small roads freight car models


Gatwood, Elden <Elden.Gatwood@...>
 

All;

I know of some small roads represented in model form by Westerfield and
Sunshine, but I was wondering if you have ever seen any models of
(accurate) freight cars, or good photo/data resources for the following:



BlawKnox Corp.

Conemaugh & Black Lick

Delray

Donora Southern

EJ&E

IHB

Koppers

Lake Terminal

Montour

McKeesport Connecting

PBNE

Pgh & Shawmut

Union RR (of Pgh; the USS subsidiary)

Youngstown & Northern



They all had cars in interchange (I saw most of these in person), but
aside from the discontinued Sunshine EJ&E boxcar, I don't think I have
ever seen a model.



Thanks!



Elden Gatwood


Andy Cich <ajc5150@...>
 

Elden,

Your list included one of my favorite subjects: freight cars of the Chicago
short lines.

EJ&E

The P2K flat car can be used for EJ&E 6375-6574 & 6575-6774
The Sunshine gift and minikit from Naperville 2003 is for EJ&E 60400-60899
The discontinued Sunshine kit you mentioned was for the EJ&E steel rebuilds.
EJ&E had lots of covered hoppers. I haven't completed my homework, but the
Kato or Bowser cars look promising.
I haven't had any luck yet matching a gondola.

IHB
The Tichy or F&C War Emergency gondola is good for IHB 6000-6299. There
have been recent articles published in both RMJ and RMC covering this car.
See the 12/96 issue of RMJ for modeling 10'6" IH boxcars. (10600-10999)
Sunshine 30.15 is a model of an IHB flatcar.

BRC (You didn't mention this one but they had few revenue freight cars)
I have a photo of BRC 865. It looks to be an ex-PRR X31A.
Their other freight cars I have discovered seem to be quite a batch of
odd-balls. I need to find more info but XM 802-850 look promising. These
were 36'5" IL single sheath cars with steel underframes. They had 6'1"
doors. Cars 852-862 had identical dimensions as the 802-850 cars, but they
didn't have roofs and were used for coke service.
Cars 2000-2049 were 33'0" IL 2171 cu ft. twin bay steel hopper cars. I
would like to find a photo of one of these cars to see if there is modeling
potential.


I hope some or all of this helps.


Andy Cich


Garth Groff <ggg9y@...>
 

Andy and Elden,

Don't forget that the IHB had 10' IH 40' boxcars. IIRC, IMWX (or maybe Des Plaines) offered this car lettered for IHB. It's gone now, but the Red Caboose model is substantially correct. Richard Hendrickson wrote about these in an RMJ/DING article at the time the models were first released.

Kind regards,


Garth G. Groff


Andy Cich wrote:

. . . IHB
The Tichy or F&C War Emergency gondola is good for IHB 6000-6299. There
have been recent articles published in both RMJ and RMC covering this car.
See the 12/96 issue of RMJ for modeling 10'6" IH boxcars. (10600-10999)
Sunshine 30.15 is a model of an IHB flatcar . . . .

Andy Cich


Gatwood, Elden <Elden.Gatwood@...>
 

Andy, Bruce, and Garth;
Thanks for the feedback. It was very helpful.

Some of these small lines may be obscure, but they did have a presence
out there, and photos confirm that presence in many areas you wouldn't
expect to see them.

If I expect to have a somewhat accurate array of freight cars
eventually, I have to address some of their fleets. I can only hope
that some resin car master builder may choose to pick up on some of
these cars and offer them on the open market.

Thanks again,

Elden Gatwood

-----Original Message-----
From: Andy Cich [mailto:ajc5150@insightbb.com]
Sent: Wednesday, February 23, 2005 6:35 PM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [STMFC] small roads freight car models


Elden,

Your list included one of my favorite subjects: freight cars of the
Chicago
short lines.

EJ&E

The P2K flat car can be used for EJ&E 6375-6574 & 6575-6774
The Sunshine gift and minikit from Naperville 2003 is for EJ&E
60400-60899
The discontinued Sunshine kit you mentioned was for the EJ&E steel
rebuilds.
EJ&E had lots of covered hoppers. I haven't completed my homework, but
the
Kato or Bowser cars look promising.
I haven't had any luck yet matching a gondola.

IHB
The Tichy or F&C War Emergency gondola is good for IHB 6000-6299. There
have been recent articles published in both RMJ and RMC covering this
car.
See the 12/96 issue of RMJ for modeling 10'6" IH boxcars. (10600-10999)
Sunshine 30.15 is a model of an IHB flatcar.

BRC (You didn't mention this one but they had few revenue freight cars)
I have a photo of BRC 865. It looks to be an ex-PRR X31A.
Their other freight cars I have discovered seem to be quite a batch of
odd-balls. I need to find more info but XM 802-850 look promising.
These
were 36'5" IL single sheath cars with steel underframes. They had 6'1"
doors. Cars 852-862 had identical dimensions as the 802-850 cars, but
they
didn't have roofs and were used for coke service.
Cars 2000-2049 were 33'0" IL 2171 cu ft. twin bay steel hopper cars. I
would like to find a photo of one of these cars to see if there is
modeling
potential.


I hope some or all of this helps.


Andy Cich





Yahoo! Groups Links


Westerfield <westerfield@...>
 

Elden - We make an EJ&E USRA DS box car. - Al

aside from the discontinued Sunshine EJ&E boxcar, I don't think I have
ever seen a model.



Thanks!


Richard Hendrickson
 

Elden Gatwood writes:

I know of some small roads represented in model form by Westerfield and
Sunshine, but I was wondering if you have ever seen any models of
(accurate) freight cars, or good photo/data resources for the following:
I'm responding only on those RRs for whose cars I have photographic evidence.

Delray
Delray Connecting RR owned about 150 hopper cars and 70 41' gondolas. The
gons were 10 panel steel cars and could be kitbashed from an MDC or
Sunshine kit. Lettering would have to be done one character at a time.

EJ&E
Hardly a small RR, and others have pointed out that Sunshine has, in the
past, offered kits for a couple of EJ&E box cars, and also that L-L did a
factory lettered EJ&E AAR 50 ton flat car. EJ&E also had a lot of 50'
steel mill gons with straight side sills and fishbelly center sills, and
many years ago I managed to kitbash a fairly decent replica of one of them
by cutting up a couple of Athearn gondola bodies into many sections and
re-assembling the pieces.

IHB
Again, IHB hardly qualifies as "small." As someone else on the list has
noted, this NYC subsidiary had AAR box cars built in the Central's Despatch
Shops, both 10' and 10'6" IH versions, and AAR 70 ton flat cars (Sunshine).
They also had 52'6" war emergency composite gondolas as modeld by Tichy
(IHB 6000-6299) as well as 25 NYC-design 70 ton covered hoppers for which
there is an F&C/North Shore Line resin kit.

Koppers
Almost entirely tank cars, most of them insulated. No correct models at
present, but one is said to be under development, and if it materializes,
it will be offered with Koppers P/L. In later years, Koppers also operated
some container gondolas which look as if they might have been ex-PRR cars.

Lake Terminal
Owned both 40' and 50' mill gons. The 50' cars had 14 panels, straight
side sills, and fishbelly center sills. The 40' cars were very similar to
cars owned by the Newburgh & South Shore, and in later years the Lake
Terminal absorbed the NSS fleet. I have kitbashed a model of an NSS car
from an MDC gon and the LT cars could be kitbashed in the same fashion.
The 50' cars would be more of a problem,though it might be possible to
kitbash them as well. Lettering would be a problem in either case.

Montour
Lots of USRA design 1880 cu. ft. twin hoppers (Tichy, Accurail). Walthers
once made decals, but they would be hard to find now.

McKeesport Connecting
A hundred 50'6" mill gondolas with 13 side panels, straight side sills, and
fishbelly center sills. Again, as with the EJ&E mill gons, a kitbash might
be possible but not easy.

Pgh & Shawmut
The Shawmutt fleet consisted almost entirely of hopper cars, none of which
appear to be of a standard design that has been modeled or can be easily
kitbashed.

Union RR (of Pgh; the USS subsidiary)
A sizeable fleet, mostly twin hoppers (including USRA-design cars) and mill
gondolas. The most numerous mill gons were 50'6" with straignt side sills,
fishbelly center sills, and an odd arrangement of side posts; they also had
40' 13 panel gons. Either would be difficult to kitbash.

Youngstown & Northern
A ragtag collection of old twin hoppers and 40' low side mill gons, the
latter very similar to the gons owned by the Newburgh & South shore though
lower in height. For modeling, see Lake Terminal above.

In short - Elden, you may want to contemplate some easier modeling projects.

Richard H. Hendrickson
Ashland, Oregon 97520


D. Scott Chatfield
 

As has already been noted, the EJ&E and IHB are hardly "small railroads." Indeed, they are officially Class 2 Terminal Lines (if I remember the terminology correctly). Terminal roads don't get a cut of the line haul, but they do charge their connections a "switching fee" which can be substantial.

I don't think Class 2s had to contribute cars to the national fleet in proportion to their revenue like Class 1s did, but many of them had significant originating traffic and it behooved them to own cars to protect the needs of their shippers. This would explain the EJ&E's and IHB large fleets. I also got the impression the NYC used the IHB as a way to make sure their steel-service empties got sent back to the Chicago end of the system rather than simply being dropped off at the nearest NYC interchange. which you could do with a car marked "NYC".

Class 3 lines, what are tradiationally thought of as shortlines, do not have to contribute cars to the national pool, and their connecting Class 1s have to supply cars for interchange traffic. Shortlines only had to own enough cars to meet their own captive movements, like LCL service, or in the case of the Yosemite Valley, limestone service between a quarry and an on-line Portland cement plant. Only shortlines that had a lot of originating traffic, or needed special cars to handle their interchange traffic, owned cars that freely roamed the national rail network. One example that comes to mind is Buffalo Creek, which served a bunch of flour mills. I gather the BCK didn't have a lot of interchangable cars until after WW2, however.

The other big exceptions to this rule were the switching lines owned by steel mills like USSteel and Bethlehem. They often had a bunch of gons to protect their originating finished steel products traffic.

It wasn't until the Incentive Per Diem craze of the '70s that many "normal" shortlines leased their own boxcars, and that was driven by other considerations, not originating traffic. Besides, that's well after the period covered by this list.

Scott C


benjaminfrank_hom <b.hom@...>
 

Elden Gatwood asked:
"...but I was wondering if you have ever seen any models of
(accurate) freight cars, or good photo/data resources for the
following:
<snip>
EJ&E"

Andy Cich made some recommendations and commented:
"I haven't had any luck yet matching a gondola."

The AHM/IHC shorty War Emergency gon can be kitbashed into a "tan
dot" model of EJ&E 33250-34189, 48 ft 6 in IL composite gons built
in 1942. (1943 CBC AC&F builder's photo from the pay side of the
RPI website)
http://railroad.union.rpi.edu/rolling-stock/gons/composite/Gons-50-
ft-composite-EJ&E-43-cyc.jpg

John Nehrich cut off the bottom ot the truss to create a straight
side-sill gon and added strip styrene at the corner posts to suggest
a drop end. This car is a stand in because the truss members don't
join at the side sill, making a structurally impossible car, but
it's a quick way to add variety to the gon fleet, makes use out of
an otherwise useless car (it's too short to truly model the 52 ft 6
in War Emergency gons), and the price is right (< $2 in junk boxes
at any train show).

See John Nehrich's article in the October 1994 Railmodel Journal for
more information.


Ben Hom


Benjamin Hom <b.hom@...>
 

Elden Gatwood wrote:
"I know of some small roads represented in model form by Westerfield and
Sunshine, but I was wondering if you have ever seen any models of
(accurate) freight cars, or good photo/data resources for the following:

BlawKnox Corp."
John Nehrich writes in "NEB&W Guide IV, From Baby Ruth to Byerlyte" that
Blaw-Knox ordered 6 70-ton gons from Standard Steel in 1922, BKX 1001-1006,
listed in the ORER through at least 1968. No pictures, unfortunately.


"Donora Southern"
October 1913 Standard Steel Car Co. builder's photo of Donora Southern 603,
an H21-style quad, on p 35 of Teichmoeller. Car has the old-style hoppers
but differs from Class H21 in at least the following details: "club" style
hand brake and 70-ton archbar trucks. Side stakes appear to be similar to
H21. Lettering very similar to PRR NK3 scheme. Bowser offers this paint
scheme on their H21 kit:
http://www.bowser-trains.com/img/54104.jpg


Ben Hom