Erie radial roof


ed_mines
 

on the fallen flags site go to Erie, box cars - XM75893 & XM76335

second car may have a yellow diamond

C&O had a lot of cars with this Chicago Cleveland climax radial roofs

Ed


Gene <bierglaeser@...>
 

Gentlemen,
First, many thanks to all, including Ben Hom, Richard Hendrickson, Al Brown, Frank Peacock, Steve Wintner, Ed Mines and Bob Witt, who responded with information answering my questions about the ERIE 71800-series box cars. I was hoping for a quick, easy project but, as is so often the case, . . .

It appears that the Westerfield decal #3314 for these cars is correct for the period 1919-1936. Westerfield lists a couple of other ERIE decals for single-sheathed cars but in any event piecing of the car number and who knows what else would be necessary. I assume the same would be the case for the Champ decal HN-63.

I found an ad in the 1931 Car Builders' Cyc on page 362 and a photo of ERIE box car 75893 on the next page, both show a Chicago-Cleveland Climax roof. It looks like the Climax roof will be my stumbling block. Ah well, another potential project pushed to the back burner.

Gene Green


ed_mines
 

It looks like the Climax roof will be my stumbling block. Ah well, another potential project pushed to the back burner.


Gene, doesn't Al offer a radial roof with his C&O USRA SS box cars? I think this is a flat kit.

I have a 40 ft. roof like the one you need on a Yankee Clipper car. Probably a C&O 1932 ARA box car. Could be NKP. PM had this type of roof too.

There may be a good picture of these cars in the soft cover C&O freight car book.

Ed


Charlie D modeling the Mopac http://mopac51.tripod <trduck@...>
 

Gene, doesn't Al offer a radial roof with his C&O USRA SS box cars? I think this is a flat kit.
The only radial 40' roof I'm aware of that Al has in his inventory is the MP single-sheathed boxcar kit.

Charlie Duckworth


Frederick Freitas <prrinvt@...>
 

GUYZ,
 
Is it possible to warm and bend a sheet of reasonable thickness Evergreen styrene over the wood streamlined roof material offerd by Northeastern Scale Products?  How hard can the seaming be if it is small enough to attach fine pieces of styrene? Anyone here ever try it?
 
Fred Freitas

--- On Tue, 8/17/10, ed_mines <ed_mines@...> wrote:


From: ed_mines <ed_mines@...>
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Erie radial roof
To: STMFC@...
Date: Tuesday, August 17, 2010, 2:56 PM


 



It looks like the Climax roof will be my stumbling block. Ah well, another potential project pushed to the back burner.

Gene, doesn't Al offer a radial roof with his C&O USRA SS box cars? I think this is a flat kit.

I have a 40 ft. roof like the one you need on a Yankee Clipper car. Probably a C&O 1932 ARA box car. Could be NKP. PM had this type of roof too.

There may be a good picture of these cars in the soft cover C&O freight car book.

Ed


Benjamin Hom
 

Fred Freitas wrote:
"Is it possible to warm and bend a sheet of reasonable thickness
Evergreen styrene over the wood streamlined roof material offered by
Northeastern Scale Products?  How hard can the seaming be if it is
small enough to attach fine pieces of styrene? Anyone here ever try
it?"

In Bob Hundman's series on scratchbuilding an HO scale ATSF Class Bx-9 boxcar (Mainline Modeler, June through October 1999), he showed how to scratchbuild a radial roof using styrene. Instead of doing what Fred is proposing, he built a jig to bend the roof to the right curvature, then used sheet and strip styrene to do the carlines and intermediate stiffeners. No heat was involved.


Ben Hom


Benjamin Hom
 

Ed Mines wrote:
"...doesn't Al offer a radial roof with his C&O USRA SS box cars?"
Yes.

"I think this is a flat kit."
It is not - it has a one piece body.
http://www.westerfield.biz/3353_64109.htm


Ben Hom


Benjamin Hom
 

Charlie Duckworth wrote:
"The only radial 40' roof I'm aware of that Al has in his inventory is
the MP single-sheathed boxcar kit."

Westerfield's USRA SS boxcar kits with radial roofs are the C&O and N&W rebuilt cars:
http://www.westerfield.biz/3353_64109.htm
http://www.westerfield.biz/3365_64174.htm

...and that doesn't include other house car kits in his line, including the UP A-50-4 Automobile Cars, which are darn near the first kits Al put on the market.


Ben Hom


al_brown03
 

"Freight Cars of the C&O, 1937" states the USRA rebuilds got Murphy radial roofs ... but in the Funaro website, check out the 1930 C&O auto car (kit #6770). If I correctly understand Frank Peacock's description of the Climax roof, this roof appears to match.

Al Brown, Melbourne, Fla.

--- In STMFC@..., "Charlie D modeling the Mopac http://mopac51.tripod" <trduck@...> wrote:

Gene, doesn't Al offer a radial roof with his C&O USRA SS box cars? I think this is a flat kit.
The only radial 40' roof I'm aware of that Al has in his inventory is the MP single-sheathed boxcar kit.

Charlie Duckworth


Frederick Freitas <prrinvt@...>
 

Ben,
 
       did it turn out well or look odd?  I don't have that issue, dang it.
 
Fred Freitas

--- On Tue, 8/17/10, benjaminfrank_hom <b.hom@...> wrote:


From: benjaminfrank_hom <b.hom@...>
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Erie radial roof
To: STMFC@...
Date: Tuesday, August 17, 2010, 8:57 PM


 



Fred Freitas wrote:
"Is it possible to warm and bend a sheet of reasonable thickness
Evergreen styrene over the wood streamlined roof material offered by
Northeastern Scale Products?  How hard can the seaming be if it is
small enough to attach fine pieces of styrene? Anyone here ever try
it?"

In Bob Hundman's series on scratchbuilding an HO scale ATSF Class Bx-9 boxcar (Mainline Modeler, June through October 1999), he showed how to scratchbuild a radial roof using styrene. Instead of doing what Fred is proposing, he built a jig to bend the roof to the right curvature, then used sheet and strip styrene to do the carlines and intermediate stiffeners. No heat was involved.

Ben Hom


Andy Carlson
 

The Model Diecasting (Roundhouse) 50' single sheathed boxcar has a radial roof.
The Jack Parker NP stockcar has an NP 40' radial roof. Both of these roofs are
injection molded styrene.
-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA

-Andy Carlson





________________________________
From: al_brown03 <abrown@...>
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Tue, August 17, 2010 6:08:30 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Erie radial roof


"Freight Cars of the C&O, 1937" states the USRA rebuilds got Murphy radial roofs
... but in the Funaro website, check out the 1930 C&O auto car (kit #6770). If I
correctly understand Frank Peacock's description of the Climax roof, this roof
appears to match.

Al Brown, Melbourne, Fla.

--- In STMFC@..., "Charlie D modeling the Mopac
http://mopac51.tripod" wrote:

Gene, doesn't Al offer a radial roof with his C&O USRA SS box cars? I think
this is a flat kit.

The only radial 40' roof I'm aware of that Al has in his inventory is the MP
single-sheathed boxcar kit.

Charlie Duckworth



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Benjamin Hom
 

Frederick Freitas asked:
"...did [Hundman's ATSF Class Bx-9 radial roof] turn out well or look odd? I don't have that issue, dang it."

The roof construction is covered in the August 1999 issue of Mainline Modeler, including a description of the jig used to establish curvature of the roof. The completed roof looks as good or better as any resin or injection molded part on the market. Say what you will about Hundman's faults - I've always come away learning something from his freight car scratchbuilding projects.


Ben Hom


soolinehistory <destorzek@...>
 

--- In STMFC@..., Andy Carlson <midcentury@...> wrote:

The Model Diecasting (Roundhouse) 50' single sheathed boxcar has a radial roof.
The Jack Parker NP stockcar has an NP 40' radial roof. Both of these roofs are
injection molded styrene.
-Andy Carlson
The CV stockcar roof is specifically the NP "circular" roof, which was an outside metal roof over wood sheathing. The panels are flat, no stiffening ribs, and the seam caps are tiny, with cast clasps at the eaves; not the Climax roof at all.

The MDC roofs might work, however, but I believe they are molded to the body.

Dennis


Andy Carlson
 

Yes, this is all true, but the greater point is that these are radial roofs, and
in plastic. If someone wishes to modify a roof and start with an existing roof,
a plastic one would be easier than an equally incorrect resin one.
-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA





________________________________
From: soolinehistory <destorzek@...>
To: STMFC@...
Sent: Tue, August 17, 2010 7:12:27 PM
Subject: [STMFC] Re: Erie radial roof




--- In STMFC@..., Andy Carlson <midcentury@...> wrote:

The Model Diecasting (Roundhouse) 50' single sheathed boxcar has a radial roof.

The Jack Parker NP stockcar has an NP 40' radial roof. Both of these roofs are
injection molded styrene.
-Andy Carlson
The CV stockcar roof is specifically the NP "circular" roof, which was an
outside metal roof over wood sheathing. The panels are flat, no stiffening ribs,
and the seam caps are tiny, with cast clasps at the eaves; not the Climax roof
at all.


The MDC roofs might work, however, but I believe they are molded to the body.

Dennis


jerryglow2
 

But I think those are one piece bodies. At least mine is that I bought quite a few years ago at the NMRA National in Ft. Lauderdale.

Jerry Glow
http://home.comcast.net/~jerryglow/decals/

--- In STMFC@..., "benjaminfrank_hom" <b.hom@...> wrote:

Charlie Duckworth wrote:
"The only radial 40' roof I'm aware of that Al has in his inventory is
the MP single-sheathed boxcar kit."

Westerfield's USRA SS boxcar kits with radial roofs are the C&O and N&W rebuilt cars:
http://www.westerfield.biz/3353_64109.htm
http://www.westerfield.biz/3365_64174.htm

...and that doesn't include other house car kits in his line, including the UP A-50-4 Automobile Cars, which are darn near the first kits Al put on the market.


Ben Hom


ed_mines
 

--- In STMFC@..., Andy Carlson <midcentury@...> wrote:

The Model Diecasting (Roundhouse) 50' single sheathed boxcar has a radial roof.
The Jack Parker NP stockcar has an NP 40' radial roof. Both of these roofs are
injection molded styrene.

I think both are different than the Chicago Cleveland climax roof which has 2 stiffeners between each rib.

The NP round roof is way diffent. The rib caps on the Erie car are big! There may have boltheads on them.

Erie used this replacement roof on other house cars. See the stock car SK67062 in the box car section (Erie) on the fallen flags site.

Ed


soolinehistory <destorzek@...>
 

The CV stockcar roof is specifically the NP "circular" roof, which was an
outside metal roof over wood sheathing. The panels are flat, no stiffening ribs,
and the seam caps are tiny,
--- In STMFC@..., Andy Carlson <midcentury@...> wrote:

Yes, this is all true, but the greater point is that these are radial roofs, and
in plastic. If someone wishes to modify a roof and start with an existing roof,
a plastic one would be easier than an equally incorrect resin one.
-Andy Carlson
Ojai CA
Yes, that's true; I hadn't thought of it that way. Just file all the detail off and have the basic shape. On the plus side, the CV stockcar is about a scale foot too wide, so likely the radial roof is wide enough to fit AAR steel cars. They can be narrowed by cutting a sliver out at the centerline and joining the halves back together.

Dennis


Clark Propst
 

Beings, I believe, the CV NP roofs are available separately in multi packs at a reasonable price. I believe this is the way to go. Screw one up, there's more, and you're not out much.
Clark Propst

Yes, that's true; I hadn't thought of it that way. Just file all the detail off and have the basic shape. On the plus side, the CV stockcar is about a scale foot too wide, so likely the radial roof is wide enough to fit AAR steel cars. They can be narrowed by cutting a sliver out at the centerline and joining the halves back together.

Dennis


Benjamin Hom
 

Clark Propst wrote:
"...the CV NP roofs are available separately in multi packs at a reasonable
price."

Central Valley part number 1002, three to a pack:
http://www.cvmw.com/1000/index.htm


Ben Hom


Benjamin Hom
 

Dennis Sotrzek wrote:
"On the plus side, the CV stockcar is about a scale foot too wide, so likely the
radial roof is wide enough to fit AAR steel cars. They can be narrowed by
cutting a sliver out at the centerline and joining the halves back together."

For the original application being discussed (Erie USRA SS boxcar rebuild), the
CV roof would have to be narrowed.  FWIW, I still think Hundman's
scratchbuilding approach is valid.


Ben Hom