It was pointed out to me yesterday that terminology I used (as provided to
me during the design phase) on the 1941-built Tennessee Central boxcar was
incorrect. The design IS correct and, therefore, so is the model, so those
of you who purchased the kit have nothing to worry about.



The comments made to me indicated that the web image, a low rez image
required for fast loading for folks still using dial-up connections, seemed
to show roof ribs. Weathering with oils along the rivet rows, photo angle,
combined with the low resolution image, caused the visual problem. The
Pullman riveted roof does, indeed, have ONLY rows of rivets, no ribs. My
web page description has been corrected to reflect proper Pullman
terminology for the roof and ends.



Jim King

Smoky Mountain Model Works, Inc.

Ph. (828) 777-5619

<www.smokymountainmodelworks.com>

Jim,
Thank God - I was beginning to doubt my sanity or my memory (or both), since I thought the TC boxcar had been built with the Pullman riveted roof (smooth, with overlapping sections above internal carlines) instead of the even-less-common Murphy flat-panel roof (flat, no raised rectangular or diagonal panels, between external carlines, as on some late '30s Canadian boxcars). I hadn't thought the TC as-built roof had "ribs" - but that web photo sure seemed to have 'em. Not that I was worried about my model since the rebuilds had a replacement roof. I was going to email you to ask about that, but the web photo made me hesitate; I'm glad someone else mentioned to you, though; this posting greatly eased my mind.
Then again, I might mention that you (like most everyone) missed a minor identifying characteristic of Pullman-Standard's boxcars of the '40s, seen on both their AAR standard boxcars and the very earliest PS-1s: stepped bolster tabs. Take a real close look at the prototype photos and you'll see an inch/inch-and-a-half squared-off section at both the bottom and the top of each bolster tab. Ted Culotta noted this in his Essential Freight Cars article on the early PS-1s; once you first see it, you start noticing it on Pullman-Standard boxcars built from the very late '30s through about 1949 or so (but not cars built by ACF, Magor, or anyone else). It's one of those tiny oddities that make prototype modeling fun or maddening, or both in various proportions at different times.
Gotta' have a little fun with it,
Dave Sieber
Reno NV


To: STMFC@...
From: jimking3@...
Date: Thu, 14 Apr 2011 13:52:28 -0400
Subject: [STMFC] TC boxcar nomenclature correction






It was pointed out to me yesterday that terminology I used (as provided to
me during the design phase) on the 1941-built Tennessee Central boxcar was
incorrect. The design IS correct and, therefore, so is the model, so those
of you who purchased the kit have nothing to worry about.

The comments made to me indicated that the web image, a low rez image
required for fast loading for folks still using dial-up connections, seemed
to show roof ribs. Weathering with oils along the rivet rows, photo angle,
combined with the low resolution image, caused the visual problem. The
Pullman riveted roof does, indeed, have ONLY rows of rivets, no ribs. My
web page description has been corrected to reflect proper Pullman
terminology for the roof and ends.

Jim King

Smoky Mountain Model Works, Inc.

Ph. (828) 777-5619

<www.smokymountainmodelworks.com>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

My apologies to all - that last email was intended to go only to Jim King. I'm a very satisfied customer of Smokey Mountain Model Works. Dave Sieber

On Thu, 14 Apr 2011 12:26:05 -0700, David Sieber wrote

My apologies to all - that last email was intended to go only to Jim King.

Maybe but the stepped bolster tab info is pretty interesting, and I will start looking
for it and hopefully use it to at least identify PS built cars from prototype photos :-)

Andy

Dave Sieber wrote: "Jim, Then again, I might mention that you (like
most everyone) missed a minor identifying characteristic of
Pullman-Standard's boxcars of the '40s, seen on both their AAR standard
boxcars and the very earliest PS-1s: stepped bolster tabs. Take a real
close look at the prototype photos and you'll see an
inch/inch-and-a-half squared-off section at both the bottom and the top
of each bolster tab. Ted Culotta noted this in his Essential Freight
Cars article on the early PS-1s; once you first see it, you start
noticing it on Pullman-Standard boxcars built from the very late '30s
through about 1949 or so (but not cars built by ACF, Magor, or anyone
else). It's one of those tiny oddities that make prototype modeling fun
or maddening, or both in various proportions at different times."

===================================

I am looking at photos, mostly from Bob's, of the B&O versions of these
P-S boxcars ca. 1941, classes M-55a/M-55B, built with Duryea
underframes and they don't have the "stepped bolster tabs". Possibly the
spotting feature only applies to boxcars with AAR center sills and
underframe design. One can always rely on the B&O to have something
different.

Regards,

Bob Witt

Dave Sieber wrote:

Then again, I might mention that you (like most everyone) missed a minor identifying characteristic of Pullman-Standard's boxcars of the '40s, seen on both their AAR standard boxcars and the very earliest PS-1s: stepped bolster tabs. . . on Pullman-Standard boxcars built from the very late '30s through about 1949 or so (but not cars built by ACF, Magor, or anyone else).

Not true, Dave. You can see it on Pressed Steel Car and Bethlehem cars built before WW II.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, thompson@...
Publishers of books on railroad history

Isn't that "step" just where the tab is bent into an "L" shape,
i.e. aren't we looking at the bottom of the "L" edge-on? If so,
maybe the "stepless" tabs were trimmed differently, so when they
were folded (bent into an L) the taper appears to be continuous.

Tim O'Connor

Jim,



Any idea when these will ship?



Jim Brewer

--- In STMFC@..., Anthony Thompson wrote [to my comment on stepped bolster tabs as an identifier for Pullman-Standard boxcars of the late '30s/early '40s]: "Not true, Dave. You can see it on Pressed Steel Car and Bethlehem cars built before WW II."
--- and Bob Witt wrote: "I am looking at photos, mostly from Bob's, of the B&O versions of these P-S boxcars ca. 1941, classes M-55a/M-55B, built with Duryea underframes and they don't have the "stepped bolster tabs". Possibly the spotting feature only applies to boxcars with AAR center sills and underframe design..."

Now I'm glad I (mis)sent my comment to the Group - I learn something new every day. My photo collection is nowhere near as large (plus is skewed toward the '50s) compared to many on this List, especially the acknowledged experts ... Thanks, Tony and Bob!

Some of the sections that tabs are made from are bulb angle, unequal
angle or channel. The flange (short side of the "L") is cut square while
the web or the surface we see is cut at an angle. Tabs made of channel
have two flanges cut square and the web cut at an angle between those two
square cut flanges resulting in the steps we see. Tabs made from angles
have only one square cut flange and it is up against the side sill and
very hard to see in photos. The side we see is simply cut at an angle, no
step.
I hope this makes some sort of sense, I always have trouble describing
something without using may hands....
Later,
Bill Kelly

Tim O'Connor wrote:

Isn't that "step" just where the tab is bent into an "L" shape,
i.e. aren't we looking at the bottom of the "L" edge-on? If so,
maybe the "stepless" tabs were trimmed differently, so when they
were folded (bent into an L) the taper appears to be continuous.

Tim O'Connor


At 4/14/2011 04:40 PM Thursday, you wrote:

Dave Sieber wrote:

Then again, I might mention that you (like most everyone)

missed

a minor identifying characteristic of Pullman-Standard's boxcars

of

the '40s, seen on both their AAR standard boxcars and the very
earliest PS-1s: stepped bolster tabs. . . on Pullman-Standard
boxcars built from the very late '30s through about 1949 or so

(but

not cars built by ACF, Magor, or anyone else).

Not true, Dave. You can see it on Pressed Steel Car and
Bethlehem cars built before WW II.

Tony Thompson

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thanks Bill. that made sense, after I looked up "bulb angle" :-)

Tim O'