Date
1 - 18 of 18
Couplers, Coupler Pockets, and Trucks
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S. Busch <SCSBusch@...>
Please Mr. Sam At Kadee,
Yes, I vote for the 78s in bulk, too, as well as : A USRA STYLE ANDREWS FREIGHT CAR TRUCK - sprung, of course. Please, please, please --- Thanks! Steve Busch Duncan, SC
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Patrick Wider <pwider@...>
--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "S. Busch" <SCSBusch@W...> wrote:
Why sprung? The toy cars aren't heavy enough to compress the springs anyway and they don't equalize so why bother? They also don't roll as well as they could. I hate HO "sprung" trucks. And while I'm at it Mr. Kadee, please replace those spider-web springs with something more substantial. I hate looking through the spring groups and seeing the daylight (layout lighting?) coming through. It's blinding. Jack Spencer rolls his own springs out of heavier wire and they look great! Other people use brass loco driver springs. In days of old when knights were bold and Central Valley made trucks with concentric wheels, their truck springs looked better as well. Phosphor bronze I think. Why can't Kadee make a similar improvement to the appearance of their trucks? Continuous improvement - that keeps companies in business. Sorry but this a sore spot with me. Pat Wider
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S. Busch <SCSBusch@...>
Pat Wider!
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When I cut my teeth in model railroading, American Flyer had chrome plated journal boxes on sheet steel sideframe trucks. The first time I ever saw real looking truck they were HO sprung Varneys or Athearns or something. Heck, even those ugly looking Silver Streak trucks looked good. So, there you go. I have never quite recovered, and still prefer real springs. P.S. - love your research work and articles--- Steve Busch Duncan, SC
----- Original Message -----
From: "Patrick Wider" <pwider@sbcglobal.net> To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com> Sent: Friday, October 07, 2005 12:17 PM Subject: [STMFC] Re: Couplers, Coupler Pockets, and Trucks --- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "S. Busch" <SCSBusch@W...> wrote:Why sprung? The toy cars aren't heavy enough to compress the springs anyway and they
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Patrick Wider <pwider@...>
That's fine - then just make them look like real springs! And thanks for the kind words!
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Pat Wider
--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "S. Busch" <SCSBusch@W...> wrote:
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Pat, I was at Michael's (a craft store) the other day and noticed
they have a wide selection of small gage wire on spools that may be perfect for making non-functional replacement springs. I got some for making baled-wire loads for gondolas. They stock it in the bead jewelry section. I agree I hate the truck springs and think the Kadees roll badly, but they're also great looking trucks! I toss the Kadee wheels and replace with Reboxx, which improves them considerably in both rolling quality and appearance. Step 2 will be to replace the springs. Tim O'Connor
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Patrick Wider <pwider@...>
--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "S. Busch" <SCSBusch@W...> wrote:
My first experience was with nickel-plated rails - three of them with 27" diameter curves. The first time I ever saw real looking truck they were HO sprung Varneys or Athearns or something.Me too! I have never quite recovered, and still prefer real springs.I'd prefer real prototype springs but I don't think they'd fit plus they'd collapse my benchwork. (-:} Pat Wider
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David Jobe, Sr.
Hi Pat,
Coming back to your earlier point about sprung and equalized trucks I'll agree that at our scale sizes there's negligible compression of the springs and I would also like to see a different size/material to make the springs more visually realistic regardless of their functionality. However, the trucks are quite capable to provide equalization, just not out of the package. It's a simple matter to disassemble the trucks, carefully clean the flash off of the castings, and reassemble. This was one of the very first jobs my father gave me to begin my transition from tinplate to scale modeling at around 7 years old. He set up a work area for me with a hard tempered masonite work surface held in place with ordinary masking tape. The trucks were deemed acceptable when they could roll diagonally across that 1/8 inch height differential *AND* all four wheels maintained contact with their respective surface. At the time it gave this youngster quite a sense of accomplishment and confidence. Obviosusly, that extreme of equalization is not necessary, but the flexibility of equalization is nonetheless invaluable. If the wheels are in constant contact with the rail they're far less likely to derail. And, in the case of a locomotive and DCC, the benefit of improved contact due to equalization results in more reliable operation. Cheers, David Jobe St. Ann, Missouri --- Patrick Wider <pwider@sbcglobal.net> wrote: --------------------------------- --- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "S. Busch" <SCSBusch@W...> wrote: Why sprung? The toy cars aren't heavy enough to compress the springs anyway and they don't equalize so why bother? They also don't roll as well as they could. I hate HO "sprung" trucks. And while I'm at it Mr. Kadee, please replace those spider-web springs with something more substantial. I hate looking through the spring groups and seeing the daylight (layout lighting?) coming through. It's blinding. Jack Spencer rolls his own springs out of heavier wire and they look great! Other people use brass loco driver springs. In days of old when knights were bold and Central Valley made trucks with concentric wheels, their truck springs looked better as well. Phosphor bronze I think. Why can't Kadee make a similar improvement to the appearance of their trucks? Continuous improvement - that keeps companies in business. Sorry but this a sore spot with me. Pat Wider SPONSORED LINKS Worldwide travel insurance Travel trailer insurance International travel insurance Travel insurance usa Travel medical insurance Csa travel insurance --------------------------------- YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS Visit your group "STMFC" on the web. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: STMFC-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ---------------------------------
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Patrick Wider <pwider@...>
Thanks Dave,
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I've never had a truck derail due to lack of equalization. I've spent lots of time perfecting my track alignment (on a layout now existing in my fading memory). Most HO "sprung" trucks right out of the blister pack don't work as intended, don't look right, and don't even have brake shoes. They don't belong on an otherwise accurate scale model. Period. Pat Wider
--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, Tangerine Flyer <tangerine_flyer@s...> wrote:
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Thomas M. Olsen <tmolsen@...>
Pat,
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While we are petitioning Kadee for unsprung trucks, let us ask them to modify their truck bolsters so that we can add the brakeshoe clip-ons that they make for the PS-1 box cars that they make. I was able to get about 200 of the clip-ons from them several years ago. When they arrived we divided them up amongst three of us. Unfortunately, they no longer sell them in bulk, but in packages with enough for two cars. It would be nice to have them available with the trucks with the bolsters modified for them from the beginning. At present you have trucks with brake beams cast on, but no shoes and a big air gap between the truck sideframe and the wheelsets. Tom Olsen & Boundary Road, West Branch Newark, Delaware, 19711-7479 (302) 738-4292 tmolsen@udel.edu Patrick Wider wrote:
--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "S. Busch" <SCSBusch@W...> wrote:
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Fred in Vt. <pennsy@...>
Guyz,
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You've made my day. Was beginning to think I was one of the last who remembered bent metal tabs & slots for couplers. What a lot of modelers would find useful are some leaf spring replacements for Kadee trucks. The last ones I have came in a Silver Streak box. Another item is to put a black blank panel behind the truck springs, this eliminates the daylight issue with the coil springs. IIRC, the first sprung trucks purchased came in a Binkley kit. Fred Freitas
----- Original Message -----
From: Patrick Wider To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com Sent: Friday, October 07, 2005 2:08 PM Subject: [STMFC] Re: Couplers, Coupler Pockets, and Trucks --- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "S. Busch" <SCSBusch@W...> wrote: > > When I cut my teeth in model railroading, American Flyer had chrome plated > journal boxes on sheet steel sideframe trucks. My first experience was with nickel-plated rails - three of them with 27" diameter curves. The first time I ever saw > real looking truck they were HO sprung Varneys or Athearns or something. Me too! > I have never quite recovered, and still prefer real springs. I'd prefer real prototype springs but I don't think they'd fit plus they'd collapse my benchwork. (-:} Pat Wider SPONSORED LINKS Worldwide travel insurance Travel trailer insurance International travel insurance Travel insurance usa Travel medical insurance Csa travel insurance ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ YAHOO! GROUPS LINKS a.. Visit your group "STMFC" on the web. b.. To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: STMFC-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com c.. Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Schuyler Larrabee
On
Behalf Of Thomas M. OlsenHold on there . . .not all of us agree on that point. I like the sprung trucks (and I DO see them equalizing as the train moves along) but I agree about the lacy character of the springs themselves. It seems to me that a Really Good Materials Guy (Hey, Tony??) should be able to come up with some form of plastic that could be molded or extruded or something into springs with appropriate dimensional characteristics, and low enough spring rate, so as to make the trucks actually compress. Now, they'd have to compress at a rate so that a properly weighted car would do the trick, so we'd have to be faithful to the NMRA weighting rules. let us ask them to modify their truck bolsters so that we can addI do agree with this. SGL
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Patrick Wider <pwider@...>
At the risk of going slightly off subject, D&G makes HO-scale passenger car trucks such
that their springs actually compress and the trucks actually equalize. And in case there's still any lingering doubt due to my screw-up: THE COMPANY IS STILL IN BUSINESS!!!!! Perhaps there's hope for "equalized" freight car trucks. Schuyler, you say you can actually see your trucks equalize as they go down the track? That doesn't say much for your trackwork. What scale are you in? Pat Wider --- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, "Schuyler Larrabee" <schuyler.larrabee@v...> wrote: them equalizing as the train moves along) but I agree about the lacy character of the springsthemselves. It seems to me that a Really Good Materials Guy (Hey, Tony??) should be able to come upwith some form of plastic that could be molded or extruded or something into springs withappropriate dimensional characteristics, and low enough spring rate, so as to make the trucksactually compress. Now, they'd have to compress at a rate so that a properly weighted car would do thetrick, so we'd have to be faithful to the NMRA weighting rules.
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Schuyler Larrabee
Perhaps there's hope for "equalized" freight car trucks.HO, Pat, and my club's got VERY good track work, laid almost exclusively by one man who's got Very High Standards. But even on very good trackwork there are occasional joints that don't PERFECTLY match, and switchwork with high numbers, where equalization does help, and id visible. Mostly, the trucks that do have the equalization are the Dan Kilgore trucks, which have pretty wimpy springs. I don't have trackwork of my own (except for the small amount I've laid at the Club). I do believe there's a market, small, maybe, for a line of Really Superb Scale Trucks. Springs with appropriate visual density, low spring rates, all the parts (brakeshoes, etc) and that if these were available at a not-too-stratospheric price, changing out trucks would be as common as it used to be to toss the x2f's as far as one could, and replace with Kadees. SGL
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Patrick Wider <pwider@...>
SGL, you don't mind if I call you "S"?
Amen to everything you said!!! My eyesight is getting so bad I'm lucky if I can see the derailed car in a long string. I wondered how the heck you could see the truck sideframes moving around. You must be a young snot!!!!! <g> Pat Wider HO, Pat, and my club's got VERY good track work, laid almost exclusively by one manwho's got Very High Standards. But even on very good trackwork there are occasional joints that don'tPERFECTLY match, and switchwork with high numbers, where equalization does help, and id visible.Mostly, the trucks that do have the equalization are the Dan Kilgore trucks, which have prettywimpy springs. I don't have trackwork of my own (except for the small amount I've laid at the Club).Springs with appropriate visual density, low spring rates, all the parts (brakeshoes, etc) and that ifthese were available at a not-too-stratospheric price, changing out trucks would be as common asit used to be to toss the x2f's as far as one could, and replace with Kadees.
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Andy Carlson
Interesting side note: the "G" in D&G is for Jim
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Gerstley, the one who has graciously shared his 50's color freight car slides with us. -Andy Carlson Ojai CA --- Patrick Wider <pwider@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
At the risk of going slightly off subject, D&G makes
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Schuyler Larrabee
Well, P, I can't see them as well as I used to be able to. 57 isn't just Heinz's varieties!
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SGL Schuyler G Larrabee, in case Yahoo mail doesn't disclose the name of the sender . . .
-----Original Message-----
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Roger Parry <uncleroger@...>
Some 20 years ago, I experimented with replacing Kadee truck springs with Kadee #5/10 knuckle coupler springs. They really flexed on a light weight wood model. I ran the car with no derailments but never expanded the scope of the experiment. I like the way Kadee trucks look WITH the springs!
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On Oct 7, 2005, at 9:44 PM, Schuyler Larrabee wrote:
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george30045
--- Patrick Wider <pwider@s...> wrote:I have Used the D&G trucks on quite a few models of passenger cars andAt the risk of going slightly off subject, D&G makes I really like them. They are truly works of art from any perspective; aesthetic AND operational. Demetre Argiro
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