LNE 1923 ARA Box


Robert Daniels
 

Hi Group,

I�m looking for any or all of the following
information regarding the appliances used on LNE 1923
ARA boxcars following AB upgrades:

1) What type of brake housing (I believe it was power
brakes, but not sure what kind)
2) What type of cut lever (carmer, upper or lower bar)
3) Was the three-lever system like the one on the PRR
X29 retained, or was it converted to the more
conventional two-lever AB arrangement?
4) What type of trucks was used?

Thanks!

Rob Daniels
New York, NY




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Benjamin Hom <b.hom@...>
 

Rob Daniels asked:
"I'm looking for any or all of the following information regarding the
appliances used on LNE 1923 ARA boxcars following AB upgrades:

1) What type of brake housing (I believe it was power brakes, but not sure
what kind)"

Will Whittaker photographed LNE 8413 at San Francisco in 1963. This photo
ran in the Amerine/Freeman X29 article in the October 1978 Prototype
Modeler. Brake wheel and housing are Ajax.


"2) What type of cut lever (carmer, upper or lower bar)"

It's hard to tell in the Whitaker photo - it appears to be top operated.
The cars were built with Carmer cut levers. If I had to guess, I would say
that many retained them to retirement, with some replaced as Carmer parts
became scarce (as did the PRR X29).


"3) Was the three-lever system like the one on the PRR X29 retained, or was
it converted to the more conventional two-lever AB arrangement?"

The LNE cars had KC brakes vice the KD brakes of the PRR cars, so the lever
arrangement is different. I'd go with the two lever arrangement. A Paul
Dunn photo of LNE 8484 in the November 2001 Railmodel Journal has the AB
brake components nicely silhouetted.


"4) What type of trucks was used?"

The cars were built new with ARA Type Y trucks. (The Bowser 2D-F8 is the
closest match in HO and N.) These were replaced by the 1950s with AAR cast
sideframe trucks with simplex bolsters. (Life-Like Canada LL212560 in HO.)


Ben Hom


Ted Culotta <tculotta@...>
 

On Mar 15, 2005, at 3:44 AM, Benjamin Hom wrote:

Rob Daniels asked:
"I'm looking for any or all of the following information regarding the
appliances used on LNE 1923 ARA boxcars following AB upgrades:

1) What type of brake housing (I believe it was power brakes, but not sure
what kind)"

Will Whittaker photographed LNE 8413 at San Francisco in 1963. This photo
ran in the Amerine/Freeman X29 article in the October 1978 Prototype
Modeler. Brake wheel and housing are Ajax.
First group (8001-8200) used unpowered staff-type hand brakes. The second group (8201-8500) used Ajax hand brakes with the early hand wheel (use the parts from Intermountain) and the last group I can't definitively say, but I believe they used Ajax. As the earlier cars (8001-8200) received their diagonal panel roofs, they also received power hand brakes, not Ajax in every case.

"2) What type of cut lever (carmer, upper or lower bar)"

It's hard to tell in the Whitaker photo - it appears to be top operated.
The cars were built with Carmer cut levers. If I had to guess, I would say
that many retained them to retirement, with some replaced as Carmer parts
became scarce (as did the PRR X29).
The last group of cars built (8501-8750) used bottom operated cut levers.

"3) Was the three-lever system like the one on the PRR X29 retained, or was
it converted to the more conventional two-lever AB arrangement?"

The LNE cars had KC brakes vice the KD brakes of the PRR cars, so the lever
arrangement is different. I'd go with the two lever arrangement. A Paul
Dunn photo of LNE 8484 in the November 2001 Railmodel Journal has the AB
brake components nicely silhouetted.


"4) What type of trucks was used?"

The cars were built new with ARA Type Y trucks. (The Bowser 2D-F8 is the
closest match in HO and N.) These were replaced by the 1950s with AAR cast
sideframe trucks with simplex bolsters. (Life-Like Canada LL212560 in HO.)
Again, the last group was different, using an ARA truck with cast steel sideframes with a coil-elliptic spring package. All of the photos I have of cars with different trucks show none with anything like the Life Like trucks (a 1920s type). Does Life Like offer more than one truck (that would be good news)?

Ben's comments were probably directed towards the models and thus, towards the two earlier groups. The last group of cars had always puzzled me. Why would the LNE build a 1923 ARA car with Dreadnaught ends and a Murphy roof when the 1932 ARA car was already being built. The answer I found was that the rolls for the Z-sections of the center sill on the 1932 ARA cars were not available in large enough quantities so they opted to build a 1923 ARA car with the more modern roof and ends.

Regards,
Ted Culotta

Speedwitch Media
100 14th Avenue, San Mateo, CA 94402
info@...
www.speedwitch.com
(650) 787-1912


Robert Daniels
 

Thanks Ted -- do you know about when the cars received
diagonal panel roofs?

--- Ted Culotta <tculotta@...> wrote:

On Mar 15, 2005, at 3:44 AM, Benjamin Hom wrote:

Rob Daniels asked:
"I'm looking for any or all of the following
information regarding the
appliances used on LNE 1923 ARA boxcars following
AB upgrades:

1) What type of brake housing (I believe it was
power brakes, but not
sure
what kind)"

Will Whittaker photographed LNE 8413 at San
Francisco in 1963. This
photo
ran in the Amerine/Freeman X29 article in the
October 1978 Prototype
Modeler. Brake wheel and housing are Ajax.
First group (8001-8200) used unpowered staff-type
hand brakes. The
second group (8201-8500) used Ajax hand brakes with
the early hand
wheel (use the parts from Intermountain) and the
last group I can't
definitively say, but I believe they used Ajax. As
the earlier cars
(8001-8200) received their diagonal panel roofs,
they also received
power hand brakes, not Ajax in every case.

"2) What type of cut lever (carmer, upper or lower
bar)"

It's hard to tell in the Whitaker photo - it
appears to be top
operated.
The cars were built with Carmer cut levers. If I
had to guess, I
would say
that many retained them to retirement, with some
replaced as Carmer
parts
became scarce (as did the PRR X29).
The last group of cars built (8501-8750) used bottom
operated cut
levers.

"3) Was the three-lever system like the one on the
PRR X29 retained,
or was
it converted to the more conventional two-lever AB
arrangement?"

The LNE cars had KC brakes vice the KD brakes of
the PRR cars, so the
lever
arrangement is different. I'd go with the two
lever arrangement. A
Paul
Dunn photo of LNE 8484 in the November 2001
Railmodel Journal has the
AB
brake components nicely silhouetted.


"4) What type of trucks was used?"

The cars were built new with ARA Type Y trucks.
(The Bowser 2D-F8 is
the
closest match in HO and N.) These were replaced
by the 1950s with AAR
cast
sideframe trucks with simplex bolsters.
(Life-Like Canada LL212560 in
HO.)
Again, the last group was different, using an ARA
truck with cast steel
sideframes with a coil-elliptic spring package. All
of the photos I
have of cars with different trucks show none with
anything like the
Life Like trucks (a 1920s type). Does Life Like
offer more than one
truck (that would be good news)?

Ben's comments were probably directed towards the
models and thus,
towards the two earlier groups. The last group of
cars had always
puzzled me. Why would the LNE build a 1923 ARA car
with Dreadnaught
ends and a Murphy roof when the 1932 ARA car was
already being built.
The answer I found was that the rolls for the
Z-sections of the center
sill on the 1932 ARA cars were not available in
large enough quantities
so they opted to build a 1923 ARA car with the more
modern roof and
ends.

Regards,
Ted Culotta

Speedwitch Media
100 14th Avenue, San Mateo, CA 94402
info@...
www.speedwitch.com
(650) 787-1912



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Tim O'Connor
 

Rob Daniels wrote

1) What type of brake housing (I believe it was power
brakes, but not sure what kind)
Rob, it depends on the car # and probably on the era. A 1959 photo
of LNE #8009 clearly has a Champion hand brake housing and wheel, a
modern cut lever, Apex steel running board, and a new roof. It may
have received all of these changes in 1959, I don't know.

There are a couple of other photos that show Champion hand brakes,
including a 1961 shot that appears to show a car with its original
roof and wood running board.

I used a Kadee Champion brakewheel on my model of 8208.

At least one photo shows the leaf-coil spring AAR trucks that no one
makes in HO scale. But the #8009 photo shows trucks exactly like the
Red Caboose kit trucks (2DF8?).

Tim O.


2) What type of cut lever (carmer, upper or lower bar)
3) Was the three-lever system like the one on the PRR
X29 retained, or was it converted to the more
conventional two-lever AB arrangement?
4) What type of trucks was used?

Thanks!
Rob Daniels
New York, NY


Mark Heiden
 

Hi Rob,

There is an LNE website that has some photos that may be of use to
you:

http://www.gingerb.com/L&NE_Freight_Equipment_1961.htm

Mark Heiden

--- In STMFC@..., Rob Daniels <shalizadad@y...> wrote:
Hi Group,

I'm looking for any or all of the following
information regarding the appliances used on LNE 1923
ARA boxcars following AB upgrades:

1) What type of brake housing (I believe it was power
brakes, but not sure what kind)
2) What type of cut lever (carmer, upper or lower bar)
3) Was the three-lever system like the one on the PRR
X29 retained, or was it converted to the more
conventional two-lever AB arrangement?
4) What type of trucks was used?

Thanks!

Rob Daniels
New York, NY




__________________________________
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Yahoo! Sports - Sign up for Fantasy Baseball.
http://baseball.fantasysports.yahoo.com/


Robert Daniels
 

Thanks Mark, I've actually been looking at that site
for a while. I just wish the photos were a little more
detailed. And some photos of the ends wouldn't have
hurt either. I don't think there's much chance of
going back in time to 1961 to retake the photos so for
now they are probably our best online resource.

Rob Daniels
New York, NY

--- Mark Heiden <mark_heiden@...> wrote:

Hi Rob,

There is an LNE website that has some photos that
may be of use to
you:

http://www.gingerb.com/L&NE_Freight_Equipment_1961.htm

Mark Heiden


--- In STMFC@..., Rob Daniels
<shalizadad@y...> wrote:
Hi Group,

I'm looking for any or all of the following
information regarding the appliances used on LNE
1923
ARA boxcars following AB upgrades:

1) What type of brake housing (I believe it was
power
brakes, but not sure what kind)
2) What type of cut lever (carmer, upper or lower
bar)
3) Was the three-lever system like the one on the
PRR
X29 retained, or was it converted to the more
conventional two-lever AB arrangement?
4) What type of trucks was used?

Thanks!

Rob Daniels
New York, NY




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