Transporting Sheep In Open Top Cars


Bob Chaparro <thecitrusbelt@...>
 

Below is an image link from the files of the California State Railroad
Museum. This image is described as "Sheep en route to slaughter via
the Southern Pacific Railroad. The cars appear to be sugar beet cars
used as stock cars."

http://www.sacramentohistory.org/admin/photo/935_1940.jpg

Are these sugar beet cars from the early 1900s or some other type of
car?

Thanks.

Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA


Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Bob Chaparro wrote:
Below is an image link from the files of the California State Railroad Museum. This image is described as "Sheep en route to slaughter via the Southern Pacific Railroad. The cars appear to be sugar beet cars used as stock cars."

http://www.sacramentohistory.org/admin/photo/935_1940.jpg

Are these sugar beet cars from the early 1900s or some other type of car?
It's hard to tell what they are, and certainly they MIGHT be beet racks. But most of the SP beet racks had an "A" frame inside so the beets would slide out the side doors. Those sheep are either very adept at standing on a slope, or there is no A frame.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Andy Laurent <andy.laurent@...>
 

--- In STMFC@..., Anthony Thompson <thompson@...> wrote:

Bob Chaparro wrote:
Below is an image link from the files of the California State
Railroad
Museum. This image is described as "Sheep en route to slaughter
via
the Southern Pacific Railroad. The cars appear to be sugar beet
cars
used as stock cars."

http://www.sacramentohistory.org/admin/photo/935_1940.jpg

Are these sugar beet cars from the early 1900s or some other type
of
car?
It's hard to tell what they are, and certainly they MIGHT be
beet
racks. But most of the SP beet racks had an "A" frame inside so the
beets would slide out the side doors. Those sheep are either very
adept
at standing on a slope, or there is no A frame.
Were the cars convertible gons, or did they have a permanent A-frame
floor? Either way, it gives a pretty clear picture of how tightly
animals were crowded into a freight car. I would imagine that hogs
and cattle were similarly loaded.

Andy Laurent


Paul Hillman
 

I'm curious as to how they were unloaded, or even loaded in the first place.

Was each one "hand-lowered" into the car, then the opposite at the destination?

Paul Hillman

----- Original Message -----
From: Andy Laurent<mailto:andy.laurent@...>
To: STMFC@...<mailto:STMFC@...>
Sent: Tuesday, December 18, 2007 6:31 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Transporting Sheep In Open Top Cars


--- In STMFC@...<mailto:STMFC@...>, Anthony Thompson <thompson@...> wrote:
>
> Bob Chaparro wrote:
> > Below is an image link from the files of the California State
Railroad
> > Museum. This image is described as "Sheep en route to slaughter
via
> > the Southern Pacific Railroad. The cars appear to be sugar beet
cars
> > used as stock cars."
> >
> > http://www.sacramentohistory.org/admin/photo/935_1940.jpg<http://www.sacramentohistory.org/admin/photo/935_1940.jpg>
> >
> > Are these sugar beet cars from the early 1900s or some other type
of
> > car?
>
> It's hard to tell what they are, and certainly they MIGHT be
beet
> racks. But most of the SP beet racks had an "A" frame inside so the
> beets would slide out the side doors. Those sheep are either very
adept
> at standing on a slope, or there is no A frame.
>
Were the cars convertible gons, or did they have a permanent A-frame
floor? Either way, it gives a pretty clear picture of how tightly
animals were crowded into a freight car. I would imagine that hogs
and cattle were similarly loaded.

Andy Laurent


Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Andy Laurent wrote:
Were the cars convertible gons, or did they have a permanent A-frame floor? Either way, it gives a pretty clear picture of how tightly animals were crowded into a freight car. I would imagine that hogs and cattle were similarly loaded.
Neither. The SP sugar beet shipping in that day was in a rack structure which included the A frame, and which was mounted on a flat car in season only. Not a gondola and not a permanent A-frame on the car, but a fixed A-frame in the rack.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Douglas Harding <dharding@...>
 

Bob I came across this photo a few years ago. At that time it was labled as
being "gons", which was quite puzzling, ie how did they get the sheep in or
out of the cars. Tony and I discussed this and concluded the cars were
indeed beet racks, can't recall the manufacture without consulting old
notes. The beet racks have doors in the sides. You might want to search the
group files for our discussion. The photo has intrigued anyone who has seen
it.

Doug Harding
www.iowacentralrr.org

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Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Doug Harding wrote:
Bob I came across this photo a few years ago. At that time it was labled as being "gons", which was quite puzzling, ie how did they get the sheep in or out of the cars. Tony and I discussed this and concluded the cars were indeed beet racks, can't recall the manufacture without consulting old notes. The beet racks have doors in the sides.
Yes, and I still agree that these superstructures do seem to have side doors. But even the earliest SP beet racks, called "Blackburn" racks for their designer, had an A-frame interior, and said interior looks like it's part of the structure of the rack, thus not readily removable. It's possible, of course, that these are modified beet racks for the exact purpose of stock movement, though SP throughout the first half of the 20th century had one of the larger stock car fleets in the country and is thus a little unlikely as a candidate to create "emergency" rolling stock like this.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


al_brown03
 

Anyone recognize the location?

Al Brown, Melbourne, Fla.


--- In STMFC@..., Anthony Thompson <thompson@...> wrote:

Doug Harding wrote:
Bob I came across this photo a few years ago. At that time it
was
labled as being "gons", which was quite puzzling, ie how did they
get
the sheep in or out of the cars. Tony and I discussed this and
concluded the cars were indeed beet racks, can't recall the
manufacture without consulting old notes. The beet racks have
doors in
the sides.
Yes, and I still agree that these superstructures do seem
to
have side doors. But even the earliest SP beet racks, called
"Blackburn" racks for their designer, had an A-frame interior, and
said
interior looks like it's part of the structure of the rack, thus
not
readily removable. It's possible, of course, that these are
modified
beet racks for the exact purpose of stock movement, though SP
throughout the first half of the 20th century had one of the larger
stock car fleets in the country and is thus a little unlikely as a
candidate to create "emergency" rolling stock like this.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Bill Kelly
 

Possibly these racks are a predecessor of the Blackburn sugar
beet rack as shown on page 171 of _SP Freight Cars vol 3_.
Interesting that the car in the book is coupled to a stock car.

Later,
Bill Kelly

Tony wrote:
Yes, and I still agree that these superstructures do seem to
have side doors. But even the earliest SP beet racks, called
"Blackburn" racks for their designer, had an A-frame interior, and
said interior looks like it's part of the structure of the rack, thus
not
readily removable. It's possible, of course, that these are modified
beet racks for the exact purpose of stock movement, though SP
throughout the first half of the 20th century had one of the larger
stock car fleets in the country and is thus a little unlikely as a
candidate to create "emergency" rolling stock like this.


Bob Chaparro <thecitrusbelt@...>
 

I ran across this image today and it made me think about my recent
post.

This is a link to a Southern Pacific photo in USC's digital archive
collection at: http://digarc.usc.edu/search/controller/index.htm .

This may be the same kind of car, but it's not identical. The
caption reads "Load of sugar beets being dumped into a Southern
Pacific railroad car in Compton, 1910."
http://digarc.usc.edu/search/controller/asset/chs-m5675/CHS-12736

This is the car in my previous post:
http://www.sacramentohistory.org/admin/photo/935_1940.jpg

Are they similar cars? The outside posts don't seem to be exactly
the same plus on the beet car they&#92; posts are pared because they are
actually door frames. The car hauling sheep does not have the top
mounted rods running the length of the car. But I don't know. Maybe
the sheep car is some kind of earlier beet car.

Bob Chaparro
Hemet, CA


Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Bob Chaparro wrote:
This may be the same kind of car, but it's not identical. The
caption reads "Load of sugar beets being dumped into a Southern
Pacific railroad car in Compton, 1910."
http://digarc.usc.edu/search/controller/asset/chs-m5675/CHS-12736

This is the car in my previous post:
http://www.sacramentohistory.org/admin/photo/935_1940.jpg
The same dumper is shown on page 164 of my Volume 1 on SP gondolas. These beet racks did have A-frame interiors.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Charlie Vlk
 

The Beet Car rack is built on a pressed steel flatcar.
It is a different style rack than the one loaded with sheep (the sheep car has more side bracing).
Interesting shots...
Charlie Vlk