Kits? Yep...they're still with us


Mike Brock <brockm@...>
 

Jack Burgess writes:

"While I appreciate all of the new freight cars, both plastic and resin, all
of these "riches" (as I mentioned before) may have reduced our hobby to a
"ready to run" hobby. After all, there is very little that you can't now
purchase ready to run....engines, DCC systems, freight cars, structures,
track, etc. It seems that MR especially has embraced this idea...."


Actually, while I think Jack is correct about much that he said, he has a small but interesting conflict in this part of his comments. "Resin". As Jack well knows "resin" is not ready to run. I don't doubt that it is true that people wish to purchase ready to run but one cannot purchase ready to run resin cars...at least not yet. Part of the reason for buying ready to run stuff is, as Jack alludes to, it's easy to do AND it's probably the only way some of us are going to acquire the huge fleets of cars we seem to require. Today there are many, many frt cars not available in plastic so we are forced to go the resin route if we want some of these gems. For that matter, there are still large numbers of frt cars simply not available...in any form. Anyhow, the point is, we seem to see very different frt car acquisitions by the same people...ready to run plastic and "ready to build" resin cars....kits.

Mike Brock


Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Another point worth making is that there really wasn't all that much scratch building 50 years ago or so. You just made do with what you could get. Layouts were full of Athearn and Ulrich metal cars, Varney plastic, and some paper-side cars. You could visit layouts all over the country and see the exact same freight cars (and structures and passenger cars and . . . ) because anything else was far too much trouble. Sure, some talented and energetic people were building great models, but I'd guess there were no more of them then than now. And what they built wouldn't be that impressive today. Just go back and look at the magazine photos.
Layouts like Jack Burgess's YV were really inconceivable then. Jack has had to scratch build an awful lot, but 50 years ago you couldn't even get sheet styrene (nor would you have known what to do with it), and the very first brass engines were just coming into view. People thought Ambroid kits were "too hard," and hey, those Bowser locomotives didn't look THAT odd with Belpaire boilers on your free-lanced short line. And there was hardly any serious prototype information being published; practically no modelers had discovered the Cyc and other resources.
The progress to today is really qualitative, not just quantitative. Richard Hendrickson is right when he says "THIS is the golden age." When we have one of these discussion about where the hobby is and where it's going, let's not forget where it's come from.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


armprem
 

Tony,You forgot to mention Silver Streak , Central Valley ,Globe and Mantua to name a few others.Armand Premo

----- Original Message -----
From: "Anthony Thompson" <thompson@signaturepress.com>
To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2007 1:25 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Kits? Yep...they're still with us


> Another point worth making is that there really wasn't all that
> much scratch building 50 years ago or so. You just made do with what
> you could get. Layouts were full of Athearn and Ulrich metal cars,
> Varney plastic, and some paper-side cars. You could visit layouts all
> over the country and see the exact same freight cars (and structures
> and passenger cars and . . . ) because anything else was far too much
> trouble. Sure, some talented and energetic people were building great
> models, but I'd guess there were no more of them then than now. And
> what they built wouldn't be that impressive today. Just go back and
> look at the magazine photos.
> Layouts like Jack Burgess's YV were really inconceivable then.
> Jack has had to scratch build an awful lot, but 50 years ago you
> couldn't even get sheet styrene (nor would you have known what to do
> with it), and the very first brass engines were just coming into view.
> People thought Ambroid kits were "too hard," and hey, those Bowser
> locomotives didn't look THAT odd with Belpaire boilers on your
> free-lanced short line. And there was hardly any serious prototype
> information being published; practically no modelers had discovered the
> Cyc and other resources.
> The progress to today is really qualitative, not just
> quantitative. Richard Hendrickson is right when he says "THIS is the
> golden age." When we have one of these discussion about where the hobby
> is and where it's going, let's not forget where it's come from.
>
> Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
> 2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
> (510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
> Publishers of books on railroad history
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.17.15/659 - Release Date: 1/30/2007 9:31 AM
>
>


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


pullmanboss <tgmadden@...>
 

Tony Thompson wrote:

Another point worth making is that there really wasn't all that
much scratch building 50 years ago or so. You just made do with
what you could get. Layouts were full of Athearn and Ulrich metal
cars, Varney plastic, and some paper-side cars. You could visit
layouts all over the country and see the exact same freight cars
(and structures and passenger cars and . . . ) because anything
else was far too much trouble.
Which is why many of us who were interested in scratchbuilding
gravitated to narrow gauge. The sort of detailed prototype
information we now take for granted began surfacing for Colorado
narrow gauge half a century ago. MR articles by Len Madsen, RMC
plans by Al Kamm and the availability of John Maxwell's drawings
from the newly-established Colorado Railroad Museum gave narrow
gaugers a leg up on serious prototype modeling. Plus the prototype
equipment still existed and was accessible for measuring and
photographing.

Next month marks the 50th anniversary of Len Madsen's landmark March
1957 MR article on scratchbuilding a D&RGW narrow gauge drop bottom
gon. That, and his article on scratchbuilding the Chama coaling
tower a couple of years later were responsible for pulling me into
serious HOn3 modeling for over 25 years. When I tired of the "quaint
and decrepit" factor in the mid-80's, Dennis Storzek's article
on "Seven Improvements to Athearn Box Cars" and Richard
Hendrickson's WestRail conversion kits were there to greet me and
demonstrate that the detailed information we took for granted in
narrow gauge modeling was coming to light for standard gauge. More
than anything, it's the availability of good prototype information
that makes good modeling possible.

To close the loop on the thread title, I was in Caboose Hobbies on
Wednesday. There were dozens of Red Caboose and InterMountain cars
on the shelves, but not one RC or IM kit.

Tom Madden


rfederle@...
 

And Armand, you forgot Quality Craft, Suydam and Penn Line to name a few more.

Robert Federle
---- "A. Premo" <armprem@surfglobal.net> wrote:

Tony,You forgot to mention Silver Streak , Central Valley ,Globe and
Mantua to name a few others.Armand Premo
----- Original Message -----
From: "Anthony Thompson" <thompson@signaturepress.com>
To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2007 1:25 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Kits? Yep...they're still with us


> Another point worth making is that there really wasn't all that
> much scratch building 50 years ago or so. You just made do with what
> you could get. Layouts were full of Athearn and Ulrich metal cars,
> Varney plastic, and some paper-side cars. You could visit layouts all
> over the country and see the exact same freight cars (and structures
> and passenger cars and . . . ) because anything else was far too much
> trouble. Sure, some talented and energetic people were building great
> models, but I'd guess there were no more of them then than now. And
> what they built wouldn't be that impressive today. Just go back and
> look at the magazine photos.
> Layouts like Jack Burgess's YV were really inconceivable then.
> Jack has had to scratch build an awful lot, but 50 years ago you
> couldn't even get sheet styrene (nor would you have known what to do
> with it), and the very first brass engines were just coming into view.
> People thought Ambroid kits were "too hard," and hey, those Bowser
> locomotives didn't look THAT odd with Belpaire boilers on your
> free-lanced short line. And there was hardly any serious prototype
> information being published; practically no modelers had discovered the
> Cyc and other resources.
> The progress to today is really qualitative, not just
> quantitative. Richard Hendrickson is right when he says "THIS is the
> golden age." When we have one of these discussion about where the hobby
> is and where it's going, let's not forget where it's come from.
>
> Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
> 2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
> (510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
> Publishers of books on railroad history
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.17.15/659 - Release Date:
1/30/2007 9:31 AM
>
>


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


armprem
 

Ambroid too.Armand Premo

----- Original Message -----
From: <rfederle@cox.net>
To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Cc: "A. Premo" <armprem@surfglobal.net>
Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2007 10:40 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Kits? Yep...they're still with us


> And Armand, you forgot Quality Craft, Suydam and Penn Line to name a few more.
>
> Robert Federle
> ---- "A. Premo" <armprem@surfglobal.net> wrote:
>> Tony,You forgot to mention Silver Streak , Central Valley ,Globe and
>> Mantua to name a few others.Armand Premo
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Anthony Thompson" <thompson@signaturepress.com>
>> To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
>> Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2007 1:25 AM
>> Subject: Re: [STMFC] Kits? Yep...they're still with us
>>
>>
>> > Another point worth making is that there really wasn't all that
>> > much scratch building 50 years ago or so. You just made do with what
>> > you could get. Layouts were full of Athearn and Ulrich metal cars,
>> > Varney plastic, and some paper-side cars. You could visit layouts all
>> > over the country and see the exact same freight cars (and structures
>> > and passenger cars and . . . ) because anything else was far too much
>> > trouble. Sure, some talented and energetic people were building great
>> > models, but I'd guess there were no more of them then than now. And
>> > what they built wouldn't be that impressive today. Just go back and
>> > look at the magazine photos.
>> > Layouts like Jack Burgess's YV were really inconceivable then.
>> > Jack has had to scratch build an awful lot, but 50 years ago you
>> > couldn't even get sheet styrene (nor would you have known what to do
>> > with it), and the very first brass engines were just coming into view.
>> > People thought Ambroid kits were "too hard," and hey, those Bowser
>> > locomotives didn't look THAT odd with Belpaire boilers on your
>> > free-lanced short line. And there was hardly any serious prototype
>> > information being published; practically no modelers had discovered the
>> > Cyc and other resources.
>> > The progress to today is really qualitative, not just
>> > quantitative. Richard Hendrickson is right when he says "THIS is the
>> > golden age." When we have one of these discussion about where the hobby
>> > is and where it's going, let's not forget where it's come from.
>> >
>> > Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
>> > 2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
>> > (510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
>> > Publishers of books on railroad history
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Yahoo! Groups Links
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > No virus found in this incoming message.
>> > Checked by AVG Free Edition.
>> > Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.17.15/659 - Release Date:
>> 1/30/2007 9:31 AM
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.17.15/659 - Release Date: 1/30/2007 9:31 AM
>
>


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


ljack70117@...
 

Did I see John English in the list?
Thank you
Larry Jackman
Boca Raton FL
ljack70117@adelphia.net
I was born with nothing and
I have most of it left

On Feb 3, 2007, at 10:40 AM, <rfederle@cox.net> <rfederle@cox.net> wrote:

And Armand, you forgot Quality Craft, Suydam and Penn Line to name a few more.

Robert Federle
---- "A. Premo" <armprem@surfglobal.net> wrote:
Tony,You forgot to mention Silver Streak , Central Valley ,Globe and
Mantua to name a few others.Armand Premo
----- Original Message -----
From: "Anthony Thompson" <thompson@signaturepress.com>
To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2007 1:25 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Kits? Yep...they're still with us


Another point worth making is that there really wasn't all that
much scratch building 50 years ago or so. You just made do with what
you could get. Layouts were full of Athearn and Ulrich metal cars,
Varney plastic, and some paper-side cars. You could visit layouts all
over the country and see the exact same freight cars (and structures
and passenger cars and . . . ) because anything else was far too much
trouble. Sure, some talented and energetic people were building great
models, but I'd guess there were no more of them then than now. And
what they built wouldn't be that impressive today. Just go back and
look at the magazine photos.
Layouts like Jack Burgess's YV were really inconceivable then.
Jack has had to scratch build an awful lot, but 50 years ago you
couldn't even get sheet styrene (nor would you have known what to do
with it), and the very first brass engines were just coming into view.
People thought Ambroid kits were "too hard," and hey, those Bowser
locomotives didn't look THAT odd with Belpaire boilers on your
free-lanced short line. And there was hardly any serious prototype
information being published; practically no modelers had discovered the
Cyc and other resources.
The progress to today is really qualitative, not just
quantitative. Richard Hendrickson is right when he says "THIS is the
golden age." When we have one of these discussion about where the hobby
is and where it's going, let's not forget where it's come from.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history




Yahoo! Groups Links





--
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.17.15/659 - Release Date:
1/30/2007 9:31 AM


---------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------




Yahoo! Groups Links



Frederick Freitas <prrinvt@...>
 

Guyz,

Allow me to fill in 3 more; Megow, Kaisner, and Laconia.
Fred Freitas

ljack70117@adelphia.net wrote:
Did I see John English in the list?
Thank you
Larry Jackman
Boca Raton FL
ljack70117@adelphia.net
I was born with nothing and
I have most of it left

On Feb 3, 2007, at 10:40 AM, <rfederle@cox.net> <rfederle@cox.net>
wrote:

And Armand, you forgot Quality Craft, Suydam and Penn Line to name
a few more.

Robert Federle
---- "A. Premo" <armprem@surfglobal.net> wrote:
Tony,You forgot to mention Silver Streak , Central
Valley ,Globe and
Mantua to name a few others.Armand Premo
----- Original Message -----
From: "Anthony Thompson" <thompson@signaturepress.com>
To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2007 1:25 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Kits? Yep...they're still with us


Another point worth making is that there really wasn't
all that
much scratch building 50 years ago or so. You just made do with what
you could get. Layouts were full of Athearn and Ulrich metal cars,
Varney plastic, and some paper-side cars. You could visit layouts
all
over the country and see the exact same freight cars (and structures
and passenger cars and . . . ) because anything else was far too
much
trouble. Sure, some talented and energetic people were building
great
models, but I'd guess there were no more of them then than now. And
what they built wouldn't be that impressive today. Just go back and
look at the magazine photos.
Layouts like Jack Burgess's YV were really inconceivable
then.
Jack has had to scratch build an awful lot, but 50 years ago you
couldn't even get sheet styrene (nor would you have known what to do
with it), and the very first brass engines were just coming into
view.
People thought Ambroid kits were "too hard," and hey, those Bowser
locomotives didn't look THAT odd with Belpaire boilers on your
free-lanced short line. And there was hardly any serious prototype
information being published; practically no modelers had
discovered the
Cyc and other resources.
The progress to today is really qualitative, not just
quantitative. Richard Hendrickson is right when he says "THIS is the
golden age." When we have one of these discussion about where the
hobby
is and where it's going, let's not forget where it's come from.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail,
thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history




Yahoo! Groups Links





--
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.17.15/659 - Release Date:
1/30/2007 9:31 AM


----------------------------------------------------------
-----------




Yahoo! Groups Links







---------------------------------
No need to miss a message. Get email on-the-go
with Yahoo! Mail for Mobile. Get started.


rfederle@...
 

Might as well throw Walthers and Red Ball out there too.

Robert Federle
---- Frederick Freitas <prrinvt@yahoo.com> wrote:

Guyz,

Allow me to fill in 3 more; Megow, Kaisner, and Laconia.
Fred Freitas

ljack70117@adelphia.net wrote:
Did I see John English in the list?
Thank you
Larry Jackman
Boca Raton FL
ljack70117@adelphia.net
I was born with nothing and
I have most of it left

On Feb 3, 2007, at 10:40 AM, <rfederle@cox.net> <rfederle@cox.net>
wrote:

And Armand, you forgot Quality Craft, Suydam and Penn Line to name
a few more.

Robert Federle
---- "A. Premo" <armprem@surfglobal.net> wrote:
Tony,You forgot to mention Silver Streak , Central
Valley ,Globe and
Mantua to name a few others.Armand Premo
----- Original Message -----
From: "Anthony Thompson" <thompson@signaturepress.com>
To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2007 1:25 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Kits? Yep...they're still with us


Another point worth making is that there really wasn't
all that
much scratch building 50 years ago or so. You just made do with what
you could get. Layouts were full of Athearn and Ulrich metal cars,
Varney plastic, and some paper-side cars. You could visit layouts
all
over the country and see the exact same freight cars (and structures
and passenger cars and . . . ) because anything else was far too
much
trouble. Sure, some talented and energetic people were building
great
models, but I'd guess there were no more of them then than now. And
what they built wouldn't be that impressive today. Just go back and
look at the magazine photos.
Layouts like Jack Burgess's YV were really inconceivable
then.
Jack has had to scratch build an awful lot, but 50 years ago you
couldn't even get sheet styrene (nor would you have known what to do
with it), and the very first brass engines were just coming into
view.
People thought Ambroid kits were "too hard," and hey, those Bowser
locomotives didn't look THAT odd with Belpaire boilers on your
free-lanced short line. And there was hardly any serious prototype
information being published; practically no modelers had
discovered the
Cyc and other resources.
The progress to today is really qualitative, not just
quantitative. Richard Hendrickson is right when he says "THIS is the
golden age." When we have one of these discussion about where the
hobby
is and where it's going, let's not forget where it's come from.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail,
thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history




Yahoo! Groups Links





--
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.5.432 / Virus Database: 268.17.15/659 - Release Date:
1/30/2007 9:31 AM


----------------------------------------------------------
-----------




Yahoo! Groups Links







---------------------------------
No need to miss a message. Get email on-the-go
with Yahoo! Mail for Mobile. Get started.



Schuyler Larrabee
 

Anthony Thompson:
Sure, some talented and energetic people were building great
models, but I'd guess there were no more of them then than now.
So, just how many of us are there? This list's home page says 1,244 members. Yet when I spoke with
John Engstrom at Springfield about the idea of undecorated versions of the 65' mill gon, he said
"There's only about 60 of you guys out there, you know."

Y'know, I think he's wrong. But that's what he thinks.

Now, I know that there are probably a lot of guys on this list (are there ANY women?) who simply
want to know more about when a car was built, who built them, the kind of car they are, the era
they're appropriate for, how long they lasted and that's about it. There's another subset that want
to know precisely what kind of end they have, what brake gear they have, the kind of roof walk, and
so on. And then there are those who want to know exactly how many rivets, and what size they were,
on some specific tank car.

But I'm absolutely sure that there are more, way more, than "60 of you guys out there."

There's power in numbers, and if we want kits, we have to make sure that Athearn (and BLI, IM, and
the others) know that there's more than 60 of us.

SGL


George Hollwedel <georgeloop@...>
 

What is John's e-mail address?

Prototype N Scale Models
by George Hollwedel
proto.nscale@yahoo.com
310 Loma Verde Street
Buda, TX 78610-9785
512-796-6883

----- Original Message -----
From: "Schuyler Larrabee" <schuyler.larrabee@verizon.net>
To: <STMFC@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2007 1:53 PM
Subject: RE: [STMFC] Kits? Yep...they're still with us



Anthony Thompson:
Sure, some talented and energetic people were building great
models, but I'd guess there were no more of them then than now.
So, just how many of us are there? This list's home page says 1,244 members. Yet when I spoke with
John Engstrom at Springfield about the idea of undecorated versions of the 65' mill gon, he said
"There's only about 60 of you guys out there, you know."

Y'know, I think he's wrong. But that's what he thinks.

Now, I know that there are probably a lot of guys on this list (are there ANY women?) who simply
want to know more about when a car was built, who built them, the kind of car they are, the era
they're appropriate for, how long they lasted and that's about it. There's another subset that want
to know precisely what kind of end they have, what brake gear they have, the kind of roof walk, and
so on. And then there are those who want to know exactly how many rivets, and what size they were,
on some specific tank car.

But I'm absolutely sure that there are more, way more, than "60 of you guys out there."

There's power in numbers, and if we want kits, we have to make sure that Athearn (and BLI, IM, and
the others) know that there's more than 60 of us.

SGL




Yahoo! Groups Links



Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Armand Premo wrote:
Tony,You forgot to mention Silver Streak , Central Valley ,Globe and Mantua to name a few others.
There was no intention to provide a complete history of HO kits <g>, just choosing a couple of examples. Speaking just for me, I loved Silver Streak kits in those days.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


rfederle@...
 

I have a couple Silver Streak kits on the shelf awaiting construction. Maybe someday.

Robert Federle
---- Anthony Thompson <thompson@signaturepress.com> wrote:

Armand Premo wrote:
Tony,You forgot to mention Silver Streak , Central Valley ,Globe
and Mantua to name a few others.
There was no intention to provide a complete history of HO kits
<g>, just choosing a couple of examples. Speaking just for me, I loved
Silver Streak kits in those days.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Doug Brown <g.brown1@...>
 

"those Bowser locomotives didn't look THAT odd with Belpaire boilers on your
free-lanced short line."



Fifty years ago those locomotives were Penn Line. They also made 40' trailer
flats for them to pull.



Doug Brown

-----Original Message-----
From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of
rfederle@cox.net
Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2007 9:41 AM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Cc: A. Premo
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Kits? Yep...they're still with us



And Armand, you forgot Quality Craft, Suydam and Penn Line to name a few
more.

Robert Federle
---- "A. Premo" <armprem@surfglobal. <mailto:armprem%40surfglobal.net> net>
wrote:
Tony,You forgot to mention Silver Streak , Central Valley ,Globe and
Mantua to name a few others.Armand Premo
----- Original Message -----
From: "Anthony Thompson" <thompson@signaturep
<mailto:thompson%40signaturepress.com> ress.com>
To: <STMFC@yahoogroups. <mailto:STMFC%40yahoogroups.com> com>
Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2007 1:25 AM
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Kits? Yep...they're still with us


Another point worth making is that there really wasn't all that
much scratch building 50 years ago or so. You just made do with what
you could get. Layouts were full of Athearn and Ulrich metal cars,
Varney plastic, and some paper-side cars. You could visit layouts all
over the country and see the exact same freight cars (and structures
and passenger cars and . . . ) because anything else was far too much
trouble. Sure, some talented and energetic people were building great
models, but I'd guess there were no more of them then than now. And
what they built wouldn't be that impressive today. Just go back and
look at the magazine photos.
Layouts like Jack Burgess's YV were really inconceivable then.
Jack has had to scratch build an awful lot, but 50 years ago you
couldn't even get sheet styrene (nor would you have known what to do
with it), and the very first brass engines were just coming into view.
People thought Ambroid kits were "too hard," and hey, those Bowser
locomotives didn't look THAT odd with Belpaire boilers on your
free-lanced short line. And there was hardly any serious prototype
information being published; practically no modelers had discovered the
Cyc and other resources.
The progress to today is really qualitative, not just
quantitative. Richard Hendrickson is right when he says "THIS is the
golden age." When we have one of these discussion about where the hobby
is and where it's going, let's not forget where it's come from.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturep
<mailto:thompson%40signaturepress.com> ress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history




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Kurt Laughlin <fleeta@...>
 

----- Original Message -----
From: "Schuyler Larrabee" schuyler.larrabee@verizon.net

So, just how many of us are there? This list's home page says 1,244
members. Yet when I spoke with
John Engstrom at Springfield about the idea of undecorated versions of the
65' mill gon, he said
"There's only about 60 of you guys out there, you know."
----- Original Message -----

He might mean 60 people who would buy one. Gons are poor sellers from what I hear. There were only a bit more than 15,000 65-footers even in 1961 (compared to 102,000 50-footers and 96,000 40-footers) so they weren't all that common. (And of that 15,000, almost a quarter were PRR and over half were under PRR, RDG, P&LE, B&O, NYC, or ATSF markings.)

Besides, aren't pretty much all the accurate prototypes already covered by existing releases?

KL


Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Doug Brown wrote:
Fifty years ago those locomotives were Penn Line. They also made 40' trailer
flats for them to pull.
You're absolutely right, Doug, and I remember mostly because they ran very well for their day.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Schuyler Larrabee
 

"those Bowser locomotives didn't look THAT odd with Belpaire
boilers on your
free-lanced short line."

Fifty years ago those locomotives were Penn Line. They also
made 40' trailer
flats for them to pull.

Doug Brown
And the article about modifying two of them (Atlantic and ?Consolidation?) in MR was one of the
revalatory articles I read: You could CHANGE them into something else!!! WOW!!

They pulled steam era frt cars, obviously.

SGL


Raymond Young
 

Schuyler,

That article by Bill McClanahan and Malcom Voedenbaum inspired me also. I ruined one boilder casting trying to solder a brass cab roof on for a finer appearance. The boilders were cheap, however, and I obtained a replacement and succeeded the second time. From the Model Train Magazine index: The Penn Line 4-4-2 and 2-8-0 freelanced and superdetailed
Model Railroader, November 1956 page 40
Includes removing the Belpaire firebox
( 2-8-0, 4-4-2

Virgil Young
Amarillo, TX

Schuyler Larrabee <schuyler.larrabee@verizon.net> wrote:


"those Bowser locomotives didn't look THAT odd with Belpaire
boilers on your
free-lanced short line."

Fifty years ago those locomotives were Penn Line. They also
made 40' trailer
flats for them to pull.

Doug Brown
And the article about modifying two of them (Atlantic and ?Consolidation?) in MR was one of the
revalatory articles I read: You could CHANGE them into something else!!! WOW!!

They pulled steam era frt cars, obviously.

SGL


Frederick Freitas <prrinvt@...>
 

Tony & List,

If you find some of these old kits on shelf, you might try my method of upgrade.
Cut a piece of .040 styrene to the size of the floor block supplied; cover it on one side with scribed flooring; use in place of original floor in construction; now all the newer details are easily attached to the styrene base. Replace the kit grabs & hardware with newer details. You end up with an outstanding model with more proto details. Another old kit builder.....

Fred Freitas

Anthony Thompson <thompson@signaturepress.com> wrote:
Armand Premo wrote:
Tony,You forgot to mention Silver Streak , Central Valley ,Globe
and Mantua to name a few others.
There was no intention to provide a complete history of HO kits
<g>, just choosing a couple of examples. Speaking just for me, I loved
Silver Streak kits in those days.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history






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asychis@...
 

"There's only about 60 of you guys out there, you know.

Y'know, I think he's wrong. But that's what he thinks."

He's probably basing this on sales, and from my experience he's probably
right. I have some pretty good figures about kit vs. assembled sales, and
assembled far outweigh kits sales. A lot of people mention that they like kits, or
bemoan the lack of kits, but when the kits arrive.......


Jerry Michels