Red CABOOSE "NYC 40 ft Sheathed Boxcar (X-29)"


Benjamin Hom <b.hom@...>
 

Lou Nigro wrote:
"Rob is right, I should have said Red Caboose."

Is it kit no. RC-7050? At first glance, this might appear to be another
bogus Red Caboose model, but it's actually pretty accurate based on the
information that we have. NYC built 100 cars in 1926 to the either the
proposed 1923 ARA standard steel boxcar design or the early X29 design (NYC
97000-97099, later renumbered to NYC 128000-128099).
http://www.canadasouthern.com/caso/images/lot-504.jpg

I'm hedging because this diagram is the best that we've got so far on this
car. As you can see, it's pretty minimalist, but it clearly shows X29-type
flat ends. Unfortunately, it doesn't confirm the number of side panels or
roof type; however, the dimensions are very close to that of PRR Class X29.
John Nehrich wrote to the NYCSHS requesting photos of these cars, but they
replied that there were no known photos.

It's rather humorous that Red Caboose offered 21 different car numbers for
this 100 car lot. In reality, if you're going by fleet numbers of general
service boxcars, you'd need 210 Westerfield USRA-design steel boxcars for
every one of the Red Caboose kits.


Ben Hom


CASO <caso@...>
 

----- Original Message -----
From: "Benjamin Hom" <b.hom@...>

Is it kit no. RC-7050? At first glance, this might appear to be another
bogus Red Caboose model, but it's actually pretty accurate based on the
information that we have. NYC built 100 cars in 1926 to the either the
proposed 1923 ARA standard steel boxcar design or the early X29 design
(NYC
97000-97099, later renumbered to NYC 128000-128099).
http://www.canadasouthern.com/caso/images/lot-504.jpg

I'm hedging because this diagram is the best that we've got so far on this
car. As you can see, it's pretty minimalist, but it clearly shows
X29-type
flat ends. Unfortunately, it doesn't confirm the number of side panels or
roof type; however, the dimensions are very close to that of PRR Class
X29.
John Nehrich wrote to the NYCSHS requesting photos of these cars, but they
replied that there were no known photos.

One published photo appears in New York Central's Later Power by Staufer and May. Page 41 - car coupled to the
front of the locomotive. Has the three panel door similar to the Red Caboose kit.

And here are some shots of 128026 involved in a wreck on the CASO:
http://www.canadasouthern.com/caso/images/dunnville-wreck.jpg
http://www.canadasouthern.com/caso/images/nyc-128026.jpg

I believe these two shots should answer some questions about the construction of these cars.

Terry Link
Bramalea, Ontario, Canada
trlink@...
www.canadasouthern.com


benjaminfrank_hom <b.hom@...>
 

Terry Link wrote:
"One published photo appears in New York Central's Later Power by
Staufer and May. Page 41 - car coupled to the front of the
locomotive. Has the three panel door similar to the Red Caboose kit.

And here are some shots of 128026 involved in a wreck on the CASO:
http://www.canadasouthern.com/caso/images/dunnville-wreck.jpg
http://www.canadasouthern.com/caso/images/nyc-128026.jpg "

Terry, thanks for pointing us to these photos. The quality of the
photos isn't good enough to conclusively to ID whether or not these
are X29 or ARA copies (the particular spotting feature is the
arrangement of rivets at the panel seam between the panel closest to
the end and the second panel in)*, but they certainly provide much
more more information than what I thought we had earlier.

* - Specifically, the ARA arrangement has the panel seam centered on
the vertical structural member behind the sheathing. This results
in the row of closely spaced rivets on the inner (closest to the
door) side of the seam , and the other, wider spaced row of rivets
on the other side of the seam. The 1924 X29 arrangement has both
rows of rivets on the inner side of the seam.


Ben Hom


Jeff English
 

--- In STMFC@..., "Benjamin Hom" <b.hom@w...> wrote:

<snip>

I'm hedging because this diagram is the best that we've got so far
on this
car. As you can see, it's pretty minimalist, but it clearly shows
X29-type
flat ends. Unfortunately, it doesn't confirm the number of side
panels or
roof type; however, the dimensions are very close to that of PRR
Class X29.
John Nehrich wrote to the NYCSHS requesting photos of these cars,
but they
replied that there were no known photos.
Well, that response was pure balderdash, because I have the
builder's photo which I obtained from the NYCSHS; it's neg # F168
(no hyphen, Ben! See, even NYC did <something> the same way PRR
did, besides using standard gauge.) The image is the 3-in-1 type
typical of NYC builder's photos of the late teens and through the
20s.

The NYC cars, Lot 504-B, were most definitely built on the X29
pattern and <not> the ARA design.

This fact has been covered in at least two different clinics I have
presented at conventions, as well as discussed on this list's
predecessor, freightcars@..., in a message I
posted on 2001 August 17:

" At long last and at great expense, I have obtained from the
NYCSHS copies of the builder's photos of the elusive NYC Lot 504-
B, built as NYC 97000 - 97099 by MDT, East Rochester, in 12-25.
The most remarkable thing is that the rivet pattern does not
match the 1923 ARA recommended design (as I had expected),
but rather that of the early PRR X29! (based on the patterns
illustrated in Jeff Koeller's article on PM/C&O cars in the May 2001
issue
of Mainline Modeler) So I will stop railing on people who call
these cars
X29s, since they are tantamount to being X29s after all.
I think it is also notable that MDT concurrently built 400 cars in
Lot 503-B, NYC 97100 - 97499, following their USRA-clone all-steel
box car design. It appears as if the NYC's Mechanical Dept
wanted to do a controlled comparison of the two designs, and used
plans from the Pennsy rather than from the ARA. Obviously, they
continued to prefer the USRA-clone design, since they purchased
thousands more after this 100-car experiment.
PRR was never so open-minded as to try out the competition's
design."

Jeff English
Troy, New York