Date   
Re: Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola

brianleppert@att.net
 

FWIW, the journal box lids on the trucks under this gondola all have a cast on foundry mark.  A "B" inside a circle.  That stands for the Buckeye Steel Castings Co.

Brian Leppert
Tahoe Model Works
Carson City, NV

nice image of a three-axle truck

David
 

N&W 90-ton battleship gon, class GK, GKa, or GL. The Buckeye truck was not original, so this is likely a test application.

David Thompson

Re: What activity is going on here?

Ray Breyer
 

Well, it's a non-revenue car, so I'll bet what we're seeing here is a company stores car stopped at a station, unloading company coal to the local depot (those are giant chunks of coal; why pay to have coal broken & washed for employes when they can do it themselves in their ample free time?)

The guy in the suit may be the local agent. More likely, he's just a local coming to watch all the excitement.

Ray Breyer
Elgin, IL


On Saturday, May 23, 2020, 02:40:58 PM CDT, Claus Schlund \(HGM\) <claus@...> wrote:


Hi List Members,
 
I stumbled upon an interesting view which captures a steam era freight car of some sort, a coal conveyor, and two people...
 
 
In my mind, there are way more questions than there are answers...
 
(1) What is the freight car? It appears to have a small window. Work train car? Caboose? Other?
 
(2) Is the freight car in the process of being unloaded?
 
(3) There is nothing at the other end of the coal conveyor to receive whatever is being conveyed – what is the story there?
 
The guy nearest the freight car is holding a shovel, looks like he is going to drop the shovel load onto the conveyor, the other guy in the snappy clothes is not making any meaningful contribution other than supervising (maybe)
 
Perhaps this entire scene is simply posed for the benefit of the camera, rather than being a real work scene?
 
Claus Schlund
 

Re: What activity is going on here?

A&Y Dave in MD
 

Claus,

The photo is crystal clear in a time before autofocus and big flood lamps, so it is clearly a "frozen moment" likely posed photo, but maybe only temporarily stopped.  It does look like the dray or truck on the receiving end is moved off.  There are lumps of what look like coal up and down the conveyor, so maybe waiting for the next one to line up?  The car's window and grab suggest a MoW car or side door caboose.  Who knows for sure, but maybe it's coal for caboose stoves or for depot heating?  Maybe the guy in the suit is a station agent?  All speculation, but they did dress more formally in that day.

Note the conveyor is on steel/iron beam skids and as positioned the car step looks like it just clears the conveyor.   So that could be semi-permanent setup for regular coal dump of small amounts or it could be temporary and staged.

Why take the photo, might be the real question. Is this for describing proper loading technique?  Is it to prepare a legal case for a workplace injury claim?  How many photos were taken just for fun when the materials were relatively expensive and the setup was a challenge?

It is an interesting image.  Thanks for sharing.

Dave Bott

Saturday, May 23, 2020, 3:26:36 PM, you wrote:


Hi List Members,
 
I stumbled upon an interesting view which captures a steam era freight car of some sort, a coal conveyor, and two people...
 
https://www.grpmcollections.org/Detail/objects/172757
 
In my mind, there are way more questions than there are answers...
 
(1) What is the freight car? It appears to have a small window. Work train car? Caboose? Other?
 
(2) Is the freight car in the process of being unloaded?
 
(3) There is nothing at the other end of the coal conveyor to receive whatever is being conveyed – what is the story there?
 
The guy nearest the freight car is holding a shovel, looks like he is going to drop the shovel load onto the conveyor, the other guy in the snappy clothes is not making any meaningful contribution other than supervising (maybe)
 
Perhaps this entire scene is simply posed for the benefit of the camera, rather than being a real work scene?
 
Claus Schlund
 



--
David Bott

Sent from David Bott's desktop PC
--
____________________________
David Bott, modeling the A&Y in '34

Re: Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola

Schuyler Larrabee
 

Not about the car in the subject line . . .

 

Were the records of Buckeye (and Columbus Steel Castings) preserved at all?  I don’t remember what I was after – might have been for a locomotive driver center -  but I once contacted them and they said if I >>REALLY<< needed it, they had the drawings I was interested in at the time, but it would probably take a couple man days to locate them.  Was I willing to pay for that?

 

Ah, nooooo.

 

But I still wonder if they were preserved.

 

Schuyler

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Matt Goodman via groups.io
Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2020 1:21 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola

 

The amazing thing was that Columbus Steel Castings (the successor to Buckeye) was the largest steel foundry under one roof in North America in the last couple of decades.  Not something you normally associate Columbus with. 

 

My model railroad club, on which I pulled steam era freight cars, was on the grounds (in the old ARMCO executive building) from 1969 until 2016-ish, when we were finally asked to leave, so I’ve long had a soft spot for the facility. 

Matt Goodman

Columbus, Ohio

 

Sent from my mobile


On May 23, 2020, at 1:09 PM, Riverboy via groups.io <river_dweller_ohio@...> wrote:



Beautiful photo.

 

It's interesting to note that over the last year, ALL of the Buckeye Steel buildings have been torn down, and the entire property is being cleaned up and will eventually be redeveloped. I moved from Massachusetts to Ohio in 1993 when I was 25, and moved just south of Columbus in 1995 when I bought my house, and after over 20 years of seeing the complex there, busy with all kinds of activity, along with a smell that was a lot like a burning clutch or burning brakes, the property is now vacant and void of all the structures. It looks so "wrong". Kind of sad in a way. A lot of history is now gone.

 

Tod C Dwyer

 

Lockbourne/Shadeville Ohio

 

On Saturday, May 23, 2020, 12:54:21 PM EDT, Bob Chaparro via groups.io <chiefbobbb@...> wrote:

 

 

Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola

An undated photo from the Columbus Metropolitan Library:

https://digital-collections.columbuslibrary.org/digital/collection/memory/id/71933/rec/2728

This is a very clear photo and can be enlarged quite a bit.

My thanks to Bill West on the PRR Group for the link tip.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA

Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola

David
 

The stencil had me scratching my head, too, but I think it is for Buckeye since Bethlehem didn't merge Cambria/Midvale until 1922.

Here is a second photo showing a similar (same?) gondola...
https://digital-collections.columbuslibrary.org/digital/collection/memory/id/67537
That one is a Hocking Valley car:
https://digital-collections.columbuslibrary.org/digital/collection/memory/id/67531

David Thompson

Re: Boxcars Labeled "Vehicle" Or "Carriage"

Schuyler Larrabee
 

Love the photo . . . and the cars, too!

 

Schuyler

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Claus Schlund \(HGM\)
Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2020 9:51 AM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Boxcars Labeled "Vehicle" Or "Carriage"

 

Hi Bob,

 

Sometimes cars were labeled “Furniture and Vehicles” – see attached image of CNW 41098 at Appleton WI in 1892.

 

Claus Schlund

 

 

 

From: Bob Chaparro via groups.io

Sent: Friday, May 22, 2020 9:14 PM

Subject: [RealSTMFC] Boxcars Labeled "Vehicle" Or "Carriage"

 

Boxcars Labeled "Vehicle" Or "Carriage"

The attached photo Pere Marquette Boxcar 42794 is the only one I've seen of a boxcar labeled "Vehicle".

I was told such a label was not all that uncommon around 1900 and that some boxcars were labeled "Carriage" as well because their usual loads were wagons and carriages. This was slightly before the popular introduction of horseless carriages.

Has anyone see more examples of these "Vehicle" boxcars or the even more elusive "Carriage" boxcars?

Thanks.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA

Re: What activity is going on here?

Dennis Storzek
 

On Sat, May 23, 2020 at 12:40 PM, Claus Schlund \(HGM\) wrote:
In my mind, there are way more questions than there are answers...
 
(1) What is the freight car? It appears to have a small window. Work train car? Caboose? Other?
Most likely a boxcar converted to work service.
 
 
(2) Is the freight car in the process of being unloaded?
That's my guess.
 
 
(3) There is nothing at the other end of the coal conveyor to receive whatever is being conveyed – what is the story there?
The truck or wagon just pulled away, and the next to be loaded is not yet in position. The guy with the shovel is cleaning up what lumps missed the conveyor, so his boss (in the background) knows he's working. Those lumps will be the first up when they start the conveyor again. Why a mechanized conveyor? it's not evident, but when unloading coal from boxcars, after the coal near the door has been cleared, a wheelbarrow is needed inside the car. If no conveyor, the coal must be dumped on the floor again, then shoveled up over the sides of the wagon/truck. Since they have a conveyor, it does the heavy lifting and the guys are mainly shoveling downward, making fullest use of gravity.

Dennis Storzek
 

Re: Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola

Steve and Barb Hile
 

Makes sense to me.  I can see a number 10 on the car, also.

 

From what I can see in Eric Neubauer’s builder’s listings.  Pressed Steel car built six 55 ton cars (perhaps hoppers?) in 1920.  Ralston (also in Columbus) built eighteen 70 ton gondolas for BSCCo in 1920 and 12 more in 1930.  Pullman Standard tagged along eight 50 ton, 40’6” seven post gondolas numbered 60-67 to an SP&S order lot 5944, as lot 5944A.

 

Apparently these were all in captive in-plant service as there are not ORER records that I could find (quickly) for Buckeye Steel.

 

Steve Hile

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Dave Parker via groups.io
Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2020 2:37 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola

 

Steve:

Ahh.  Now I get it it.

Indeed, the history of the Johnstown facility indicates that it was Cambria when this car was built, then briefly Midvale before the Bethlehem acquisition in 1923.

So here's the alternative:  The BSCCo stencil refers Buckeye Steel Castings Company, who produced a wide array of steel (earlier iron) castings for the railroad industry.  It seems this isn't an interchange car as there is no car number.  Perhaps it was built by Cambria for Buckeye to custom specs and/or design.  It is a 70-ton car, not something I think of as being very common in 1912.

That's the best I can come up with in the SWAG department.

Best regards.
--
Dave Parker
Swall Meadows, CA

Re: What activity is going on here?

Eric Hansmann
 

That looks like a rider car as there are grabs at the door and steps below. 

Whatever else is going on here is questionable. 

Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN

On May 23, 2020, at 2:26 PM, Claus Schlund &#92;(HGM&#92;) <claus@...> wrote:

Hi List Members,
 
I stumbled upon an interesting view which captures a steam era freight car of some sort, a coal conveyor, and two people...
 
 
In my mind, there are way more questions than there are answers...
 
(1) What is the freight car? It appears to have a small window. Work train car? Caboose? Other?
 
(2) Is the freight car in the process of being unloaded?
 
(3) There is nothing at the other end of the coal conveyor to receive whatever is being conveyed – what is the story there?
 
The guy nearest the freight car is holding a shovel, looks like he is going to drop the shovel load onto the conveyor, the other guy in the snappy clothes is not making any meaningful contribution other than supervising (maybe)
 
Perhaps this entire scene is simply posed for the benefit of the camera, rather than being a real work scene?
 
Claus Schlund
 

What activity is going on here?

Claus Schlund \(HGM\)
 

Hi List Members,
 
I stumbled upon an interesting view which captures a steam era freight car of some sort, a coal conveyor, and two people...
 
 
In my mind, there are way more questions than there are answers...
 
(1) What is the freight car? It appears to have a small window. Work train car? Caboose? Other?
 
(2) Is the freight car in the process of being unloaded?
 
(3) There is nothing at the other end of the coal conveyor to receive whatever is being conveyed – what is the story there?
 
The guy nearest the freight car is holding a shovel, looks like he is going to drop the shovel load onto the conveyor, the other guy in the snappy clothes is not making any meaningful contribution other than supervising (maybe)
 
Perhaps this entire scene is simply posed for the benefit of the camera, rather than being a real work scene?
 
Claus Schlund
 

Re: Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola

Dave Parker
 

Steve:

Ahh.  Now I get it it.

Indeed, the history of the Johnstown facility indicates that it was Cambria when this car was built, then briefly Midvale before the Bethlehem acquisition in 1923.

So here's the alternative:  The BSCCo stencil refers Buckeye Steel Castings Company, who produced a wide array of steel (earlier iron) castings for the railroad industry.  It seems this isn't an interchange car as there is no car number.  Perhaps it was built by Cambria for Buckeye to custom specs and/or design.  It is a 70-ton car, not something I think of as being very common in 1912.

That's the best I can come up with in the SWAG department.

Best regards.
--
Dave Parker
Swall Meadows, CA

Re: Boxcars Labeled "Vehicle" Or "Carriage"

earlyrail
 

Actually this is a 327' 6" inner length car, 40,000 cpy. series 41000 - 41716 (even only) 297 car in 1905
Howard Garner

Re: Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola

Steve and Barb Hile
 

According to the car builder’s listing at Mid Continent Railway Museum

 

https://midcontinent.org/rollingstock/list/bldr_list_C.htm#C

 

the Bethlehem Steel facility at Johnstown doesn’t begin until circa 1922.  That facility in 1912 was Cambria Steel with a brief name of Midvale before Bethlehem got it.

 

That’s where my confusion lies.

 

Steve Hile           

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Dave Parker via groups.io
Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2020 12:57 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola

 

Steve, I'm not sure I understand your question.  BSC was Bethlehem Steel in Johnstown, PA.  I haven't seen their name on a lot of cars, but they did build ~5 of the X29 lots in the 1924-30 time frame, among others . I'm guessing they had a car-building division, thus the "B.S.C.Co." stencil on this car. 

Best regards.
--
Dave Parker
Swall Meadows, CA

nice image of a three-axle truck

Claus Schlund \(HGM\)
 

Hi Bob and List Members,
 
This site also has a nice image of a three-axle truck under what I will guess is a steel gon...
 
 
Claus Schlund

Re: Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola

Claus Schlund \(HGM\)
 

Hi List Members,
 
Here is a second photo showing a similar (same?) gondola...
 
 
 
Claus Schlund
 
 
 

From: Claus Schlund
Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2020 1:43 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola
 
Hi Bob and List Members,
 
I’ve not done a rivet-by-rivet comparison, but it looks like it is identical to and built to the PRR class GS design – see link below.
 
 
Claus Schlund
 
 
From: Bob Chaparro via groups.io
Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2020 12:54 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola
 

Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola

An undated photo from the Columbus Metropolitan Library:

https://digital-collections.columbuslibrary.org/digital/collection/memory/id/71933/rec/2728

This is a very clear photo and can be enlarged quite a bit.

My thanks to Bill West on the PRR Group for the link tip.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA

Re: Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola

Riverboy
 

Hello again. 

I had to go through my files, but I knew I had taken a photo about ten to fifteen years ago, when I was selling scrap at a nearby facility that is on the access road next to the steel plant, and I'm not sure, but it could be the same car, or one from the same series of cars. It looks similar but has been super patched and everything over the years. I could be wrong though. I apologize for the poor quality of the photo, but it was an early digital camera, long before there were smart phones with good cameras. 

On Saturday, May 23, 2020, 01:33:19 PM EDT, Steve and Barb Hile <shile@...> wrote:


I am trying to figure out who built this car.  It says 1912 and BSC Co and Johnstown on its side.  Pressed Steel built cars for Buckeye, but only in about 1920 and later cars were built by Ralston.

 

Thoughts?

Steve Hile

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Matt Goodman via groups.io
Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2020 12:21 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola

 

The amazing thing was that Columbus Steel Castings (the successor to Buckeye) was the largest steel foundry under one roof in North America in the last couple of decades.  Not something you normally associate Columbus with. 

 

My model railroad club, on which I pulled steam era freight cars, was on the grounds (in the old ARMCO executive building) from 1969 until 2016-ish, when we were finally asked to leave, so I’ve long had a soft spot for the facility. 

Matt Goodman

Columbus, Ohio

 

Sent from my mobile


On May 23, 2020, at 1:09 PM, Riverboy via groups.io <river_dweller_ohio@...> wrote:



Beautiful photo.

 

It's interesting to note that over the last year, ALL of the Buckeye Steel buildings have been torn down, and the entire property is being cleaned up and will eventually be redeveloped. I moved from Massachusetts to Ohio in 1993 when I was 25, and moved just south of Columbus in 1995 when I bought my house, and after over 20 years of seeing the complex there, busy with all kinds of activity, along with a smell that was a lot like a burning clutch or burning brakes, the property is now vacant and void of all the structures. It looks so "wrong". Kind of sad in a way. A lot of history is now gone.

 

Tod C Dwyer

 

Lockbourne/Shadeville Ohio

 

On Saturday, May 23, 2020, 12:54:21 PM EDT, Bob Chaparro via groups.io <chiefbobbb@...> wrote:

 

 

Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola

An undated photo from the Columbus Metropolitan Library:

https://digital-collections.columbuslibrary.org/digital/collection/memory/id/71933/rec/2728

This is a very clear photo and can be enlarged quite a bit.

My thanks to Bill West on the PRR Group for the link tip.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA

Re: Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola

Claus Schlund \(HGM\)
 

Hi Bob and List Members,
 
I’ve not done a rivet-by-rivet comparison, but it looks like it is identical to and built to the PRR class GS design – see link below.
 
 
Claus Schlund
 
 

From: Bob Chaparro via groups.io
Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2020 12:54 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola
 

Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola

An undated photo from the Columbus Metropolitan Library:

https://digital-collections.columbuslibrary.org/digital/collection/memory/id/71933/rec/2728

This is a very clear photo and can be enlarged quite a bit.

My thanks to Bill West on the PRR Group for the link tip.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA

Re: Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola

Dave Parker
 

Steve, I'm not sure I understand your question.  BSC was Bethlehem Steel in Johnstown, PA.  I haven't seen their name on a lot of cars, but they did build ~5 of the X29 lots in the 1924-30 time frame, among others . I'm guessing they had a car-building division, thus the "B.S.C.Co." stencil on this car. 

Best regards.
--
Dave Parker
Swall Meadows, CA

Re: Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola

Steve and Barb Hile
 

I am trying to figure out who built this car.  It says 1912 and BSC Co and Johnstown on its side.  Pressed Steel built cars for Buckeye, but only in about 1920 and later cars were built by Ralston.

 

Thoughts?

Steve Hile

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io [mailto:main@RealSTMFC.groups.io] On Behalf Of Matt Goodman via groups.io
Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2020 12:21 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola

 

The amazing thing was that Columbus Steel Castings (the successor to Buckeye) was the largest steel foundry under one roof in North America in the last couple of decades.  Not something you normally associate Columbus with. 

 

My model railroad club, on which I pulled steam era freight cars, was on the grounds (in the old ARMCO executive building) from 1969 until 2016-ish, when we were finally asked to leave, so I’ve long had a soft spot for the facility. 

Matt Goodman

Columbus, Ohio

 

Sent from my mobile


On May 23, 2020, at 1:09 PM, Riverboy via groups.io <river_dweller_ohio@...> wrote:



Beautiful photo.

 

It's interesting to note that over the last year, ALL of the Buckeye Steel buildings have been torn down, and the entire property is being cleaned up and will eventually be redeveloped. I moved from Massachusetts to Ohio in 1993 when I was 25, and moved just south of Columbus in 1995 when I bought my house, and after over 20 years of seeing the complex there, busy with all kinds of activity, along with a smell that was a lot like a burning clutch or burning brakes, the property is now vacant and void of all the structures. It looks so "wrong". Kind of sad in a way. A lot of history is now gone.

 

Tod C Dwyer

 

Lockbourne/Shadeville Ohio

 

On Saturday, May 23, 2020, 12:54:21 PM EDT, Bob Chaparro via groups.io <chiefbobbb@...> wrote:

 

 

Photo: Buckeye Steel Transfer Gondola

An undated photo from the Columbus Metropolitan Library:

https://digital-collections.columbuslibrary.org/digital/collection/memory/id/71933/rec/2728

This is a very clear photo and can be enlarged quite a bit.

My thanks to Bill West on the PRR Group for the link tip.

Bob Chaparro

Hemet, CA