Date   
Re: [Non-DoD Source] [RealSTMFC] "Dedicated" freight car service

Bill Keene
 

Thank you Ben and Elden,

An appliance service car would be a good addition to the layout’s fleet. It appears that the X29D dates from 1953 which happens to me my modeling year. A quick search reveals that F&C has a kit for the X29D.  I guess my next step is to dive into some research to learn more about these cars. 

Cheers & Happy Modeling,
Bill Keene
Irvine, CA



On Mar 10, 2020, at 11:16 AM, Gatwood, Elden J SAD <elden.j.gatwood@...> wrote:

Ben is correct; post-55 cars, as-built never in CK P&L.  They did go all over the country with GE appliance loads.
 
Elden Gatwood
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Bill Keene via Groups.Io
Sent: Tuesday, March 10, 2020 1:43 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] "Dedicated" freight car service
 
Elden,
 
What is the rough date that the X29F box cars went into service? Would these have been in service during the circle keystone era? 
 
My knowledge of the PRR is quite limited thus this rather basic question.
 
Thanks & Happy Modeling,
Bill Keene
Irvine, CA
 
 


On Mar 10, 2020, at 7:18 AM, Gatwood, Elden J SAD <elden.j.gatwood@...> wrote:
 
Gang;
 
This is a dedicated service PRR X29F in appliance service to GE, with STB load restraining equipment.  They were specially rebuilt from X29 u/f’s expressly for this purpose.
 
Elden Gatwood
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Charles Peck
Sent: Wednesday, March 4, 2020 7:06 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: [Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] "Dedicated" freight car service
 
GE's Appliance Park in Louisville KY got a dedicated group of high-cube cars, not all from just one road.  Park opened in 1951.
Chuck Peck
 
 
 
 


Re: [Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] "Dedicated" freight car service

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Ben is correct; post-55 cars, as-built never in CK P&L.  They did go all over the country with GE appliance loads.

 

Elden Gatwood

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Bill Keene via Groups.Io
Sent: Tuesday, March 10, 2020 1:43 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] "Dedicated" freight car service

 

Elden,

 

What is the rough date that the X29F box cars went into service? Would these have been in service during the circle keystone era? 

 

My knowledge of the PRR is quite limited thus this rather basic question.

 

Thanks & Happy Modeling,

Bill Keene

Irvine, CA

 

 



On Mar 10, 2020, at 7:18 AM, Gatwood, Elden J SAD <elden.j.gatwood@...> wrote:

 

Gang;

 

This is a dedicated service PRR X29F in appliance service to GE, with STB load restraining equipment.  They were specially rebuilt from X29 u/f’s expressly for this purpose.

 

Elden Gatwood

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Charles Peck
Sent: Wednesday, March 4, 2020 7:06 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: [Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] "Dedicated" freight car service

 

GE's Appliance Park in Louisville KY got a dedicated group of high-cube cars, not all from just one road.  Park opened in 1951.

Chuck Peck

 

 

 

 

Re: "Dedicated" freight car service

Benjamin Hom
 

Bill Keene asked:
"What is the rough date that the X29F box cars went into service? Would these have been in service during the circle keystone era?"

c. 1958.  They are post-circle keystone era; the last Class X29 rebuilds to be painted in CK were the X29D.


Ben Hom

Re: [Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] "Dedicated" freight car service

Bill Keene
 

Elden,

What is the rough date that the X29F box cars went into service? Would these have been in service during the circle keystone era? 

My knowledge of the PRR is quite limited thus this rather basic question.

Thanks & Happy Modeling,
Bill Keene
Irvine, CA



On Mar 10, 2020, at 7:18 AM, Gatwood, Elden J SAD <elden.j.gatwood@...> wrote:

Gang;
 
This is a dedicated service PRR X29F in appliance service to GE, with STB load restraining equipment.  They were specially rebuilt from X29 u/f’s expressly for this purpose.
 
Elden Gatwood
 
From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Charles Peck
Sent: Wednesday, March 4, 2020 7:06 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: [Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] "Dedicated" freight car service
 
GE's Appliance Park in Louisville KY got a dedicated group of high-cube cars, not all from just one road.  Park opened in 1951.
Chuck Peck
 
 


Re: [Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] "Dedicated" freight car service

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Gang;

 

This is a dedicated service PRR X29F in appliance service to GE, with STB load restraining equipment.  They were specially rebuilt from X29 u/f’s expressly for this purpose.

 

Elden Gatwood

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Charles Peck
Sent: Wednesday, March 4, 2020 7:06 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: [Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] "Dedicated" freight car service

 

GE's Appliance Park in Louisville KY got a dedicated group of high-cube cars, not all from just one road.  Park opened in 1951.

Chuck Peck

 

 

On Wed, Mar 4, 2020 at 6:42 PM np328 <jcdworkingonthenp@...> wrote:

     For the railroads I have studied and read up in company files, I'll make a generalization that: specialized cars are most likely to be found in dedicated service. 

The rational is that these costs of the (then) new designs had to be justified by a dependable ROI.

    When the NP ordered new 50' cars in the late 1920's, these new 6000 series were to be dedicated to auto service. The studies done by them indicated that shipments of autos at that time were most dependent on what empty cars were available in the local Detroit area yards, and who let cars sit around idle local to the auto plants waiting for the call. They wanted these cars yesterday if not sooner, so they bought 1000 of these based largely on an existing AT&StF design that a car builder was building and had the assy. jigs already in place.  As autos grew in length, the Evans loaders needed to be changed more or less yearly with each new auto development. Eventually for lack of several inches (3 - 4 inches) of interior roof height, the cars were no longer viable as auto carriers and were released into general service.  

      Later came covered hoppers, at a time when these were still uncommon on railroads, the NP bought a handful - for one shipper per the request of the sales dept. Then later bought the next handful for another shipper, again per the sales dept.  Both of these sets and many later purchases of covered hoppers went directly into dedicated service.  The SP&S and GN were the same early on in the development of covered hoppers from the exchange of letters found in corporate files. The Q had a bigger heavy industry market (the Chicago area) than the others and so was on an earlier timeline.

   More NP examples (covered gons) exist however they are beyond this lists 1960 end date. 

     And I will state that if it was a dedicated service car, accounting had already crunched the numbers on the sales department request for said cars to be dedicated. An AFE or reading the railroads Board of Directors budget request for the prior year that cars were ordered for Oliver Farm Equipment or others should shed light on things. 
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              Jim Dick - St. Paul, MN

 

    

Re: Shrink wrap

Eric Hansmann
 

I used a similar technique for tarp covered loads. Attached are a couple images. I start with a pad of chipboard from a cereal box and glue Styrofoam shapes onto it. Then I covered the shapes with wrapping tissue paper, the kind Mont recommends. I sprayed the final form with an almond color from a rattle can then lightly dusted with a sooty color. Sorry for the blurry second image but it’s the only one I could find quickly to share.

 

I can’t believe the photo files are dated May 2011. Was it really that long ago?

 

 

Eric Hansmann

Murfreesboro, TN

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Mont Switzer
Sent: Monday, March 9, 2020 6:10 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Shrink wrap

 

I like to use tissue paper like what comes with a new shirt.  I cut it to the dimensions of a tarp, typically 12 x 12.  Lay it or them over the object and tack it in place with Elmer's.  This will not look like shrink wrap nor should it.  When satisfied with the coverage paint it dark gray or grimy black.  

 

Remember, tarps were pretty stiff (heavy) and did not always conform to the shape of the object being covered.

 

Tarps were tied down with ropes, wire or even nailed to the car floor.

 

Mont Switzer 

 

Re: Consumer Warning Labels

Brian Termunde
 

Micro-Trains (N Scale) does this to a degree. See attached - sorry that this particular car is outside our time frame, but it does show what they list.

Take Care,
 
Brian R. Termunde
Midvale, Utah

Re: [Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] "Dedicated" freight car service

Gatwood, Elden J SAD
 

Group;

 

Thank you for all your great input on this subject!  It added greatly to my knowledge of how diverse all these services were.

 

Thanks!

 

Elden Gatwood

 

From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> On Behalf Of Garth Groff and Sally Sanford
Sent: Thursday, March 5, 2020 8:52 PM
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: [Non-DoD Source] Re: [RealSTMFC] "Dedicated" freight car service

 

Friends,

 

Though what I noticed was beyond our period, I remember that some WP 50' DD PS-1 (which were delivered within our period) ended their days carrying spent automobile batteries out of West Sacramento on the Sacramento Northern. The cars were marked "Lead Battery Loading Only" or some such wording. The cars were contaminated, much like a cars in hide or fish service, and were probably scrapped soon thereafter. The several cars I saw were 50', which might be odd for such service, but not if the management was trying to squeeze a few more bucks out of cars that were already destined for scrap.

 

Yours Aye,

Garth Groff  🦆

 

 

On Thu, Mar 5, 2020 at 12:46 PM Dave Parker via Groups.Io <spottab=yahoo.com@groups.io> wrote:

Elden:

On the B&M, at least "back in the day", the only examples I know of are (i) the 200 MDT-built reefers of 1923 that carried "BANANA SERVICE ONLY" stencils, and (ii) the 1929-30 ARA quad hoppers that said "FOR EXCLUSIVE USE ON HOME ROADS".  I'm not sure if the latter qualifies as the kind of "dedicated service" that you are curious about.  Its origin, I presume, was the age and condition of the B&M's other coal cars, and the need to move a lot of water-borne bituminous from Boston to the many re-coaling facilities scattered around northern New England.

I don't think either stencil persisted for very long, certainly not much after the war.  I think the some of the reefers might have ended up in dedicated ice service, but that's too far into the future for me.

--
Dave Parker
Swall Meadows, CA

Re: Alcohol

Tony Thompson
 

Tony, some railroads observe Rule G.  And some observe the exceptions
to the rule. 

 Um, I didn't mean making cocktails during op sessions -- or at the workbench. Just after completing a project! Of course those not consuming alcohol at all will miss the multiple-use feature.

Tony Thompson



Re: MEK...was Consumer Warning Labels

Tim O'Connor
 




Sent from Xfinity Connect Application


-----Original Message-----

From: jack.f.mullen@...
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io
Sent: 2020-03-09 7:36:47 PM
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] MEK...was Consumer Warning Labels

On Mon, Mar 9, 2020 at 07:55 AM, Jack Burgess wrote:
Our hardware store had a MEK substitute but I read that it didn’t work on styrene like MEK
Exactly what I found. Presumably the substitute is effective as a paint thinner, but it's pretty useless for welding plastic.

Jack Mullen


--
Tim O'Connor
Sterling, Massachusetts

Re: Alcohol

Charles Peck
 


Tony, some railroads observe Rule G.  And some observe the exceptions
to the rule. 
C. Peck

 
I also priced Everclear ethyl alcohol but for only 75%, it was way too
costly.  

Yeah, but you can make cocktails with Everclear. Multiple use!

Tony Thompson



Re: MEK...was Consumer Warning Labels

Jack Mullen
 

On Mon, Mar 9, 2020 at 07:55 AM, Jack Burgess wrote:
Our hardware store had a MEK substitute but I read that it didn’t work on styrene like MEK
Exactly what I found. Presumably the substitute is effective as a paint thinner, but it's pretty useless for welding plastic.

Jack Mullen

Re: Alcohol

Tony Thompson
 

Charles Peck wrote:

Stripping paint is my usual use, sometimes just lifting lettering.
As for local stores, Publix supermarket, Walmart, Walgreens, and CVS.
I also priced Everclear ethyl alcohol but for only 75%, it was way too
costly.  

Yeah, but you can make cocktails with Everclear. Multiple use!

Tony Thompson



Re: Alcohol

Nolan Hinshaw
 

On Mar 9, 2020, at 16:13, Jack Mullen <jack.f.mullen@...> wrote:

Try the paint department at a hardware or home improvement store for isopropol. Demand there doesn't seem to be impacted by the Corona crisis.
Add paint stores and chandleries; it's a fine cleaning sovent. If you think of using it for hand sanitizers, though, it probably doensn't meet US Pharmacopeia standards

"Don't worry, boys, it's just a furry with a syringe on top."
F. Feghoot

Re: Prototype info on labels, was the hijacked thread RE: [RealSTMFC] Consumer Warning Labels

Randy Hammill
 

Well, Branchline put the paint scheme date on the box.


Rapido, True Line, Tangent, Exactrail, and Intermountain (and probably some I’m missing) have various amounts of information on their website and packaging, and we at Prototype Junction have specifically stated that we will put a reweigh date within 6 months of the earliest documented application of a paint scheme.

MTH specifically labels cars that are fantasy schemes.

So I think this is/has been done to various degrees already. 

I can’t speak for other manufacturers, but I’m sure the majority are happy to answer questions when asked.

But if there are things you want us to put on the label at Prototype Junction, let us know. Of course, it will have to wait until we relaunch, but we are happy to provide any information that will make it easier for the modeler you choose which of our models they would like.

I doubt we are unique in that regard, but message received. More information on the labels/website.

Randy


Randy Hammill
Prototype Junction
http://prototypejunction.com

Modeling the New Haven Railroad 1946-1954
http://newbritainstation.com

Re: Alcohol

Charles Peck
 

Yes, I have in the past bought alcohol at such places.  Can't buy from an empty shelf.
Chuck Peck

On Mon, Mar 9, 2020 at 7:00 PM Nelson Moyer <npmoyer@...> wrote:
Walmart, Walgreen, CVS, etc. all sell 70% and 91% isopropanol for under $2 quart.

Nelson Moyer

On Mar 9, 2020, at 3:32 PM, Charles Peck <lnnrr152@...> wrote:

I am out of 90% isopropyl alcohol.  Local stores have none, not even 70%. 
What are you guys using as a substitute?
Chuck Peck

Re: Alcohol

Jack Mullen
 

Try the paint department at a hardware or home improvement store for isopropol.  Demand there doesn't seem to be impacted by the Corona crisis. 

Jack Mullen

Re: Shrink wrap

Mont Switzer
 

I like to use tissue paper like what comes with a new shirt.  I cut it to the dimensions of a tarp, typically 12 x 12.  Lay it or them over the object and tack it in place with Elmer's.  This will not look like shrink wrap nor should it.  When satisfied with the coverage paint it dark gray or grimy black.  

Remember, tarps were pretty stiff (heavy) and did not always conform to the shape of the object being covered.

Tarps were tied down with ropes, wire or even nailed to the car floor.

Mont Switzer 



Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone


-------- Original message --------
From: Allen Cain <Allencaintn@...>
Date: 3/9/20 5:36 PM (GMT-05:00)
To: main@realstmfc.groups.io
Subject: Re: [RealSTMFC] Shrink wrap

Would stretch wrap give the effect you are seeking?

The stuff that movers use is very thin and stretches a lot. Available at Home Depot and most self storage placed.

Allen Cain

Re: Alcohol

Roger Huber
 

I was told yesterday by a person at Walgreens that all alcohol is selling fast because of the corona virus scare.

Roger Huber
Deer Creek Locomotive Works


On Monday, March 9, 2020, 05:56:25 PM CDT, Charles Peck <lnnrr152@...> wrote:


Stripping paint is my usual use, sometimes just lifting lettering.
As for local stores, Publix supermarket, Walmart, Walgreens, and CVS.
I also priced Everclear ethyl alcohol but for only 75%, it was way too
costly.  
Chuck Peck

On Mon, Mar 9, 2020 at 6:42 PM Bruce Smith <smithbf@...> wrote:
Chuck,

1) Um, it might help if you told us what you are doing with it so we know where this is going... 😉

2) I would assume that when you say "Local stores" you have checked your local big box drug store?

Regards,
Bruce Smith
Auburn, AL


From: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io> on behalf of Charles Peck <lnnrr152@...>
Sent: Monday, March 9, 2020 5:32 PM
To: main@RealSTMFC.groups.io <main@RealSTMFC.groups.io>
Subject: [RealSTMFC] Alcohol
 
I am out of 90% isopropyl alcohol.  Local stores have none, not even 70%. 
What are you guys using as a substitute?
Chuck Peck

Re: Alcohol

Nelson Moyer
 

Walmart, Walgreen, CVS, etc. all sell 70% and 91% isopropanol for under $2 quart.

Nelson Moyer

On Mar 9, 2020, at 3:32 PM, Charles Peck <lnnrr152@...> wrote:

I am out of 90% isopropyl alcohol.  Local stores have none, not even 70%. 
What are you guys using as a substitute?
Chuck Peck