Topics

Bob's photos


Fred in Vt. <pennsy@...>
 

Tony,

Thanks for the info, now I can sit down with my confused friend, and hopefully get him through his Mopac withdrawl symtoms.

Fred F

----- Original Message -----
From: Anthony Thompson
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, August 27, 2005 2:54 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] RE: Bob's photos


> Let me take this one step further, if you don't mind.
> When a car is resided with steel over the Z bracing, does the ORER
> still list it as Z braced?

No, nor does the ORER normally list Z braces. It would
probably say "all steel" instead of "steel frame" or "steel
underframe."

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


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Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Let me take this one step further, if you don't mind. When a car is resided with steel over the Z bracing, does the ORER still list it as Z braced?
No, nor does the ORER normally list Z braces. It would probably say "all steel" instead of "steel frame" or "steel underframe."

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Fred in Vt. <pennsy@...>
 

Rich,

Let me take this one step further, if you don't mind. When a car is resided with steel over the Z bracing, does the ORER still list it as Z braced?
The fellow in question is a Mopac modeler, and is having issues with photos matching nember series. I'm a PRR modeler, and all I know about MP is the express & 10-6 sleepers in pool service.

Fred Freitas

----- Original Message -----
From: Richard Hendrickson
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 8:30 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] RE: Bob's photos


On Aug 26, 2005, at 4:13 PM, Fred in Vt. wrote:

> I'm trying to find an answer for a fellow modeler up here, and
> I did not have a clue to the right explanaton. Would one the more
> knowledgable please indulge me with the difference between Z bracing,
> and what some call "exteral bracing". Not to be confused with hat
> section structural members. It's one of those things I should know,
> and can't recall it. Drat !!!

At last! A genuine freight car question. "External bracing" or, more
correctly, "external framing" is any method of house car construction
in which the framing is outside the sheathing. In the steam era, this
was common to what are properly described as single sheathed cars (NOT
"outside braced," a term that was never used in the RR industry). Such
cars had a single layer of (usually) wood sheathing applied inside the
body framing, which could be either hat section (usually Pratt truss,
with the diagonals in compression) or Z section (usually Howe truss,
with the diagonals in tension).



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Richard Hendrickson
 

On Aug 26, 2005, at 4:13 PM, Fred in Vt. wrote:

I'm trying to find an answer for a fellow modeler up here, and I did not have a clue to the right explanaton. Would one the more knowledgable please indulge me with the difference between Z bracing, and what some call "exteral bracing". Not to be confused with hat section structural members. It's one of those things I should know, and can't recall it. Drat !!!
At last! A genuine freight car question. "External bracing" or, more correctly, "external framing" is any method of house car construction in which the framing is outside the sheathing. In the steam era, this was common to what are properly described as single sheathed cars (NOT "outside braced," a term that was never used in the RR industry). Such cars had a single layer of (usually) wood sheathing applied inside the body framing, which could be either hat section (usually Pratt truss, with the diagonals in compression) or Z section (usually Howe truss, with the diagonals in tension).


Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

In fairness to Martin, I would not pay up front & not have a guaranteed spot on the floor. Some folks are getting over-inflated, and need a reality check.
As for Al, that was a nightmare. . . .
I wasn't quibbling about the reason(s), just pointing out the absence.

I'm trying to find an answer for a fellow modeler up here, and I did not have a clue to the right explanaton. Would one the more knowledgable please indulge me with the difference between Z bracing, and what some call "exteral bracing". Not to be confused with hat section structural members. It's one of those things I should know, and can't recall it.
The cross-section of one is kind of a hat (inverted U), the other is a Z.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Fred in Vt. <pennsy@...>
 

Tony,

In fairness to Martin, I would not pay up front & not have a guaranteed spot on the floor. Some folks are getting over-inflated, and need a reality check.
As for Al, that was a nightmare. Al & Patricia waited till the next day to head home; just in time for a 20 some inch snow fall. IIRC, they had soda cans explode in their vehicle from the -10 temps.
Mrs. westerfield may be from Vermont, but Al does NOT DO SNOW. Have no reason to feel deprived by his decision, I can order on line.
For those who may never have operated in snow------it's different!!!
Now back to the regular programming >>>>>.

I'm trying to find an answer for a fellow modeler up here, and I did not have a clue to the right explanaton. Would one the more knowledgable please indulge me with the difference between Z bracing, and what some call "exteral bracing". Not to be confused with hat section structural members. It's one of those things I should know, and can't recall it. Drat !!!
Thanks.......

Fred Freitas

----- Original Message -----
From: Anthony Thompson
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 12:37 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] RE: Bob's photos


Thomas M. Olsen wrote:

> Springfield may have a waiting list of vendors, but they when they
> finally select a vendor to fill a spot, apparently they won't guarantee
> the table space until the vendor arrives to set up. Martin Lofton has
> been asked to attend as a vendor a number of times . . .

And Westerfield has told us he went once and isn't going again.
So Springfield isn't exactly presenting "all the big resin producers."

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


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Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Thomas M. Olsen wrote:

Springfield may have a waiting list of vendors, but they when they
finally select a vendor to fill a spot, apparently they won't guarantee
the table space until the vendor arrives to set up. Martin Lofton has
been asked to attend as a vendor a number of times . . .
And Westerfield has told us he went once and isn't going again. So Springfield isn't exactly presenting "all the big resin producers."

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Thomas M. Olsen <tmolsen@...>
 

Springfield may have a waiting list of vendors, but they when they finally select a vendor to fill a spot, apparently they won't guarantee the table space until the vendor arrives to set up. Martin Lofton has been asked to attend as a vendor a number of times by the people who run this show, but when he asked if they could guarantee him the table space, their reply was that he had to arrive at the door and they would then see what they could do.

Martin said that each time that he was asked, he told them that he would only come if they could guarantee the table space as he was not traveling across the country, only to arrive and find that they could not fit him in!

That is why Sunshine Models had only been attending the Great Scale Train Show at Timonium Maryland. He knows that he will get the space to set up that he paid in advance for! How could anyone run a show where they invite the dealer/manufacturer to participate, but cannot guarantee as space until he arrives? At this time it is a moot point as Martin has reduced his traveling to shows by almost 75% over the years due to his work backlog.

Tom Olsen
7 Boundary Road, West Branch
Newark, Delaware, 19711-7479
(302) 738-4292
tmolsen@udel.edu

Fred in Vt. wrote:

Rich,

You're forgiven, and you can come back north anytime. Heck, I live in southern Vermont, and snow season is the best time to sit in a warm shop & build away. Springfield must be doing something right, there is a waiting list of 60 vendors who want to attend.
Plus, it helps to have the major NE cities close by too.
If you get to really missing the place, I could always send a snowball in a cryo-pac !! <LOL>

Fred Freitas
----- Original Message -----
From: Richard Hendrickson To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 11:47 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] RE: Bob's photos


On Aug 24, 2005, at 8:35 PM, Tim O'Connor wrote:
>
> Springfield Massachusetts, Tony... in January. Bob has several hundred
> books, and chairs to sit on. And there are other excellent photo dealers
> there too.

Springfield, Mass. in January? When Cocoa Beach, Fla. is an alternative? Give me, as we say, a break. The Springfield meet is all very well for those who already live in the area, but I spent three winters in New England once and I ain't goin' back.

Richard Hendrickson



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Schuyler Larrabee
 

OK, so it's a little cold in January in Springfield. Maybe.

My sister called me a few days ago from North Carolina, and mentioned that the temperature was going
to be over 100 for the fourth day in a row, and she was looking forward to it's cooling off into the
90s in a few days. And it was humid.

Another good friend lives in FL. Used to live near Philadelphia. Complains about how his sinuses
give him trouble in FL, because the AC makes things so dry in the house . . .and he has to stay in
the house because of the heat. Wishes he still lived in PA.

OK, so it's a little cold in January in Springfield.

I'll take it.

Besides, it's a great show!

SGL

----- Original Message -----
From: David Owens
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2005 1:49 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] RE: Bob's photos


You chicken littles are depriving yourselves of the finest
train show
in the country. A little snow, a little ice, no problem.

Dave Owens


Fred in Vt. <pennsy@...>
 

Dave,

Let's not tell them how many of us drive 4x4's to have room to haul all the stuff home in the snow.

Fred Freitas
at home in the snow in Vermont

----- Original Message -----
From: David Owens
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2005 1:49 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] RE: Bob's photos


You chicken littles are depriving yourselves of the finest train show
in the country. A little snow, a little ice, no problem.

Dave Owens


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Tim O'Connor
 

Tim O'Connor wrote:
Springfield Massachusetts, Tony... in January.
In January. You ARE kidding.
Tony

If there were cab forwards on Donner this winter, I would
be there... Too much sunshine is bad for your brain! And
who wants to play with trains in the basement if the sun
is shining and it's warm outside? Gimme ice and snow, that's
the ticket.

Tim O.


ljack70117@...
 

On Thursday, August 25, 2005, at 01:29 PM, <branchline@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

Jeez Tony, you West Coast types really are wimps... :>)

In fact, its not a real Springfield show if it doesn't snow at least one
day... A few years back we had a blizzard the first morning of Springfield.
We showed up early to set up the booth and were greeted by a long line of
hearty New England model railroaders waiting two hours or more outside - in
the blinding snow - to get in! Now them's real model railroaders! Think I
even saw Tim in that line....

Now, having said all that - See you at the pool bar in Cocoa Beach!

Bill Schneider
Been in south Florida for 5 years. Get a little wind but have seen no snow yet.
Thank you
Larry Jackman
ljack70117@adelphia.net
Shin: A device for finding furniture in the dark.


Dave Owens
 

You chicken littles are depriving yourselves of the finest train show
in the country. A little snow, a little ice, no problem.

Dave Owens


Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Jeez Tony, you West Coast types really are wimps... :>)
Like Richard, I did my time in New England going to graduate school. I've never since missed those winters in any way, shape or form and certainly have no interest in doing it again. There's a number of reasons I choose to live in California and weather is one of them.

Now, having said all that - See you at the pool bar in Cocoa Beach!
Especially if the outdoor bar is working this year <g>.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Tim Gilbert <tgilbert@...>
 

branchline@sbcglobal.net wrote:

Jeez Tony, you West Coast types really are wimps... :>)

In fact, its not a real Springfield show if it doesn't snow at least one
day... A few years back we had a blizzard the first morning of Springfield.
We showed up early to set up the booth and were greeted by a long line of
hearty New England model railroaders waiting two hours or more outside - in
the blinding snow - to get in! Now them's real model railroaders! Think I
even saw Tim in that line....
This Tim is a bit wiser - stay in the car with a mug of coffee until just before the doors open. Also, bring a broom to sweep the snow away when leaving.

Tim Gilbert


branchline@...
 

Jeez Tony, you West Coast types really are wimps... :>)

In fact, its not a real Springfield show if it doesn't snow at least one day... A few years back we had a blizzard the first morning of Springfield. We showed up early to set up the booth and were greeted by a long line of hearty New England model railroaders waiting two hours or more outside - in the blinding snow - to get in! Now them's real model railroaders! Think I even saw Tim in that line....

Now, having said all that - See you at the pool bar in Cocoa Beach!

Bill Schneider

Tim O'Connor wrote:
Springfield Massachusetts, Tony... in January.
In January. You ARE kidding.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history




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Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Tim O'Connor wrote:
Springfield Massachusetts, Tony... in January.
In January. You ARE kidding.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Fred in Vt. <pennsy@...>
 

List,

Why do I get the impresson these guyz live in a motor home? They don't sem to be in residence much. Just how big a layout can they fit into one of those tag along trailers anyway?
Enquiring minds, etc......
No doubt each show has it's merit, what really counts is the $$$ for gas or airfare. Too much for either, and your buying power is too diminished for the show!!

Fred Freitas
modeling PRR, ca.1953

"You know you're a real Vermonter when your
grandparents drive 60 in blizzards."

----- Original Message -----
From: Ted Culotta
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2005 6:04 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] RE: Bob's photos



On Aug 24, 2005, at 11:47 PM, Richard Hendrickson wrote:

> On Aug 24, 2005, at 8:35 PM, Tim O'Connor wrote:
>>
>> Springfield Massachusetts, Tony... in January. Bob has several hundred
>> books, and chairs to sit on. And there are other excellent photo
>> dealers
>> there too.
>
> Springfield, Mass. in January? When Cocoa Beach, Fla. is an
> alternative? Give me, as we say, a break. The Springfield meet is all
> very well for those who already live in the area, but I spent three
> winters in New England once and I ain't goin' back.
>

Richard:

I'll agree with your assessment of the weather, but it is the best
train show in the country, bar none. Now, if you have everything you
need, as you do or are close to, then Cocoa Beach is a far better
alternative. I'll be at both.

Regards,
Ted Culotta

Speedwitch Media
645 Tanner Marsh Road, Guilford, CT 06437
info@speedwitch.com
www.speedwitch.com
(650) 787-1912



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Fred in Vt. <pennsy@...>
 

Rich,

You're forgiven, and you can come back north anytime. Heck, I live in southern Vermont, and snow season is the best time to sit in a warm shop & build away. Springfield must be doing something right, there is a waiting list of 60 vendors who want to attend.
Plus, it helps to have the major NE cities close by too.
If you get to really missing the place, I could always send a snowball in a cryo-pac !! <LOL>

Fred Freitas

----- Original Message -----
From: Richard Hendrickson
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 24, 2005 11:47 PM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] RE: Bob's photos


On Aug 24, 2005, at 8:35 PM, Tim O'Connor wrote:
>
> Springfield Massachusetts, Tony... in January. Bob has several hundred
> books, and chairs to sit on. And there are other excellent photo
> dealers
> there too.

Springfield, Mass. in January? When Cocoa Beach, Fla. is an
alternative? Give me, as we say, a break. The Springfield meet is all
very well for those who already live in the area, but I spent three
winters in New England once and I ain't goin' back.

Richard Hendrickson



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armprem
 

Too bad Jeff,we shall miss you. I truly miss Springfield,but when one
looks at the disadvantages of spending the rest of the winter there,Cocoa
Beach wins in a heartbeatArmand Premo

----- Original Message -----
From: "englishintroy" <englij@rpi.edu>
To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Thursday, August 25, 2005 5:56 AM
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Bob's photos


--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, Richard Hendrickson <rhendrickson@o...>
wrote:
Springfield, Mass. in January? When Cocoa Beach, Fla. is an
alternative? Give me, as we say, a break. The Springfield meet is
all
very well for those who already live in the area, but I spent three
winters in New England once and I ain't goin' back.
As always, I cannot let climate-ist statements like this go
ununaswered. I, for one, will take a northern winter (and the other
three seasons with it) over the wimp-appeal of the sunbelt. Look for
me at Springfield, but not at Cocoa Beach.

Jeff English
Troy, New York






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