Date   

Re: Throwback Thursday: Athearn Rolling Stock Ad, Model Railroader, February 1959

Benjamin Hom
 

James Lackner asked:
“And did any of these (in this advertisement), ever match a specific prototype?  All that I have ever seen is "similar to, but not an exact match to...."

The issue with these models, specifically, the two flat cars and the tank cars is that prototype matches are coincidental rather than intentional.  This is why you see the caveat “similar to, but not an exact match.”   


Comments on Garth’s assessments:

“Some but not many. The 40' flatcar (a hold-over from the metal kits, by the way) only has a Rutland Prototype.”

Again, not an exact prototype, though a good starting point for models as illustrated by John Nehrich, Kyle Williams, and Will Gill in past articles in MR and RMC.  Not just Rutland either; keep in mind that the Rutland was under NYC control between 1904-1911, so their freight car fleet reflected NYC design practices.  In this case, this would be Lot 344-F and 345-F flat cars, originally built for the Michigan Central, later going to CASO and NYC during the late 1930s system renumbering.
http://www.canadasouthern.com/caso/images/caso-482857.jpg   

The metal flat car kits feature an interesting combination of stamped metal parts and castings, including a stamped metal strip of stake pockets that fit on the inside of the carbody.
 

“Their 40' tank car is similar to SP, WP and UP 12K tanks, but has a lot of problems as it was a retool of their foobie 3-dome tank.”

Not the tank car from this ad (the 40 ft “chemical” insulated tank car), which is a further development from the tank cars that Garth describes, which are the non-insulated single and three dome tank cars.  What Garth says is true, but these models are salvageable and still the only non-brass game in town for the SP, WP, ad UP 12,000 gallon tank cars.  Tony Thompson has a nice writeup on how to use these models on his blog.

http://modelingthesp.blogspot.com/2011/05/modeling-sp-tank-cars.html  


Plus another writeup on salvaging the “Chemical” tank car model:
http://modelingthesp.blogspot.com/2010/12/upgrading-old-models-2.html  


“Their 40' 10'6" IH square-corner boxcar was used only by two or three railroads.”

Specifically, the combination of 10 ft 6 in IH, 5/5 square corner Dreadnaught ends, 10-panel sides, rectangular panel roof, and Youngstown door makes this ubiquitous model good for only three railroads: IC, SOO, DSS&A.  This is one of the two most ill-used models of all time, decorated in any paint and lettering scheme applied to any prototype 40 ft boxcars, and some 50 ft and 36 ft prototypes too.


“The hoppers aren't too bad.”

None of them were in the ad that I posted…but since we’re discussing them:

- The 40 ft offset quad is the ARA standard 70-ton quadruple hopper, with details modeling B&O Class W-2.  It has not aged well, and the operating doors are especially overscale and toylike.  It is the second of the two most ill-used models of all time, decorated in any hopper paint and lettering scheme and copied by many other manufacturers (Tyco, Rivarossi/Roco/AHM/Mehano, Cox/Bachmann) who offered even more bogus schemes.  (There are actually quite a few legitimate paint schemes for these cars.)

- The three twin hopper models were actually introduced in the early 1970s, making them latecomers in the Blue Box line.  The offset twin is probably the nicest model in the Blue Box line; the composite twin is nice with the exception of reusing the offset model’s tooling for the interior, resulting in interiors that make absolutely no sense; the 7-side post model is a foobie that coincidentally is close to similar PRR and Virginian prototypes.  It also suffers from reusing the offset model’s interior.
 

Bill Keene asked:
“Wasn't Athearn's stock car based upon a Union Pacific prototype?”

Garth replied:
“Supposedly, but I understand it is so bad that I didn't mention same. I seem to remember the roof panels are backwards.”

UP Class S-40-12.
https://donstrack.smugmug.com/UtahRails/Union-Pacific/UP-Freight-Cars/i-VCQBnhr/A
The roof is the biggest issue – the diagonal panels are the mirror image of the prototype.  Otherwise, it’s actually not too bad.


Notes on other cars in the ad:

- The derrick and work caboose are imagineered models to reuse the tooling for the 40 ft flatcar.

- The containers on the frozen food gon are legit models of refrigerated containers, N&W IIRC.

- The TOFC flat is basically a toy, though the trailers are a start for short trailers of the era.

- The Auto Loader is patterned after an experimental Evans prototype, but is shortened to fit the Athearn 50 ft flat car.
http://www.canadasouthern.com/caso/NYC-EARLY-AUTORACK-STORY.jpg  

 
Garth wrote:
“In my view, most Athearn cars are useful as fodder for conversions” and
“Some features on most Athearn cars are prototype, and could be used for slice-and-dice conversions, but you still have to get rid of all the cast-on ladders and such. Often there are, or have been, better solutions available.”

There are often better solutions available…but there’s immense learning value from these projects.  The plastic is easy to work with; the models and parts are abundant and inexpensive if you take your time and keep looking, and the consequences of making mistakes during the learning process are fairly low.  It’s easy to turn up your nose on these models, and going with better models is preferred, but there’s still a lot of fun to be had if you want to use up the ones you already have.


Ben Hom










Re: Bucyrus decals?

StephenK
 

Champ had two sets:  

BRH-32 Generic Wrecking Crane set in white (also in Black as BRH-33).  Champs description:  "This set contains SUPER DETAIL lettering for many, many wrecking train cars, including a minimum of two wrecking CRANES and all the various cars used in a wrecking train...all the data, numbers and misc. lettering you need is in this set."

HC-299:  Bucyrus-Erie Wrecking Crane in white.  

Of course, Champ is long gone, but EBay is loaded with their decals:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Champ-Decals-BRH-33-HO-Gould-Wrecking-Train-Cranes-Cars-Decal-Set-Black/391829154018?hash=item5b3ad668e2:g:yiUAAOSw4DJYiPk4


Steve Kay


West India Fruit & Steamship Company (W.I.F.) Box Car 323

Lester Breuer
 

After receiving a request from a friend I have added a new post for West India Fruit & Steamship Company (W.I.F.) Box Car 323 to my blog.  If you are interested in viewing photos of finished car and writeup of build, you can on my blog I have to share photos and writeup of modeling projects on my Minneapolis & Northland Railroad Company.  If you would like to take a look please do at the following link:

http://mnrailroadcab100.blogspot.com/

Lester Breuer


Re: Throwback Thursday: Athearn Rolling Stock Ad, Model Railroader, February 1959

Garth Groff <sarahsan@...>
 

Bill,

Supposedly, but I understand it is so bad that I didn't mention same. I seem to remember the roof panels are backwards. Some features on most Athearn cars are prototype, and could be used for slice-and-dice conversions, but you still have to get rid of all the cast-on ladders and such. Often there are, or have been, better solutions available.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff

On 4/12/19 2:24 AM, Bill Keene via Groups.Io wrote:
Garth,

Wasn't Athearn's stock car based upon a Union Pacific prototype?

Cheers,
Bill Keene
Irvine, CA


On Apr 11, 2019, at 11:13 PM, Garth Groff <sarahsan@...> wrote:

Jim,

Some but not many. The 40' flatcar (a hold-over from the metal kits, by the way) only has a Rutland Prototype. Their 40' tank car is similar to SP, WP and UP 12K tanks, but has a lot of problems as it was a retool of their foobie 3-dome tank. Their 40' 10'6" IH square-corner boxcar was used only by two or three railroads. Their cupola caboose is ATSF and similar to some CRR cars (different steps), while their bay window is SP. The crane matches up to closely to several prototypes. The hoppers aren't too bad. None of these are perfect, and I'm sure all of you are going to enjoy picking my suggestions apart. In my view, most Athearn cars are useful as fodder for conversions.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff

On 4/11/19 6:50 PM, James Lackner wrote:
And did any of these (in this advertisement), ever match a specific
prototype?  All that I have ever seen is "similar to, but not an exact
match to...."

Jim Lackner







Re: Throwback Thursday: Athearn Rolling Stock Ad, Model Railroader, February 1959

Bill Keene
 

Garth,

Wasn't Athearn's stock car based upon a Union Pacific prototype?

Cheers,
Bill Keene
Irvine, CA


On Apr 11, 2019, at 11:13 PM, Garth Groff <sarahsan@...> wrote:

Jim,

Some but not many. The 40' flatcar (a hold-over from the metal kits, by the way) only has a Rutland Prototype. Their 40' tank car is similar to SP, WP and UP 12K tanks, but has a lot of problems as it was a retool of their foobie 3-dome tank. Their 40' 10'6" IH square-corner boxcar was used only by two or three railroads. Their cupola caboose is ATSF and similar to some CRR cars (different steps), while their bay window is SP. The crane matches up to closely to several prototypes. The hoppers aren't too bad. None of these are perfect, and I'm sure all of you are going to enjoy picking my suggestions apart. In my view, most Athearn cars are useful as fodder for conversions.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff

On 4/11/19 6:50 PM, James Lackner wrote:
And did any of these (in this advertisement), ever match a specific
prototype?  All that I have ever seen is "similar to, but not an exact
match to...."

Jim Lackner






Re: Throwback Thursday: Athearn Rolling Stock Ad, Model Railroader, February 1959

Garth Groff <sarahsan@...>
 

Jim,

Some but not many. The 40' flatcar (a hold-over from the metal kits, by the way) only has a Rutland Prototype. Their 40' tank car is similar to SP, WP and UP 12K tanks, but has a lot of problems as it was a retool of their foobie 3-dome tank. Their 40' 10'6" IH square-corner boxcar was used only by two or three railroads. Their cupola caboose is ATSF and similar to some CRR cars (different steps), while their bay window is SP. The crane matches up to closely to several prototypes. The hoppers aren't too bad. None of these are perfect, and I'm sure all of you are going to enjoy picking my suggestions apart. In my view, most Athearn cars are useful as fodder for conversions.

Yours Aye,


Garth Groff

On 4/11/19 6:50 PM, James Lackner wrote:
And did any of these (in this advertisement), ever match a specific
prototype?  All that I have ever seen is "similar to, but not an exact
match to...."

Jim Lackner






Re: Throwback Thursday: Athearn Rolling Stock Ad, Model Railroader, February 1959

Richard Bale <Rhbale@...>
 

Irv Athearn lead a rather frugal lifestyle, just he and his wife in a double-wide trailer a few miles from the office. What made me remember that was seeing the Cadillac's in the Blue Box auto carrier in the ad Ben posted. They were inspired by the big Cadillac driven by the Mrs., one of the few extravagances in the Athearn family.
Richard Bale 

In a message dated 4/11/2019 3:04:42 PM Pacific Standard Time, b.hom@... writes:

This is why I laugh when I see panic over the retirement of Athearn Blue Box kits...some of them were in continuous production for over 50 years by the time kits were discontinued in 2009.  If you can't find these on the secondary market, you're just not trying.


Ben Hom


Re: Throwback Thursday: Athearn Rolling Stock Ad, Model Railroader, February 1959

James Lackner
 

And did any of these (in this advertisement), ever match a specific
prototype? All that I have ever seen is "similar to, but not an exact
match to...."

Jim Lackner


Throwback Thursday: Athearn Rolling Stock Ad, Model Railroader, February 1959

Benjamin Hom
 

This is why I laugh when I see panic over the retirement of Athearn Blue Box kits...some of them were in continuous production for over 50 years by the time kits were discontinued in 2009.  If you can't find these on the secondary market, you're just not trying.


Ben Hom


Re: You have been removed from main@RealSTMFC.groups.io

John Hagen <sprinthag@...>
 

Ya knows, your opinion is always welcome here in these USofA.

So is counter opinions.

It always amazes me when I see people slamming anything from, in this case, Microsoft. It also happens with other major companies.

In regards your comment about Outlook being something scary, I’ve only have been using it since around 1995-96. Occasional glitches? Sure, but nothing of any consequence.  Just saying I feel it works mighty fine.

Really, the one company I would not deal with at all if it were possible is Google. Some of their stuff on the web that we have no choice but to use does work okay; others I have tried has been nothing but a hassle.

But that is a minor point. What gripes me is the near monopoly given to Google by our “servants” in Washington. All of them, regardless of party affiliation.

People complain about he government spying on us common folk. Well, let them. I don’t do anything to piss them and they leave me alone, well, at least as much as the other poor peons out there.

But Google spying is very deep and very consistent. And they SELL all our privacy to as many organizations who are willing to pay for it. I just read a few days ago about some other way they are about to force more of their self-serving programing down our throats.

Anyway, that’s the way I see I it.

We now return to our normal programing.

Thank you for listening,

John Hagen

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Tim O'Connor
Sent: Thursday, April 11, 2019 2:11 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] You have been removed from main@RealSTMFC.groups.io

 


Andy, it happens. The best thing to do is to contact an administrator AFTER first checking the web site
to make sure you are still subscribed to the mailing list. A lot of email services are doing things that we
don't want them to do in the name of "convenience". I miss Eudora so much! I'm using Thunderbird and
it's about the crappiest email program ever... after Outlook that is. (shudder)

Tim O'


Re: Bucyrus decals?

 

Jerry,

Jim is correct, the Tichy set #9310 has text that reads "The Buycrus Co." in text that looks right for the boom of their derrick.  The way I've spelt it here is the way it is on the sheet, so you'll have some cutting/pasting to do.  The 9310 is white, gothic style text, but they have other options:

https://www.tichytraingroup.com/Shop/tabid/91/c/ho_decals/Default.aspx


Regards,

Mike Aufderheide


Re: Grain Loading Limit Stencils

Rich C
 

Thanks Jerry 

On Thursday, April 11, 2019, 5:40:30 AM CDT, jerryglow2 <jerryglow@...> wrote:


I created a PDF of floors an interior walls to print on light cardstock and glue inside a car. Guess I should add some of these marks near the door opening. BTW feel free to use the file.


Re: You have been removed from main@RealSTMFC.groups.io

Tim O'Connor
 


Andy, it happens. The best thing to do is to contact an administrator AFTER first checking the web site
to make sure you are still subscribed to the mailing list. A lot of email services are doing things that we
don't want them to do in the name of "convenience". I miss Eudora so much! I'm using Thunderbird and
it's about the crappiest email program ever... after Outlook that is. (shudder)

Tim O'


On 4/11/2019 3:01 PM, Andy Carlson wrote:

I received this email this morning from Group io. It said to resume subscription to click there. I have not received any STMFC emails since, though I complied with their instructions. Do I need to reapply to the administration? I have no clue as to why a group email to me was scammed.

Hello,

Because your Email Service Provider reported to us that one or more messages sent to you from main@RealSTMFC.groups.io has been marked as spam you have been automatically removed from the group. We suggest that you check your spam box as soon as possible to see if your Email Service Provider has diverted legitimate messages into it.

You will receive no more emails from that group. If this was a mistake, you can resume your subscription within the next 7 days by clicking the following link:

Resume Subscription

Groups.io groups offer several options for controlling how much and what types of emails to receive. See this Help Center article for more information.

If this happens repeatedly please check with your email service to learn about how they decide to send feedback reports to list services (such as Groups.io groups).



--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts


You have been removed from main@RealSTMFC.groups.io

Andy Carlson
 



I received this email this morning from Group io. It said to resume subscription to click there. I have not received any STMFC emails since, though I complied with their instructions. Do I need to reapply to the administration? I have no clue as to why a group email to me was scammed.

Hello,

Because your Email Service Provider reported to us that one or more messages sent to you from main@RealSTMFC.groups.io has been marked as spam you have been automatically removed from the group. We suggest that you check your spam box as soon as possible to see if your Email Service Provider has diverted legitimate messages into it.

You will receive no more emails from that group. If this was a mistake, you can resume your subscription within the next 7 days by clicking the following link:

Resume Subscription

Groups.io groups offer several options for controlling how much and what types of emails to receive. See this Help Center article for more information.

If this happens repeatedly please check with your email service to learn about how they decide to send feedback reports to list services (such as Groups.io groups).

Cheers,
The Groups.io Team


Re: Attaching parts to brass models.

Tim O'Connor
 

I have used epoxy to attach parts to brass with excellent results - including a trip through the
150 degree oven to "bake" the Scalecoat paint. I would never trust CA for this application. For
tiny parts like NBW I would try either 'canopy' white glue, or diluted contact cement - assuming
you can make it invisible.

Tim O'Connor

On 4/11/2019 9:02 AM, Bruce Smith wrote:
Jared,

I don’t foresee any major problems. We all wash and grit blast CA applied details all the time. As Paul noted, make sure the surfaces are clean.  I would consider grit blasting the brass prior to using CA to apply details just to give the brass a bit more “tooth” to hold with the CA but metal to meat and plastic to metal are two of the best surfaces to get good CA bonds.

When you’re done with the details, just wash in dish soap (Dawn) and water with a soft toothbrush. Gentle scrubbing should be fine. Then, when dry, I would grit blast, wash again, and paint.
--
*Tim O'Connor*
*Sterling, Massachusetts*


Re: Bucyrus decals?

James E Kubanick
 

Tichy might have something you can use in their set for their wreck crane kit.

Jim Kubanick
Morgantown WV

On Wednesday, April 10, 2019, 8:06:54 PM EDT, Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:


I recently purchased to HO-Scale Bucyrus cranes from  Reynauld's Euro Imports, Inc and was wondering if anyone knew of a source for Bucyrus decals?  I want to load the cranes on a flat car (freight car content), and need to get them lettered.

Thanks,

Jerry Michels


Re: Bucyrus decals?

Jerry Michels
 

Thanks Tim.  Curious.  I tried a Google search and did not find this site.  Oh well.  Sorry to take up time, but I thought someone might have used Bucyrus decals before.

Jerry Michels


Re: Attaching parts to brass models.

Bruce Smith
 

Jared,

I don’t foresee any major problems. We all wash and grit blast CA applied details all the time. As Paul noted, make sure the surfaces are clean.  I would consider grit blasting the brass prior to using CA to apply details just to give the brass a bit more “tooth” to hold with the CA but metal to meat and plastic to metal are two of the best surfaces to get good CA bonds. 

When you’re done with the details, just wash in dish soap (Dawn) and water with a soft toothbrush. Gentle scrubbing should be fine. Then, when dry, I would grit blast, wash again, and paint.

Regards

Bruce


Bruce F. Smith            

Auburn, AL

"Some days you are the bug, some days you are the windshield."




On Apr 10, 2019, at 10:01 PM, Jared Harper <harperandbrown@...> wrote:

I have been detailing a Balboa Santa Fe gas electroc to resemble M.177.  
So far I have been soldering everything but I have gotten to the point of wanting to attach nut-bolt-washer castings to the radiators.  I am thinking CA but when it comes time to paint the model I will want to clean it.  How do I clean it without detaching the n-b-w's.

Jared Harper
Athens, GA


Re: SAL AF-4 and AF-3

O Fenton Wells
 

Thanks Jerry, the decals are from Speedwitch and are beautiful. 


On Apr 9, 2019, at 9:03 AM, Jerry Breon <jbreon@...> wrote:

Those are some nice looking cars Fenton. I'm a long time PRR modeler, but since relocating to NC those y'all road cars are becoming more and more attractive. Have always like the Seaboard graphics.

Jerry Breon
Mooresville, NC

SAL AF-4 and AF-3 
From: O Fenton Wells
Date: Fri, 05 Apr 2019 14:53:36 EDT 

Here are two cars just finished.  The AF-4 was first and I didn't do a very good job on the Kadee roofwalk, the AF-3 was second and is much better almost excellent.  I'm learning. The AF-3 was a RC 40 DD , W corner car with Speedwitch doors and decals.  And yes I learned how to apply those decals better as well, thanks to members on this list. 
The AF-4 was greatly aided by information from Pat Wider, thanks Pat.  It's basically an early welded PS-1 with modified roof and ends.  Southwest Scale doors modified to be DD's and Speedwitch decals.  Still learning how to mount the Kadee brake steps so they are horizontal and not crooked.  Practice, practice,. practice....and hopefully I'll get better.
The AF-5 is next and we are making new doors and ends in resin for that.
Fenton



Re: Attaching parts to brass models.

Paul Woods <paul@...>
 

Hi Jared

I would suggest cleaning the model prior to adding the NBW castings, then handle as little as possible while adding the castings and finish up by cleaning the areas with NBW castings using a very soft brush such as an artists brush and soapy water.  From my experience with CA and epoxy glues in the marine industry, both of them are very good so long as the surfaces being joined are very clean, so it's a good idea to wash the model before applying the glue in any case.

I am assuming that the NBW's are plastic and not brass - I would never glue brass details on; I would sweat them on using a low-temp solder that contains silver (so that it won't build up and hide detail) otherwise you might as well save the cost of the brass castings and use plastic.

Regards
Paul Woods

Whangarei, NZ