CGW 1934 X29


mopacfirst
 

One more question about these cars.

The link to steamfreightcars.com shows one of these cars less than ten years after delivery. In the CGW Color Guide, several of these cars are shown near the end of their existence, and (whether rebuilt or not) almost all of them have a more conventional double-truss truck instead of the Dalman two-level. Is it fair to say that most of them had these trucks replaced, and if so when and why?

Ron Merrick


brianleppert@att.net
 

Ron, The CGW 85000 and 89000 series box cars came with Dalman 2-Level trucks (available from Tahoe Model Works). However, the 87000 series cars were built with Coil-Elliptic trucks, where a leaf spring is centered between the coil springs (also available from TMW).

Those leaf springs worked fine as long as they stayed lubricated, from what I've read. But they tended to dry out and were removed in later years, resulting in a double truss truck with a wide gap between the springs (and also from TMW).

Brian Leppert
Tahoe Model Works
Carson City, NV

--- In STMFC@..., "mopacfirst" <ron.merrick@...> wrote:

One more question about these cars.

The link to steamfreightcars.com shows one of these cars less than ten years after delivery. In the CGW Color Guide, several of these cars are shown near the end of their existence, and (whether rebuilt or not) almost all of them have a more conventional double-truss truck instead of the Dalman two-level. Is it fair to say that most of them had these trucks replaced, and if so when and why?

Ron Merrick


mopacfirst
 

I'll refine my original question just a bit.

By the end of this time frame (1960), were there very many of the Dalman two-level trucks still around on these CGW cars? The CGW color guide suggests not, but I'm curious if this is a statistical quirk based on the photos that made it into the book.

The coil-elliptic spring truck, I can certainly see that.

Ron Merrick

--- In STMFC@..., "brianleppert@..." <brianleppert@...> wrote:

Ron, The CGW 85000 and 89000 series box cars came with Dalman 2-Level trucks (available from Tahoe Model Works). However, the 87000 series cars were built with Coil-Elliptic trucks, where a leaf spring is centered between the coil springs (also available from TMW).

Those leaf springs worked fine as long as they stayed lubricated, from what I've read. But they tended to dry out and were removed in later years, resulting in a double truss truck with a wide gap between the springs (and also from TMW).

Brian Leppert
Tahoe Model Works
Carson City, NV


Clark Propst
 

Ron, the late CGW X29 style cars I have on the computer are all 87000s with Coil-Elliptic trucks.
Clark Propst


brianleppert@att.net
 

I can find only one photo in the Color Guide that shows one of these cars WITHOUT its original Dalman trucks. #W85320 shows up on pages 106 and 107, photographed in 1978 with roller bearing Ride Control trucks. Other cars appearing in the book, photogrphed in 1967, 1980 and 1984, still have their Dalmans.

The Summer, 1992 issue of North Western Lines had a seven page article on these box cars.

Brian Leppert
Carson City, NV

--- In STMFC@..., "mopacfirst" <ron.merrick@...> wrote:

I'll refine my original question just a bit.

By the end of this time frame (1960), were there very many of the Dalman two-level trucks still around on these CGW cars? The CGW color guide suggests not, but I'm curious if this is a statistical quirk based on the photos that made it into the book.

The coil-elliptic spring truck, I can certainly see that.

Ron Merrick


mopacfirst
 

I do indeed see a couple more Dalmans that I hadn't seen before. But look at car 87043 on p. 25. This group was built with coil-elliptic trucks, not Dalmans, but the B-end truck (left in the photo) is plausibly one where the elliptic spring was removed. I have difficulty believing that to be true of the other truck (right in the photo).

I'm really trying to determine what a 'typical' car from this series would have looked like in the early 60s, and I think I'm convinced that a lot of them would still have had the Dalmans (the first 1000 cars, anyway).

My guess, also, is that non-rebuilt cars that were still in the 85000 - 86000 series would have been more likely to have them than any of the leased and renumbered cars.

Ron Merrick

--- In STMFC@..., "brianleppert@..." <brianleppert@...> wrote:




I can find only one photo in the Color Guide that shows one of these cars WITHOUT its original Dalman trucks. #W85320 shows up on pages 106 and 107, photographed in 1978 with roller bearing Ride Control trucks. Other cars appearing in the book, photogrphed in 1967, 1980 and 1984, still have their Dalmans.

The Summer, 1992 issue of North Western Lines had a seven page article on these box cars.

Brian Leppert
Carson City, NV


--- In STMFC@..., "mopacfirst" <ron.merrick@> wrote:

I'll refine my original question just a bit.

By the end of this time frame (1960), were there very many of the Dalman two-level trucks still around on these CGW cars? The CGW color guide suggests not, but I'm curious if this is a statistical quirk based on the photos that made it into the book.

The coil-elliptic spring truck, I can certainly see that.

Ron Merrick


Clark Propst
 

Ron, are you modeling the CGW where you would need several of these car or do you just want one of two?

If you needed 10 or 12 of them then, yes, I'd go for typical. If you only want 1 or 2 then I'd use the Tahoe trucks the number series came with.

I looked at my b/w photos. I have a black renumbered 'merchandise' car riding on Dalmans.

Clark Propst


mopacfirst
 

I'm modeling the MoPac in Kansas in the 1960-65 period. That means I need a lot of 40' boxcars, preferably with 6' doors, that followed the grain traffic. I personally observed the fact that these were mostly from Midwest roads, hence my desire for this type of car. So when I picked up an RC car, I saw that it had the Accurail trucks that almost all IM cars now come with, and glanced at the CGW book, and concluded that the original trucks were correct. I undoubtedly pulled the trucks and painted them red, since that's the state of the car now. Then I followed this thread and looked more closely at the book, and eventually concluded that this pair of trucks was not right. I do have a pair of the correct trucks in inventory, so they've been painted and are going on the car shortly. Thanks, Brian, for making stuff that improves my modeling.

BTW, I think I have a permanent supply of the Accurail AAR double-truss truck. I used to buy kits, so I'd toss the molded truck frames into the parts drawer, then when I needed a pair of them I'd put IM wheelsets in them and go. But, more cars came with them, improperly, than different cars for which I needed that truck. The MoPac 45' gons made by F&C are an example of the models that those trucks went under.

But, now, I buy an IM assembled car, strip the trucks and toss them into the same parts drawer and get whatever the proper truck is, the Barber truck that comes in many Branchline kits, or a Tahoe truck, or a Kato, etc. So I no longer even have to bother installing wheelsets in those Accurail trucks when I need a pair - they're just sitting there waiting for me. That pile is even bigger than the pile of plastic knuckle couplers that I'm going to throw out someday.

Getting farther off the subject, I did a neat exchange a few months ago. I bought two IM Santa Fe reefers at different times, came to realize the roof (platforming around the hatches, specifically) was wrong on each one - but was right for the other car! Took me about ten minutes to get the complete roof off of each car, swap them and re-glue. Thank you, Richard, for the descriptions and illustrations that were precise enough for me to grasp this difference.

Ron Merrick


--- In STMFC@..., "rockroll50401" <cepropst@...> wrote:


Ron, are you modeling the CGW where you would need several of these car or do you just want one of two?
<snip>

Clark Propst


Anthony Thompson <thompson@...>
 

Ron Merrick wrote:
Getting farther off the subject, I did a neat exchange a few months ago. I bought two IM Santa Fe reefers at different times, came to realize the roof (platforming around the hatches, specifically) was wrong on each one - but was right for the other car! Took me about ten minutes to get the complete roof off of each car, swap them and re-glue. Thank you, Richard, for the descriptions and illustrations that were precise enough for me to grasp this difference.
Ron, can you tell us which classes were involved? Some of the rest of us may need to do something similar.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


mopacfirst
 

No problem - I can recognize those cars because I added the reporting marks on the hatches at the time I did the swap.

These were two cars released in 2009 or possibly 2008. One was a Texas Chief Rr-28 and the other was an Rr-23, both in the straight map scheme. The Rr-28 and after should have platforms that do not surround the hatch, so the corner grabs are in the roof proper, while earlier cars had platforms that surrounded the hatch and had the corner grabs attached to the platform.

Photos in Hendrickson's Santa Fe reefer book, p. 133 and 141, are especially useful in showing the difference.

Ron Merrick

--- In STMFC@..., Anthony Thompson <thompson@...> wrote:

Ron Merrick wrote:
Getting farther off the subject, I did a neat exchange a few months
ago. I bought two IM Santa Fe reefers at different times, came to
realize the roof (platforming around the hatches, specifically) was
wrong on each one - but was right for the other car! Took me about
ten minutes to get the complete roof off of each car, swap them and
re-glue. Thank you, Richard, for the descriptions and illustrations
that were precise enough for me to grasp this difference.
Ron, can you tell us which classes were involved? Some of the
rest of us may need to do something similar.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history


Brian Carlson
 

Ron; why did you paint the trucks, by your timeframe they were not to be
painted.

I do have a pair of the correct trucks in inventory, so they've been painted
and are going on the car shortly. Thanks, Brian, for making stuff that
improves my modeling.





Brian J. Carlson, P.E.

Cheektowaga NY

prrk41361@...


mopacfirst
 

Trucks, and even couplers, in this era were frequently painted. I go by the photographic evidence. Later on, this would not have been the case, and unpainted (rust-covered) couplers are quite obvious in most photos, as are truck sideframes if the light is correct. That's what I'm trying to match. The newer truck sideframe dies have had a much more realistic texture to them than the older ones, but still the shine of unpainted "engineering plastic", to use MR's famous term, and machined wheels, has to go before I put a car in service.

I paint the entire truck, then go back with a mix of black and rail brown and sometimes other colors to paint the wheel faces by hand. The weathering comes later, since I tend to airbrush rusty or dirty colors in groups of several cars. There is a stretch of track on the layout that I use to roll wheels back and forth, but I'm not overly concerned with getting the paint off of the wheel faces right away. It wears off quite nicely over time. The stretch of track that I use to wear the paint off does get a bright-boy treatment after I do this.

Most of what I'm modeling hadn't been painted since the mid-fifties at least, and in no-count branch lines there are a lot of cars lying around that aren't necessarily fully compliant as well as cars that no longer are legal in interchange service, so I often look to earlier iterations of current practice as opposed to the mid-sixties when the application of NDE began to be more rigorously applied.

Ron Merrick


--- In STMFC@..., "Brian J Carlson" <prrk41361@...> wrote:

Ron; why did you paint the trucks, by your timeframe they were not to be
painted.
<snip>


Brian J. Carlson, P.E.

Cheektowaga NY

prrk41361@...
















proto48er
 

Ron & Guy -

Missouri Pacific painted truck sideframes, wheels and couplers with a thin black paint as late as the 1940's and early 1950's. It is very hard to see the painted wheels in photos, since they are covered in grime on the outside by caked-on lube from the journals. However, if you have access to an MP car painted in the early 1950's, you can scrape off the grime and see that the wheels and axles were painted. Older MP cabooses also have this paint job.

A.T. Kott

--- In STMFC@..., "mopacfirst" <ron.merrick@...> wrote:

Trucks, and even couplers, in this era were frequently painted. I go by the photographic evidence. Later on, this would not have been the case, and unpainted (rust-covered) couplers are quite obvious in most photos, as are truck sideframes if the light is correct....