DL&W Wartime composite USRA hoppers


Louis C. Whiteley <octoraro1@...>
 

On page 279 of Karig's "Coal Cars" is a photo of DL&W #81688. This USRA hopper was repaired with four panels of wood and steel diagonals in 1944. The 1953 ORER lists one other car with the same reduced 1840 cubic capacity, #81572. I haven't checked my 1948 ORER for other cars.

Can anyone provide additional information about these cars, i.e. AB brake system, power handbrake mechanism, trucks, etc.?

Lou Whiteley
Lawrenceville, NJ


Jerry Dziedzic
 

Lou, check back issues of ELHS' "The Diamond." Jim Harr covered these cars in a recent Modeler's Workbench. Sorry I can't provide a more specific reference, but my files aren't convenient to me.

Jerry Dziedzic
Pattenburg, NJ

--- In STMFC@..., "Louis C. Whiteley" <octoraro1@...> wrote:

On page 279 of Karig's "Coal Cars" is a photo of DL&W #81688. This USRA hopper was repaired with four panels of wood and steel diagonals in 1944. The 1953 ORER lists one other car with the same reduced 1840 cubic capacity, #81572. I haven't checked my 1948 ORER for other cars.

Can anyone provide additional information about these cars, i.e. AB brake system, power handbrake mechanism, trucks, etc.?

Lou Whiteley
Lawrenceville, NJ


Gene Deimling <losgatos48@...>
 

Lou
The Lackawanna diagram book dated 1953 shows that they were converting to AB brakes and Ajax brake wheels at the date of publication. The trucks were listed as a USS pattern which appears to be similar to the AAR double truss design. I have seen it described in other sources as a Gould sideframe. Maybe someone else on the list can clear up this description.

Gene Deimling

--- In STMFC@..., "Louis C. Whiteley" <octoraro1@...> wrote:

On page 279 of Karig's "Coal Cars" is a photo of DL&W #81688. This USRA hopper was repaired with four panels of wood and steel diagonals in 1944. The 1953 ORER lists one other car with the same reduced 1840 cubic capacity, #81572. I haven't checked my 1948 ORER for other cars.

Can anyone provide additional information about these cars, i.e. AB brake system, power handbrake mechanism, trucks, etc.?

Lou Whiteley
Lawrenceville, NJ


Richard Hendrickson
 

On Aug 10, 2009, at 9:13 AM, Gene Deimling wrote:

Lou
The Lackawanna diagram book dated 1953 shows that they were
converting to AB brakes and Ajax brake wheels at the date of
publication. The trucks were listed as a USS pattern which appears
to be similar to the AAR double truss design. I have seen it
described in other sources as a Gould sideframe. Maybe someone
else on the list can clear up this description.
Gene, RR diagram books were often more confusing than helpful
regarding trucks. The RRs typically ordered side frames, bolsters,
and other truck parts separately, and the diagram for a particular
car might show the side frames as "Gould #456" or perhaps just "Gould
cast steel." In such cases, you really have to look at photos to
determine what type of side frame it was.

Richard Hendrickson


MDelvec952
 

Richard is correct here about the general arrangment drawings and reality. Too, the GA-drawings were generally only good for as-built cars about the time that drawing was published.

In the case of these rebuilds, photos show that many types of cars got the wooden sides and additional braces, and at the same time trucks were replaced or swapped as needed, sometimes only on one end.? Some photos of these show them with one t-section sideframe and the other an Andrews, Gould or ASF.

Other details and improvements were?also made;?power brakes were most often Ajax, but sometimes the as-built equipment stayed in place.

It's always best to work from a photo. In photos from the 1950s, these composite hoppers most often?show up in steam coal service, around the?engine terminal at Hoboken since photography there was easier than at other terminals. ?After WWII, some cars were rebuilt with steel, with additional horizontal and vertical stiffening -- no diagonals -- making for some very odd-looking two-pocket coal hoppers.

???????????????????? ....Mike Del Vecchio

-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Hendrickson <rhendrickson@...>
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Mon, Aug 10, 2009 2:35 pm
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Re: DL&W Wartime composite USRA hoppers






On Aug 10, 2009, at 9:13 AM, Gene Deimling wrote:

Lou
The Lackawanna diagram book dated 1953 shows that they were
converting to AB brakes and Ajax brake wheels at the date of
publication. The trucks were listed as a USS pattern which appears
to be similar to the AAR double truss design. I have seen it
described in other sources as a Gould sideframe. Maybe someone
else on the list can clear up this description.
Gene, RR diagram books were often more confusing than helpful
regarding trucks. The RRs typically ordered side frames, bolsters,
and other truck parts separately, and the diagram for a particular
car might show the side frames as "Gould #456" or perhaps just "Gould
cast steel." In such cases, you really have to look at photos to
determine what type of side frame it was.

Richard Hendrickson


al_brown03
 

Richard, in your experience how reliable are diagram books in regard to dimensions? For example, if a bolster-to-striker distance is cited as 5'6", may one take that it isn't 5'0"?

-- TIA --

-- Al Brown, Melbourne, Fla.

--- In STMFC@..., Richard Hendrickson <rhendrickson@...> wrote:

On Aug 10, 2009, at 9:13 AM, Gene Deimling wrote:

Lou
The Lackawanna diagram book dated 1953 shows that they were
converting to AB brakes and Ajax brake wheels at the date of
publication. The trucks were listed as a USS pattern which appears
to be similar to the AAR double truss design. I have seen it
described in other sources as a Gould sideframe. Maybe someone
else on the list can clear up this description.
Gene, RR diagram books were often more confusing than helpful
regarding trucks. The RRs typically ordered side frames, bolsters,
and other truck parts separately, and the diagram for a particular
car might show the side frames as "Gould #456" or perhaps just "Gould
cast steel." In such cases, you really have to look at photos to
determine what type of side frame it was.

Richard Hendrickson



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Richard Hendrickson
 

On Aug 10, 2009, at 6:06 PM, al_brown03 wrote:

Richard, in your experience how reliable are diagram books in
regard to dimensions? For example, if a bolster-to-striker distance
is cited as 5'6", may one take that it isn't 5'0"?
Yes, the diagram books were generally quite accurate about
dimensions, since they called out the dimensions that were reported
to the ORERs.

Richard Hendrickson


aslt28 <karig@...>
 

"USS" stands for "United States Standard." It was used to describe USRA standard trucks. The USRA hopper cars were equipped with the USRA standard, Andrews-type, U-section side frame. Several Andrews trucks--Accurail and Tichy come to mind--would be good substitutes, however, the USRA truck did not have "Andrews" cast into the side frame. Instead, the letters "USS" were cast into the left end of the side frame just above and the journal box. These trucks/sideframes were cast by a number of different manufacturers. There are pictures and diagrams of the side frame in my chapter on trucks.

AB brakes would have been required for use in interchange service after 1953.

Bob Karig


The trucks were listed as a USS pattern which appears to be similar to the AAR double truss design. I have seen it described in other sources as a Gould sideframe. Maybe someone else on the list can clear up this description.


Gene Deimling