NORTHERN PACIFIC BOXCAR TRUCKS


WILLIAM PARDIE
 

I am wrapping up the redetaiing of several Challnger brass
Northern Pacific outside braced war emergency boxcars. As
on most of my rolling stock I am also changing the trucks to
better rolling and more accurate (prefeably Tahoe Model
Works) units. The truck that I have found that is closet to
my photos is the TMW #209 Barber lateral motion truck.
The bolster ends, however, do not match the photos.

Any suggestions on this or am I not seeing the correct truck?

Thanks in advance:

Bill Pardie


Richard Hendrickson
 

On Jul 18, 2013, at 11:54 AM, WILLIAM PARDIE <PARDIEW001@...> wrote:


I am wrapping up the redetaiing of several Challnger brass
Northern Pacific outside braced war emergency boxcars. As
on most of my rolling stock I am also changing the trucks to
better rolling and more accurate (prefeably Tahoe Model
Works) units. The truck that I have found that is closet to
my photos is the TMW #209 Barber lateral motion truck.
The bolster ends, however, do not match the photos.

Any suggestions on this or am I not seeing the correct truck?
Bill, the NP War Emergency box cars were delivered with Barber Stabilized S-2 trucks. Branchline offered those trucks in HO, and though they are now out of production you may be able to find some. Currently in production are the Exactrail ET-114 Barber S-2s.

Richard Hendrickson


Gene <bierglaeser@...>
 

There was a time when the railroad or other freight car purchaser specified which truck sideframe, bolster, side bearing, brake beam, and so on was to be used on freight cars being built. In the past, at least, it was possible that each of these parts could come from a different manufacturer.

Narrowing my scope to just the sideframes and truck bolster, I always assumed that a truck such as the ASF Ride-Control truck, for example, would have to have sideframes and truck bolster from the same manufacturer.

Can anyone confirm or refute?

Gene Green


Richard Hendrickson
 

On Jul 18, 2013, at 1:33 PM, Gene <bierglaeser@...> wrote:

There was a time when the railroad or other freight car purchaser specified which truck sideframe, bolster, side bearing, brake beam, and so on was to be used on freight cars being built. In the past, at least, it was possible that each of these parts could come from a different manufacturer.

Narrowing my scope to just the sideframes and truck bolster, I always assumed that a truck such as the ASF Ride-Control truck, for example, would have to have sideframes and truck bolster from the same manufacturer.

Can anyone confirm or refute?
Gene, all the parts wouldn't have to have come from the same manufacturer, but on the evidence I have seen it was customary to order trucks of a specific design like the ASF A-3s and Barber S-2s from the same source.


Richard Hendrickson


brianleppert@att.net
 

Some of these cars also had ASF A-3 Ride Control trucks. See the builder's photo of NP #28464 in the September 1994 issue of Mainline Modeler.

Brian Leppert
Tahoe Model Works
Carson City, NV

--- In STMFC@..., Richard Hendrickson <rhendrickson@...> wrote:

On Jul 18, 2013, at 11:54 AM, WILLIAM PARDIE <PARDIEW001@...> wrote:


I am wrapping up the redetaiing of several Challnger brass
Northern Pacific outside braced war emergency boxcars. As
on most of my rolling stock I am also changing the trucks to
better rolling and more accurate (prefeably Tahoe Model
Works) units. The truck that I have found that is closet to
my photos is the TMW #209 Barber lateral motion truck.
The bolster ends, however, do not match the photos.

Any suggestions on this or am I not seeing the correct truck?
Bill, the NP War Emergency box cars were delivered with Barber Stabilized S-2 trucks. Branchline offered those trucks in HO, and though they are now out of production you may be able to find some. Currently in production are the Exactrail ET-114 Barber S-2s.

Richard Hendrickson



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Monk Alan <Alan.Monk@...>
 

The other thing to bear in mind is that the specified truck would be as newly built (and for a while thereafter... couple of years maybe??)

But, once a car has been in service a few years, it's likely to have visited a RIP track (and that likelihood will increase as the car ages). There was discussion recently (either here or on another list/forum/blog) about how the RIP team were unlikely to have stocks on hand for every truck design, so may have used what was available - certainly there's photographic evidence of cars with different trucks than as delivered (even different at each end). I'm guessing that some other components were also swapped out as required which may not have been exactly like for like?

So, for older cars certainly, I don't think we should get too hung-up on 'as built' detail.

Regards,
Alan Monk
Reading, UK

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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


Tim O'Connor
 

It would be nice to know which cars had which. I have photos of
28151, 28198, 28318, 28757, 28762 and all of them are riding on
the Barber trucks. The NP equipment diagram is no help at all. :-)

http://research.nprha.org/NP%20Box%20Cars/Box%20Cars%2040%20Ft.%20Single%20Sheathed%2028000-999.jpg

Tim O'Connor

Some of these cars also had ASF A-3 Ride Control trucks. See the builder's photo
> of NP #28464 in the September 1994 issue of Mainline Modeler.
> Brian Leppert


>> Bill, the NP War Emergency box cars were delivered with Barber Stabilized S-2 trucks.
>> Branchline offered those trucks in HO, and though they are now out of production you
>> may be able to find some. Currently in production are the Exactrail ET-114 Barber S-2s.
>> Richard Hendrickson


brianleppert@att.net
 

According to Railway Prototype Cyclopedia #19, NP #28375-28749 had ASF A-3 Ride Control trucks.

Brian Leppert
Tahoe Model Works
Carson City, NV

--- In STMFC@..., Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:


It would be nice to know which cars had which. I have photos of
28151, 28198, 28318, 28757, 28762 and all of them are riding on
the Barber trucks. The NP equipment diagram is no help at all. :-)

http://research.nprha.org/NP%20Box%20Cars/Box%20Cars%2040%20Ft.%20Single%20Sheathed%2028000-999.jpg

Tim O'Connor


Gene <bierglaeser@...>
 

Thank Richard (and Dave, who contacted me off list),
I should have been more clear in my original post. (I knew what I was thinking and figured you guys would all know, too. We're all clairvoyant, right?)

Using ASF A-3s and Barber S-2s as examples, would it be true that the only bolster that would fit the sideframe would have to come from the same manufacturer?

Although I didn't mention it, I was thinking in terms of the manufacturing of scale model trucks for freight cars. No doubt we have all experienced instances wherein the best available scale model truck in terms of sideframe for a particular car has the end of a truck bolster that doesn't match what we see in our prototype photo.

The same would be true of journal box lids but let's not go there now.

In later years the scale model truck manufacturer could most like be reasonably assured that a given sideframe would have only one truck bolster end visible on both prototype and model.

I'd like to see, in HO at least, scale model trucks where the bolster end and journal box lids are separate parts applied by the modeler to match what he or she sees in the photo of their prototype.

Wow! Wouldn't those be expensive!

Gene Green

--- In STMFC@..., Richard Hendrickson <rhendrickson@...> wrote:

On Jul 18, 2013, at 1:33 PM, Gene <bierglaeser@...> wrote:

There was a time when the railroad or other freight car purchaser specified which truck sideframe, bolster, side bearing, brake beam, and so on was to be used on freight cars being built. In the past, at least, it was possible that each of these parts could come from a different manufacturer.

Narrowing my scope to just the sideframes and truck bolster, I always assumed that a truck such as the ASF Ride-Control truck, for example, would have to have sideframes and truck bolster from the same manufacturer.

Can anyone confirm or refute?
Gene, all the parts wouldn't have to have come from the same manufacturer, but on the evidence I have seen it was customary to order trucks of a specific design like the ASF A-3s and Barber S-2s from the same source.


Richard Hendrickson





Tim O'Connor
 

Gene there is a precedent. Intermountain produced EMD Blomberg trucks
for their F units with separate journal boxes. However, since most of
the models are RTR, they don't bother to use the correct journals for
each prototype! (Even though both journal styles are on the sprue.)
Athearn didn't bother about it for their Highliner/Genesis chassis.

My guess is it's not that expensive, but 99.8% of modelers simply do
not care.

Tim O'Connor

I'd like to see, in HO at least, scale model trucks where the bolster end and journal box lids are separate parts applied by the modeler to match what he or she sees in the photo of their prototype.
> Wow! Wouldn't those be expensive!
> Gene Green


railsnw@frontier.com <railsnw@...>
 

Railway Prototype Cyclopedia 19 does list the trucks, see the caption on the top photo of page 28. Cars 28000 to 28374 were equipped with Barber S-2 and 28375 to 28749 used ASF A-3. NP 28757 and 28762 must have had trucks changed out. The Northwest Railway Museum has NP 28129 and 28417 and both have their correct trucks.

Richard Wilkens

--- In STMFC@..., Tim O'Connor <timboconnor@...> wrote:


It would be nice to know which cars had which. I have photos of
28151, 28198, 28318, 28757, 28762 and all of them are riding on
the Barber trucks. The NP equipment diagram is no help at all. :-)

http://research.nprha.org/NP%20Box%20Cars/Box%20Cars%2040%20Ft.%20Single%20Sheathed%2028000-999.jpg

Tim O'Connor



> Some of these cars also had ASF A-3 Ride Control trucks. See the builder's photo
> of NP #28464 in the September 1994 issue of Mainline Modeler.
> Brian Leppert


>> Bill, the NP War Emergency box cars were delivered with Barber Stabilized S-2 trucks.
>> Branchline offered those trucks in HO, and though they are now out of production you
>> may be able to find some. Currently in production are the Exactrail ET-114 Barber S-2s.
>> Richard Hendrickson


Jack Mullen
 

Gene Green wrote:

Thank Richard (and Dave, who contacted me off list),
I should have been more clear in my original post. (I knew what I was thinking and figured you guys would all know, too. We're all clairvoyant, right?)

Using ASF A-3s and Barber S-2s as examples, would it be true that the only bolster that would fit the sideframe would have to come from the same manufacturer?
Gene,
I'm not a mechanical guy, but from what I've learned on the job and in derailment cause-finding training, it's true that each of the major "stabilized" truck designs (the above plus National C-1) has a different, proprietary arrangement of wedges that requires a match between bolster and sideframe. That said, both ASF and Barber designs were licensed to other truck manufacturers, eg. Scullin or Symington. The licensed products may well have been interchangeable with the "parent" design. But I suspect that the advent of "Ride Control" or "Stabilized" trucks pretty much ended the practice of ordering truck sideframes and bolsters piecemeal.

From a modeling viewpoint, in looking at the various mfrs pages in the Cycs, I have not noticed significant differences in the appearance of the bolster end that would distinguish, say a Symington Ride Control truck bolster from an ASF one. You and others have probably paid more attention to this, however.

Jack Mullen


Jack Mullen
 

Gene Green wrote:

I'd like to see, in HO at least, scale model trucks where the bolster end and journal box lids are separate parts applied by the modeler to match what he or she sees in the photo of their prototype.

We've seen this in O scale. Intermountain's trucks had two styles of journal box lids, also a spring plank vs plankless option, and a choice of two (dummy)spring packages. Just one bolster, though.

Jack Mullen


Tom Vanwormer
 

Gene,
In HO Scale look at Thielsen Trucks from Trout Creek Engineering and
journal lids from Silver Crash Car Works.
Tom VanWormer

moonmuln wrote:





Gene Green wrote:

I'd like to see, in HO at least, scale model trucks where the
bolster end and journal box lids are separate parts applied by the
modeler to match what he or she sees in the photo of their prototype.
We've seen this in O scale. Intermountain's trucks had two styles of
journal box lids, also a spring plank vs plankless option, and a
choice of two (dummy)spring packages. Just one bolster, though.

Jack Mullen