Date   

Re: Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

Bob Werre
 

I put together that package of the pipe for loads maybe 10-14 years ago.  It worked out fine and as I recall you used a wooden dowel as an armature.  I later made up some larger diameter pipe using corrugated material sold by Triangle models (S scale--not sure if it's still available from the new owner though).  It was slightly thicker but worked out well--just don't drop something on the car or you'll have scrap metal load!  I used Chartpack for strapping.  A good friend used scrap exposed and processed litho film, then painted the final few scale inches with red paint--that was perfect. 

Bob Werre

BobWphoto.com 


Swift Reefers

Steve and Barb Hile
 

As I plunge further into the maelstrom that is the Swift reefer fleet, I wonder if anyone has copies of the Swift pages from an ORER in the early 1920's, say 21-24, and from on in the late 1920's, preferably 1929 that they are willing to share.  I have copies for 25, 26 with quantities and 30 where the quantities go "dark."  The quantities don't reappear until around 1943.
 
Thanks in advance,
Steve Hile
 
 


Re: Modeling USRE rebuild of Columbus & Greenville 3703

O Fenton Wells
 

Very nice Bill, thanks for sharing some early "Welch" photos from the archives
Fenton

On Thu, Oct 17, 2019 at 12:46 PM Bill Welch <fgexbill@...> wrote:

I think my question about USRE rebuilding business awhile was prompted by a model I built many years ago of a Columbus & Greenville rebuilt steel boxcar based on a photo I saw in the Henderson Boxcar Book #1 published I think in the early 1990’s. This may have been my first kit-bash effort and as I was looking at it recently I decided I wanted to go back and make some improvements, mainly taking off the oversize rivets—really NBW’s—and replacing them with harvested rivets (or maybe Tichy’s .020 rivets).

The base model is an Athearn boxcar. The ends are Westerfield’s Murphy ends and Detail Associates Dreadnaught ends spliced together. I think the Youngstown doors are also Westerfield. The steel running board may be Detail Associates or Overland as this model dates from the mid-1990’s before there were other options.

I used Accuflex (long gone now) GN green applied with the Binks Wren “B” I had purchased as a lad. The decals are mostly Walthers while the USRE Map decal is from a Microscale minical for some sort coil car if my memory is correct.

I know the paint scheme was being used by 1957 because the C&G used it on the Pullman PS-1 boxcars they purchased that year. I suspect this rebuild dates from sometime in the 1960’s but in my “Ya’ll” universe it was reweighed in 1954 which coincidentally is when USRE started its business, a fact I did not know when I did the reweigh decals but I like the synchronicity.

I cannot find my Henderson book but Tim O’Conner sent me another prototype photo gleaned from the internet.

Bill Welch



--
Fenton Wells
250 Frye Rd
Pinehurst NC 28374
910-420-8106
srrfan1401@...


Modeling USRE rebuild of Columbus & Greenville 3703

Bill Welch
 

I think my question about USRE rebuilding business awhile was prompted by a model I built many years ago of a Columbus & Greenville rebuilt steel boxcar based on a photo I saw in the Henderson Boxcar Book #1 published I think in the early 1990’s. This may have been my first kit-bash effort and as I was looking at it recently I decided I wanted to go back and make some improvements, mainly taking off the oversize rivets—really NBW’s—and replacing them with harvested rivets (or maybe Tichy’s .020 rivets).

The base model is an Athearn boxcar. The ends are Westerfield’s Murphy ends and Detail Associates Dreadnaught ends spliced together. I think the Youngstown doors are also Westerfield. The steel running board may be Detail Associates or Overland as this model dates from the mid-1990’s before there were other options.

I used Accuflex (long gone now) GN green applied with the Binks Wren “B” I had purchased as a lad. The decals are mostly Walthers while the USRE Map decal is from a Microscale minical for some sort coil car if my memory is correct.

I know the paint scheme was being used by 1957 because the C&G used it on the Pullman PS-1 boxcars they purchased that year. I suspect this rebuild dates from sometime in the 1960’s but in my “Ya’ll” universe it was reweighed in 1954 which coincidentally is when USRE started its business, a fact I did not know when I did the reweigh decals but I like the synchronicity.

I cannot find my Henderson book but Tim O’Conner sent me another prototype photo gleaned from the internet.

Bill Welch


Re: Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

Daniel A. Mitchell
 

The plastic insulation (sometimes nylon) of many kinds of “magnet wire” is NOT removable by lacquer thinner … or much of anything else either. However heating the wire to near red-heat (candle or lighter) will char the coating, making it easily removable with solvents or mild abrasion (sandpaper).

Dan Mitchell
==========

On Oct 17, 2019, at 8:56 AM, Nelson Moyer <npmoyer@...> wrote:

That works, but you can remove the lacquer insulation from magnet wire with a few wipes of lacquer thinner and do the same thing. The large array of wire diameters available as magnet wire give you more control of scale sizes.
 
Nelson Moyer
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of mvlandsw
Sent: Thursday, October 17, 2019 12:42 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Suggestions For Wire Load Ties
 
For very small diameter wire without any insulating coating strip the insulation off of stranded wire used in decoder installations. This should accept chemical blackening.

Mark Vinski 

 

Scanned by McAfee and confirmed virus-free.
 


Re: Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

Nelson Moyer
 

That works, but you can remove the lacquer insulation from magnet wire with a few wipes of lacquer thinner and do the same thing. The large array of wire diameters available as magnet wire give you more control of scale sizes.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of mvlandsw
Sent: Thursday, October 17, 2019 12:42 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

 

For very small diameter wire without any insulating coating strip the insulation off of stranded wire used in decoder installations. This should accept chemical blackening.

Mark Vinski

 


Scanned by McAfee and confirmed virus-free.

 


Re: Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

 

Corrugated pipes for loads are now made by Iowa Scaled Engineering.


Regards,

Colin ‘t Hart
Frösön, Sweden


Re: Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

Mark Vinski
 

For very small diameter wire without any insulating coating strip the insulation off of stranded wire used in decoder installations. This should accept chemical blackening.

Mark Vinski


Re: Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

s shaffer
 

Tim O'Connor writes:


*Jaeger*is the vendor - they don't make that pipe kit anymore. It was a GREAT kit
I just bought one of the kits on ebay. I had been trying to roll my own using heavy and extra heavy aluminum foil and different sizes of all- thread. Was not working well. I need to measure the thickness of the aluminum in the kit which are corrugated flat sheets that you roll around a wood dowel. Campbell Scale Models used to sell corrugated roof metal, but I do not remember how the corrugations were oriented to be useful for making pipe. Only other corrugated metal I have used was in the Suydam metal kits but that is too heavy to roll and somewhat course.

Steve Shaffer
Las Cruces, New Mexico


Re: Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

Tim O'Connor
 


Jaeger is the vendor - they don't make that pipe kit anymore. It was a GREAT kit I just
wish they had expanded the product to include 3 or 4 pipe sizes - these are often shipped
as smaller pipes inside larger pipes, because the pipes are relatively lightweight.

I used Chartpak 1/64 for banding on the pipes.



On 10/16/2019 7:39 PM, gary laakso wrote:

Here is a picture of a Chad Boas GN flat car with an ancient, as in 28 plus years. load of galvanized pipe with straps.  The vendor was Jamiko,( spelling), in a blue and white box.  The material is a synthetic and came in a roll and was used both for a lumber load and for the galvanized pipe.  Likely, the material is available in a craft store. 

 

Gary Laakso

Northwest of Mike Brock

 

Attachments:


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

Douglas Harding
 

Yes it appears my message was in haste, warranting further research. I thank everyone for correcting my error and offering proof of much earlier use of metal strapping.

 

Based on this new information I too can begin using the chart tape on some loads.

 

Doug  Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Nelson Moyer
Sent: Wednesday, October 16, 2019 10:55 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

 

I love it. Every time we get a definitive answer to a question, new material surfaces to disprove it. I guess I’ll keep my steel strap aka chart tape.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Richard Townsend via Groups.Io
Sent: Tuesday, October 15, 2019 11:33 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

 

Apparently its been around since at least the 1920, or even earlier: https://www.madeinchicagomuseum.com/single-post/signode

Richard Townsend

Lincoln City, OR

 

-----Original Message-----
From: David W Beidle <gmnodave@...>
To: main <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Sent: Tue, Oct 15, 2019 8:34 pm
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

Doug  Harding wrote: " The first patent for steel strapping was applied for in 1966."

I won't argue with you about that, but I was using steel banding (strapping) in the Air Force in 1963.

 

Dave Beidle

St Louis

 

 

 


Scanned by McAfee and confirmed virus-free.

 


Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

gary laakso
 

Here is a picture of a Chad Boas GN flat car with an ancient, as in 28 plus years. load of galvanized pipe with straps.  The vendor was Jamiko,( spelling), in a blue and white box.  The material is a synthetic and came in a roll and was used both for a lumber load and for the galvanized pipe.  Likely, the material is available in a craft store. 

 

Gary Laakso

Northwest of Mike Brock

 


Re: Northern Pacific Hopper 70168 upgrade

James E Kubanick
 

Lester,

Good to see one of those old TM hoppers turned into something  close to a prototype car. very impressive!

Jim Kubanick
Morgantown WV

On Wednesday, October 16, 2019, 7:12:03 AM EDT, O Fenton Wells <srrfan1401@...> wrote:


Looking good Lester, well done!!
Fenton

On Tue, Oct 15, 2019 at 5:51 PM Lester Breuer <rforailroad@...> wrote:
I have finished upgrade of Northern Pacific hopper 70168.  A Train-Miniature hopper with offset side side gussets corrected to seven from nine and Archer rivets applied to get correct rivet patterns.   Other upgrade items include wire grab irons, brake gear after opening molded “B” end between braces, adding “B” end brake details as piping, train line, other under body details, and making decals for end numbers.  If you are interested, photos and writeup of the upgrade including paint match are now available on my blog I have to share photos and writeup of modeling projects on my Minneapolis & Northland Railroad Company.   If you would like to take a look please do at the following link:

http://mnrailroadcab100.blogspot.com/

Lester Breuer



--
Fenton Wells
250 Frye Rd
Pinehurst NC 28374
910-420-8106
srrfan1401@...


Re: Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

Dennis Storzek
 

A few rambling thoughts on strapping vs. banding vs. wire...

Are banding and strapping the same? I think not. Banding is the general term for a much older product, which was soft mild steel. Back in my formative years, during the seventies I worked as a construction carpenter on several poured-in-place concrete buildings. We always had a roll of "band iron" for use in situations where form ties just wouldn't work. This was thin mild steel, and the "band puller" was a foot long handle with a hinged jaw at the end. You nailed down one end of the band and threaded the other through the puller, which was hooked around a corner and the handle used to apply leverage. The other end of the band was then nailed down. Two nails were enough; where the nail pierced the metal became a stress concentrator and the band would break at the hole before the nails would pull out. I still have my band puller in the garage somewhere, but I haven't had anything to pull with it in the last forty five years.

Modern steel strapping is semi hard high tensile steel. You won't be driving nails through that. The beauty of the Signode system and those that came after is the design of the buckle and the tool that deforms the buckle and both layers of strapping where they overlap. Tension is provided with another tool that grasps both layers of strapping and pulls one over the other, then the crimp through the buckle keeps them from sliding back

Wire (round steel wire, not cable) was the traditional tension tie because it could be installed with minimal tools. The wire, or multiple strands of wire, were looped around the pair of stakes and either spliced to themselves or both ends fastened to the same stake. A bar or pipe could then be inserted in the loop, and the wires twisted together. The more they were twisted, the shorter they became, pulling the stakes together and developing tension between them. The bar or pipe was then secured so the wires could not untwist. Simple and effective. 

Dennis  Storzek


NYSW 1950 or close ORER information

David
 

July 1950 gives 25 cars in series 5000-5491, no individual numbers. January 1953 is down to five cars: 5039, 5144, 5191, 5391, 5396.

David Thompson


Re: Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

Nelson Moyer
 

Never mind. I figured out that I need to use the Permanent Ling to This Book URL. It’s now working.

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Nelson Moyer
Sent: Wednesday, October 16, 2019 3:06 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

 

I downloaded and installed the download helper program, and when I enter the book URL, I get an invalid URL message.

 

https://catalog.hathitrust.org/Record/102184919?type%5B%5D=all&lookfor%5B%5D=Rules%20governing%20the%20loading%20of%20commodities&ft=ft

 

This URL isn’t working. What am I doing wrong?

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Douglas Harding
Sent: Wednesday, October 16, 2019 10:57 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

 

This program will allow you to download entire books from hathitrust, even if you do not belong to a member institution.

https://sourceforge.net/projects/hathidownloadhelper/

 

Doug  Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Dave Parker via Groups.Io
Sent: Wednesday, October 16, 2019 10:33 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

 

Claus:

Here is the link to the 1934 Loading Rules:

https://catalog.hathitrust.org/Record/102184919?type%5B%5D=all&lookfor%5B%5D=Rules%20governing%20the%20loading%20of%20commodities&ft=ft

Anybody can peruse the document on-line, but you need to belong to a member institution to download the PDF.

--
Dave Parker
Swall Meadows, CA

 


Scanned by McAfee and confirmed virus-free.

 


Re: Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

Nelson Moyer
 

I downloaded and installed the download helper program, and when I enter the book URL, I get an invalid URL message.

 

https://catalog.hathitrust.org/Record/102184919?type%5B%5D=all&lookfor%5B%5D=Rules%20governing%20the%20loading%20of%20commodities&ft=ft

 

This URL isn’t working. What am I doing wrong?

 

Nelson Moyer

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Douglas Harding
Sent: Wednesday, October 16, 2019 10:57 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

 

This program will allow you to download entire books from hathitrust, even if you do not belong to a member institution.

https://sourceforge.net/projects/hathidownloadhelper/

 

Doug  Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Dave Parker via Groups.Io
Sent: Wednesday, October 16, 2019 10:33 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

 

Claus:

Here is the link to the 1934 Loading Rules:

https://catalog.hathitrust.org/Record/102184919?type%5B%5D=all&lookfor%5B%5D=Rules%20governing%20the%20loading%20of%20commodities&ft=ft

Anybody can peruse the document on-line, but you need to belong to a member institution to download the PDF.

--
Dave Parker
Swall Meadows, CA


Re: Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

Tim O'Connor
 


Circa 1950




On 10/16/2019 7:06 AM, earlyrail wrote:
Re: Suggestions For Wire Load Ties
From: Douglas Harding
Date: Tue, 15 Oct 2019 19:53:04 PDT

According to https://patents.google.com/patent/US3421951

The first patent for steel strapping was applied for in 1966.



This can not be true.
I help my dad apply steel strapping in the mid to late 50's.
Dad was a car inspector/repairman for the CGW in Randolph, MN at the time.
They had all the strapping, clips and tools required.

Howard Garner


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


Re: Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

Bruce Smith
 

Steve,

The reweigh on the NYC flat carrying the corrugated pipes appear to be “10-43” which would mean circa 1945 at the latest ;)

Regards

Bruce


Bruce F. Smith            

Auburn, AL

"Some days you are the bug, some days you are the windshield."




On Oct 16, 2019, at 10:36 AM, James SANDIFER <steve.sandifer@...> wrote:

36 gauge magnet wire, like we use on 403 LEDs. 
 
By the way, when did the railroad begin shipping corrugated pipe like in the photo. Being a specific modeler, I want to confirm the time frame for such shipments. Likewise be careful of painting the ends of pipe or wood if you model the steam era. 


Re: Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

Douglas Harding
 

This program will allow you to download entire books from hathitrust, even if you do not belong to a member institution.

https://sourceforge.net/projects/hathidownloadhelper/

 

Doug  Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Dave Parker via Groups.Io
Sent: Wednesday, October 16, 2019 10:33 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Suggestions For Wire Load Ties

 

Claus:

Here is the link to the 1934 Loading Rules:

https://catalog.hathitrust.org/Record/102184919?type%5B%5D=all&lookfor%5B%5D=Rules%20governing%20the%20loading%20of%20commodities&ft=ft

Anybody can peruse the document on-line, but you need to belong to a member institution to download the PDF.

--
Dave Parker
Swall Meadows, CA

13861 - 13880 of 181263