Reefer Roundup revisited


Walter Cox
 

I have spent the evening searching the archives for useful information as
to collecting a representative collection of U. S. roadname (fruit and
vegetable) refrigerator cars FGE, PFE, SFRX, ART? MDT? which would or could
have run into Montreal and now have a pretty good Idea of what I'll need. My
main problem now is which paint schemes available on the various models
would be suitable for 1959. I am not interested in covering all possible cars,
just what reasonably might have made it into Montreal.

A secondary question was posed in the Reefer Roundup back in 2007 but does
not seem to have been answered. It concerned what might have been the
beginning of a prototypical model using an Athearn reefer and Details West 4/4
square dreadnaught ends.

If anyone can shed any light on these issues it sure would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance, Walt


Tony Thompson
 

Walt Cox wrote:
A secondary question was posed in the Reefer Roundup back in 2007 but does not seem to have been answered. It concerned what might have been the beginning of a prototypical model using an Athearn reefer and Details West 4/4 square dreadnaught ends.
Whether this change was intended to model some specific prototype, I don't know. But if a PFE car is the goal, don't bother. The PFE class with that end was R-40-10, and InterMountain makes an excellent R-40-10 which has correct ends.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Bill Welch
 

Walt, I am not sure if this responsive to your question or not.

I have been fortunate to assemble a collection of Perishable Schedules for the L&N, SRR, ACL and SAL. Here is what I have gleaned from these for perishables headed to Montreal. These three schedules are for the 1948-49 season.

On the Southern for their #56 leaving Jacksonville on Tuesday at 5 PM it would arrive at Potomac Yard at 6 AM on Thursday. The B&O left Pot Yard with the train at 10 AM the same day and eventually three trains would arrive in Montreal with Florida Perishables.
1. 9:30 PM on Saturday via the B&O-Rdg-CNJ-D&H-CN
2. 10 PM on Saturday via B&O-Rdg-CNJ-NH-CV-CN
3. 5 AM Sunday B&O-Rdg-CNJ-D&H-CP

On the ACL with their Train ACD-10 leaving Jacksonville on Tuesday at 8:45 AM this block of perishables would be brought into Pot Yard by the RF&P on Thursday. Six trains ultimately bound for Montreal proceeded thusly.
1. Arriving 5 PM Saturday via PRR-D&H-CP
2. Arriving 11:30 PM Saturday via PRR-D&H-CN
3. Arriving 11:45 PM Saturday via PRR-NH-CV-CN
4. Arriving 11:45 PM Saturday via B&O-Rdg-CNJ-NH-CV-CN
5. Arriving 11:30 PM Saturday via B&O-Rdg-CNJ-D&H-CN
6. Arriving 5 AM Sunday via B&O-Rdg-CNJ-D&H-CP

The SAL named train "The Marketer" left Jacksonville on Tuesdays at 4:30 PM scheduled to reach Pot Yard via the RF&P 11:59 PM on Wednesday. Five trains took the perishables to Montreal.
1. Arriving 9:30 PM Saturday via PRR-D&H-CN
2. Arriving 4 PM Saturday via PRR-D&H-CP
3. Arriving 10 PM Saturday via PRR-NH-CV-CN
4. Arriving 11:30 PM Saturday via B&O-Rdg-CNJ-D&H-CN
5. Arriving 10 PM Saturday via B&O-Rdg-CNJ-NH-CV-CN

The refrigerator cars would course been randomly from the Fruit Growers Express/Western Fruit Express/Burlington Refrigerator Express System. I tell people the approximate ratio of car ownership was FGE-15/WFE-7-8/BRE-2 that is perhaps a point of departure for a mixture of reporting marks. Including a random ART, PFE, MDT, NWX, SFRD car or cars would be appropriate.

Hope this helps.

Bill Welch

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, WaltGCox@... wrote:

I have spent the evening searching the archives for useful information as
to collecting a representative collection of U. S. roadname (fruit and
vegetable) refrigerator cars FGE, PFE, SFRX, ART? MDT? which would or could
have run into Montreal and now have a pretty good Idea of what I'll need. My
main problem now is which paint schemes available on the various models
would be suitable for 1959. I am not interested in covering all possible cars,
just what reasonably might have made it into Montreal.

A secondary question was posed in the Reefer Roundup back in 2007 but does
not seem to have been answered. It concerned what might have been the
beginning of a prototypical model using an Athearn reefer and Details West 4/4
square dreadnaught ends.

If anyone can shed any light on these issues it sure would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance, Walt

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Walter Cox
 

Thanks to all who replied to my original

In a message dated 7/11/2013 11:59:23 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
tony@signaturepress.com writes:




Walt Cox wrote:
A secondary question was posed in the Reefer Roundup back in 2007 but
does not seem to have been answered. It concerned what might have been the
beginning of a prototypical model using an Athearn reefer and Details West
4/4 square dreadnaught ends.
Whether this change was intended to model some specific prototype, I don't
know. But if a PFE car is the goal, don't bother. The PFE class with that
end was R-40-10, and InterMountain makes an excellent R-40-10 which has
correct ends.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, _tony@signaturepress.com_
(mailto:tony@signaturepress.com)
Publishers of books on railroad history

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Walter Cox
 

That thank you was sent prematurely. All that information was helpful. As
far as PFE cars are concerned if I could get a handle on when the dual color
herald, black and white herald, overland, and modern gothic lettering
schemes came into use that would take care of PFE's R40-10 & R40-23.

It would also help to know when the MDT cars changed from white to
yellow,(or yellow to white) and whether or not Intermountain's R40-23 is correct
for MDT and WFE and if their R40-10 is correct for ART and WFE.

In a message dated 7/11/2013 11:59:23 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
tony@signaturepress.com writes:




Walt Cox wrote:
A secondary question was posed in the Reefer Roundup back in 2007 but
does not seem to have been answered. It concerned what might have been the
beginning of a prototypical model using an Athearn reefer and Details West
4/4 square dreadnaught ends.
Whether this change was intended to model some specific prototype, I don't
know. But if a PFE car is the goal, don't bother. The PFE class with that
end was R-40-10, and InterMountain makes an excellent R-40-10 which has
correct ends.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, _tony@signaturepress.com_
(mailto:tony@signaturepress.com)
Publishers of books on railroad history

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Tony Thompson
 

Walt Cox wrote:
That thank you was sent prematurely. All that information was helpful. As far as PFE cars are concerned if I could get a handle on when the dual color herald, black and white herald, overland, and modern gothic lettering schemes came into use that would take care of PFE's R40-10 & R40-23.
The dual emblem scheme with color UP medallion was instituted in 1946, and the R-40-23 cars were so delivered. The black and white UP emblem was introduced in 1950, and "gothic" in 1960.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


James Fellows
 

Tony,



How late into the 50's was it reasonable to see the color UP emblem on a PFE
reefer?



Thanks,



Jim Fellows



From: STMFC@yahoogroups.com [mailto:STMFC@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tony
Thompson
Sent: Friday, July 12, 2013 8:14 PM
To: STMFC@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [STMFC] Reefer Roundup revisited





Walt Cox wrote:
That thank you was sent prematurely. All that information was helpful. As
far as PFE cars are concerned if I could get a handle on when the dual color
herald, black and white herald, overland, and modern gothic lettering
schemes came into use that would take care of PFE's R40-10 & R40-23.
The dual emblem scheme with color UP medallion was instituted in 1946, and
the R-40-23 cars were so delivered. The black and white UP emblem was
introduced in 1950, and "gothic" in 1960.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@signaturepress.com
<mailto:tony%40signaturepress.com>
Publishers of books on railroad history


Tony Thompson
 

How late into the 50's was it reasonable to see the color UP emblem on a PFE reefer?
Photos show by the mid-1950s that a large majority of PFE cars had the black-white scheme. The shops must have been very focussed in the early 1950s on updating the paint schemes. But of course some cars can escape notice, even in an operation like PFE where EVERY car went through a PFE shop when returning from EVERY trip. Then if you choose to model the color UP emblem, the problem is, in say, 1958 or 59, that you are modeling an oddity or a rarity. I guess I would be uncomfortable, if it were my modeling, to include a color UP emblem after 1956 or 57.
Others on the list may have different opinions, and if so, please chime in.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, tony@signaturepress.com
Publishers of books on railroad history


Bill Welch
 

Neither of the IM PFE models is correct for WFE.

Bill Welch

--- In STMFC@yahoogroups.com, WaltGCox@... wrote:

That thank you was sent prematurely. All that information was helpful. As
far as PFE cars are concerned if I could get a handle on when the dual color
herald, black and white herald, overland, and modern gothic lettering
schemes came into use that would take care of PFE's R40-10 & R40-23.

It would also help to know when the MDT cars changed from white to
yellow,(or yellow to white) and whether or not Intermountain's R40-23 is correct
for MDT and WFE and if their R40-10 is correct for ART and WFE.


In a message dated 7/11/2013 11:59:23 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
tony@... writes:




Walt Cox wrote:
A secondary question was posed in the Reefer Roundup back in 2007 but
does not seem to have been answered. It concerned what might have been the
beginning of a prototypical model using an Athearn reefer and Details West
4/4 square dreadnaught ends.
Whether this change was intended to model some specific prototype, I don't
know. But if a PFE car is the goal, don't bother. The PFE class with that
end was R-40-10, and InterMountain makes an excellent R-40-10 which has
correct ends.

Tony Thompson Editor, Signature Press, Berkeley, CA
2906 Forest Ave., Berkeley, CA 94705 www.signaturepress.com
(510) 540-6538; fax, (510) 540-1937; e-mail, _tony@..._
(mailto:tony@...)
Publishers of books on railroad history

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Walter Cox
 

Thanks Bill, I kind of suspected that.
Walt

In a message dated 7/12/2013 9:15:52 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
fgexbill@tampabay.rr.com writes:




Neither of the IM PFE models is correct for WFE.

Bill Welch






[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]