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You wreck It, You Buy It!
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eabracher@...
Another so called wrecked car was a C&NW 40' box which had the roof burned
off by sparks from a V&T loco. They bought the car and re roofed it. It is a storage shed today behind the Carson City museum. Rio Grande models did a kit of this box #1015 in HO scale. eric ************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour |
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Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
Louie Hydrick wrote:
It seems the smaller offenders, or the management being tight on finances of an offending road, was a barometer as to the probability that foreign road car wreck would be rebuilt for the home road verses scrap.Sometimes you "bought" it even if you didn't wreck it. There's a story, possibly apocryphal, about an 8,000-gallon tank car on the Western Pacific, which they supposedly REPORTED as badly damaged to the owner, UTLX, and then simply relettered it for their own use. The car still exists at the Portola Museum, but I can't vouch for the story. Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA 2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com (510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@... Publishers of books on railroad history |
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Garth G. Groff <ggg9y@...>
Tony,
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That's an interesting story. I suppose the Western Pacific AFEs at the CSRM might shed some light on the truth, but they maybe they wouldn't. They are notoriously inaccurate, and have been known to have been rigged in various ways. I just went to the Portola Museum site tank car page ( http://www.wplives.org/WPRM_Home/Equipment_Roster/Tank_Cars/tank_cars.html ) and found only two possible cars that might fit the story: WPMW 257 and WPMW 0291 (the latter is actually reached by clicking on WPMW 1132, the hot links being backwards between these two cars). I don't have reference materials here at work, but is 0291 an ex-UTLX car? The other cars on this page are also worthy of study. WP 1072 and 1074 are two 10G AC&F Type 4 or 7 high walkway cars and were original to the WP. The real 1132 is (I think) an AC&F type 11, part of the WP's third order of tank cars circa 1912. FR&W 12107 is an ex-military post-war welded tank and is supposedly the prototype of the Red Caboose model. Kind regards, Garth G. Groff Anthony Thompson wrote: Sometimes you "bought" it even if you didn't wreck it. There's a story, possibly apocryphal, about an 8,000-gallon tank car on the Western Pacific, which they supposedly REPORTED as badly damaged to the owner, UTLX, and then simply relettered it for their own use. The car still exists at the Portola Museum, but I can't vouch for the story. |
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Brian Leppert <b.leppert@...>
WPMW 0291 is ex UTLX 9284, a 6000 gallon X-3. The trucks still have the original reporting marks.
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Brian Leppert Carson City, NV ----- Original Message -----
From: "Garth G. Groff" <ggg9y@...> To: <STMFC@...> Sent: Tuesday, August 07, 2007 12:02 PM Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: You wreck It, You Buy It! Tony, |
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Richard Hendrickson
On Aug 7, 2007, at 12:02 PM, Garth G. Groff wrote:
I don't have reference materials here at work, but is 0291 an ex-UTLXYes, and though Tony described it as an 8,000 gal. car, it's actually a 6,500 gal. car. I have also heard the story that, when the WP needed an MW tank car, they arbitrarily went out into the yard, chose that car, and notified UTL that it had been wrecked and was being written off. I can't say for sure that the story is true, but the fact that similar stories abound supports the notion the the railroads were certainly capable of such actions. Richard Hendrickson |
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Brian Leppert <b.leppert@...>
OOPS--a few minutes ago I posted that the ex UTLX tank was 6000 gallon. Richard's right--its 6500.
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Brian Leppert Embarrassed, NV ----- Original Message -----
From: "Brian Leppert" <b.leppert@...> To: <STMFC@...> Sent: Tuesday, August 07, 2007 1:16 PM Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: You wreck It, You Buy It! WPMW 0291 is ex UTLX 9284, a 6000 gallon X-3. The trucks still have the |
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Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
Richard Hendrickson wrote:
Yes, and though Tony described it as an 8,000 gal. car, it's actually a 6,500 gal. car.Shows what happens when you type from memory <g>. Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA 2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com (510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@... Publishers of books on railroad history |
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Eric Hansmann
--- Eric Bracher@... wrote:
burned off by sparks from a V&T loco. They bought the car and re roofed it. It is a storage shed today behind the Carson City museum. ======================================== Eric, Can you relay more prototype details about this kit? http://www.riograndemodels.com/Images/LargeHO/3119.jpg Does the kit represent the original roof? What C&NW number was this car from? Are decals also available to letter a C&NW version? Just trying to enlarge the 1926 freight car fleet. And as an aside, since Rio Grande Models has so many great period vehicles available to use in scenes with steam era freight cars, the National Pike Steam, Gas, and Horse show is this weekend near Brownsville, PA. If you are in the greater Pittsburgh area, it's a fabulous way to spend a sunny afternoon. http://www.nationalpike.com/ Eric Hansmann Morgantown, W. Va. |
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Kurt Laughlin <fleeta@...>
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----- Original Message -----
From: Richard Hendrickson I have also heard the story that, when the WP needed an MW tank car, they arbitrarily went out into the yard, chose that car, and notified UTL that it had been wrecked and was being written off. I can't say for sure that the story is true, but the fact that similar stories abound supports the notion the the railroads were certainly capable of such actions. ----- Original Message ----- Yes, to the extent that in a much later era one shortline that did contract repair work for the Penn Central was able to greatly increase it's fleet by painting their marks on cars reported to PC as being "beyond economic repair". KL |
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eabracher@...
In a message dated 8/7/07 6:22:08 PM, eric@... writes:
Does the kit represent the original roof?Kit comes with one roof. You will have to replace it with a wood roof. What C&NW number was this car from?Sorry I do not know. Perhaps the folks at the CC museum would know. Are decals also available to letter a C&NW version?Maybe from another decal source. eric ************************************** Get a sneak peek of the all-new AOL at http://discover.aol.com/memed/aolcom30tour |
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Denny Anspach <danspach@...>
Another interesting instance of a signature boxcar of one railroad being acquired by means of a wreck to be subsequently "rebranded" and used by a second railroad is related in Sunshine's PDS liner notes accompanying their Milwaukee/GB&W/Ma & Pa single sheath boxcar kits (#47.2).
While on the Maryland & Pennsylvania RR in 1944, a Milwaukee single sheathed boxcar was purchased by the Ma & PA apparently in exchange for a Ma & Pa car lost or damaged on Milwaukee lines. Because all of the Ma & Pa's cars had arch bar trucks and such cars (under the war emergency of the time) reportedly did on occasion go off line, the Milwaukee removed the cast steel trucks under its donated boxcar, and replaced them with with the arch bar trucks removed from the damaged/destroyed Ma & Pa car. Martin explains that the Ma & Pa commonly transferred incoming interchange freight from foreign cars to its own cars at port of entry (to minimize per diem). As a result, the Ma & Pa's own small fleet of box cars was generally restricted to its own lines- hence the arch bars. How many other penurious railroads routinely transferred freight to avoid per diems? Denny -- Denny S. Anspach, MD Sacramento |
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benjaminfrank_hom <b.hom@...>
Denny Anspach wrote:
"While on the Maryland & Pennsylvania RR in 1944, a Milwaukee single sheathed boxcar was purchased by the Ma & PA apparently in exchange for a Ma & Pa car lost or damaged on Milwaukee lines. Because all of the Ma & Pa's cars had arch bar trucks and such cars (under the war emergency of the time) reportedly did on occasion go off line, the Milwaukee removed the cast steel trucks under its donated boxcar, and replaced them with with the arch bar trucks removed from the damaged/destroyed Ma & Pa car." The Ma & Pa also received four PRR Class XL boxcars in 1929 as payback for cars wrecked on the Pennsy, M&PA 1150-1153. These were the last survivors of these cars to run in revenue service. These are available in HO as Westerfield kits #s 1352 and 3551: http://www.westerfield.biz/1352_58857.htm http://www.westerfield.biz/3551_59108.htm "How many other penurious railroads routinely transferred freight to avoid per diems?" As noted before, the Rutland transferred company coal from foreign road hoppers at Alburgh to its own hoppers and gons to avoid per diem. Ben Hom |
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Garth G. Groff <ggg9y@...>
Ben and Denny,
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And at least one, maybe two of these cars is preserved on the Strasburg Railroad. But I'm sure you guys knew that, and just forgot to mention same . . . . Kind regards, Garth G. Groff benjaminfrank_hom wrote: Denny Anspach wrote: |
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smason22000 <smason2@...>
My favorite story involves a mishap on the Rutland Railroad. In the 1920's a single sheathed
boxar owned by the Canadian National took a plunge off the Rouse's Point Bridge into Lake Champlain while in a Rutland consist. The car remained completely submerged for a few decades. After many years, someone from the Rutland contacted their counterpart at the CN and asked if they still wanted the car. The obvious answer was "no". Rutland crews fished out the waterlogged car, dried it out, repainted and relettered it for the Rutland, and it remained in service until the end of the railroad in 1961. It was the only single sheathed car they owned and was numbered 7999. Scott Mason |
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JOSEPH BOWER <jnbower1@...>
Garth, Ben and Denny: Thank you for noting that the Maryland & Pennsylvania
Railroad were also involved in acquiring cars in replacement or payment for their rolling stock lost or damaged on other railroads. The two preserved Ma & Pa Box Cars at Strasburg are #s 713 and 723. These are home-built, wood, double sheathed, truss rod type cars (not the ex PRR XLS). They are painted and lettered in the original Ma & Pa scheme. The Maryland & Pennsylvania Railroad had a number of one off cars acquired from other railroads. This has been a boon for Ma & Pa prototype modelers. Consequently, The Maryland and Pennsylvania Railroad Historical Society has "commissioned" Westerfield, Sunshine, Red Caboose, and Funaro & Camerlingo to produce, as Ma & Pa versions, models they produce of other railroad's prototypes. In addition to Sunshine's Milwaukee/ Ma & Pa # 1155 model and Westerfield's PRR XL and B&O M-15b/ Ma & Pa #1154 models, F&C has recently produced an H.O. kit for the 700 Series Box Cars, and also an H.O.Bobber Caboose Kit for Ma & Pa # 2006 as a special version of their kit for PRR ND/NDa cabooses. The Society stocks and sells all these models. Regards, Joe Bower (Society Modeling Chairman) : Re: [STMFC] Re: You wreck It, You Buy It! Garth G. Groff wrote: Ben and Denny, And at least one, maybe two of these cars is preserved on the Strasburg Railroad. But I'm sure you guys knew that, and just forgot to mention same . . . . Kind regards, Garth G. Groff benjaminfrank_hom wrote: Denny Anspach wrote:eld.biz/1352_58857.htm http://www.westerfi <http://www.westerfield.biz/3551_59108.htm>eld.biz/3551_59108.htm
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armprem
Wrong bridge.Right lake.It was a locomotive that went for a swim off the Rouses' Point trestle. # 33 a USRA Mikado.Armand Premo
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----- Original Message -----
From: "smason22000" <smason2@...> To: <STMFC@...> Sent: Wednesday, August 08, 2007 8:35 PM Subject: [STMFC] Re: You wreck It, You Buy It! My favorite story involves a mishap on the Rutland Railroad. In the 1920's a single sheathed |
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al_brown03
IIRC, the bridge the boxcar went off of was the pontoon bridge
between the end of the Addison Branch at Larrabee's Point, Vt., and the D&H connection on the New York side of the lake. The incident is discussed in Bob Nimke's histories, and I think also in Jim Shaughnessy's. The boxcar and Mikado "swam" within a few years of each other circa 1920. Al Brown, Melbourne, Fla. --- In STMFC@..., "Armand Premo" <armprem@...> wrote: swim off the Rouses' Point trestle. # 33 a USRA Mikado.Armand Premothe 1920's Rouse's Pointa single sheathed counterpart atBridge into Lake repainted andthe CN and asked in 1961.relettered it for the It was the only single |
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Dennis Storzek <destorzek@...>
--- In STMFC@..., "al_brown03" <abrown@...> wrote:
I offered this version of my CGR resin kit back in the eighties. There are photos on the RPI site of the car caught in the ice, partially submerged. It eventually sank to the bottom of the lake. As I recall, when the car went into the lake it was un-rcoverable, this was, after all, a pontoon bridge, with no place to block the outriggers on a wrecker. No one was going to risk putting the wrecker in the drink to retrieve a boxcar. :-) The car was paid for, and sat in the lake for several years, until the pontoon bridge was abandoned. It was fished out while the bridge was being dismantaled, likely using a derrick on a barge. Since it was still in good shape, the Rutland, ever frugal, restored the car to service, numbering it at the top of their 7000 series, 7999. When the Rutland rebuilt the car they changed the roof from the original inside metal roof to an outside metal version. Accurail also offered this car; the Hutchins roof on our car doesn't look all that different from the outside metal roof the prototype had. Hobby Stores Distributing than wanted multiple numbers, so we did this single car prototype in three road numbers for them. ;-) Dennis |
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Charlie Vlk
It seems to me that I ran across some information decades ago that indicated that the Ma&Pa had some 34' or 36' CB&Q truss rod
wood frame boxcars. How they acquired them I never followed up on but I do know that the Q did on occasion sell off obsolete equipment (instead of rebuilding it as was their normal practice) as I have pictures of some early wood automobile boxcars that were brokered for resale through Grace Tank Car Lines in the 1920's or early 1930's. Charlie Vlk |
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