot less rework required.  When you start bringing up hacking roofs off of other carbodies (frankly, it's just easier removing the corrugations), the point of diminishing returns comes up on you pretty quick. 


Ben Hom


Re: UP B-50-40 from IM UP B-50-52 kits?

Richard Townsend
 

True enough, but at three times the price.

Richard Townsend
Lincoln City, OR


-----Original Message-----
From: Benjamin Hom <b.hom@...>
To: main <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Sent: Mon, Jun 3, 2019 6:27 am
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] UP B-50-40 from IM UP B-50-52 kits?

Tim O'Connor wrote:
"This is the McKean model decorated by Evergreen Roundhouse.
It's not exactly correct. If I were building this model NOW, I would use the Kadee pre-1950 PS-1."

Ken, I agree with Tim.  While the Evergreen Roundhouse line has some of the nicest UP factory lettering ever offered, I'd wait until the pre-1950 Kadee PS-1 comes out unless you have an absolute life-or-death immediate need for a Class B-50-40.  The PS-1 is such a ubiquitous prototype that there's surely another off-line car that fits your needs that is closer to the Intermountain model.


Ben Hom


Re: PRR AAR 65 foot gondola

Brian Carlson
 

G26 or 26a can’t tell based on the small pic on my phone. They are similar but different to the AAR. Sides stakes is the most obvious difference. 

On Jun 3, 2019, at 11:09 AM, Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:


This surprised me - I didn't think PRR owned any AAR 65 foot gondolas.

Anyone have builder/class data?

https://www.flickr.com/photos/66415287@N02/47970166157/

Tim O'Connor



--
*Tim O'Connor*
*Sterling, Massachusetts*




PRR AAR 65 foot gondola

Tim O'Connor
 

This surprised me - I didn't think PRR owned any AAR 65 foot gondolas.

Anyone have builder/class data?

https://www.flickr.com/photos/66415287@N02/47970166157/

Tim O'Connor



--
*Tim O'Connor*
*Sterling, Massachusetts*


Re: Photos: Gondola & Boxcar

Tim O'Connor
 


While technically true, the SP wasted no time in erasing EP&SW reporting marks.



On 6/3/2019 10:09 AM, Eric Hansmann wrote:

While the gon is a former EP&SW car, the El Paso & Southwestern company was not merged into the SP until 1955. The SP leased the line starting November 1, 1924, but a formal merging was not until 29 years later.

 

 

Eric Hansmann

Murfreesboro, TN

 

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Rich C via Groups.Io
Sent: Saturday, June 1, 2019 11:02 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photos: Gondola & Boxcar

 

The gon is ex El Paso & South Western. They were not an SP subsidiary, just merged into the SP in 1924.

 

Rich Christie



--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: Photos: Gondola & Boxcar

Eric Hansmann
 

While the gon is a former EP&SW car, the El Paso & Southwestern company was not merged into the SP until 1955. The SP leased the line starting November 1, 1924, but a formal merging was not until 29 years later.

 

 

Eric Hansmann

Murfreesboro, TN

 

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Rich C via Groups.Io
Sent: Saturday, June 1, 2019 11:02 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photos: Gondola & Boxcar

 

The gon is ex El Paso & South Western. They were not an SP subsidiary, just merged into the SP in 1924.

 

Rich Christie


Re: UP B-50-40 from IM UP B-50-52 kits?

Benjamin Hom
 

Tim O'Connor wrote:
"This is the McKean model decorated by Evergreen Roundhouse.
It's not exactly correct. If I were building this model NOW, I would use the Kadee pre-1950 PS-1."

Ken, I agree with Tim.  While the Evergreen Roundhouse line has some of the nicest UP factory lettering ever offered, I'd wait until the pre-1950 Kadee PS-1 comes out unless you have an absolute life-or-death immediate need for a Class B-50-40.  The PS-1 is such a ubiquitous prototype that there's surely another off-line car that fits your needs that is closer to the Intermountain model.


Ben Hom


Re: UP B-50-40 from IM UP B-50-52 kits?

Tim O'Connor
 


This is the McKean model decorated by Evergreen Roundhouse.

It's not exactly correct. If I were building this model NOW, I would use the Kadee pre-1950 PS-1.

Tim O'Connor



On 6/2/2019 11:53 PM, Richard Townsend via Groups.Io wrote:
Here's another alternative. Get rid of the cars you bought, and go on eBay and buy the McKean PS-1 cars that were decorated by Evergreen Roundhouse. They are B-50-40 cars and not too expensive. 

Richard Townsend
Lincoln City, OR



--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: UP B-50-40 from IM UP B-50-52 kits?

Richard Townsend
 

Here's another alternative. Get rid of the cars you bought, and go on eBay and buy the McKean PS-1 cars that were decorated by Evergreen Roundhouse. They are B-50-40 cars and not too expensive. 

Richard Townsend
Lincoln City, OR


-----Original Message-----
From: Ken Adams <smadanek44g@...>
To: main <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Sent: Sun, Jun 2, 2019 3:06 pm
Subject: [RealSTMFC] UP B-50-40 from IM UP B-50-52 kits?

I made a blooper bidding on some IM boxcar kits at an NMRA division meet. I wound up with 3 1957 built B-50-52 PS-1 cars instead of cars I could use built as is in my pre-1955 model era. The kits only cost me a total of $14 for the trio so not a great financial loss. I didn't realize how late they were until I got home and started some research. Relying on uphs.org/boxcars.htm, the only UP Pullman box cars built prior were the B-50-40 series from 1948. So the question is can these be backdated from a B-50-52 to a B-50-40 at least superficially?

I would need

  • Pullman 10/12 roofs to replace the kit 12/12 roof.
  • Superior 6 Panel Doors for a 10'6 car to replace the Pullman doors
  • Appropriate 1948-50 era decals
That would be enough for me. If it were an SP car these days I might be a little more fanatical. At least the roofs and doors are separate parts. I don't mind spending a few dollars to a little bashing to add some variety. 

The kits were old enough that they were marked "Manufactured in Colorado by Intermountain Tooling Specialist Inc."
 Your comments are always tolerated in spite of my thinning hair and skin.

KJA


Re: UP B-50-40 from IM UP B-50-52 kits?

Ed Hawkins
 


On Jun 2, 2019, at 5:06 PM, Ken Adams <smadanek44g@...> wrote:

I made a blooper bidding on some IM boxcar kits at an NMRA division meet. I wound up with 3 1957 built B-50-52 PS-1 cars instead of cars I could use built as is in my pre-1955 model era. The kits only cost me a total of $14 for the trio so not a great financial loss. I didn't realize how late they were until I got home and started some research. Relying on uphs.org/boxcars.htm, the only UP Pullman box cars built prior were the B-50-40 series from 1948. So the question is can these be backdated from a B-50-52 to a B-50-40 at least superficially?

I would need

  • Pullman 10/12 roofs to replace the kit 12/12 roof.
  • Superior 6 Panel Doors for a 10'6 car to replace the Pullman doors
  • Appropriate 1948-50 era decal

Ken,
There are a number of changes that could be made to back-date the model, however, the significant issue is the UP B-50-40 PS-1 box cars built in 1948 came with 6’ door openings while the B-50-52 cars built in 1957 came with 8’ door openings.

To fit your pre-1955 modeling period, there are 40’ PS-1 box cars for other railroads that could be modeled using the same body without changing any primary features. Cars built in 1954 were SL-SF 18050-18549 or USAX 26912-27231 in which only the doors would require substituting with Youngstown or Superior 6-panel, respectively. 

In case you’re not aware, Kadee has announced the UP B-50-40 box car, which is planned for release in September 2019. Kadee is accepting advance reservations on their web site. Hope this helps. 

Regards,
Ed Hawkins







Re: UP B-50-40 from IM UP B-50-52 kits?

Richard Townsend
 

Microscale 87-494 decals


Richard Townsend
Lincoln City, OR


-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Townsend via Groups.Io <richtownsend@...>
To: main <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Sent: Sun, Jun 2, 2019 3:30 pm
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] UP B-50-40 from IM UP B-50-52 kits?

I don't know how much this will help, but you can get the 10/12 roofs from the old McKean PS-1 kits. You would have to cut them off as they are molded integrally with the sides and ends (I have some McKean kits if you want to buy some cheap). The 6' doors of the B-50-40 were 7 panel, not six panel. Such doors are available, including from Kadee, which should be perfect. My ignorance of B-50-40 decals is comprehensive, so help in that regard will have to come from others.

Richard Townsend
Lincoln City, OR


-----Original Message-----
From: Ken Adams <smadanek44g@...>
To: main <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Sent: Sun, Jun 2, 2019 3:06 pm
Subject: [RealSTMFC] UP B-50-40 from IM UP B-50-52 kits?

I made a blooper bidding on some IM boxcar kits at an NMRA division meet. I wound up with 3 1957 built B-50-52 PS-1 cars instead of cars I could use built as is in my pre-1955 model era. The kits only cost me a total of $14 for the trio so not a great financial loss. I didn't realize how late they were until I got home and started some research. Relying on uphs.org/boxcars.htm, the only UP Pullman box cars built prior were the B-50-40 series from 1948. So the question is can these be backdated from a B-50-52 to a B-50-40 at least superficially?

I would need

  • Pullman 10/12 roofs to replace the kit 12/12 roof.
  • Superior 6 Panel Doors for a 10'6 car to replace the Pullman doors
  • Appropriate 1948-50 era decals
That would be enough for me. If it were an SP car these days I might be a little more fanatical. At least the roofs and doors are separate parts. I don't mind spending a few dollars to a little bashing to add some variety. 

The kits were old enough that they were marked "Manufactured in Colorado by Intermountain Tooling Specialist Inc."
 Your comments are always tolerated in spite of my thinning hair and skin.

KJA


Re: UP B-50-40 from IM UP B-50-52 kits?

Richard Townsend
 

I don't know how much this will help, but you can get the 10/12 roofs from the old McKean PS-1 kits. You would have to cut them off as they are molded integrally with the sides and ends (I have some McKean kits if you want to buy some cheap). The 6' doors of the B-50-40 were 7 panel, not six panel. Such doors are available, including from Kadee, which should be perfect. My ignorance of B-50-40 decals is comprehensive, so help in that regard will have to come from others.

Richard Townsend
Lincoln City, OR


-----Original Message-----
From: Ken Adams <smadanek44g@...>
To: main <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Sent: Sun, Jun 2, 2019 3:06 pm
Subject: [RealSTMFC] UP B-50-40 from IM UP B-50-52 kits?

I made a blooper bidding on some IM boxcar kits at an NMRA division meet. I wound up with 3 1957 built B-50-52 PS-1 cars instead of cars I could use built as is in my pre-1955 model era. The kits only cost me a total of $14 for the trio so not a great financial loss. I didn't realize how late they were until I got home and started some research. Relying on uphs.org/boxcars.htm, the only UP Pullman box cars built prior were the B-50-40 series from 1948. So the question is can these be backdated from a B-50-52 to a B-50-40 at least superficially?

I would need

  • Pullman 10/12 roofs to replace the kit 12/12 roof.
  • Superior 6 Panel Doors for a 10'6 car to replace the Pullman doors
  • Appropriate 1948-50 era decals
That would be enough for me. If it were an SP car these days I might be a little more fanatical. At least the roofs and doors are separate parts. I don't mind spending a few dollars to a little bashing to add some variety. 

The kits were old enough that they were marked "Manufactured in Colorado by Intermountain Tooling Specialist Inc."
 Your comments are always tolerated in spite of my thinning hair and skin.

KJA


UP B-50-40 from IM UP B-50-52 kits?

Ken Adams
 

I made a blooper bidding on some IM boxcar kits at an NMRA division meet. I wound up with 3 1957 built B-50-52 PS-1 cars instead of cars I could use built as is in my pre-1955 model era. The kits only cost me a total of $14 for the trio so not a great financial loss. I didn't realize how late they were until I got home and started some research. Relying on uphs.org/boxcars.htm, the only UP Pullman box cars built prior were the B-50-40 series from 1948. So the question is can these be backdated from a B-50-52 to a B-50-40 at least superficially?

I would need

  • Pullman 10/12 roofs to replace the kit 12/12 roof.
  • Superior 6 Panel Doors for a 10'6 car to replace the Pullman doors
  • Appropriate 1948-50 era decals
That would be enough for me. If it were an SP car these days I might be a little more fanatical. At least the roofs and doors are separate parts. I don't mind spending a few dollars to a little bashing to add some variety. 

The kits were old enough that they were marked "Manufactured in Colorado by Intermountain Tooling Specialist Inc."
 Your comments are always tolerated in spite of my thinning hair and skin.

KJA