Date   

Re: Photo: Erie Boxcar 86601 (1915)

Donald B. Valentine
 

This is one of the Erie’s version of what is properly known as the Dominion car. Whether in incorporated

use of the Fowler patent used for the first few thousand Dominion cars constructed I do not know. The N.C.&St.L. also had cars of this type.

 

Cordially, Don Valentine

 

 


Re: Proto 2000 Stock Car

Rich Yoder
 

Hi Ray,

What’s your source of information for the “Stretching of the 36” Mather stock cars to 40”?

Rich Yoder

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Ray Breyer via groups.io
Sent: Monday, September 21, 2020 5:23 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io; main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Proto 2000 Stock Car

 

Yes and no. Those original 40 foot Mather stock cars were stretched 36-footers, which they had too many of and which nobody wanted to lease. They started stretching them around 1928, but forgot that the center sills were a bit small (6" C channel, IIRC). They tended to sag a little too much, so Mather added two trussrods along the center sill to strengthen it (traditionally, trussrods are used to hold an all-wood BODY together, not a steel frame).

 

By the early Depression years the stretched cars, and the newly built 40-footers, had a stronger underframe, and the trussrods were eliminated. I have a few photos of WWII-era Mather cars that still have the rods, mostly on long term lease C&NW cars.

 

Ray Breyer
Elgin, IL

 

 

 

On Monday, September 21, 2020, 06:08:54 AM CDT, Bill Welch <fgexbill@...> wrote:

 

 

[Edited Message Follows]

Circa 1939 photos I own show L&N and CNW Mather stock cars with truss rod u/f.

Bill Welch


Roundhouse MP Auto Car Completed

golden1014
 

Hi Guys,

Thought you'd like to se my MP auto car I just finished this weekend.  I used Ted's decal set and the model turned out pretty well.  It has a few problems, namely the door tracks are completely prototypical, and I left in the lumber door in the A end.  Also I need to swap out the trucks with TMW spring-plankless type.  I'll do an extensive write-up on my blog soon.





John Golden


Re: What car is this on the Rio Grande?

Jim Allen
 

Thank you for the info on Silver Streak.  I’m an O scaler. 

Jim Allen
Visit www.oscaledirectory.com


--
Jim Allen
Utah


Re: Question about weathering

Aley, Jeff A
 

Brianna, it seems, independently discovered one of the corollaries to Murphy’s Law: “There are two kinds of dirt – the dark kind, which is attracted to light objects, and the light kind, which is attracted to dark objects.”

 

Regards,

 

-Jeff

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Bruce Smith
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2020 7:43 AM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Question about weathering

 

Ray, Jim,

 

Additional commentary interspersed ;)

 

On Sep 23, 2020, at 9:21 AM, Jim Betz <jimbetz@...> wrote:

 

  2) Darker colors on the roof and lighter colors on the bottom.

 

As a rule of thumb, everything goes towards a mid-tone. Brianna, my daughter, and I gave a clinic at an SER NMRA annual convention when she was the tender age of 5. She had many things to contribute, but perhaps the most seminal was “If it is light, make it darker, and if it is dark, make it lighter”.  BTW, the old theater adage “don’t work with children and animals” is entirely true. Brianna stole the show. 

 

And no pressure, but if a 5-year old can weather cars, so can you ;)



  3) Cars sit more than they move - a lot more.  So any "streaks"
       need to be vertical rather than horizontal.

 

Except passenger cars and head end cars, which may have a more all-over weathering pattern, with some horizontal aspects. Locomotives also have patterns that both relate to gravity and movement.



  5) A final light dusting with an air brush helps a lot - I call this the
      "blending coat" - I usually use a very thin "weathered black" color
      for this but have also used just dullcoat and other such.

 

Vary this color to vary your weathering. Alternative are Harbor Mist Grey, Railroad tie brown, 



  6) Weathered equipment is never "shiny".

 

In real life, some equipment can retain a shine, whilst being weathered. However, I have never found that gloss looks anything but “toy-like” on a model, even if the prototype was shiny.



 10) Rust is a job best done sparingly.

 

And remember that there are infinite shades of rust.

 

P.S. There are many different 'methods' - I prefer acrylic washes.

        Some guys prefer pan pastels.  Some guys like to do it all
        using an air brush (I consider this to be the least successful).
        In the end you will develop your own 'process'.  Don't forget
        to vary what you do from car to car - such as the shade of
        this coat, how much of a particular coat you use, what order
        you do different steps, etc.

 

I try to use different methods to mix things up to avoid the everything looks the same problem, but also to build skills with different media. 

 

Regards

Bruce

 

Bruce F. Smith            

Auburn, AL

"Some days you are the bug, some days you are the windshield."

 

 


Re: Question about weathering

Benjamin Hom
 

My two cents:
1. Richard Hendrickson's article "Vintage Dating Freight Cars" in the December 1995 issue of Railmodel Journal is required reading, not for specific weathering techniques, but the importance of context in capturing the overall scene on your layout.  The article is available online at http://magazine.trainlife.com/rmj_1995_12/  .  (Go to page 32.)

In Richard's words,
"Freight car fleets keep evolving. Older cars are retired, modernized, rebuiIt and/or renumbered. New cars are delivered. New paint and lettering schemes are introduced and gradually replace earlier ones. The process is end­less, not only on the prototype railroad you're modeling but on the other lines whose cars turn up on your railroad in interchange service. Making your freight car models realistic, then, isn't enough; not only should each car repre­sent its prototype accurately but all your cars should look the way their pro­totypes did at the same moment in time."

Just as having a fleet of brand new cars is unrealistic, having an entire fleet weathered to the brink of extinction is also unrealistic.  (The most notorious example of this is a heavily weathered Athearn Santa Fe "Shock Control" boxcar that turned up regularly in photos of Sellios' Franklin & South Manchester.) 

2.  Weathering from memory is tough as what you initially think is credible weathering turns out to be atypical or odd.  (An example is the Ertl boxcars and gon "flood recovery" weathering.)  Keep color photos handy for inspiration - an excellent source is the Library of Congress Farm Security Administration/Office of War Information Colllection.  These are often misidentified on these lists as from "Shorpy" or "Collection of Shorpy", but the reality is these are in the public domain and available online, and the collection is far more extensive than what is posted on that blog.



Re: Using Pledge (Future)

Ken Adams
 

I have even been known to use it on my Pergo floors without harm. Let us hope that J&J never tries to "improve" it in our lifetimes...
--
Ken Adams
Still in splendid Shelter In Place solitude, about half way up Walnut Creek


Re: Using Pledge

Ken Adams
 

I hand brush Pledge as the self leveling action of the product does not require an air brush (which I can't use anyway.) I cover just the larger area the decal will go on such as the whole side of a car but not the roof. I don't feel I need to cover areas such as car roofs or underframe where no decals will be applied. Use a clean soft very fine bristle art brush to apply pledge. I clean the brushes with IPA and water immediately after use.

After decaling I spray with a rattle can Tamiya matte finish. 
--
Ken Adams
Still in splendid Shelter In Place solitude, about half way up Walnut Creek


Re: GN 50 footer

Bob Chapman
 

Clark --

Great looking build. And love the steel door conversion -- the wood-side/steel door look has always struck me as a cool combination. 

Bob Chapman 


Re: Question about weathering

Mont Switzer
 

Weathering:  last but not least, you can hide your mistakes with weathering.  I’ve weathered my way out of more than one mess of  my own making.

 

Mont

 

Montford L. Switzer

President

Switzer Tank Lines, Inc.

Fall Creek Leasing, LLC.

mswitzer@...

(765) 836-2914

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Bruce Smith
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2020 11:16 AM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Question about weathering

 

Ray,

 

GO FOR IT!  It can be daunting to take a nice model and feel like you might ruin it. In chemistry terms, it has a “high activation energy”, but the rewards are many and the risks actually few. Some suggestions beyond what others have posted.

 

1) Start with Chalks. If you use plain chalks, they are easy to wash off. In addition, when you clear coat, they get much less intense. Chalks with adhesive, such as Bragdon’s or the ones I use, Doc O’Brien's Weathering Powders (Micro Mark https://www.micromark.com/Doc-ObrienS-Powders) are a little harder to remove but will come off too.

 

2) I’m a little crazy, but my 1st weathering attempt was a P2K PRR HH1 (N&W Y-3) 2-8-8-2. Weathering a $400 locomotive is enough to keep you focused! You might want to work on a freight car 1st ;)

 

3) Acrylic washes are also easy to work with. I do them over acrylics, so I have to be careful when removing. The most common approach is something Jim Six called “Q-Tip weathering”. Easy-peasy! Take a nice thin grunge wash, and brush it on the car side. Now, using a cotton swap (e.g. Q-tip), gently stoke down the side of the car, removing most of the paint. Keep changing swabs to keep removing paint. What is left will be in the shadow of rivets, seams, etc. Do one half of one side at at time. Let dry and admire (then add chalk marks…)

 

Now, there was the time I got too heavy handed and airbrushed an all over “wash” on a RC express X29 (for the complete grunge covered look) and it totally sucked (too much paint, blotching, “flowering”, etc). So I literally poured 90% isopropanol on the car side and started scrubbing with Q-tips. The wash sort of came off, as did some of the lettering. It actually looked beat-to-hell great! Then it dried with a white filmy look (UGH!). Thinking back to advice here, I wondered if a clear coat would get rid of the haze (I’m tempted to call it an “alcohol haze” but then folks might comment on my drinking habits!). Rescued. Now this is one of my favorite weathering jobs… happened 100% by accident. Which leads to #4

 

4) Make lemonade out of lemons. Did you totally screw it up? Fine!  Strip the car, repaint, decal, and do it again. Or maybe too much weathering? Gently remove the acrylic wash with isopropanol and a Q-tip. Not enough weathering? That the easy one, just add more! ;) 

 

5) As Jim Betz noted and as I have presented. Weathering is due to the action of nature and man on machine. Think about all the sources of weathering (not just rain, but road dust, other cars, mishandling, etc…) and how the job of that particular piece of equipment affects its weathering (My next “EXTREME weathering project will be a Jordan spreader)

 

6) Finally, it isn’t necessary to make every car a work of art. Here are two quick “fleet weathering approaches”. These can be chalk or acrylic washes

Boxcar

- Fade the sides - lightly cover with a thinned color that is the same or a lighter version of the body color

- Fade the trucks - grit blast the side frames (protect the bearings with tape)

- Fade the underbody - a light coat of grimy or faded black, or darkish grime colors so show road dirt

- Fade the roof - a light coat of grimy or faded black to mimic the soot of the steam era

Tank car (black)

- overall fade with tarnished black (remember, if it is dark, make it lighter!)

- grimy or oily black around and under the dome (oil drips)

- fade the trucks

- thin rust wash next to the tank bands (to simulate their slipping as the tank expands and contracts)

 

Weathering is a nearly endless subject, with so many cool approaches. I typically use 2 to 3 different approaches, including washes, chalk, and airbrush to weather an individual car. For example, there are metallic paints that can then be oxidized to generate REAL rust finishes, or real copper. The more layers of weathering, the more realistic it looks. Military modelers have a LOT of great ideas and have been doing this a long time. One recent You-Tube video of a German tank build included something ridiculous like 80 HOURS of weathering! But don’t panic, 20-30 minutes can get you a lot of nice effects too!

 

Regards

Bruce

 

Bruce F. Smith            

Auburn, AL

"Some days you are the bug, some days you are the windshield."

 

 



On Sep 23, 2020, at 7:53 AM, Ray Hutchison <rayhutchison2@...> wrote:

 

Decided to post this after reading comments about pledge...

I am supremely unconfident about weathering cars and engines.  Is there a way to apply overcoat to original finish that might allow for removal of later weathering if one decides that the weathering did not turn out as expected?  A finish where acrylic colors might later be removed, for example?

(I have noted that there is a GN 4-8-4 with very heavy weathering that has sat at ebay for many months, I think the reason being that the finish is not something that anyone else would want sitting on their layout.)

rh

 


Re: [Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] Question about weathering

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Guys;

 

I agree with everything you all have said, and only add that I go slowly, and look at the results of each step before moving on.

 

The attached are examples of different processes, to get where I want them.  Each one used a different process.

 

I think they look a bit garish close up, but that is not what I want the final product to achieve.  I want them to look right in a train, or on a siding, on my layout.

 

My favorite techniques are: beginning washes, often with tube oils like brown/burnt umber/dark grey, to make rivets and junctures pop, then light dry-brushing of rivet heads and details, sometimes chalk or lighter or darker base color rubbing if the prototype looks like that, potential board by board coloring, and a final blending coat of lighter or darker base color by airbrush.

 

I have always found weathering to be intimidating, but so important.  IMO, a “finished” model without weathering, looks like a toy, not a small version of the prototype.

 

There is a lot of disagreement on this subject.  I have had more than one person say to me, “I can’t understand how you could ruin a perfectly good model like that!”  It is obviously the eye of the beholder.

 

Finally, I use my grit-blaster to remove weathering if I hate the end result.  It works really well, if you go slowly and evaluate the results as you go along.

 

Elden Gatwood

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Jim Betz
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2020 10:22 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] Question about weathering

 

Ray,

  Take a box car you don't really care about and weather it.  Build up the
weathering slowly - taking a day or two between to just look at it several
times a day to see "when it is enough"..  Work from a photo - try to copy
some prototype example ... or the work of someone else that you like.
Do one side of it - then do the other side differently (more practice, less
sacrificial lambs).

  I use acrylic -washes- applied with a brush ... here are some 'basics'.

  1) The roof is almost always more weathered than the sides.
  2) Darker colors on the roof and lighter colors on the bottom.
  3) Cars sit more than they move - a lot more.  So any "streaks"
       need to be vertical rather than horizontal.
  4) Use gravity to let your washes actually move down the car sides.
  5) A final light dusting with an air brush helps a lot - I call this the
      "blending coat" - I usually use a very thin "weathered black" color
      for this but have also used just dullcoat and other such.
  6) Weathered equipment is never "shiny".
  7) Weathering on the prototype is a "process" - with variations depending
       upon where the car has been, how long it's been since it was painted,
       what kind of service it is in (cement hoppers are entirely different than
       ore jennies), etc.  
  8) Be careful not to over do 'special effects' such as bird droppings, rust
      "lines" along the rivets, etc.
  9) I use a combination of "detail painting by hand (grabs and drop steps
      and other metal parts)" and "general effects (washes - usually done
      after the detail items but not always).
10) Rust is a job best done sparingly.

  If you study a photo of a steam era freight yard the first thing you
notice is that "all the cars seem to be the same".  Closer examination
shows subtle differences from this car to the one next to it.  That's
the look I strive for ... said another way "don't fall in love with just
one process/set of steps - variety is the spice of weathering".

  Your first attempts are likely to be 'failures' (that's why we used an
old car we don't care about).  Most of the time it will be due to too
much rather than too little.  Even your worst weathering job will be
better than no weathering at all.  *G*
  Keep your test car around and run it on the layout every once in a
while - to remind you of "where you aren't going".  *W*  And how 
far you've come since you started down this journey.

  Weathering is like the student mathematician who went to see his
girl friend.  First he went half way there, then he went half way more,
then he went half way more again, etc.  He never really got to where
his girl was ... but he got close enough for all practical purposes.
                                                                                                       - Jim

P.S. There are many different 'methods' - I prefer acrylic washes.
        Some guys prefer pan pastels.  Some guys like to do it all
        using an air brush (I consider this to be the least successful).
        In the end you will develop your own 'process'.  Don't forget
        to vary what you do from car to car - such as the shade of
        this coat, how much of a particular coat you use, what order
        you do different steps, etc.


Re: Question about weathering

Bruce Smith
 

Ray,

GO FOR IT!  It can be daunting to take a nice model and feel like you might ruin it. In chemistry terms, it has a “high activation energy”, but the rewards are many and the risks actually few. Some suggestions beyond what others have posted.

1) Start with Chalks. If you use plain chalks, they are easy to wash off. In addition, when you clear coat, they get much less intense. Chalks with adhesive, such as Bragdon’s or the ones I use, Doc O’Brien's Weathering Powders (Micro Mark https://www.micromark.com/Doc-ObrienS-Powders) are a little harder to remove but will come off too.

2) I’m a little crazy, but my 1st weathering attempt was a P2K PRR HH1 (N&W Y-3) 2-8-8-2. Weathering a $400 locomotive is enough to keep you focused! You might want to work on a freight car 1st ;)

3) Acrylic washes are also easy to work with. I do them over acrylics, so I have to be careful when removing. The most common approach is something Jim Six called “Q-Tip weathering”. Easy-peasy! Take a nice thin grunge wash, and brush it on the car side. Now, using a cotton swap (e.g. Q-tip), gently stoke down the side of the car, removing most of the paint. Keep changing swabs to keep removing paint. What is left will be in the shadow of rivets, seams, etc. Do one half of one side at at time. Let dry and admire (then add chalk marks…)

Now, there was the time I got too heavy handed and airbrushed an all over “wash” on a RC express X29 (for the complete grunge covered look) and it totally sucked (too much paint, blotching, “flowering”, etc). So I literally poured 90% isopropanol on the car side and started scrubbing with Q-tips. The wash sort of came off, as did some of the lettering. It actually looked beat-to-hell great! Then it dried with a white filmy look (UGH!). Thinking back to advice here, I wondered if a clear coat would get rid of the haze (I’m tempted to call it an “alcohol haze” but then folks might comment on my drinking habits!). Rescued. Now this is one of my favorite weathering jobs… happened 100% by accident. Which leads to #4

4) Make lemonade out of lemons. Did you totally screw it up? Fine!  Strip the car, repaint, decal, and do it again. Or maybe too much weathering? Gently remove the acrylic wash with isopropanol and a Q-tip. Not enough weathering? That the easy one, just add more! ;) 

5) As Jim Betz noted and as I have presented. Weathering is due to the action of nature and man on machine. Think about all the sources of weathering (not just rain, but road dust, other cars, mishandling, etc…) and how the job of that particular piece of equipment affects its weathering (My next “EXTREME weathering project will be a Jordan spreader)

6) Finally, it isn’t necessary to make every car a work of art. Here are two quick “fleet weathering approaches”. These can be chalk or acrylic washes
Boxcar
- Fade the sides - lightly cover with a thinned color that is the same or a lighter version of the body color
- Fade the trucks - grit blast the side frames (protect the bearings with tape)
- Fade the underbody - a light coat of grimy or faded black, or darkish grime colors so show road dirt
- Fade the roof - a light coat of grimy or faded black to mimic the soot of the steam era
Tank car (black)
- overall fade with tarnished black (remember, if it is dark, make it lighter!)
- grimy or oily black around and under the dome (oil drips)
- fade the trucks
- thin rust wash next to the tank bands (to simulate their slipping as the tank expands and contracts)

Weathering is a nearly endless subject, with so many cool approaches. I typically use 2 to 3 different approaches, including washes, chalk, and airbrush to weather an individual car. For example, there are metallic paints that can then be oxidized to generate REAL rust finishes, or real copper. The more layers of weathering, the more realistic it looks. Military modelers have a LOT of great ideas and have been doing this a long time. One recent You-Tube video of a German tank build included something ridiculous like 80 HOURS of weathering! But don’t panic, 20-30 minutes can get you a lot of nice effects too!

Regards

Bruce


Bruce F. Smith            

Auburn, AL

"Some days you are the bug, some days you are the windshield."




On Sep 23, 2020, at 7:53 AM, Ray Hutchison <rayhutchison2@...> wrote:

Decided to post this after reading comments about pledge...

I am supremely unconfident about weathering cars and engines.  Is there a way to apply overcoat to original finish that might allow for removal of later weathering if one decides that the weathering did not turn out as expected?  A finish where acrylic colors might later be removed, for example?

(I have noted that there is a GN 4-8-4 with very heavy weathering that has sat at ebay for many months, I think the reason being that the finish is not something that anyone else would want sitting on their layout.)

rh


Re: Using Pledge

lsittler
 

Thanks for all the comments and information. This group is very helpful and I really appreciate it. Les

Sent from my Verizon Motorola Smartphone

On Sep 23, 2020 10:16 AM, Mont Switzer <MSwitzer@...> wrote:

Bruce,

Thanks. I will give that process a try; Future on both sides of the decal lettering.

Mont

Montford L. Switzer

President

Switzer Tank Lines, Inc.

Fall Creek Leasing, LLC.

mswitzer@...

(765) 836-2914

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Bruce Smith
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2020 8:38 AM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Using Pledge

Mont,

Yes, the military modelers, from whom I learned about Future, overcoat decals with a coat of Future to help them disappear. I think that the idea is to have a similar finish on the entire model, prior to applying a flat finish. I can’t say I’ve noticed a huge difference, but on cars where I am not going to be weathering much, or at all, like my in-progress GN plywood cars, or some passenger cars, I think it does improve the final product.

Regards,

Bruce



On Sep 23, 2020, at 6:54 AM, Mont Switzer <MSwitzer@...> wrote:

Bruce,

I’ve not OVERCOATED decals with Future. I assume it helps the decals lay down better and that is why you do it?

I use Testor’s dullcoat to eliminate the Future shine. Sometimes a second coat is required.

Mont

Montford L. Switzer

President

Switzer Tank Lines, Inc.

Fall Creek Leasing, LLC.

(765) 836-2914


Re: Question about weathering

Bruce Smith
 

Ray, Jim,

Additional commentary interspersed ;)


On Sep 23, 2020, at 9:21 AM, Jim Betz <jimbetz@...> wrote:

  2) Darker colors on the roof and lighter colors on the bottom.

As a rule of thumb, everything goes towards a mid-tone. Brianna, my daughter, and I gave a clinic at an SER NMRA annual convention when she was the tender age of 5. She had many things to contribute, but perhaps the most seminal was “If it is light, make it darker, and if it is dark, make it lighter”.  BTW, the old theater adage “don’t work with children and animals” is entirely true. Brianna stole the show. 

And no pressure, but if a 5-year old can weather cars, so can you ;)

  3) Cars sit more than they move - a lot more.  So any "streaks"
       need to be vertical rather than horizontal.

Except passenger cars and head end cars, which may have a more all-over weathering pattern, with some horizontal aspects. Locomotives also have patterns that both relate to gravity and movement.

  5) A final light dusting with an air brush helps a lot - I call this the
      "blending coat" - I usually use a very thin "weathered black" color
      for this but have also used just dullcoat and other such.

Vary this color to vary your weathering. Alternative are Harbor Mist Grey, Railroad tie brown, 

  6) Weathered equipment is never "shiny".

In real life, some equipment can retain a shine, whilst being weathered. However, I have never found that gloss looks anything but “toy-like” on a model, even if the prototype was shiny.

 10) Rust is a job best done sparingly.

And remember that there are infinite shades of rust.

P.S. There are many different 'methods' - I prefer acrylic washes.
        Some guys prefer pan pastels.  Some guys like to do it all
        using an air brush (I consider this to be the least successful).
        In the end you will develop your own 'process'.  Don't forget
        to vary what you do from car to car - such as the shade of
        this coat, how much of a particular coat you use, what order
        you do different steps, etc.

I try to use different methods to mix things up to avoid the everything looks the same problem, but also to build skills with different media. 

Regards
Bruce

Bruce F. Smith            
Auburn, AL
"Some days you are the bug, some days you are the windshield."




Re: GN 50 footer

Eric Hansmann
 

Sweet work, Clark.

 

Does anyone know if the GN painted roof and ends black when these cars were built?

 

 

Eric Hansmann

Murfreesboro, TN

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Clark Propst
Sent: Tuesday, September 22, 2020 5:20 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] GN 50 footer

 

I built a ton of cars the first five months of the year. This is the only car I’ve worked on since. A normal pace  ;  ))

Since then I’ve picked up a couple kits off eBay and traded with friends for a couple others. So, I now have a slight cushion to boredom when cold weather hits. This Westerfield kit came as wood door and a half Auto car. The instructions shows a version with a 6’ steel door I decided to buy a 6’ steel door and the correct decals to change the car for Westerfield to make the conversion. The body was painted with Tru-color paints, I used Scalecoat on the underframe and trucks. Weathering Prismacolor pencils and Pan Pastels.

Clark Propst
Mason City Iowa


Re: Question about weathering

Jim Betz
 

Ray,

  Take a box car you don't really care about and weather it.  Build up the
weathering slowly - taking a day or two between to just look at it several
times a day to see "when it is enough"..  Work from a photo - try to copy
some prototype example ... or the work of someone else that you like.
Do one side of it - then do the other side differently (more practice, less
sacrificial lambs).

  I use acrylic -washes- applied with a brush ... here are some 'basics'.

  1) The roof is almost always more weathered than the sides.
  2) Darker colors on the roof and lighter colors on the bottom.
  3) Cars sit more than they move - a lot more.  So any "streaks"
       need to be vertical rather than horizontal.
  4) Use gravity to let your washes actually move down the car sides.
  5) A final light dusting with an air brush helps a lot - I call this the
      "blending coat" - I usually use a very thin "weathered black" color
      for this but have also used just dullcoat and other such.
  6) Weathered equipment is never "shiny".
  7) Weathering on the prototype is a "process" - with variations depending
       upon where the car has been, how long it's been since it was painted,
       what kind of service it is in (cement hoppers are entirely different than
       ore jennies), etc.  
  8) Be careful not to over do 'special effects' such as bird droppings, rust
      "lines" along the rivets, etc.
  9) I use a combination of "detail painting by hand (grabs and drop steps
      and other metal parts)" and "general effects (washes - usually done
      after the detail items but not always).
10) Rust is a job best done sparingly.

  If you study a photo of a steam era freight yard the first thing you
notice is that "all the cars seem to be the same".  Closer examination
shows subtle differences from this car to the one next to it.  That's
the look I strive for ... said another way "don't fall in love with just
one process/set of steps - variety is the spice of weathering".

  Your first attempts are likely to be 'failures' (that's why we used an
old car we don't care about).  Most of the time it will be due to too
much rather than too little.  Even your worst weathering job will be
better than no weathering at all.  *G*
  Keep your test car around and run it on the layout every once in a
while - to remind you of "where you aren't going".  *W*  And how 
far you've come since you started down this journey.

  Weathering is like the student mathematician who went to see his
girl friend.  First he went half way there, then he went half way more,
then he went half way more again, etc.  He never really got to where
his girl was ... but he got close enough for all practical purposes.
                                                                                                       - Jim

P.S. There are many different 'methods' - I prefer acrylic washes.
        Some guys prefer pan pastels.  Some guys like to do it all
        using an air brush (I consider this to be the least successful).
        In the end you will develop your own 'process'.  Don't forget
        to vary what you do from car to car - such as the shade of
        this coat, how much of a particular coat you use, what order
        you do different steps, etc.


Re: Using Pledge

Mont Switzer
 

Bruce,

 

Thanks.  I will give that process a try; Future on both sides of the decal lettering.

 

Mont

 

Montford L. Switzer

President

Switzer Tank Lines, Inc.

Fall Creek Leasing, LLC.

mswitzer@...

(765) 836-2914

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Bruce Smith
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2020 8:38 AM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Using Pledge

 

Mont,

 

Yes, the military modelers, from whom I learned about Future, overcoat decals with a coat of Future to help them disappear. I think that the idea is to have a similar finish on the entire model, prior to applying a flat finish. I can’t say I’ve noticed a huge difference, but on cars where I am not going to be weathering much, or at all, like my in-progress GN plywood cars, or some passenger cars, I think it does improve the final product.

 

Regards,

Bruce



On Sep 23, 2020, at 6:54 AM, Mont Switzer <MSwitzer@...> wrote:

 

Bruce,

 

I’ve not OVERCOATED decals with Future.  I assume it helps the decals lay down better and that is why you do it? 

 

I use Testor’s dullcoat to eliminate the Future shine.  Sometimes a second coat is required.

 

Mont  

 

Montford L. Switzer

President

Switzer Tank Lines, Inc.

Fall Creek Leasing, LLC.

(765) 836-2914

 


Re: Using Pledge

Mont Switzer
 

Doug,

 

I store my Future in small Floquil size bottles.  It can over time get a little “stiff,” at lease in the small bottles.  Distilled water takes care of that.

 

Mont

 

Montford L. Switzer

President

Switzer Tank Lines, Inc.

Fall Creek Leasing, LLC.

mswitzer@...

(765) 836-2914

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Douglas Harding
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2020 8:21 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Using Pledge

 

The Pledge/Future floor finish product is 100% clear acrylic. No need to thin for airbrushing. It can also be brushed on, good for small areas. Clean up with water. It provides a gloss finish perfect for decals. I have created a flat finish by mixing Tamiya Flat Base with, at a 10 to 1 ratio.

 

Doug Harding

www.iowacentralrr.org

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of lsittler
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2020 5:40 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Using Pledge

 

Good morning- I have been using Pledge to affix rivet decals to plastic and resin, based on the advice from Bill Welch and others in this group. It has worked very well. In those cases, I was brushing Pledge in the areas where the rivets were to be placed. But I have read that others use Pledge as a finish coat before applying decals. I am assuming that in those cases, Pledge was applied over  acrylic paint such as Polyscale, due to the flat finish of those paints, correct? Do you spray it on? If so, do you thin it? And what's the thinner? Or do you brush it in the areas where the decals go? Also, I'm thinking that with a paint like Scalecoat 2, this would be unnecessary since that paint has a gloss finish already  and  decals can be applied right on top. Any advice would be most appreciated. Thanks. Les


Re: Question about weathering

Pierre Oliver
 

Ray
The best thing to do is get your hands a a stack of cheap freight cars and practice 
Figure out processes and materials that give you the results you want
There’s a large array of products out there to discover

Pierre Oliver
www.elgincarshops.com
www.yarmouthmodelworks.com


On Sep 23, 2020, at 8:53 AM, Ray Hutchison <rayhutchison2@...> wrote:

Decided to post this after reading comments about pledge...

I am supremely unconfident about weathering cars and engines.  Is there a way to apply overcoat to original finish that might allow for removal of later weathering if one decides that the weathering did not turn out as expected?  A finish where acrylic colors might later be removed, for example?

(I have noted that there is a GN 4-8-4 with very heavy weathering that has sat at ebay for many months, I think the reason being that the finish is not something that anyone else would want sitting on their layout.)

rh


Re: Using Pledge

Eric Hansmann
 

Here’s a 2016 blog post about working with Pledge Future acrylic floor wax.

http://blog.resincarworks.com/working-with-future/

 

 

Eric Hansmann

Murfreesboro, TN

 

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of lsittler
Sent: Wednesday, September 23, 2020 5:40 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Using Pledge

 

Good morning- I have been using Pledge to affix rivet decals to plastic and resin, based on the advice from Bill Welch and others in this group. It has worked very well. In those cases, I was brushing Pledge in the areas where the rivets were to be placed. But I have read that others use Pledge as a finish coat before applying decals. I am assuming that in those cases, Pledge was applied over  acrylic paint such as Polyscale, due to the flat finish of those paints, correct? Do you spray it on? If so, do you thin it? And what's the thinner? Or do you brush it in the areas where the decals go? Also, I'm thinking that with a paint like Scalecoat 2, this would be unnecessary since that paint has a gloss finish already  and  decals can be applied right on top. Any advice would be most appreciated. Thanks. Les