This is completely ON topic!


Bill Lane <billlane@...>
 

Hi All,

I figured I would shake the list up with something that is completely ON
STMFC topic. Wow, what a novel concept I!! (:->)

In 100 words or less, what is your single favorite Steam Era Freight Car,
and WHY? Principal contributors Ted Culotta and Ben Hom are required to
respond.

This outta be interesting. I stir the pot, and see what happens.....

Thanks
Bill


tim gilbert <tgilbert@...>
 

Bill Lane wrote:

I figured I would shake the list up with something that is completely ON
STMFC topic. Wow, what a novel concept I!! (:->)

In 100 words or less, what is your single favorite Steam Era Freight Car,
and WHY? Principal contributors Ted Culotta and Ben Hom are required to
respond.
B&M Pulpwood Racks #29000-29099 which resembled an open-top stock car
crammed inside a steel 40' gon with mangled tie rods spanning the top of
the car. These lasted with arch bar trucks until 1949.

Another candidate would be B&M 36' SUF Boxcar series #64680-65687 which
had Fox Trucks. The last was retired from revenue service in 1948.

Neither class could be considered "essential" or "ubiquitous" a la
Culotta.

Tim Gilbert

Tim Gilbert


Benjamin Frank Hom <b.hom@...>
 

Bill Lane wrote:
In 100 words or less, what is your single favorite Steam Era Freight Car,
and WHY? Principal contributors Ted Culotta and Ben Hom are required to
respond.

PRR Class X29: It wasn't the first steel boxcar. It had three significant
design limitations: a side sill design that trapped water, when combined
with a leaky roof design, led to significant corrosion problems in virtually
every car built. Additionally, the car had a smallish cubic capacity due to
its 8 ft 7 in IH. The Pennsy kept it in production so long that it was
obsolescent by the time the last one was built in 1932. But the Pennsy
built 28,701 of them, and they showed up in every kind of freight and
passenger (as express cars) all over North America from 1924 into the 1960s.
You simply can't model a steam era freight train without at least one.

Runner-up - NYC USRA-design steel boxcar: Just as numerous as the X29 when
you add up all of them system wide, but sorely underrepresented on almost
every steam-era layout. Another car you just got to have to model a steam
era freight train.


Ben Hom


Steven Delibert <STEVDEL@...>
 

Well, painful to answer an on-topic message, but this one is easy for
me: New York Central "USRA" boxcars, of course: Shouldn't exist, were
built by the bazillions and survived for decades, easy to spot, signature
car of my favorite big railroad, available in several variations in
Wonderful Westerfield kits, only close competition is Westerfield NYC
hoppers . . ...
Now, if somebody really made Ulster & Delaware models, we might have
something to debate, but otherwise, case closed for me! Doubtless rational
minds may differ.
Steve Delibert

----- Original Message -----
From: Bill Lane <billlane@comcast.net>
In 100 words or less, what is your single favorite Steam Era Freight Car,
and WHY? Principal contributors Ted Culotta and Ben Hom are required to
respond.


Spen Kellogg <spenkell@...>
 

Bill Lane wrote:
Hi All,
I figured I would shake the list up with something that is completely ON
STMFC topic. Wow, what a novel concept I!! (:->)
In 100 words or less, what is your single favorite Steam Era Freight Car,
and WHY? Principal contributors Ted Culotta and Ben Hom are required to
respond.
This outta be interesting. I stir the pot, and see what happens.....
SP Tea and Silk car. Second choice is the SP BR-40-10 express reefer.

Regards, Spen Kellogg


thompson@...
 

Ben Hom said:
PRR Class X29: ...the Pennsy
built 28,701 of them, and they showed up in every kind of freight and
passenger (as express cars) all over North America from 1924 into the 1960s.
You simply can't model a steam era freight train without at least one.
I'd vote with Ben. That's why the X29 was on the first Friends of the
Freight Car shirt. (and you thought I was an unrepentant teaser of SPFs...)

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2942 Linden Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 http://www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroads and on Western history


Denis F. Blake <dblake2996@...>
 

Without a doubt, from my view point, that would be the Seaboards 1932 cars.
These cars saw service for many years with some of them getting rebuilt into
ventilated express cars as well. The Seaboard was second in total owned of
these cars, behind the Mopac.

Sure would be nice to get a plastic model of this car but there were simply
too many variations and too few so called "major" owners for this to happen.

Best regards,

Denis F. Blake
NS Conductor
Columbus, OH
TTHOTS

Please visit my photo site at

http://hyperphoto.photoloft.com/view/allalbums.asp?s=cano&u=1665499

----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Lane" <billlane@comcast.net>
To: "Steam Era Freight cars" <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Tuesday, May 20, 2003 7:50 PM
Subject: [STMFC] This is completely ON topic!


Hi All,

I figured I would shake the list up with something that is completely ON
STMFC topic. Wow, what a novel concept I!! (:->)

In 100 words or less, what is your single favorite Steam Era Freight Car,
and WHY? Principal contributors Ted Culotta and Ben Hom are required to
respond.

This outta be interesting. I stir the pot, and see what happens.....

Thanks
Bill



To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
STMFC-unsubscribe@egroups.com



Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/


CBarkan@...
 

I think the X-29's fore-runner, the X-25 is actually a more interesting &
attractive car, and it too is under-represented. And it can lay claim to being
the first large-production all-steel boxcar.

Chris-Barkan

In a message dated 5/20/03 8:58:49 PM, b.hom@worldnet.att.net writes:

<< PRR Class X29: It wasn't the first steel boxcar. It had three significant
design limitations: a side sill design that trapped water, when combined
with a leaky roof design, led to significant corrosion problems in virtually
every car built. Additionally, the car had a smallish cubic capacity due to
its 8 ft 7 in IH. The Pennsy kept it in production so long that it was
obsolescent by the time the last one was built in 1932. But the Pennsy
built 28,701 of them, and they showed up in every kind of freight and
passenger (as express cars) all over North America from 1924 into the 1960s.
You simply can't model a steam era freight train without at least one. >>


Bruce F. Smith <smithbf@...>
 

Bill asks
In 100 words or less, what is your single favorite Steam Era Freight Car,
and WHY? Principal contributors Ted Culotta and Ben Hom are required to
respond.
Dangerous ground here Bill. "Favorite" implies emotional and not logical
reasoning, and thus a favorite car could be the antithesis of a logical car
<G>. After all, what stands out in the mind is often the oddball, or
unusual, so for favorites, I would have to vote for two, one-of-a-kind cars:

1) PRR X30 70' steel boxcar. A special purpose boxcar with end doors
designed for loading aerial ladder trucks for American LaFrance in Elmira
New York. A 70' boxcar in a fleet of 40'ers...too cool...AND the Elmira
branch is one of my favorite PRR branches...AND it combines a fascination
of trains and fire engines...Hopefully, Rail Classics will release this car
in HO shortly.

2) PRR FD2/FW1 flat car. Two cars really as there was a depressed center
body and a well hole body that carried different numbers. With 16 axles, 4
ex-tender trucks and its humongous size, it is a train all by itself (and
often had to handled as such!)

Happy Rails
Bruce

Bruce F. Smith V.M.D., Ph.D.
Scott-Ritchey Research Center
334-844-5587, 334-844-5850 (fax)
http://www.vetmed.auburn.edu/~smithbf/

"Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin
__
/ &#92;
__<+--+>________________&#92;__/___ ____________________________________
|- ______/ O O &#92;_______ -| | __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ __ |
| / 4999 PENNSYLVANIA 4999 &#92; | ||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||__||
|/_____________________________&#92;|_|____________________________________|
| O--O &#92;0 0 0 0/ O--O | 0-0-0 0-0-0


benjaminfrank_hom <b.hom@...>
 

Chris Barkan wrote:
I think the X-29's fore-runner, the X-25 is actually a more
interesting & attractive car, and it too is under-represented. And
it can lay claim to being the first large-production all-steel boxcar.

I considered the Class X25 cars, but quantity has a quality all its
own. Besides, it's fun to defeat arguments by the folks who claim "I
model (fill in the blank) RR - I don't need to know about those
Pennsy boxcars" by having them pull a yard or train photo from said
railroad and pointing out the X29s. Doesn't even work for the guys
out in Hawaii - the Oahu Railway had narrow gauge versions of the
X29, two of which survive in the Hawaiian Railway Society's
collection at Ewa. ;-)


Ben Hom
Ann-Margaret has a dash in her name, but PRR car classes DON'T...


Kevin Slark <MoffatRoad@...>
 

Denver & Rio Grande/D&RGW GS gons. Circa 1950 nearly
40,000 of tweleve classes dating from 1902 roamed the
rails. All different, down to the trucks, brake gear,
and safety appliances. Their only unifying trait was
their steel construction and "DRG/DRGW" reporting
marks. Also, they were painted oxide red before
1943/4, when they started to repainted black with
"Flying Rio Grande" on their sides. It is thought that
the red cars wearing the old "Royal Gorge/Moffat
Tunnel" hearld roamed around until 1960 or so. Only
the most modern cars have been produced by Red
Caboose, W&R has imported the 1937-class, and thats
it. I find this suprising for such a "popular" road
and that plans exist for most of the classes. Paging
Mr. Westerfield, paging Mr. Westerfield....

Yes, I realize this is more than 100 words. Aren't
English majors allowed to be wordy?

Kevin Slark
Rabid D&RGW/D&SL/CM Fan

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search - Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com


Garth G. Groff <ggg9y@...>
 

Kevin:

Maybe is would be better to page Martin Loftin of Sunshine. I have heard overtures have been made to him for a 46' GS gondola (including my own offer to provide data), though nothing has been produced yet. Both the D&RGW and the WP had similar classes of such cars built after WWII, which would make marketing such a car easier.

Perhaps some of the earlier cars would be more in Al's era of interest.

Be as wordy as you like.

Kind regards,


Garth G. Groff

Kevin Slark wrote:

Denver & Rio Grande/D&RGW GS gons. Circa 1950 nearly
40,000 of tweleve classes dating from 1902 roamed the
rails. All different, down to the trucks, brake gear,
and safety appliances . . . Paging
Mr. Westerfield, paging Mr. Westerfield....
Yes, I realize this is more than 100 words. Aren't
English majors allowed to be wordy?
Kevin Slark
Rabid D&RGW/D&SL/CM Fan


Dave Nelson <muskoka@...>
 

Maybe is would be better to page Martin Loftin of Sunshine. I have heard
overtures have been made to him for a 46' GS gondola (including my own
offer to provide data), though nothing has been produced yet.
I too have pitched the idea of GS gons to Martin -- the DRGW 71000 series;
46' foot IH, wood side as delivered, steel when rebuilt. Handed him scale
drawings too.

He was polite.

Dave Nelson


Dave Nelson <muskoka@...>
 

-----Original Message-----
I find this suprising for such a "popular" road
and that plans exist for most of the classes. Paging
Mr. Westerfield, paging Mr. Westerfield....

Kevin, do you know of any plans or other engineering drawings of the DRGW
36' GS gons?

Dave Nelson


thompson@...
 

Dave Nelson said:
I too have pitched the idea of GS gons to Martin -- the DRGW 71000 series;
46' foot IH, wood side as delivered, steel when rebuilt. Handed him scale
drawings too.
He was polite.
Dave, in my experience, Martin is ALWAYS polite. But you may have heard
him say on occasion, as I have, that open-top cars aren't great sellers.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2942 Linden Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 http://www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroads and on Western history


Dave Nelson <muskoka@...>
 

-----Original Message-----
From: thompson@signaturepress.com [mailto:thompson@signaturepress.com]
Dave Nelson said:
I too have pitched the idea of GS gons to Martin -- the DRGW
71000 series;
46' foot IH, wood side as delivered, steel when rebuilt. Handed
him scale drawings too.
He was polite.
Dave, in my experience, Martin is ALWAYS polite. But you may have heard
him say on occasion, as I have, that open-top cars aren't great sellers.
Well, yes, he *is* always polite. I didn't mean to suggest otherwise (I was
trying to convey my notice of a lack of enthusiasm on his part as I waved
drawings at him). He didn't mention anything about poor sales of open top
cars. I'm sure he knows his business and I'm not going to second guess him
on that. Too bad... there were lots of neat GS gons.

So tell me Tony, wouldn't you be a bit enthusastic if somebody offered a one
pc resin kit of any of the older inset side GS gons used by the SP? Hmm?
8-) Bet you would. Me too. 8-)

Dave Nelson


tim gilbert <tgilbert@...>
 

thompson@signaturepress.com wrote:

... in my experience, Martin is ALWAYS polite. But you may have
heard
him say on occasion, as I have, that open-top cars aren't great
sellers.
Unlike boxcars and, perhaps, general service flat cars - anyone of which
could show up on any line on any road in the 1945-55 era, open top cars
were far more limited in their range of operation.

Empty open top cars were much more difficult to reload on foreign roads
than boxcars; hence, many, if not the majority, of the open tops were
returned to their home roads empty.

Therefore, the market for model open tops is somewhat limited to the
home road and roads having direct interchanges with the home road.

There may be exceptions - e.g. mill gons - but these were not as free
rolling as boxcars because of the difficulty in getting reloads.

Tim Gilbert


thompson@...
 

Tim Gilbert said:
Unlike boxcars and, perhaps, general service flat cars - anyone of which
could show up on any line on any road in the 1945-55 era, open top cars
were far more limited in their range of operation.
Therefore, the market for model open tops is somewhat limited to the
home road and roads having direct interchanges with the home road.
I fully agree with all this, but any hobby shop owner will tell you that
house cars outsell everything else about 25 to 1--which somehow I doubt
reflects any knowledge of loading rules. More likely it represents pure
buying appeal.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2942 Linden Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 http://www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroads and on Western history


thompson@...
 

Dave Nelson asked:
So tell me Tony, wouldn't you be a bit enthusastic if somebody offered a one
pc resin kit of any of the older inset side GS gons used by the SP? Hmm?
8-) Bet you would. Me too. 8-)
Sure, but I'd prefer one of the 46-ft. DRGW or WP gons. One can redetail
the old Ulrich and at least HAVE a 1920s SP GS. Right now the 46-ft. cars
are a tough kitbash (though it's been done).
Or did you mean G-50-7 or thereabouts? Now that's a yummy thought.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2942 Linden Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 http://www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroads and on Western history


smokeandsteam@...
 

It's been interesting to see the responses, but I can't really say that I
have a favourite car.

What appeals to me is the train of which the car is only a part. It's that up
and down of the roofs and the variety of textures in the sides -- here a DS
box, there a Howe truss and over there a steel car, with a tankcar, hopper,
loaded flat or gon to add interest at intervals.

Aidrian Bridgeman-Sutton
Willows CA